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Message edited on: 07/27/2005 19:45

Nice! We need more military uniforms.

But if this will be a MP item, it probably belongs in Product Showcase.

I'll have to see the rest, but this could be very tempting. Incidentally, be careful about using the phrase "battle dress", as "battledress" has some very specific meaning in this context, referring to a specific type of British and Canadian (at least) military uniform. Some search engines get confused. For those interested, the film "Battle of Britain" is pretty good on the uniforms. You see many pilots in what is essentially the pre-War uniform, which Ian McShane's character is sometimes wearing battledress. But don't trust the WAAF hairstyles. Apart from colours and rank badges, I think there were some differences in detail between the battledress versions worn by the RAF, the Army, and some of the RN. And there were changes post-war too. And, apart from shape-tailoring, I wouldn't be surprised if the battledress sometimes worn by WAAFs and ATS also had a few differences. So if you do do a battledress uniform for WW2 it could have very wide use.

AntoniaTiger I see your prospective cleary. I am using the Battledress here in the forum very loosely to give every one here a basic visual idea what he / she (WASP) will /could look like. I guess the term I should use is Battle Ready. The short Battledress Tunic never really came out for the RAF till about 1942. For those who are militaria savvy the RAF Pilot will evenly I hope will come out in a 4 different configurations, year and theater versions over time.

1940 -1941 (Battle of Britain: Summer)

Pre War RAF Service Tunic and Pants (Air Force Blue)
(three-quarter length tunic, single-breasted with a four button front closure)
RAF Side Cap
RAF High Neck Wool Sweater / Shirt and Tie
RAF Wool Socks
RAF Flying Boots - P 36
RAF Gauntlets - P 33
RAF Oxygen Type D Mask / E Carbon Microphone
RAF Flight Goggles Mk III A
RAF Flight Helmet Type B
RAF Mae West - P 32 (Early Lime Green)
Additional RAF Field Equipment and Personal Items

looking very good so far - a truly realistic set of uniforms for ww2 would be on my to buy list : )

It certainly looks good. (I suspect I may have misremembered Battle of Britain and the uniform Ian McShane's character had.) I'm not sure if the straps on those flying boots would be correct in 1940. I've seen it said they were added later, when it was realised that aircrew baling out would lose their boots when the parachute opened. If that was the only mesh-level different, material grouping and transparency would cope.

Yes you are correct that the pilots had many problems with keeping their boots on when parachuting from their planes almost everyone did. There where many models of boots created during the war - some just to try to cure this very problem. The most common boot available to pilots in the summer 1940 was the pre war 1936 Pattern boots like the basic un-textured model above (it's very accurate).

The boots that followed this model where the following:

Pattern 1939 (P-36 boot with just a canvas top desert use only)

Pattern 1940 (leather uppers, gum rubber soles and a zipper in front (no straps))

Pattern 1941 (P-41 boot with big strap added around the ankle to keep them on better)

Pattern 1943 Escape Boots (zipper on side of uppers, lower shoes looked like a plain civilian - the tops were cut away with a knife after they bailed out in enemy territory, so the would blend in better)

I know nothing of correct uniforms but I do know great work. Very nice boot. One thing that gets my eye is the ends of the buckle on the left side...the top one seems to be a tad short??? Aganin very nice.

Thank you Ellocolobo for your wonderful comment. The Buckle probably does look a little strange if you have never seen a pair before. The female strap and buckle are located on the left out side corner of the boot - it is much shorter. The longer inner male strap is longer goes across the front of the boot and pulls the buckle in towards the middle when tightened. If you are making reference to the left side of the buckle itself - the left side has the roller part of the roller style buckle and seems different or short. I hope this helps and clears all things up.

(I suspect I may have misremembered Battle of Britain and the uniform Ian McShane's character had.) No, I think you're probably right - I'll have to dig my copy out and look, you've got me interested now. :-) The other thing is whether Trevor Howard's character (AVM Keith Park) really did wear that gleaming white boiler suit when flying between stations!

LOL... yes the "Boiler Suit" youre referring to is known as a Sidcot Suit (they came in white & kaki tan). They were issued to most pilots in 1940 and went over the normal service uniform like overalls. The average Hurricane and Spitfire pilot dislike them because they restricted their movement while flying in a tight cockpit (kind of flying short sheeted), but Douglas Bader used the sidcot all the time. I will be making a pilot with a Sidcot Suit as well but a little later.

Thanks for that, I've wondered about that ever since I first saw this movie!

I couldn't find any photos of Sir Keith Park in a Sidcot suit, though I came across one which had a couple of RAF types in the background, wearing some sort of white overall. I hadn't realised white was an option for the Sidcot.

Bader isn't wearing a belt, but you can see a belt-buckle on the guy on the right of the picture. It makes a difference, and Trevor Howard as Park certainly didn't have the baggy look that Bader has.

And look closely at the man standing next to Bader. Different collar, and the whole line of the front fastening looks different. Are those pockets?

Message edited on: 07/29/2005 03:10

Attached Link: Battle of Britian Reenacting Forum Images

The 1940 and 1941 patterns were exactly the same - made of a heavy canvas, front zipper, removable fur like collar and inner kapok liner. The only difference was the 1941 pattern had an electric D Type personal heating. This was the last model of the sidcot to be manufactured by the RAF. I do believe the RAAF had their version of the sidcot as well - I know of one version with off set side button front.

In regards to the belt - I am not sure. It may have came with the suit but I am not aware. A "Rigger" perhaps may have made one for him, or this item could be a just a private purchase.

Pilots during these times did not use just issued items. German fighter pilots purchased allot of their own items and stole from the Allies - wearing a RAF Sidcot was a real prized trophy item. I would have to look into it further down the road.

I have provided a link to a reenactors forum that have a few pictures that should interest most BOB lovers.

Congratulations on a fine boot. Pilot outfits are in short supply and us warbird modelers applaud your efforts.

While it would need other photographs to be sure, I think the Bader photograpn does show one BoB-period pilot wearing a white overall of the general style which the movie depiction of AVM Park used. The visible pockets and the alignment of the front opening seem to match. It's a general sort of overall which, pre-war, could have been worn by fitters and riggers. I've a recollection of many pictures of white overalls of the same general design being worn by mechanics and drivers in motor racing, pre-war and post-war. So a garment as shown in the movie might not be strictly correct, but it might be very useful. (Not an RAF pilot, but I found a picture of Alex Henshaw in a Spitfire wearing similar overalls. He worked as a factory test pilot during the war.)

Congratulations on a couple pair of really fine looking boots!!!

I thought put up an update render or two. I will be selling all my uniform models at Vanishing Point in the near future for those interested.

You are doing a terrific job. Good luck on your project.