Over the past weeks I've been playing with the idea of making an online 3D store that charges no commissions. Kinda like DAZ3D, but without the 50/50 broker-user split. You make an account, offer your models for sale, and make all the money off them, you're in charge of your own advertisement for them, etc. i'd sell my own models and that would be that. paypal would handle the transactions. mazeltof. but yeah, this plan has a few ifs. 1. i might have the time to set up the store, but i don't have time to actively monitor it. also, while i do have a few click-and-install shopping cart sites, all four of them (CubeCart, Agora Cart, OS Commerce and Zen Cart) are hard to scale down to what i have in mind (they come pre-set with hundreds of little needless options). if you have any other store-like free web interface that you use on your site or whatever, please let me know. also, if someone is interested in running this with me, again, please let me know. 2. i'm in romania without a credit card or access to paypal. i'm interested in the legal ramifications of having a store like this. the server i host stuff from is in LA I believe, and I will need a new domain name (a .com for wob). now.. what are my options? who would i answer to legally? i don't want to answer to anyone, i just want people to be responsible for the models they sell, etc. that's why i said i don't really have the time to actively monitor each uploded item and so on. it's also logical given that i wouldn't make any money off the store. so, any ideas in this sense would also be helpful. i figure if i'm going to kickstart this, i should first find the time to accept and test out a few good models from people I know, whoever's interested in selling there. oh yeah.. would anyone be interested in this? forgot to ask, lol. i mean, would you host your stuff and be your own sales agent? m

Nice idea, will you be charging for the account?

nope, nothing.

Thats to nice of you, hope it all works out mate;)

it's just an idea, but thanks :) drac

Sounds like a nice idea. I hope you find it isn't too much of a monster, because your plan is generous and would be a good alternative, I think, to DAZ or 3D Cafe or whatever.

Just one little thing. Some of us, for some strange reason, do have problems setting up a paypal account. I have never been able to set one up, although I have good bank accounts and credit rating and so on. Paypal does seem like a great idea, if only I could get accepted by them. It seems part of the reason is the way we Brits enter our details for bank accounts, as against the way the yanks do it. For a start they kept wanting to know which state I lived in!

the 51st? drac runs

I think for the moment you'd be under the radar in terms of answering to anyone legally. As long as you had a disclaimer stating that you were in no way laible for the quality of product sold. You wouldn't be handeling or storing any financial info, paypal would, so you'd be off the hook there. You'd be providing a community, a prt of which is people selling, and as you have no financial stake other than your own goods, I would think you're clear. Even here in the US there are some retailers whose we affiliate gets away with charging no tax because it is a web site. So there seems to still be some laxity in how the web is legislated. Of course all that could change with talks that are going on lately about who should "own and run" the internet. At the end of the day though what is in it for you? Sounds like a LOT of work with no return...other than selling your own models...Though I suppose you would get some play out of using all the other member advertising to bring people to YOUR models....hmmmm

never actually thought of that. i do things mostly because i can. i just think it's possible to do it, and it would be fun. drac

You would need to consult a lawyer with some knowledge of copyright and trademark law. The first question would be "Does my site being hosted in L.A mean the laws of the US and California apply to the conduct of the business" The second question would be "Does the fact that I do not charge for hosting the product and payment is made direct to the seller isolate me for any damages resulting from Copyright or trademark infringment, defective product or any other failures on the part of the merchant" Somewhere in there would be a "Because I live in Romania does this mean I am unlikely to be successfully prosecuted because of ......" I think you need to consider some sort of fee because you probably have some bandwidth limits on the host site and if it becomes popular it could get expensive. Charging a fee though probably exposes you to some liability. You would need to collect and report sales tax for anything sold in California if your website is considered a place of business.

Yes you should run Drac.......after all we invented America (sort of)

Would people who live in CA have to pay sales tax? (Just thinking out loud)? Also, like brokers through DAZ are subject to paying income tax, how would that work out? Why has Len posted a blank message? You need a lawyer.

hmm..hey, I'm in America, and have no credit card either..;) if you want to give away some freebies though, I'm yer man..;)

@Phil
Just watching :-)

Len.
(And I was curious if "no text" would send an ebot - it does)

Okay, being thinking about this, If you set up the site/store, your merchants would have to sign an independent contractor agreement. That would take care of anyone in the US who would pay income taxes, they are responsible for collecting and saving any sales tax needed and removing a certain amount to cover their income tax. It would also get you of the hook legally for anything to do with their stores, HOWEVER, you must state that in the TOS, with your DISCLAIMER, and make it something people MUST READ and agree to before being allowed on/in the site/store.

As for carts, Paypal has a fair shopping cart setup, each merchant would be responsible for setting up their shopping cart through Paypal. For those of you outside the U.S. you would need to have an e-mail and bank account in the U.S. to sell and collect through Paypal. A matter of calling and establishing an accout with a US Bank, there is a list of 'international' banks that do business everywhere...pick a prominant one, or there abouts.

Then you would need to set up accounts on your server for merchants to upload their stuff (separate FTPs) to their store.

Questions, although this is very alturistic;

• who pays for the disk storage and bandwidth this would entail every month?
• What if the host goes out of business
• what will the up time be
• who would be managing the problems that would definitely arise everyday?
• Will your host allow this type of e-commerce?
• what is your TOS on nudity in the store(something that can get your site shutdown by Paypal)

Just some things think about....but it's a good idea, that's why I sell my stuff on my site cheaper, no commission to pay....=)

thanks for that zhann :) drac

seems like a good ideer, if it takes off i might join.

Mazeltov ? Drac is Jewish ? Sounds like a good idea. Seeing as I'm not a modeler,....it's not for me,..........however, my brother-in-law is an excellent modeler(Protofex), and I have been after him to sell but he has always been leery of sites that take huge commisions(cough, cough), I'll direct him to this thread. Best of luck drac.

Just a small point on the Paypal issue, I'm in the UK and have a viable Paypal account as do most of my friends. I've not heard of it being a problem for anyone till now to set one up. I don't understand the implications but thought it best to clear up that some of us outside the US seem able to have Paypal accounts, however that happened.

this sounds like a really great idea. though i may require help on setting up paypal and what not. other than that, Drac, this is a great idea.

...well I'm "speechless" - hence the "real" reason for my #13 post ;-)

Actually, even I think it's a good idea (and I hate the guy)! Just one thing he said that amazes me though, 'bout using WoB.com

LOL dude, if you're going to do it, do it right, and don't limit it's potential before you even get started. WoB is an excellent name for a "Bryce" website, but I think you could be wiser for "this" particular project.

What you're proposing has massive potential if run well enough, so why limit a "possible" expansion in the future. Rendergods.com is a great name to have under your belt for two reasons:

1 - It's universal, and doesn't tie you down to "Bryce" only (even if that's all you want for now).

2 - It's name is a perfect descriptive for people using "any" 3D app because no matter what, they "all" render (every app - now, and in the future)!

Len.
(Yeah, somethin' like that)

Len makes a good point. WOB will turn some people because they think it is excuslively bryce. rendergods sounds better to attract modelers S.Coleman (Waiting for the cash to flow in)

I like the name "rendergods" as well. Go for it, drac. ;)

I know nothing about this stuff, but it does seem to me that if you have no quality control over the stuff sold through your site, people may upload models that are extremely low-quality and hurt your reputation. I mean that people that have high-quality 3D files to upload will look at some of these low-quality models and simply assume that your site is not a profitable venture, and simply take their business elsewhere. Again, I have no clue what I'm talking about, but it does seem to me that this could end up being a very definite problem. Although, if you and Phil and maybe some other good modelers are providing the launch models, maybe this isn't really an issue. I would definitely be interested in selling something through a website like the one you describe (especially my textures, which have been well-received here), regardless. Since everyone seems to like the name "rendergods", perhaps you could simply expand the site you already have with an online store. Let me know if there is anything I can do to help (school permitting), although I do not know much about web development and maintenance. Best of luck to you and I hope this works out for you.

Just throwing the idea out, how about selling prints too?

Brilliant idea Drac. Like the idea of calling it after Rendergods too. (Just wish I could sort out my paypal password problems - I'm about to try) (again!) Good Luck with it Drac.