Can anyone suggest an affordable 2D program to use with Poser 6? I hope to try my hand at digital comics, any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

what's your budget? Personally, I use Jasc (Corel now) Paintshop Pro 9 - the Corel website are selling it for $99

Yup, I'd recommend Paint Shop Pro for a very nice, highly capable program that won't break the bank. Lots of bang for the buck. There are also lots and lots of PSP tutorials and usergroups and such. bonni

The only downside I can see with PSP is that most of the postwork products here in the marketplace are designed for Photoshop.

I can spend up to $200, I was looking at the different Photoshops, and they seem to be pricey.

Attached Link: http://www.gimp.org/

For the money, you can't beat Paint Shop Pro. It has most of the features of Photoshop, for a great price. It can also import .psd (Photoshop) files as well as many of the brush files, so the downside is minimal, if not non-existant.

Attached Link: http://cinepaint.sourceforge.net/

Photoshop IS pricey, but the "Elements" series is pretty good and not too expensive. It lacks some of the high end features of the full Photoshop, but those aren't things most people end up needing (stuff like CMYK, for example). Adobe Photoshop Elements 3.0 plus Adobe Premiere Elements appears to be going for around US$150 at the Adobe site, but it may be found elsewhere for less if you shop around (I dunno, I haven't looked around much ;)). bonni

PSP 9 is $84 at Amazon, Adobe Photoshop Elements 3 is $89 dollars. Also, I have been hearing good things about Vue, does anyone think that would help render comics?

Sorry, I forgot I to tell everyone thanks for there help.

Attached Link: http://www.serif.com/photoplus5/index.asp

Vue (Vue d'Esprit) is a 3D program, used for generating landscapes and the like, although you can import figures and scenes from Poser. bonni

I'll put my vote in for Ulead Photoimpact, great bang for the buck as well !

Attached Link: http://www.download.com/3120-20_4-0.html?qt=deep+paint&tg=dl-20

For around $100 Adobe sells Photoshop Elements 3. Although it can't use PS actions, it CAN use brushes, etc.

Version matching may be a problem, but I've used Photoshop plugins with PaintShop Pro. Certainly true a couple or three major versions ago. Photoshop Elements came with my film scanner, and so far I've mainly used it for adjusting photo images. I've gotten rather used to PSP.

Paint shop pro can use layers (since version 5) and it can use some (but not all) photoshop plugins.

PS Elements can use many Photoshop actions -- if you have the Hidden Power plug-in installed. Should be still available at the Adobe Studio Exchange.

Attached Link: http://www.ulead.com/pi/runme.htm

Quote - Paint shop pro can use layers (since version 5) and it can use some (but not all) photoshop plugins.

Paint Shop Pro is Adobe compatible, so if Photoshop can use the filter, so can PSP from my understanding. I haven't run across a filter yet that hasn't worked in PSP. If you do, it's just a matter of your computer requiring 2 extra .dll files in your windows folders.

Acadia, I didn`t know that, do you know what the dlls are and how to get them?

Attached Link: http://www.serif.com/photoplus/photoplus10/index.asp

IMHO and my apologies to PSP users but:

If you are at all serious about ever using a computer for graphics, bite the bullet and find some way to get the funds to get Photoshop. It is THE paint program, and that is not likely to change ever.

If you learn a different program now, you will just have to unlearn it and learn Photoshop someday if you ever want to do pro work. Maybe if you are a student you can get an educational discount on an older version somewhere and upgrade later (I am still using PS 7 myself).

(I used many paint programs over the years, on many different platforms, starting with a TRS-80, a friend of mine wrote one of the first paint progs for the IBM PC, and I was a contributing editor for Avid, the old Amiga magazine, so I know a little whereof I speak.)

I've used PhotoShop for a number of years, but just couldn't afford it anymore. So I looked for a good alternative.

If you are at all serious about ever using a computer for graphics you DO NOT NEED photoshop at all. There are very excellent, useable and affordable alternatives out there. You can even use these alternative for printing stuff at a professional printer, since the can output layer psd images too. I've done it without owning photoshop without a problem. It's overrated and overpriced for sure.

Message edited on: 07/31/2005 15:09

No offense here, but my opinion of PhotoShop(yes, I've used it for many things before)is that it's highly overrated and definitely overpriced.

Okay I'll wade in here :)

I use Photoshop for all my texturing but I also use PhotoImpact, although not for texturing. I use it for my promo images and for most images that I put in my gallery.

What can I say, I'm a software crossdresser LOL.

I've been a PhotoImpact user for years and have been a beta tester on several versions and it is indeed a very versatile and powerful piece of software.

Unfortunately, most users have been screaming for better brushes for a long time now and for some reason, the voices have not been heard which is what drove me to get my head around Photoshop a few years ago and I haven't looked back.

However any Photoshop tutorial can be done in PhotoImpact without having to twist your brain inside out and there is a wonderful e-book available for advanced users that extends the possibilities even further.

I cut my teeth on PhotoImpact and nooooooo, I am no longer involved in the beta testing and I don't work for Ulead either but the learning curve for me was way easier than PSP.

But the bottom line is...Photoshop is the industry standard and unfortunately and even "stupidly" there is a misconception that if you don't use Photoshop, you're not a professional...to which I say bunkum ...use what you're comfortable with and if you produce an equal or better mousetrap, the world will come :)

Here endeth the lesson LOL.

Is that stuff legal?

Attached Link: http://www.glorianon.com/psp/psp15.html

Attached Link: http://photoshopsupport.com/articles/john-knoll-pirates.html

Not too sure:

Quote - Q: How does Super Buy Software sell software at such low prices?
A: We purchase software from various venues. Such places include: overstock, auctions, closeouts, and companies going out of business. We pass on the savings to you. We are able to sell at such low prices because we sell only OEM software. Therefore this software does not qualify for tech support or registration with the manufacturer, however it will download all updates from the product manufacturer. All titles are full versions and brand new. We work hard to bring our customers the best value, and our prices are truly super buys and rock bottom prices.

Q: Is your software pirated or illegal?
A: No, we are a legitimate business selling only legal software. All Software is brand new and still in a factory seal. All software has a serial number and can receive downloads and be upgraded. There is no retail box or manual included. Just a new sealed CD. Again, we sell only new and authentic, full version software. You understand that you are buying OEM software. All titles are full versions, but will not register for tech support or with the manufacturer.

Q: What exactly is OEM software?
A: OEM generally means "original equipment manufacturer." Sometimes it is referred to as "open-ended market" or "bulk-pack," "white box," "brown box," and "bundled." Almost all software vendors make two versions of the same product. One is the retail boxed products sold mainly through retailers. The second one is the OEM products which are sold mainly to system builders, such as Compaq and Dell (the OEMs). These bulk-pack products do not have fancy packaging and are produced in much higher volume.

Q: Is it legal to sell OEM / CD Only software?
A: Many of the software companies would like you to believe the answer is NO and often attempt to scare customers by placing text on the CD that says, for example; For distribution with a new PC only or something to that effect, but rest assured it is in fact legal to purchase OEM software. The truth is that the First Sale Doctrine protects our right, as well as yours to sell OEM / CD Only software.

So it seems that site sells the CD's that were sold to computer tech companies who build computers, and these techs and companies have "gone out of business" and sold their CD's to this company for resale. Which does seem legit. Message edited on: 07/31/2005 16:17

If that's the case then it's not legal, since it can only be sold with certain hardware it was intended to be sold with at the first place.

Attached Link: http://www.siia.net/piracy/faq.asp

Ahh...sorry about that Karen. Just did a Google and came up with that one which was a link off of the first PS link I gave. :(

How about Amazon.com where one can get PS7 for $135.00?

Hehe, I wouldn't worry Ardiva. I made a flub in a graphic group that I'm in. I got a few people into trouble from it too :( I posted a tube challenge and gave a tutorial that had some cute fishy things in it, and I didn't even think about the copyright. So there are members making these cute tags with a tube I gave them, and they are being deleted left, right and center by the managers because of the lack of copyright availability on the periferal tubes in the tutorial. I've been falling all over myself there apologizing. We're all human and make mistakes. This copyright stuff is hard to get a handle on and we all will slip up from time to time. I don't think that photoshopsupport.com is an affiliate of Adobe. It looks to me that it's a site that someone set up on their own. I could be mistaken, but I didn't see anything indicating that it's associated directly with Adobe.

It's probably a used version. I think those are legal. People sell used books and software there all the time.

The first link I gave at 'photoshopsupport.com' explains why the software is so expensive. Look who created it? grin. Anyways, on Amazon there is 'new and used' from $135.00. :)

Yes, used versions are usually okay as long as the original owner is deleting all the content and transferring the license to you. However, if the original owner has used their copy of PS7 to upgrade to PSCS, then you wouldn't be able to use it in the same way to get an upgrade. If you have any queries about the legality of used software, I advise to contact the seller. I have found that if they are selling illegal copies (which they'll sometimes call "backup" copies or whatever) a simple query of "Is this a fully legal copy, can it be registered with the publisher?" will get zero response. That's what I've always found with e-bay, anyway :-

gad, the more I read this, the more I like Open source..look for the Gimp (can do a lot more than I can at present, but can do layers, crops, brushes, etc. Plus there are a boatload of 'plugins' for it out there on the web.
Project Dogwaffel has a free paint program that looks fairly nice. Haven't played with it much, but lawsey, it does have enough parameters..both should show up in a Google search.

I'm not privy to Ebay when it comes to buying stuff like this. I would think that Amazon would be a more legit source, no?

Yes, Amazon should be, they seem to be a lot stricter than eBay about it, too.

Well, anyway...to those that are complaining about the high price of PS(and I dont blame you one bit), try Amazon. :)

Message edited on: 07/31/2005 16:54

Photoshop is NOT worth the outrageous expense IMHO. You can get a comparative graphic program that can do 90% of what PS can do at 1/10th the price. Those that spend the 1K or 1.5K on PS are buying it because of the name.

My nephew does computerized graphics for a living and has done contract work for some Hollywood movie studios and he tells me that PSP is excellent value for a very low price, and while he uses Photoshop because that's what his company provided him with, he still uses PSP more than 50% of the time just because it's easier, more streamlined and gives him the same results in the end. That's his opinion, but I'm sure there are die hard PS users that will refute that.

It's simply a matter of choice. The way I figure it though. If I can spend $100 on a program that does the same thing as a $1,000.00 one, why would I want to?

Message edited on: 07/31/2005 17:04

Exactly, Acadia. Also the lower-end priced software( PSP, PI) can do the same thing in half the time it takes in PS. :)

Paint Shop Pro is Adobe compatible, so if Photoshop can use the filter, so can PSP from my understanding. Not correct. MOST Photoshop filters will work perfectly well in PSP, but not all of them will. bonni

...and the same goes for PhotoImpact.

... and Corel Photo Paint. A couple of the ones in my plug-ins folder won't work right in that but do just fine in PSP. And vice versa, while all of them will work in Photoshop. However, the fact I've too many filters, even though I've culled them down to just the most often used sets, might have something to do with a few being rather wonky in one program or another.

Re: "I'm with mathman on this. [Ulead] PI is a more powerful program than PS or PSP or whatever." Perhaps it's a better value, but I don't think anyone could say PhotoImpact is more powerful the Adobe Photoshop. Given Photoshop's user base and longevity, I'd say it's the more robust solution.

I disagree, kenyarb...but that's ok as we all have our opinions on these kind of things. :)

Photoshop's great strength is its incredible versatility. It's the most powerful program of its kind, which is why it's the industry standard. Yes, the learning curve is steep, but that's true of anything sufficiently powerful and versatile. The more it can do, the more there is to know. I've used Paint Shop Pro since version 1, which came on a single floppy and ran on Windows 3.x. The first graphical website I designed used homemade graphics done in PSP (version 3, I think). I still have a recent copy of PSP, although I don't know about future upgrades (depends on what Corel does to the program). I have nothing against Paint Shop Pro. On the other hand, I've been using Photoshop since about 1999 and while the learning curve WAS very steep, I'm now highly proficient with it and there's no way I'd go back to using PSP as my primary 2D graphic program. Photoshop is simply too powerful and too versatile, and has too many features I can't get anywhere else. Simple as that. So, yes, by all means, I recommend PSP as a highly capable program with a very reasonable price and it even has a lot of stuff all its own, things that are unique to the program. Very good, solid program, particularly for the hobbiest or cottage industry user. But saying that Photoshop is nothing more than an inflated pricetag is a huge misnomer. Photoshop can do things that Paint Shop Pro simply cannot do, has features that are unique and powerful, and is, after all, the industry standard for a reason. Now to a more important question. Coke or Pepsi? (I'm a die-hard Coca-Cola girl, myself ;-). bonni