SOLUTION 1: Sell your stuff someplace else like Renderotica, Raunchyminds, faeriewylde or Maleposerotica

SOLUTION 2: If you MUST sell here and MUST have promo images that show it all, put em' in a ZIP file in your freebies section and let people who're interested download the free promo images and make their decisions that way. Message edited on: 12/31/2005 12:59

News to me, Anton. I work as Q&A with Renderotica (Though someone can correct me if I am wrong.) Miz... RM does not have a store. Renderotica is an option, though if you are not comfortable with the "Adult" side, you are more than welcome to go through the "Animotions" side. I am of the opinion, that Paypal is not the only reason. I heard talk that Content Paradise is tough about it too.

Well I was only naming sites I knew that weren't afraid of nudity. I don't spend a lot of time looking in stores personally so I missed that about RM. ;)

Doesn't covering up all these images in fact constitute a kind of fraud. You can't work with poser figures without them being nude during the process of setting up your scene.

By covering up the "childhish figures aren't you implying that it is possible to not have to see "nudity" when working with this program. Isn't this a lie?

Truth be known campers, all you need do is look at the history of the RMP's policy. They announce something, pretend to take input, implement whatever they want anyway, and aside from the few who whine about it in the fora, the rest of the merchantile group just shrug and carry on. Why? Because it's the biggest place that sells by volume, where being a merchant doesn't take much skill, experience, or anything beyond making sure that the zip file puts all the bits where they belong. So, very few leave, and fewer still bother to strike out on their own. Sorry guys, but I just don't see anything in the main issue that is going to change, so let me just turn prophet and temporarily become the RMP mouthpiece for a moment: "If you're a merchant, you'll either suck it down or go away." So what are you all, the merchants, going to do about that? I already know the answer: Nothing. Nothing at all. Most of you will tweak the images to conform to the new policy, and hurriedly post it all back up into the RMP upload bin, hoping that it didn't eat too much out of your sales while the items were offline. You'll grumble and whine, but otherwise most of you will bow down and say "yes Massa Tim! I's gonna gets that fixed up for ye right away Massa Tim!" whenever you're told to do so. The last time anybody ever proved me wrong on that note, PoserPros was born ...and that was how many years ago? I'd like to see if anyone proves me wrong here as well, but note that I won't be holding my breath. -- PS: The whole Anton thing? Hell, I've no need or bother with any "vendetta" - I'm just giving him a friendly poke in the ribs at the most, and let me make this nice and bold so no one misses it: I agree with what he said on this issue with the RMP policy (and I've said that in some form or another twice now). It is asinine. As for the rest, well, I'll just sit right here and wait for the inevitable overreactions, overwrought cries, etc etc to come pouring in as they appear to have been doing all morning in my abscence. Cheers! /P

Penguinista, You are right of course, and that is the way Germany went under Hitler, Italy under Mussolini, and Russia is going now (again), and is the way that people lose their freedom. They just "suck it down" but don't emigrate. Particularly when it involves their rice bowl.

Easy - create/implement a nudity filter and stop trying to nanny the rest of us. But then, that would mean spending some of their profits on upgrading the software here - and that has not happened recently!

software is being upgraded in Jan'06 ,or so I have read :0)

Peng, I know of at least one Merchant that said to hell with it and moved exclusively to DAZ. But in general your right.... and the PTB know damned well you ARE right, hence their attitude that they will do as they wish and the hell with how it affects their merchants. This isn't the first time, nor will it be the last. Par for the course here at disneyosity. Mizrael wrote: "SOLUTION 1: Sell your stuff someplace else like Renderotica, Raunchyminds, faeriewylde or Maleposerotica SOLUTION 2: If you MUST sell here and MUST have promo images that show it all, put em' in a ZIP file in your freebies section and let people who're interested download the free promo images and make their decisions that way." Or just move on to PP's or DAZ...... I don't see DAZ asking texture artists to paint over the naughty bits of a texture. And they are supposed to be the prudes of the Poserverse aren't they? Linda357 wrote: "Why can't be selling? For many people it seems to be pretty unexpected but an average texture has more than breast and crotch areas. I know that might be rude to point out :D " Have you seen some of the textures in the store? "naughty bits" not properly aligned, half way up the lower torso.... almost belly button high? Id be damned if Id buy a texture sight unseen. And no I'm not saying all or even most are like that, there are some very good texture artists in the marketplace, but there are some........... :)

thats what I don't understand "I'm sick of Rosity's no nudity crap,so I'm going to Daz" why,there is a no nudity rule there,what is the difference? -3dz

Hey, guys, Just thought I'd pop in, not locking the thread, just posting a little blurb about the new rules. 1. They're not affecting the galleries. 2. The changes to the nudity guidelines within the Renderosity MarketPlace are due to changing trends within the industry and it provides us with a much larger target market. 3. The "dissappearance" of stores is only until the Merchant updates their thumbnail image and main promo, and is at their discretion. They were given time to change them, and many merchants had done so in the previous year with no prompting. 4. More clarification can be had by contacting the Store Admin ;) In Closing, Have a Happy New Year! MorriganShadow Poser Moderator

Do merchants actually make THAT MUCH MORE here, after Rendo gets their 50%, than they would with just little private offsite stores? Because, I seriously wonder why anyone bothers to sell here at all. Between the percentages and the eternal crap it sure does not seem worth the heart ache. Actually, no. But here they don't have to advertise as much and work as hard at selling stuff. It makes a significant difference, and is why my site puts a huge amount of effort into providing effective marketing. But, overall, those merchants who sell outside of Renderosity generally will do better. How does adding a texture make this obscene. It doesn't. Nowhere in the policy changes does renderosity state that they are doing this becuase it is obscene. That's leaping to a conclusion that isn't there, much like saying they are pandering to the religious right (also an utterly ill informed statement). All they are saying is that they don't want it here for business reasons. Rather large difference. ...and that is the way Germany went under Hitler, Italy under Mussolini, and Russia is going now (again), and is the way that people lose their freedom. They just "suck it down" but don't emigrate. Very true of governments where people fail to take action. This isn't a government, however. It's a website. Easy - create/implement a nudity filter and stop trying to nanny the rest of us. Which would b fine if they were trying to nanny us. They aren't.

"Do merchants actually make THAT MUCH MORE here, after Rendo gets their 50%, than they would with just little private offsite stores? Because, I seriously wonder why anyone bothers to sell here at all. Between the percentages and the eternal crap it sure does not seem worth the heart ache. (Unless, maybe, you have enough friends to vote your renders into the 20 day after day after day where your product credits are bound to get alot of great exposure.)" (poppi) I don't plan on uploading any new products here, I haven't in some time, and I am very happy to run my own gig elsewhere. All this silliness lately further concretes that decision. Oh, Happy New Year! :)

"Is there something in the water?" - No, Mickma, it's KoolAid. Go ahead, drink, you'll feel better. Trekkie stop talking about hot urine or we'll have to banish you to the GS corner :-) Tis indeed heartening to see such agreement among the masses though if Peng and Anton agree any more they may come to blows. TuxBird is right though, people bitch and moan and then go right on sucking the Rendo tit for whatever bitter dregs they can get. I think the kinda stones to do otherwise went out with disco or something. "If every day a man takes orders in silence from an incompetent superior, if every day he solemnly performs ritual acts which he privately finds ridiculous, if he unhesitatingly gives answers to questionnaires which are contrary to his real opinions and is prepared to deny his own self in public, if he sees no difficulty in feigning sympathy or even affection where, in fact, he feels only indifference or aversion, it still does not mean that he has entirely lost the use of one of the basic human senses, namely, the sense of humiliation. Vlav Havel"

heh Happy New Years. At least we can always count on 'rosity to take the brambly path.

Natolii, The researched a bit and foun the term "high-risk" used alot around nudity and "adult content". It seems the rates are much higher for "high-risk" businesses.

Morrigan If the reason is genuinely ' due to changing trends within the industry and it provides us with a much larger target market', how about following another ternd in the industry and giving a no quibble, 30 days money back guarantee so that if we buy a texture and find, once it is naked, that it has been poorly implemented, we get a full refund.

Charge backs(returns) are one of the biggest factors in merchant rates and expenses for credit card transactions. To many chargebacks and you can actually loose your merchant account. I forget what the average % limit of chargebacks is. 1%-3% I believe.

PS: If anyone is very interested in merchant services(creditcard transactions), iBill is a popular one for small businesses. I think they only take 10%-15% of your total sales.

DigitalDreamer, I would make that suggestion to Store Staff, DebbieM or ClintH. I have no input, personally, on store rules and regulations. MS

Nowhere in the policy changes does renderosity state
that they are doing this becuase it is obscene. That's
leaping to a conclusion that isn't there, much like
saying they are pandering to the religious right.

All they are saying is that they don't want it here
for business reasons.

Rather large difference.
Actually, when dealing with panders, no difference at all.

I don't know the PTBs from Adam, but it's clear, watching this site evolve, that the only thing that matters around here is money. At DAZ, it isn't the only thing. (How can we make some off this poo-poo?)

The most vocal complainers in America (known as "the silent majority" for some reason) are the neocon fundamentalists like Fred Phelps and Bill Frist. They'll picket The Last Temptation and send form letters if Janet Jackson's inadequate boob is flashed in their faces. They watch Desperate Housewives and then talk about what a disgusting show it is. They are obsessed with boobs and penises, so they try not to look at them.

You don't have to be a Nazi to enjoy licking for dollars. So businesses all over the country, some of them run by people even a New York liberal would wash his hands after shaking hands with, are scrambling into their sanctity suits, putting Rockwell pictures over their autographed Wendy Williams memorabilia, and hiding their spiked dildos.

I can, a tiny bit, respect the integrity of the DAZ crowd (only a tiny bit because their ethic includes a sickening dollop of hypocrisy about how much they "like" us). But the bottom line folks, who are willing to sell their own children to the highest bidder (except the firstborn son: primogeniture, don't you know), as a species I prefer to avoid.

So I do the one and only thing that would matter: Never, ever spend a nickel here.

M

SOLUTION 1: Sell your stuff someplace else like Renderotica, Raunchyminds,
faeriewylde or Maleposerotica

FYI, FaerieWylde is a forum not a store! Then I wonder how FaerieWylde fits into a list with the other above mentioned sites? FaerieWylde is no forum for adults only nor does it show adult content. While nudity is allowed even for figures that are verboten to show nude over here we do not allow the lewd display of genitals, sexual contact or sexual displays of any kind in images posted at FaerieWylde. Just to clarify before anyone got a wrong impression here and starts to post images that I have to remove from public view.

If you probably meant FaerieDreams: the naughty bits of the MilGirls or Laura have to be covered, at least with flowers or petals but completely nude is not appreciated as well because of - you might have guessed it - PayPal.

Friederike
FaerieWylde moderator

What I can't understand, is why models like Anime Doll, Hiro3 and Aiko3 considered minors. All three of these models are obviously modeled to look like adults. Sure, A3 and H3 have a "young" morph, but that's only to make them look 18 (which is still of legal age). This is even more ludicrous with Anime Doll, a character with large breasts that can't be changed and large hips. Has anyone seen any minors with large breasts and hips? I bloody well hope not. Also, even if Aiko3 and Hiro3 might look a little bit younger than some would like, they have "realistic", "full figure", "muscular" morphs, shape deformers and everything which makes them considerably older. What I am requesting is letting us show models like Anime Doll, Aiko3 and Hiro3, models which are obviously modeled to represent adults and not children. They are grown up figures and you know it. Until this is sorted, any packages I make in the future will not be sold here, but at other sites which don't have such a ludicrous and unnessecery TOS. Only recently was my "Anime's Dance" package put on hold because the 3rd promo had extreamly small thumbnails of a naked Anime Doll (a model I beleive is obviously an adult). Thumbnails so small you could even make out her hands and breasts let alone any features that would make her offensive. Ofcourse, to avoid agro I have fixed it, but it was that incident that has made me feel this strongly against Renderosity, and has made me type this post. Thank you for reading. SenshiTaurus, Nathan Jarvis aged 15, Poser user for three years, disgruntled user.

Oh Nathan, Nathan, you are exactly the innocent child the PTB's are trying to protect. Naked anime dancer thumbnails large enough that you can see they have eyes and breasts? What's next? Watching Madonna videos? Enlisting to torture people who cannot understand the merits of American democracy? Shoplifting? Thoughts of a marriage not arranged by your elders? I shake my head in despair. What is the world coming to? M

Sorry, mistake in my post.
"Thumbnails so small you could even make out her hands and breasts let alone any features that would make her offensive."
Should be:
"Thumbnails so small you couldn't even make out her hands and breasts let alone any features that would make her offensive."

Hey, man, nekkid is nekkid. ;)

honnestly, why ever bother to comment or talk abotu this ? you all know where it does lead to... it leads to nowhere if you want a more effective and fullfulling discussion, maybe go ram your head against a wall, you would get smarter answers :) so everything that doesnt look like a 90-60-90 bimbo vicky or a bodybuilded mike are teen ? maybe folks at RO should stop watching mtv or tv with totally biased vision of what men and women are, and maybe just step out of home in the street, for real ? oh, and thanx for discriminating asiate in such a way (miki) it's clever lets add a little godwin point to this discussion cause, tbh, it reall desservesit: in a perfect world,every poser figure ought to be blonde wih blue hair and look liek either voluptuous 6 feet tall mannequin girls, or weightlifter bodybuilded sport men o wot say more, you know where it leads when you try to impose and force upon people such a narrow minded and false vision... i wont say more. thanx for starting the new year such way, you ruined my holidays, me happy, i was living in fear about the time when ro woudl go crazy crusader like but they choosed beginning of the year, so i know that i dont even need to wait for them doign worse as it now crossed my own line, i wont fear for the next year...

If im not mistaken, 100% of Baron Vlad Harkonen's items are for V3, 90% or so of wyrmmaster's items are for V3. V3 is unquestionably, due to the physical dimensions and printed statement of the creators, in her 30's. both these merchants marketplaces have been slashed to the bone. This isnt about "why arent the animes considered adult?" in my eyes its more about "why is a RECOGNIZED ADULT V3 no longer allowed to be depicted nude in ANY merchant promo shots?" Well they say its new policy to attract a new market. So you tell me, what happens when this brave new market, coming fresh out of the sterile, censored MP, finds it way to our galleries? They are going to cough up a friggin lung people. Then they are going to bitch at the admins, then the admins are going to decide if they would rather have a bunch of anal retentive jackasses afraid of the naked human form spending all kinds of money in thier marketplace, OR if they would rather continue to offer us free space for our nude pictures that are driving away thier new clientel. If the whole theory is to make more money by restricting the promotional creativity and freedom of the very merchants that are the very REASON for the MP, How secure do YOU feel about your gallery now? I dont even do nudes and im sweating bullets. dunno about the rest of you, but im going to start screencapping and copying to a text doc any gallery comments that are particularly important to me.

"why is a RECOGNIZED ADULT V3 no longer allowed to be depicted nude in ANY merchant promo shots?" The promotoional rules include the following restriciton: 80% of the breast must be covered. My guess is that this isn't the case. There are additional rules regarding the way the product is represented or the type of product it is, and while I find it unlikely that they would have used those, it's always possible. I'm fairly certain, however, it's the coverage issue ;)

If im not mistaken, 100% of Baron Vlad Harkonen's items are for V3, 90% or so of wyrmmaster's items are for V3. V3 is unquestionably, due to the physical dimensions and printed statement of the creators, in her 30's. BUT,the new rules state no nudity on promo #1 and the thmbnail images, this is why their products were removed so that those images could be updated. the no nudity on promo #1 and thumbnail applies to EVERY marketplace item now.including those for v3 and other adult models. -3dz

If I have understood correctly what MorriganShadow has posted, then this is the case: The "no mudity on promo 1, promo images 2 and 3 may contain artistic nudity" way of doing things is OVER. There is no longer ANY nudity of ANY kind for ANY promotional pic. Im not a merchant but Ive seen merchants mention that they got some kind of email with guidelines including "80% breast coverage". Im suspecting they are only going to accept promo pictures now that only show a hint of cleavage.

Merchants had a lot of time for changing the thumb and first promo, the best date for the changes would be the final date, doing before would hurt the sales, but they didn't the changes at the final date, maybe they'll do it later or maybe never do it and the product will be gone. Only time will give the answer.

The "no mudity on promo 1, promo images 2 and 3 may contain artistic nudity" way of doing things is OVER. There is no longer ANY nudity of ANY kind for ANY promotional pic. incorrect.. nudity is still allowed on images 2 and 3 of the promos in the market with the exception of those models that have been tagged as "underaged" for those models there is NO nudity allowed in promos at all. -3dz

Some class of products depend for its succes on the thumb and the first image, specially products that deals with nudism, fetish or something sexy.
You only look at the second and third image if the first image caught your attention.
If this product is not allowed to show its charm in the thumb and first image, soon will be burried among all the products in the marketplace and the sales of this products will be lost, in this case maybe is much better to put for sale at another site where it can be shown.

Message edited on: 01/01/2006 14:40

Hi logansfury: No. The guidelines on nudity haven't changed. As stated previously, the guidelines are simply now being applied to stores retrospectively. Nudity in promos 2 and 3 is still allowed. Cheers Karen

retrospectively = retroactively (elle, in a pedantic mood)

"nudity is still allowed on images 2 and 3 of the promos in the market with the exception of those models that have been tagged as "underaged" for those models there is NO nudity allowed in promos at all." Yeah, and the mesh that has been tagged underage covers all of the anime figures. So if you want to buy a texture for Aiko or anime girl,etc. you're taking the chance that the texture is screwed up at a store where the return policy is horrible to say the least. By the way, since V3 only came out 4 or so years ago.... doesn't that make Vicky 3 underage? Hell shes only 4 years old. How old is Poser? I'm thinking that all Poser mesh would be considered underage......... if your going to use human terms for computer mesh, then human aging should be applied as well shouldn't it?

well, in dog years she's of age...

ooops. That image is much larger than I intended. sorry :)

based on what I've seen thus far required as 80% in the merch forum (very dated info, granted), you're a tad short. About double that..

lol!

sorry,I think in loopholes..hehe

hahaha!

Well, I would point out that I already am not purchasing anything from the Marketplace because of the repeated declinations of my credit card despite the card working at many other stores such as Daz, 3D Commune, etc. I just gave up trying after getting no help from Renderosity other than messages telling me to make sure I was entering the correct address and blah, blah. I KNOW how to purchase online. I NEVER have problems with other online stores. Anyway, I was considering trying to purchase some items with a new card that I have recently received, however this is the final straw to make me not want to purchase anything from Renderosity ever again. It's not so much the censorship that angers me, although that certainly does play a part. It's the fact that I cannot review the entire product before purchasing it. Why in heaven's name would I purchase a product that might be incomplete or low quality? If I cannot see the texture on the nipples, for example, I could end up buying a product with nipple piercings or nipples in a color that I find terribly ugly. What if the texture has a large tattoo around the bikini line with no option to remove it. That HAS happened to me on a texture I got before, and I had to edit it off of the texture manually. Some people may not have the skill or the time to do something like that at all. Why would I risk that when there are other marketplaces that allow full viewing? I suppose I can understand a policy like this when it comes to the characters that are obviously based on very young characters like the Mil kids of RC Lina. But Aiko? EJ? Hiro? Please. If I can't see what I'm getting, I'm not buying.

I do not care what the reasoning behind this is, in the end it is practically certain to be based on a singular idea: Make more profit. Assuming( yeah, one should never do that) that merchants will do exactly what they're supposed to be doing, namely as close to nothing as possible, all that will happen on the surface( as others pointed out already) is that promotional pictures get changed. This is my opinion, I'll listen to yours as well! Move on, merchants, go elsewhere - unless you still feel comfy here - better to end it now than to suffer more. There are LOTs of places out there to go to, and even if you do NOT like to be part of some of them, it is rather unlikely that you're on bad terms with them all. Just to name a few: 3d Commune Animotions DAZ FairyDreams Netherworks Odd Ditty Factory PoserPros Renderotica Runtime DNA My take on it - as a customer - is pretty easy: Whenever there is a product that I can buy as well outside of Renderosity I will buy it at the other location. Whenever there is a product that I do not really need I will postpone it - it may turn up elsewhere. Whenever there is a choice between similar products - I will buy the one I can get elsewhere. What does that mean ? It means I - the customer - am doing the exact opposite of what they hope to achieve, I am reducing their profit. It also means that you - the merchants reading this thread - should consider that there just might be others like me - and that you'd actually make money from me if you'd just offer your products elsewhere as well! And while we're at it, what do you - those merchants selling here - have to loose offering your products elsewhere as well apart from a little advertising preference? Yeah, you do have a bit more effort to invest to actually provide two or more sites with products and their updates and keep track of what is going on, but don't you think you'll reach more customers in the end and hence make more money yourselves? Ahww, well, enough from me, and I really hope to see some of you turning up elsewhere in the future. Kind regards.

Ok a note to ROSITY, the images in posts 55 and 91 did NOT make my eyes bleed, did not cause offence, or make me feel any different to normal. SO STOP THE BLOODY EXCESSIVE CENSORSHIP... jeese... by 2009 all characters will have to wear four layers of clothing, 2 bin liners and be encased in concrete, just so that it will please the powers that be so they can apparently "Please the masses"...????? errr... i thought i was one... perhaps they want us to go? is this just a subtle hint?