i am assuming that whoever did the rigging is probably scrambling to clean out their store/update their products as i type this. it wouldnt suprise me if they had done this before, and did it again because they assumed they would get away with it again. something like renda is going to come under 100x the scrutiny of the average merchant offering, however. ynsaen is perfectly correct in his analysis, btw. and why i said that while it may appear an infringement has taken place, it all depends upon the parties involved. im sure dan farr - or cooler - will have no idea this thread even exists until they show up for work tomorrow morning. what a pleasant suprise this must be for all involved, and what a crappy night it will be for those who are already aware of it. i feel bad for all parties involved, except of course the one who created the CR2. unfortunately, due to the nature of the internet, i suspect hell get away smelling like roses and all of the rest of us will be left with a huge pile of shit on our heads.

i suspect hell get away smelling like roses and all of the rest of us will be left with a huge pile of shit on our heads. It would be the correct and honorable thing for Rendo to put all Renda-related products in holding until any decisions are made; this would prevent any further sales from taking place. It's only hurting everyone worse by keeping them in the store right now.

Blackhearted i know we dont see eye to eye hun but right now i really feel for you and the others that worked on this and i hope it will all blow over and come out good in the end

Me curtsey, me no bow....

I'm gonna go chase bunny rabbits and butterflies Why do I feel vaguely alarmed about that? And who is bunny rabbit? ;-)

Bok Mok

Deecey, elgeneralisimo forgot a sarcasm tag... somebody's got a lot of 'splaining to do...

In regards to pulling products for copyright investigation. Our policy gives 1 business day based on the DMCA. In regards to the dials. The dials are simply empty channels for future development. No morph data is included .. just the dial names. These empty channel names are in the process of being renamed to PBMCC_xx. I will be doing an in-depth investigation into the Joint Parameters and will follow the Renderosity copyright policy as needed. Thanks for all the feedback. Clint

sorry no. we should have a 3rd neutral party investigate. you are involved as is Renderosity. any investigation done in house would be higly inapropriate.

Rest assured that if I find anything that violates copyrights it will be properly handled. Clint

I am waiting for Rendo to try to say that the empty morph injection channels are there for future morphs that they are going to do. It would be the only way to try to wiggle out of the fact Renda used a V3 cr2 without hardly any alterations. --Rebekah--

If the channels are there intentionally, why are you here at 11:30? And if you need help checking the .cr2's, I might be able to find a few volunteers. But really, shouldn't someone not involved in releasing this product look into it as well?

Message edited on: 06/28/2005 23:36

Clint with all respect you cannot do the investigation in all good faith.

"No morph data is included" Can someone validate this for me please. From the comparisons I have seen - the morph data IS copied, just useless.

"Clint with all respect you cannot do the investigation in all good faith." Khai, I sure can and will. I have very high ethics when it comes to issues such as this and will take the proper action as needed. "Can someone validate this for me please." EK, I'm on it. Clint

Cling I say again No. renderosity stands accused YOU cannot investigate. it would be like an accused murderer conducting his own trial.

The JCM's are present with all the deltas involved.

cross posted with Clint BTW--I didn't think that it actually included V3 deltas (morphs) just the empty hidden INJ channels and those pesky Joint Paramaters.

Ok being a dumm butt here and its late lmao if you make clothing for renda and take v3's cr2 and rigg your clothing with it it fits renda why is that?

These aren't the deltas you're looking for. Move along.... Sorry, but those Rendo PTB mind tricks don't work on me. This product was released with shoddy testing, the "fix" for the issues introduced more problems, and now it appears to be some sort of violation of the DAZ EULA, as well? Way to go, RPublishing! Your quality standards and attention to detail have truly stunned me. sigh bonni

"So... does this one count as another Poser "bug" or a hidden feature ?" - elgen

It's an Easter Egg. You have to hold down [cntrl][alt][shift][prntscrn][f12] to access it. > "im sure dan farr - or cooler - will have no idea this thread even exists until they show up for work tomorrow morning." - blackhearted

puts down phone long enough to ask: Wanna lay money on that? ;)

No offence, ClintH - but I would prefer if someone else gave me the info. As Khai has mentioned, being financially involved - I find it hard to take your word in good faith. This is not because I have issues with Rendo - I said exactly the same thing to Mehndi when things went down over at PoserPro's. Simple rule of business. Never trust the dealer. I get cars checked by my insurance agency for the same reason. EK

if you make clothing for renda and take v3's cr2 and rigg your clothing with it it fits renda why is that? Because the shape of Renda's body is nearly identical to V3's, and it appears as though that was intentional. If body shape and grouping are similar, JP's will probably also be similar.

"No morph data is included"

It's already been independently verified enough times that the morph deltas in the cr2, whether used or not, are identical to Victoria3.cr2. How would they get there? Message edited on: 06/28/2005 23:44

validate this for me please yes Clint The site had this model made the site staff did not make this model or rigg it so yes i for one would but my good faith in ppl like jennk and clint,debbie

Just out of curiousity, was Renda intentionally UV mapped almost exactly like V3? Because the samples available on her product page are set up the same (or at least look like it).

Hang in there Gabe, I hope things work out. I know that you put in a LOT of work on your products for Renda, hell I was tempted to purchase your set because I thought it looked great, but she is just too much of a v3 clone for me. Just wanted to say that, all done here ;) Now who has the popcorn??

Actually, there is no one better suited to looking into this.

Look at the experience already had -- tried and tested true. Why, who else would have the sheer talent and capability for ferreting out such things?

I sit in awe.

If body shape and grouping are similar, JP's will probably also be similar. Agreed, but the JPs are nearly identical! ;) No, you cannot get Spherical falloff zone Matrices to match exactly without either copying them parameter by parameter or just copying the CR2!

Holy Hell. Bookmark

The finger needs not to point at the site but at the ppl who made the model And i kind think that needs to be looked at

If body shape and grouping are similar, JP's will probably also be similar. Right, which is a clear indication that a V3 clone was intended from the start. But WHY???? If V3 is free, what is the point of having something identical? I don't get it.

ok right now.. really glad i didn't buy anything for renda yet.. though i was gonna go buy up blackhearted's stuff.. gabe.. gonna wait on buying that from ya ok ?? and really sorry if this is gonna turn out the way it seems it might and screw all the original and heck current content creators :(

Bobbie, the people that made the model are RPublishing. The R is renderosity. Ie. Renderosity Publishing. It is the site that made the model. Be it by contracting it out or not, it is still wholly theirs, and their responsibility. In any case, there's no problem. They've said so several times. ALl is fine and good -- these are merely the assault so fo renderosity haters coming out of the woodwork, drawn by the scent of blood tossed into the waters, seeking to gloat as the mighty ship that Tim built shudders and heaves, wracked the by the false storm of propaganda raised against it. sigh Oh, look! Poppies!!!

Over at Daz, Drax has appealed for calm, and I'd like to say the same sort of thing here. No need for pitchforks, torches, or long lengths of rope yet. It's getting near midnight in the US, so many of the people involved should be or are asleep. Perhaps it will be best to wait until morning, when everyone who is involved will have at least some idea of what's going on. Thanks Mahray PS I'll have extra butter on my popcorn, if everyone decides to continue.

its not identical 100% if it was the renda that came out would not have had so many boo boos with bending and so on am i rong?

ynsaen ur cracking me up !! I found some daisys for you too !!

Hmmm ... I think the faults in the bending were an attempt NOT to use the V3 joints (at least, that is the way I am reading it) ... because when some folks saw the faulty joints and the shape so close to that of V3, they applied V3's joints and it fixed Renda's bending issues. Unfortunately, that is very telling.

It's getting near midnight in the US Ah, but it's mid-afternoon on the east coast of Australia, and while there aren't as many Aussies here as Americans, I'm sure that the North American nightowls and Australians can keep the bonfires burning through the night.... ;-) bonni

Apply V3 joints to the first version we had Bobbie. I never bothered to download the update and as of now I won't.

I'm also an Aussie, and since my appeal for calm failed, pass the popcorn!

i have not loaded the new one yet but is there a way that they could have done it with out the v3 cr2 i know there are many figs out there that bend just fine

"No need for pitchforks, torches, or long lengths of rope yet." - Mahray

No one is going to waste brand new long rope on Renderosity. We have plenty of perfectly good used short rope from previous lynchings. ;)

short rope! short rope!! Daisies!!!! However did you know!?!?!?!? Here -- have a puppy!

(Not trying to be accusational here, trying to address Bobbie's questions) .. OK ... when DAZ created V3, they spent a lot of time developing joints that would work the best with V3's shape and grouping. They reached the values they did through a LOT of painstaking work. Those were the settings and values and zones that made V3 work like V3 for the shape of V3. Now ... earlier threads about Renda showed her mesh and V3's mesh superimposed one over another. There shapes were very nearly identical. Meaning, that "the best" joints for Renda would also be those created for V3. But, it appears that the initial release of Renda used JP's that were DIFFERENT than V3. That is why she didn't bend very well. The reason that there are other figures that are out there that bend fine without V3's joint parameters is because they aren't shaped exactly like V3, and therefore would need their own custom joint parameters.

... bookmark

I'm sure that the North American nightowls and Australians can keep the bonfires burning through the night.... ;-) I'm brewing tea as we speak.

Hey, I'll take a shrimp on the barbie and a beah, mate! :) I must be Australian at heart since I seem to work Aussie hours, not US hours (-5 to -8 GMTZ). Plus, I just installed my HDTV/Widescreen capable front projector (waiting on a gray screen for better contrast), THX|DTS|DD|SS Receiver, and 7.1 speakers for my home theater. So, pass the popcorn while I'm watching a movie and viewing this thread. Cheers! ;)

i know about the jp and fall out but how can you really tell they used v3 cr2 and not made there own very close to hers? to" Deecey" hugz

Thank you ynsaen for the puppy.

xenic101 wanders off with his new found puppy, assorted lengths of rope, and a flaming torch.

Message edited on: 06/29/2005 00:08

i have not loaded the new one yet but is there a way that they could have done it with out the v3 cr2 i know there are many figs out there that bend just fine Yes and no, but all ways are illegal! :) In order to get exact numerical matches for both the Inner and Outer spherical falloff zones (32 floating point values constituting two matrices) for each joint, the only ways would be to copy the parameter values one by one, use the JPs in the Setup Room from V3 to Renda, or copy the CR2 and use it as a starting point. The chances for all of these SFZs being identical by pure coincidence are astronomical, to say the least.