Hi midnight_stories,

My sincere apologies for any inconvenience.

We're human and sometimes things get past us, too.

The definition listed under no nudity are no female breasts and no butt cracks or genitals. There are visual aids provided in the guidelines if in doubt. (Of course, I guess I should put a disclaimer that with some monsters there is the potential for those locations to change ;-)

Each contest has it's own rules, it's own theme and it's own requirements. As long as they remain within the TOS guidelines, we like to allow for as much diversity and creative freedom as possible based upon the sponsors requests.

It is important to read the rules of each contest before entering.

Most people do not think of monsters as having genitals or being offensive - except in ugliness, of course! I would be more concerned if people are threatening violence as midnight's post indicates.

Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

One begs the question as to how goods for sale here are allowed to show FULL nudity when our images made with them are not allowed in the galleries!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The store is open to public view of all ages, is it not?????

RedtailHawk,

This thread is about the Halloween Contest which has "Contest RULES" so I really don't think this is the thread for your question.

Thanks

Quote - How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

None myself, but that's irrelevant to the discussion as human and humanoid are not always interchangable terms.  Humans are humanoids, but not all humanoids are human.

ok staci... i saw this heading only... 'Subject: what is considered nudity'.... nowhere does it say halloween... :(

Quote - > Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

 

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

ya should come live near me...ppl looking like that is pretty mild round here

No problem Redtailhawk, I just assumed you read the original post that started out with

 "There's a bit of a bun fight going on with the Halloween contest and we need a clear ruling on what is considered nudity. '

No worries though, have a great evening

"Yes, there were "ghostly" nipples...but nipples none the less"

It must be scary to see your hand pass trough....

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

 

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

 

 

 

ya should come live near me...ppl looking like that is pretty mild round here

LOL Ok I stand corrected there are people out there that look like that.

Like I said before, state that all monsters and ghosts need clothes covering breasts and genital areas. Most artists don't think of ghosts and monsters as being offensive in a sexual nature. That should have been stated. Humonoid is not clear.

Quote - God i love this site.

So do I.
Where else can you get into a heated argument over naked zombies? I bet they don't talk about this over at those fancy 3d sites like CGTalk!
 
I do think it's interesting that we're applying nudity guidelines to horrific images. It's okay to show zombies with their flesh dripping off and eating people's brains... just make sure they're clothed!
On the other hand, have you ever seen a zombie movie where the zombies did not wear clothes? Personally, I do not want to see any naked zombies. ;)
 
--John

Oh....pretty much anywhere.  At least among the major Poser-related sites -- which is admittedly limited to two (possibly three).

Quote -  I bet they don't talk about this over at those fancy 3d sites like CGTalk!

Probably not -- because much of what's permitted in the galleries here most likely would not be permitted at cgtalk.  Not to mention the fact that the forum moderation at cgtalk is far stricter than it is here.  A thread like this one would be stillborn over at cgtalk.  It's simply not allowed.

jeez, look at all those guys who showed up here july 4th! I musta missed that day. :lol: just lookin' at the first page of cgtalk's 3d gallery/forum; some images have over 30,000 views; no poser renders visible (but I didn't look beyond page 1). I'm guessing there ain't any nude aikos, nude zombies or nude skellingtons there, either. :lol:

Well, my zombies had all their naughty parts rotted off, LOL!!!

Quote - Nah, no need to go into the corner...come outta there... I caught the joke.. Im just going blind from image overload I guess and my brain is about to explode..so Im terrified to laugh :lol:

And I stand corrected on the 3PO..you are correct

May the force forbid it! Sith brains all over the place! We can't have that, no not at all, that just wouldn't do..............

On a serious note however, Jumps, so am I too take it that men now have to have shirts on? And why is it that there are full frontal nudes in some galleries here if thats not allowed anymore?

As usual confused...........

Sorry about the confusion BDC, the nudity clause that is being discussed is for the contests only..which differs a bit from the normal Renderosity standards in the galleries here.

No, males...including humans, zombies, trolls, ghosts, etc..  do not have to have a shirt on, but they have to be covered front and back on the genital and buttocks areas {genitals or not} with something that looks like solid clothing {no smoke, fog, shadows, props, blurring, smudging, or appendages like arms or legs covering those areas.

Females must have this same area covered, and this includes no thongs {If there is a slight upper hip area showing from the side that would be ok...but if the whole side per say were showing, and no hint of clothing, then it would not pass}

Female's also must have the entire breast area covered, not just the nipple area {slight cleavage from the top is ok} This includes humans, zombies, ghosts, trolls, etc, and cannot be covered by smoke, fog, shadows, props, blurring, smudging, or appendages like crossed arms

Whole bodied skeletons {bare bones} do not have to be clothed.

Beasts with full bodied fur do not have to be clothed {unless someone gets a wild idea to add obvious genitals LOL}

Hope that helps

Toddles back over to her cauldron

Thanks jumps!

Running Moonshine is still illegal aint it?

LOL

Wait, so a man's nipples are fine, but a woman's aren't? :blink:

It's the same freaking thing! Why is one acceptable and the other not?

Ok, if its the same thing...then ask a man and a woman to walk down the street  in the city, say...in Tenn... both with no top whatsoever on, and see who gets a ticket and jail time for indecent exposure.

But see, technically both should, or neither should.

Just another example of how FUBAR'ed our society is.

Well, guess we can blame Adam and Eve...if they had gotten rid of the snake we'd all be ok :lol:

And we should be still apes....

Quote - Well, guess we can blame Adam and Eve...if they had gotten rid of the snake we'd all be ok :lol:

Nah, I'll blame those people wh think they know what's best for me, and only want me thinking a certain way.

ojalque tantos no sean monos, ricardo. :lol:

Quote - Ok, if its the same thing...then ask a man and a woman to walk down the street  in the city, say...in Tenn... both with no top whatsoever on, and see who gets a ticket and jail time for indecent exposure.

Actually jumpy, as a coordinator, you have a responsibility to be accurate. While that may be the case in Tennesee, there are many places in the United States, Canada, and other countries where being "top free" is not illegal. In US cities and states where women are arrested for being "top free" they are more frequently arrested for disorderly conduct or being a public nuisance as opposed to 'indencent" exposure because there is no state law or local ordinance against it. 

I am not arguing for or against Renderosity's policy, or the fixation for and against nudity by members. I do wish we would stop criminalizing women's breasts and teaching our children to be ashamed of their bodies.

I would like to point out the following as examples concerning women's exposed breasts and the law.

In New York City there is an old law on the books that allows a women to be "top free" in public, providing it is not being used as a business. Women's right to be topless in public was legalized in New York state in 1992. In Arizona, female breasts don't constitute "private parts" under state law according to the Arizona State Supreme Court. It is not illegal for woment to be "top free" in Hawai, Ohio, Texas, or Eugene, Oregon. It is legal for women to be "top free" in Daytona Beach, Florida if  you are engaging in a protest or demonstration. It is not illegal for women to be "top free" in South Beach or Miami Beach, Florida, or in Washington, D.C.

Thanks in part to Desiree Davis, a 34 year old woman who mowed her lawn "top free" it is not illegal for women to be top free in Newport, Maine. The law in Maine prohibits the display of genitalia or the committing of sexual acts in public. It was found that breasts are not genitalia, and lawn mowing was not a sexual act. Debra Ballou and Kathryn Mann naked joggers attending the University of Maine won a case against indecent exposure. Judge Jesse Gunther of the 3rd District Court in Bangor said that a woman naked in the street is not an indecent act under Maine law because a woman’s genitals are primarily internal.

In Liverpool, England, women can sell items and be topless...but only in tropical fish stores.

In may European countries and Australia females may go "top free" at beaches, parks and swimming pools amond other places. It is not illegal for women to be "top free" in British Columbia, Ontario, or parts of Manitoba. Theoretically it's not currently illegal anywhere in Canada since sexual equality is an amendment to the Canadian Constitution.

Ironically, a fully clothed Miss Universe 2005, Natalie Glebovawas, was briefly barred from attending the opening of a Thai festival at Nathan Phillips Square in her hometown of Toronto thanks to an almost 2 decades old ordinance that considered the pagent among "activities which degrade men or women through sexual stereotyping, or exploit the bodies of men, women, boys or girls solely for the purpose of attracting attention". To be fair, the city conceded she could attend but she couldn't wear her sash or tiara, and couldn't be referred to as either Miss Universe or a beauty queen. They were permitted to to her as "an individual of note contributing to our community." Go figure...maybe if she would have been "top free" there wouldn't have been a problem.

Hi tainted_heart,

jumpstartme2 was being accurate, topless women walking around in public can be arrested for indecent exposure, at least in Nashville. Here's the law:  http://www.nac.oshkosh.net/StatesFrames/State_Laws_Frames/Tennessee_Laws/body_tennessee_laws.html

(A) "Nudity" or "state of nudity" means the showing of the bare human male or female genitals or pubic area with less than a fully opaque covering, the showing of the female breast with less than a fully opaque covering of the areola, or the showing of the covered male genitals in a discernibly turgid state. "Nudity" or "state of nudity" does not include a mother in the act of nursing the mother's baby;

But, it gets even funnier, a man has been arrested for indecent exposure because he bared his female looking breasts:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161748,00.html

Anyway, this is an interesting and thought provoking discussion.

As it relates to the contests its a rather simple matter. If we want big prizes from corporate sponsors, we will present images that will not get them in trouble for "sexual harrassment" while showing the images in their board room.

Best wishes,
Lillian

We have plenty of other contests that do not have such strict guidelines around nudity.

However, when we have these large community contests with lots of corporate sponsors, the rules are strict.

When everyone around the planet is comfortable with public nudity and nudity in the workplace I'm pretty sure we can relax these large contest rules.

Good, bad or otherwise, it is the reality in which we find ourselves at this point in time.

Quote - jumpstartme2 was being accurate, topless women walking around in public can be arrested for indecent exposure.

She was accurate regarding the state of Tennesee, which I agreed was the case; however, she seemed to be making a broad, generalized statement and used Tennessee as a single example, and there are many other cities and states that do not follow the example of Tennessee as I pointed out in my earlier post.

Quote - If we want big prizes from corporate sponsors, we will present images that will not get them in trouble for "sexual harrassment" while showing the images in their board room.

While I have no objection to Renderosity obtaining big prizes from sponsors, I find the idea of showing a work of art that contains a humanoid creature that has no genitals and is not covered from the waist down, in a board room leading to a "sexual harrassment" charge ludicrous, and hardly credible. I can't believe you could say that with a straight face and expect anyone to really believe it. I can't even imagine a company showing an image that contained an exposed pair of zombie breasts and won their prize, to their board being concerned about sexual harrassment.

Renderosity is certainly welcome to have whatever rules they desire for their contests, but better to say "these are the rules we choose because we want to judge images on their merits and not be concerned about images that cross the line or push the envelope of our version of decency" then a lame excuse like sponsors are worried about sexual harrassment charges in the board room. Puhlease!

Best Wishes

Ok, genitalia must be coveredby clothes, but can someone tell me where aliens have their genitalia?

I agree with you on this tainted_heart...the laws are so varied it's hard to keep up with where you can bare it and where you'll get locked up.

I'm just sharing a concern previously expressed by a few of the sponsors. The comment was not made about monsters (with or without genitals), but about showing digital art work containing nudity...in a business situation and a corporate setting.

maybe those wishing to use nude zombies could cover the boobs-n-pubes with some strategically-placed tree branches or tombstones. but I agree about not trying to force nudie pix upon those who don't wanna see 'em or sponsor 'em. in answer to ricardo's question, our current state of knowledge indicates that there are no aliens within travel distance of this planet, but if the lisenko-ists are correct (they aren't), then the aliens' equipment is in the same place as humans.

Ok, bring on the cat pictures!!!

Quote - I agree with you on this tainted_heart...the laws are so varied it's hard to keep up with where you can bare it and where you'll get locked up. I'm just sharing a concern previously expressed by a few of the sponsors. The comment was not made about monsters (with or without genitals), but about showing digital art work containing nudity...in a business situation and a corporate setting.

Well since the first post in this thread concerned the Halloween Contest rules requiring humanoid monsters and beasties to be clothed, I thought I'd throw that in. I can force myself to believe, with a stretch, there might be one sponsor concerned about sexual harrasment charges as a result of displaying digital art containing nudity to their board...although I still find it ludicrous and unlikely. It's much easier to believe there are some sponsors that just don't want to deal with the issue of nudity, in today's moral and politcal climate; and because there are few places one can use a prize winning image containing nudity for promotion of their product or their generosity.

I don't think anyone has a valid concern or objection to Renderosity's policy of no nudity in contests. There is a concern when nudity rules are being applied to figures that have no genitals when those figures are...well...creatures and beasties, and they are "blank" between their legs. Nudity is widely defined as the exposure of genitals and when said figures not only are creatures and beasties, but have no genitals to expose, they can hardly be considered to be nude just as. It taxes my mind to it's very limt to believe any "corporate sponsor" could be so ultra-prudish or be the least bit concerned about sexual harrassment charges resulting from displaying such an image. I honestly cannot, even in my wildest dreams, come up with any sane reason that would justify such a requirement. :blink:

Cheers.

Ahh I was just coming in here to post that very link Lillian :biggrin:

@Tainted: Actually, I used Tennessee for one reason, and thats because Bondware and Rendo are located there.

As for indecent exposure in other places, sure..laws differ...and in some states, yes you can go topless..doesnt mean everyone is going to accept it tho..and it doesnt mean that you can do that just anywhere either..some states have specific places people can go...now, iirc Texas {where I am} has topless beaches...but not all beaches here in Texas are topless...you go to one where topless is not allowed, take off your top and be free,.. you can get into trouble.

Then you have some areas in certain states, where the state itself might allow topless, but then in the small towns and larger cities it wont fly....for instance, you cant go to Houston, Tx and take your top off and walk down main street...and in my smaller town outside Houston, you would rather eat a dead snake than get caught running around here with your top off. :biggrin:

Im not claiming I know all the laws in all the states of the US, because Im not a lawyer, and its not my job to know such things, but the linl Lillian posted was the one I was going to post, because it pertained to the situation and the area . We might not agree with the laws, but we do have to follow them.

Quote - Ok, genitalia must be coveredby clothes, but can someone tell me where aliens have their genitalia?

Hmmm... don't know about most places, but the girl I used to date from Deneb 3 kept 'em in her purse. Said it was much more convenient that way, and she could just loan 'em out if she had a headache.

giggle

Captain Jack

Quote - As for indecent exposure in other places, sure..

And, did you know, there are actually places on the Internet where people go topless? Can you imagine? The things ya learn every day...

Totally mind boggling innit? :biggrin:

"Nudity is widely defined as the exposure of genitals and when said figures not only are creatures and beasties, but have no genitals to expose, they can hardly be considered to be nude just as."

Moralists are perverted people that are able to see perversion where nobody does.
You see a moster that has no sex, they see their sexual organs.
You see Donald Duck sleeping in bed with his nephews, they see an act of paedophilia.

Hey folks,

As this thread is centered around the Halloween contest, it is being moved to the Contest forum.

Thanks,
Lillian