I  just started this new head modeling project in Modo.  It's way more complex than anything I've done before, and I was wondering if anybody had any general tips aboiut modeling the nose (which as you can see I'm just getting to), and the ear too.  It's turning out to be very hard to get the little inward turning crease just back of the nostril.  Any advice appreciated. 

First question:

Are you using any references at all? If not, you should. It would make some things easier to "see".

Have a look at Bay Raitt's site. He's got an animated gif showing how to do this from a cube. The layout would be similar using edge extrusion:

http://cube.phlatt.net/home/spiraloid/movies/movies.html

I think I wrote a brief tut on this somewhere but I don't have it on my PC anymore (HD failure).  I'll search around.

Another place to look would be the Joan Of Arc tutorial at www.3dtotal.com in the tutorial section

Thanks.  I'll check those out!  And yes, I'm definately using backdrop photo references.  :)   I'm not a good enough artist to go even this far without them.  But there seem to be certain sections where the photos don't help much, like behind the nostils.  And the ear looks daunting.  .  One thing I thought of was whether maybe some people do the nose and ear seperately, unlike what I'm doing here, and then just join the verts?

Some people do that, yes. I personally don't do that anymore, though I used to do it from time to time. It really depends on the situation I guess.

Don't have much insight really, mostly thought I'd comisserate, that said...I HATE modeling noses! They get me every time. Ears, not so much of a problem, they have a nice flow to them for me, but noses always snare me. I'd rather model ten ears than one nose.

Best advice I can offer, is dig up a ton of wireframe images from other people, and see how they do it, and go from there. Find the flow that fits yours the best, and give that a try, maybe mix and match a couple different approaches if need be. Doesn't matter how you get there, as long as it looks good, and doesn't hurt the model any. It looks like you're off to a fair start so far.

As for modeling the part seprate, then attaching it, I find that works ok for the ears, b/c you can hide a lot of stuff around and behind them if need be. In fact I'm not sure I've ever modeled an ear attached, maybe on a low-poly model, but that's a whole different ballgame.

I think its best to model the nose in place tho so that it flows with the rest of the model. Its a lot harder to hide excess geometry right in the middle of the face, with all the deformation areas around, and not have problems.

You can always remove the excess geometry...assuming you aren't modeling at high poly level (what's the point of subdividing if you are?). However, I agree that it improves the flow if you model everything fresh and I find it works best for all the features of the head.  The advice that you should look at the wires of others to learn how they do it, is GREAT! That's how I learned and eventually, things just start to make sense - in terms of the process.  Base meshes used for sculpting are especially useful to this end, as they are the bare bones starting point usually, without the excess polygons subdivision brings.

Thought I'd follow Teyon's lead and cough up one of my own wireframes, mind you its not the best, but its something to look at anyway.

I started with the eyes, worked out a few loops around them. Then I went to the mouth, to get its location and shape nailed down, again, worked out a couple loops aroung it. Filled the nose in between the two, filled the cheeks in, then flushed out the chin and jawline. Did the ear seperate, patched it on, you can see some "extra" geometry around it becuase of that. Then I filled in the rest of the skull and started down the neck.

It seems like if you work too much detail into one area too early, you're bound to have trouble. Keep it as simple as you can, and add too it as you go if need be. I probably started both the eyes and the mouth with 8 or 12 [at the most] sided discs. That way as I worked on another area, and needed more geometry for it, I could easily just split a band of polys and make the appropriate adjustments, without being overwhelmed with a ton of extra geomtry.

Wow, you guys are (to use an ancient colloquialism) way cool!  I really appreciate all the help.  I'll let you know how things turn out.

That's what we're here for. :) Here's a few images you may find usefull.  - note, I did not make these. (or the one above)

Copyright 2007 Ubisoft.

 a way of "seeing". There are others.

So take a look at the tutorial and images and try to find your way around it. Be sure to post your work, so that we can help you more. :)

Here's the latest.  As you can see, I decided to delete the nose polys and start that part again.

Good starting point. Now you just need to carve out the nostril bumps and make the flesh inbetween the nostril openings a little thinner and  you're good to go.

Attached Link: Character Modeling (video tuts on Vertex Monkey)

Hi there,

Nice to see another Modo user on Rendo.
There are lots of learning materials on modeling on the Lux site (have you seen their lates Luxology.TV section). Or you can get the needed stuff on the other great places for Modo resoursesv - "Vertex Monkey" site.
I added the link here to the section dedicated to the Character Modeling (one of the movies is for Nose modeling)

Cheers
slav