Before I begin, let me ask: You were once a novice no? If you answered yes to this....then hear me out for a moment. Remember the first image you ever uploaded here? You waited in anticipation for a comment..."How did I do?" I remember that moment. I am an adult though...I can deal with rejection, actually, I thrive on constructive crits. What if though, you were 15 years old. What if your only comment was someone telling you to "get outside, you spend too much time on the computer". That was a childs first comment to a first image posted. The poster has since deleted his post, but I ask you....how fair is that? This person is a fine artist, his work superb....why bother posting something like that? Quite obviously, he spends great amounts of time creating his "WIP'S", ....a child is a work in progress. What makes a child's art done graphically, any less important than if they drew it out? What makes a childs learning any less important than if art were not apart of it? Bunnycoloa_15 creates images with the only program she has on her computer....windows paint. Om3g4 makes art...works in progress, damn fine works...but he finds a newbee, and blacks her out with a comment that says "you need to spend more time away from the computer". Is that a constructive crit? dunno...what do you think? I would like to thank Om3g4 for deleting his comment. But what would make anyone say that in the first place? Your thoughts?

I'm not an artist, but maybe they said that because they were in a bad mood, and wanted to make somebody else feel as bad as they did at that moment. Maybe they saw or read something associated with the image that indicated to them that the artist was uncomfortably detached from reality.

Incredible insight, and yes perhaps very possible! I stepped over the insight edge and thought maybe the guy saw a budding rival....I can't judge, I am still left wondering...any thoughts?

Sometimes I think that comments around here include not enough critique so I'm always hesitating but at least can't resist to give a hint like: Everything is done really good but (there is an arm poking through/you may want to smooth this hard edge etc...) - but til now it seems I didn't bother anyone by doing that. IMHO people are uploading their images to share them AND to get some hints about enhancing it. But what happened here is just rude and makes no sense. I think I've found the image you're speaking of (was not so easy, there is a typo in the name Bunnycoloa_15 ;o) ). Well, it's nothing spectacualar - if it was'nt done with windows paint. My tip: This child should get itself a better paintprogram (is Paintshop Pro still available for free?) and a cheap tablet - she has a talent and she should have better tools to use it. Maybe she can get herself a better program in school, she may ask the teacher for educational releases. And off of that: Don't care too much about comments! Sometimes I get a lot of them, sometimes not. I don't blame it on the users round here. There are so many new images every day, it's impossible to browse them all and leave a comment. The comments this child recieved already are very kind, but most of all: The commenting users looked closely and regarded that the image was made with very simple tools.

Okay, I worked with Poser for more than a year before I had the nerve to post anything here for public view...and I'm an adult!! (though I don't always act like one!!). So I applaud Bunnycula_15 for her willingness to "go public" and really encourage her to have fun with her art and accept that there are a few insensitive people here, but the overwhelming majority are thoughtful, helpful and friendly. But most importantly, have fun with it because as long you enjoy it, you will pursue it...and with experience comes improvement. What I see in "Got Paint" is an amazing eye for details and alot of patience to create the image. Those attributes will serve Bunnycula_15 well in her artwork. The only other suggestion that I might make is to consider posting her work in the "Beginner" category where there would probably be less likelihood of "non-constructive" remarks. take care, Jen

One of my daughters is now 13 yrs old, and altho she has PSP and PS she can do the most amazing things with windows paint..she creates entire webpages with it etc. etc.. Bunny, you keep on doin' what you're doin'..and dont worry about the morons who have little else to do than try and bring someone else down. There are many, many freeware paint programs out there to choose from if you want something more to play around with..and also as was mentioned above, there are educational versions available of the higher end proggies. check your PM's tater ;)

You are right, Jen, that will help from being tossed around - otherwise it would be rude and unpolite. ...and I must confess that I worked with poser for over two years and as a professional for one year before I had the guts to publish something here. Funny, some people are absolutely not self-secure - and all these that start here as beginners have my full respect (and maybe you have to be a teenager to do so).

I too was one of those Poser beginners who just about gave up until I came here and saw what could actually be done with a lot of practice and by combining programs like Poser with Photoshop and Painter. Now, I make part of my income by using these programs. I think it's most important to keep in mind that no matter what YOU might think of someone's skills, they may be very very proud of what they have created. To shoot them down with callous comments is cruel and really rather infantile. Renderosity certainly loves to refer to us all as a "community", and as a community, we should encourage and support each other, especially the new folks. After all, we've all been there, and having "paid our dues" or not, we should set a supportive example.

Seven Wolves, we share the same kind of experience ;o) I never forgot my first render (Dork standing around silly in ugly clothes lit by ugly lights). I tried some things from the library, and ended up with another kind of ugly image. Then I found this community. And with all my practise in painting on paper and canvas I felt that I knew nothing after looking at the images around here. It took me a while to see that other people used other tools for their work. And I found the tutorials and some help by friendly users. That's what I call community! It means not that you have to give applause to every image - but comments should be polite and helpful. "get outside, you spend too much time on the computer" - this may be a kind of joke ("It's spring! Enjoy the sun and spend your time on the computer when it's raining!") because the image shows computerparts. But if it is a joke, one should be careful and make that clear. My friends sometimes send me mails:"You uploaded an image at 2.00 am??? You should go and get some sleep!" But: I know these people, I know they're making jokes - and at least: Those mails end with a smily or a line like "But the image is worth a sleepless night." Maybe the commenting person wanted to be ironic or funny (hope so), but I have a son who was a teenager a few years ago - and he was very thin-skinned. This community is open for "any audience", so it may be better to take a look before you leave childish comments about children's art.

I think that the first comments are very important. When I started with Poser I wasn't a child, I had 50 years! I have never studied art and never done nothing with art with exception of a rock band in my youth. After making my first pictures in Poser I spend two weeks creating courage for posting the first image, it was not here, was at the first Renderotica. My first images were not bad at all, but nothing compared to other works done by great artists. One day I had the courage and posted one and received very good comments, posted more and received good comments and ratings. One day received a bad comment, but at this time hadn't any importance to me. Probably if in the first image posted I had received bad comments I have pulled-out the image, said good bye to Poser and today I would not be here.

Nothing much to add really to what's been said before - all of which I agree with. I suppose though that the original commenter might not have realised this was a child's work - how many of us check the artist's bio before commenting? Actually, if done with MS Paint I think the image shows quite amazing skill and perseverance - she mustn't give up!

Dinhi, it's probably best (though I'm sure you have already) to warn your daughter that just as in the real world most people here are perfectly pleasant and some can be really very nice - but that some aren't, and a few can be downright nasty. She may have encountered one of them, or as said earlier, someone who was having a really bad day. We all get those and it's all too easy to say something on the spur of the moment that we regret later.

Poser 'helps' you render the images. To make an image from scratch is very, very difficult to do. especially at a young age. I apllaud anyone who can use a paint program without any helpers/filters etc to make an image out of their imaginations. I use MS paint and it's a great tool. ;)

How come nobody's mentioned Dogwaffle? M :)

Dogwaffle is great..forgot about that one..also there is Jart, and ArtRage..all free :)

More can be found here: http://www.bakhter.com/html/freeware/paint_software.html Edit: Also Serif Software..its all free ;) http://www.freeserifsoftware.com/software/DrawPlus/default.asp

Message edited on: 04/06/2005 11:33

You guys are amazing....I will get Ash the addy for these free programs! Though, she is really keen on her MS paint...lol

There's also the GIMP, which has been available for Windows systems for a while. More complex to set up than the others mentioned here but a powerful piece of software.

Attached Link: http://gimp-win.sourceforge.net/

The few times I make comments on pictures, I try to include a critique which reflects both good and bad, and suggestions for how to fix the bad. Now, that's just the way i do things, but evidently that's a rare commodity around here because I invariably get a message from the artist thanking me for the critique and mentioning that they wish more people would do it. Being a movie reviewer, it's just the way I review anything, from writing to art to movies to whatever. The way i was taught. But I do think instead of universal acclaim for an image, or someone in a bad mood panning it, it would be more rewarding if more people here said what they liked about an image and what they didn't like, and made suggestions like, maybe you could try this... Good manners and consideration cost nothing at all, and they will take you further than blatant ass kissing or putting people down.