More in fnformation (evemn if it's side tracked) is always a good thing, IMHO. it answers questions pople don't think to ask.

Thanks for the clarifications people  I knew it sounded like BS.

Darkedge and gareee: i thought  your input into this thread  was helpful and did clear up questions that branched from my original post it was a few other people who didnt seem to add any real input or answer any questions that i was referring to in my last post!

Thanks!!

When I've created conforming footwear from the VF Meshes I've made, I've boned them in the setup room off of EF CR2's as Bone donors. That's a perfect example of using the copyrighted CR2 in a legitimate form for redistribution.  It doesn't contain any of the original figure's mesh but it most certainly uses the same bone structure from the original and has certainly been allowed by the EULA according to the passage I've already quoted here.

Quote - Sorry, my mistake.

Regardless, the opinions of seasoned merchants ARE NOT law.  Characters created from Dialed morphs are perfectly legal.  Frowned upon by some for whatever reason, but not illegal.

The reason it is frowned on is pretty simple: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2718127 That, and others like it... If you sell something based on simply spinning the supplied dials, then someone else can do the exact same thing, with the exact same settings, and there is literally no copyright violation. Diva V4 is an admitted spin-up - yet there's the merchant, complaining about someone else possibly using the same settings in another product and asking if it's a copyright violation (I'll give him/her credit that much - they asked, not demanded). But - there's no copyright on dial settings. If you built a specific morph from magnets or vertex manipulation (e.g. you built the dial itself), then you can copyright it. As it is, I could literally buy Diva V4, give the dial settings away for free, and nobody (yes, nobody) can come after me for doing so, because the merchant in that case has specifically said that s/he only used existing dial settings to create the shape. (NOTE! The textures are his/hers, and are copyrightable, so don't be stupid about it, plz). /P

On .cr2's - V4 Moprhs++ cannot have its .cr2 given away, in whole or in part. It's similar to why you cannot give away the old Victoria 2 .cr2 away, since you stand a good change of inadvertantly giving away morphs that should otherwise be bought that belong to DAZ. ...and that's why DAZ provides a blank .cr2 template to work on as well. HTH, /P

Anyone can create their own blank CR2 these days with MorphManager and probably a few other freebie tools out there. Simply use MorphManager to delete all the morphs from an existing CR2 and resave it as a blank dev CR2. Then load it in Poser or a text editor and remove all the material information leaving a blank white character to work with.

Actually, not everyone can (Mac users) and the CR2 can't be distributed in many cases.

Quote - But - there's no copyright on dial settings. If you built a specific morph from magnets or vertex manipulation (e.g. you built the dial itself), then you can copyright it. As it is, I could literally buy Diva V4, give the dial settings away for free, and nobody (yes, nobody) can come after me for doing so, because the merchant in that case has specifically said that s/he only used existing dial settings to create the shape. (NOTE! The textures are his/hers, and are copyrightable, so don't be stupid about it, plz). /P

Wtf? You will completely ignore the license you purchased. The redistribution we're talking about is a license restriction, not copyright.  Contract law is not necessarily an intellectual property topic.  boggles

Quote - Actually, not everyone can (Mac users) and the CR2 can't be distributed in many cases.

Mac users have Text editors don't they? It may be harder but the morphs can still be removed that way as well.

Quote - > Quote - But - there's no copyright on dial settings. If you built a specific morph from magnets or vertex manipulation (e.g. you built the dial itself), then you can copyright it. As it is, I could literally buy Diva V4, give the dial settings away for free, and nobody (yes, nobody) can come after me for doing so, because the merchant in that case has specifically said that s/he only used existing dial settings to create the shape. (NOTE! The textures are his/hers, and are copyrightable, so don't be stupid about it, plz). /P

Wtf? You will completely ignore the license you purchased. The redistribution we're talking about is a license restriction, not copyright.  Contract law is not necessarily an intellectual property topic.  boggles

April, I seriously doubt Pengie would do that but he makes a very valid point about the dial settings being easily recreated by anyone with a mouse and a good pair of eyes.

I dispute that you can recreate exact dial values someone else came up with independently.  These dial values up to the 4th decimal over multiple dials?  The chances of you coming to the exact same values is laughable.  IMO, exact matches on possibly ... 5 face morph dials, would be proof enough to report a redistribution (not a "recreation") infraction to the store.  Theives would have to be a bit more clever and modify their dial values just once place... sad laugh

Wouldn't it depend on the number of dials used? Let's say tere are only two dials.. that would be prety easy to figure out.. but the more you add in the mix, the more difficult it would be to recreate.

But I KNOW I've lost dial settings I did myself, and recreated those to the best of my memory in products I've developed, and recreated them pretty easily. maybe not 100%, but to the naked eye, close enough that it looked the same.

I never buy any dial spinning products because if they can dial spin, i KNOW I can as well, and come up with similar or the same results.

Quote - [
Wtf? You will completely ignore the license you purchased. The redistribution we're talking about is a license restriction, not copyright.  Contract law is not necessarily an intellectual property topic.  boggles

Certainly - though I'm fairly sure that loopholes are present in there that could be exploited easily enough. Like this one:

"The Buyer may not redistribute this archive file, in whole or in part."

So, if I pass around the .cr2 file that came with it (or a piece of that file), then yes I would be (hypothetically, yo) violating the Rendo license. However, if I pass around a list of the dial settings used, I would have, in all legality, not redistributed any part of the archive file at all (that is, any part of the .zip file thingy you download).

How can I say that? Look at the .cr2 file, where all the morph dials live... it contains a list of deltas for each affected vertex for a given morph. Passing around the dial settings is merely throwing out one number for a dial which happens to sit on another cr2 file. So instead of a long list of cartesian and vector detlas, I say "ThirdNipple: 0.56" or whatever.

(Big Fat Clue: No, I'm not going to do any such thing. I'm merely pointing out that legally and even contractually, I can. )

Now- a custom morph has no similar dial on any other .cr2, anywhere. Therefore I would have to have that .cr2, which means I would be violating the license (duh), and copyright (since the custom morph isn't merely a dial setting anymore, but a custom "dial" itself).

Now for the really fun part: The whole argument becomes moot when someone spawns a new morph dial from the collection of dial spins and uses that instead of simply spinning dials - because no longer would I, sleazy dial-set-spreading slimebag that I am, be able to pass that around without either a) picking apart each dial setting one-at-a-time, or b) break copyright by passing around the delta info (e.g. the .cr2 bits).

But wait - if you're not confuzzled enough, it gets even stranger: If I loaded the sold custom V4 figure in a scene as a wireframe display, and spun a shedload of dials on another V4 to match it as perfectly as possible, how on Earth would you know that I did it that way, and would passing those settings around be a true copyright violation? (no, we're not talking celebrity likenesses here, though that's a whole other bucket of legal mucus which we really don't want staining our brains).

Trust me, this wee CG world in which we play can have some really, really convoluted tunnels in it. :)

/P

Ah - I think I found a saving grace for the dial-spin set, and something I had overlooked:

...or did I?

From the rendo license:

"If Artist can show that any of the original material can be extracted from Buyer's derivative work, Artist can demand both the original and derivative work, and all copies thereof be deleted."

But then "Artist" would have to prove that the dial setting was "original material".

Anyone know of a faster way to destroy your rep as a merchant than to admit to simply spinning a few dials to create a character?

But then, I suspect that this may be a saving grace that I had apparently overlooked, no?

Well, sort of. If I reproduced tthe exact 4-decimal-digit settings, then yes, it appears I can no longer pass around the hypothetical dial settings. But if the accuracy is only 2-digit (which is the default display in DAZ|Studio), then no more violation, and the settings would be 'close enough for government work', so to speak...

I'll chew on it for a bit - you (and the PTB) may want to as well.

Discuss. :)

/P

Ok... no I certainly don't want to even imagine a bucket of legal mucus... heh
I was just a bit shocked at what you posted... I don't partake of forums much these days and when I noticed people have forgotten how to save MOR poses (dial spun characters) and whether or not they are even allowed to sell them, with a few non-newbies giving contradictory and irrelevant/off-topic/side-tracked/whathaveyou advice, your (apparently hypothetical) scenario made me think the whole place had gone mad. 8o
Anyway, I hope the folks with serious questions are actually getting the right answers here... :/
No more from me though, I'll leave it to the experts. ;)

That's where a lot of probems occur I think.. new "get rich quick" people see what COULD be done, and gfo ahead and try it, and then end up getting buried in the process.

yeah you CAN play devil's advocate, but when new peopel are trying to learn the proper way to do things, it's a bad idea, IMHO.

What's all this fuss about people selling character "morphs" that are nothing but dial spins?  Many (imo MOST) DAZ type characters are sold this way, certainly the majority of the ones I own (many from DAZ, from big-name vendors).

Hehe - no worries... let's boil it down to a simple thing:

Bad option: If you want to create and sell a character that you built from just dial spins, go for it - but don't complain too loud if someone rips it off, because the Rendo PTB themselves will nicely tell you there's not much you can do about it (as evidenced by the linked discussion I pointed to earlier in this thread).

Better option: If you create a big fat "spawn morph" dial out of it, or create a MOR file (not too many people do that nowadays... pity), then you stand a better chance of having your item protected.

Best option: Use magnets (or a modeling program) and create something unique. Then create morphs from that.

Packaging the critter is easy: get (or create) a blank .cr2 file for the figure you morphed. Add your specific morphs to it. Sell that.

=====================

Quote - That's where a lot of probems occur I think.. new "get rich quick" people see what COULD be done, and gfo ahead and try it, and then end up getting buried in the process.

Sure - but we're not everyone's moral babysitter. The truth will out eventually, and from what I've seen of this wee world we inhabit, very few discovered charlatans get out alive, let alone get the chance to rehabilitate their reps. Bamboozle at your peril. :)

Quote - yeah you CAN play devil's advocate, but when new peopel are trying to learn the proper way to do things, it's a bad idea, IMHO.

I kinda don't want to water things down for the merchant types... selling something should be done by someone who actually understands what they're getting into, eyes open. I mean this on both technical and business levels. If it scares 'em, I'm sorry, but its better to know about it now than to find out about it the hard way.

Users? Sure - let's make things as easy and clear as possible for folks to use the proggie and get cozy with it... no problem.

Merchants (or aspiring merchants)? Sorry, but usually someone wanting money for a product is supposed to be, you know, a pro. Someone who knows what they're doing. Someone who can offer something unique for a price.

It's a double standard, yeah... but for some pretty basic reasons, IMHO.

/P

Yep ... Mac users do have text editors but it is a PAIN ... LOL I have been doing this for years and I still don't want to strip it all manually.

When I do something that I sell I normally have a lot of dial spins included. But they also have textures and normally aren't a simple dial spin. (They also might have custom morphs as well). They normally have at least 30 dials spun and mostly help to sell the package. I am not going for one specific look for a set (i.e. trying to get the best actor or actress with dials spins and only that one character) but I really don't want to show my stuff on the default figure and head ... Not that they don't work, but I just don't work that way :)

quote: "Anyone know of a faster way to destroy your rep as a merchant than to admit to simply spinning a few dials to create a character?" surely a lot of the characters on the market are just dial spins. I like the fact they can wear the clothes and you can see the dials so you can fit them properly. there's nothing wrong with this. I would still buy it if I liked the character. Love esther

Yep .. That is one thing that is good with them ... And one reason I rarely will buy or use a character like Girl Next Door which nothing will fit. I think I have most of his stuff, actually, but it makes it really difficult to clothe which makes it mostly sit around for me. Same thing for other custom morphs. They don't fit in clothes and are kind of a mess because of that and take a long time for me to finally try them out.

So, err... how many clothes do you put on something's head? ;)

Okay, okay... but you get the idea.

I can grok the fact that custom bodies require custom clothing morphs, but that said, there are lots of options about for custom body morphs - Clothing Converters/WizardsDressers, simply supplying the magnets to modify the clothing atop the figure (those who have done this are to be admired, IMHO), or simply paint the clothing on in P-Shop during postwork (which a lot of folks do anyway).

/P

Okay, I'm gonna throw my twenty-five cents worth in (inflation yah know), and brave the hoopla that may come. In just about every case of a character set I have bought from DAZ or Rendo, the character consisted of 'dial spins'. My characters in the store are careful dial spins. Most people who use Poser are hobbyists, and many are very new to the program starting out with P7. I started in 1998 with Poser 3 and have been using the program continually. Many of these people do not have the time, the inclination, or understanding yet to create their own characters with their own textures, MAT Poses and INJ/REM poses. All of the processes which go into making a character and texture set to sell in the store takes a lot of time to learn. And I'm still learning it. When the Rendo store was new to the site, I had a set of textures for sale for some of Xurges things (and worked with him specifically to texture two armor sets). Way back then, one had to produce a MAT file by hand in a text editor by hacking the saved pose for the material settings. Now there are utilities and python scripts to produce these poses for you, and in some cases they still have to be hand edited. I also use texture bases (Merchant Resource Packages), and my particular favorites to work from are produced by VictoriasStyle, and I'm proud to say so. Product creation is a long process with a learning curve and a lot of trial and error and I do it for those people who either haven't learned these skills yet and want a beautiful character for their images, or don't have the time to spend on this long process but still want something nice to work with. (Some people may be so new that they don't even know how to install the files into Poser which is why the beta testers require that the zip file be completely ready to unzip directly into Poser. I, personally NEVER ever unzip directly into Poser, but this is a requirement from the store staff so I've made the zips to spec. And yes, there are people out there that are that new, my partner is one of these people. She has Poser 5 and I will come in and supervise as she installs files for testing since she created important texture elements for my latest package which is in the testing phase right now.)

I think rather that this discussion went astray simply because of symantics from a new comer who called their character a 'morph' rather than saying it was created from dial settings. If the original poster of this thread wants to sell his character made from dial spins, or go into Zbrush and create a new morph and sell it in the market place, more power to him. The creation process either way to making a package for the Marketplace takes time, effort, dedication, and acquiring skills using MAT creation utilities, INJection utilities, paint programs, and last but not least rendering skills to make promo images of your product. I encourage him to the learn the process.

getting down off of soap box and putting it away

(Edited to show one of my original promo ads)

Liz Pope
Latexluv
Dreamspinner

"I think rather that this discussion went astray simply because of symantics from a new comer who called their character a 'morph' rather than saying it was created from dial settings. If the original poster of this thread wants to sell his character made from dial spins, or go into Zbrush and create a new morph and sell it in the market place, more power to him. "

Except technically a "morph" derived from a combination of other product morphs IS a violation of allowed use, and IS no longer an original product, but one derived from the original morphs illegally.

it's no different then someone using photoshop to combine two texture sets (or elements from) and reselling that as a "new" product... and it's also in voliation of Rendo's original content agreement you must sign when you submit here (or even over at Daz for that matter.)

While it might seem like a nit picking of terminology, there is a HUGE difference in MORPHS created and distributed, and MOR POSES which do NOT include point manipulation data, but setting for a required morph product.

And for someone looking to sell in the marketplace, they NEED to know what they can and CANNOT legally redistribute in a new product.

Imagine if I just combined a few of capsces morphs together, and then redistributed THAT as a "new" morph set of my own making! That would literally be robbing her of her talent and work, and presenting it ads my own creation.

The reason I used that as an example, is we both DO create morph sets, and when you actually use them, you see a very marked difference in how both look.. we both have distinctive morph "styles" and you don't use your use your OWN talent in creating MORPHS when you spin dials, export that into zbrush, and then add that back into poser creating your "own" morph.

New content crators need to learn to respect the copyright and legal use of products they purchase, plain and simple.

Just because you CAN do something doesn't make it legal to do so, and does not make it your own work.

Its no different then someone saying "I want to copy Poser for my freinds... how can I do this?", and someone replying it's illegal and it's protected by copyright, but then someone else [Pengy] popping in providing them methods on duplicating it and redistributing it, and THEN saying "But you really shouldn't do it."

Quote - Many of these people do not have the time, the inclination, or understanding yet to create their own characters with their own textures, MAT Poses and INJ/REM poses. All of the processes which go into making a character and texture set to sell in the store takes a lot of time to learn.

Fair enough, if you're a user. But a Merchant is supposed to, you know... know better, no?

Quote - I, personally NEVER ever unzip directly into Poser, but this is a requirement from the store staff so I've made the zips to spec.

No worries there... the new folks can unzip what they need right into Poser's directory structure, while you, me, and lots of other folks dump the results into a dummy runtime or scratch area so as to sort things out for our own filing system.

Quote - I think rather that this discussion went astray simply because of symantics from a new comer who called their character a 'morph' rather than saying it was created from dial settings. If the original poster of this thread wants to sell his character made from dial spins, or go into Zbrush and create a new morph and sell it in the market place, more power to him.

Semantics can be nasty, but there's a reason for the precision:

IMHO, dial-spins have far, far, far less contractual protection (apparently not much, and zero copyright protection) than actual morphs, and even less than any dial-spinning that gets saved off as a specific morph.

Quote - The creation process either way to making a package for the Marketplace takes time, effort, dedication, and acquiring skills using MAT creation utilities, INJection utilities, paint programs, and last but not least rendering skills to make promo images of your product. I encourage him to the learn the process.

I agree that learning the process is a good thing. OTOH, if you're just going to whomp out something and save it off as something that anyone can (technically and legally) copy off and pass around with very little effort, then it's a setup for disaster, IMHO.

Ugly scenario: If you build a character with simple dial settings (and nothing else), and someone else (legally) copies those dial settings and sells the same thing with a different texture (off of some other merchant resource package, or even perhaps the same one you used as a base) for a lower price? Yes, that would be ultra sleazy. Yes, it would show a complete lack of scruples. But yes, it would be perfectly legal, and the worst that would happen is that someone gets banned from the store under that username (which means they simply grab the stuff from p2p and continue copying off the dial settings for other stuff and selling the results at another store)...

I want to emphasize that no, I myself would never do this. However, that wouldn't stop someone else from doing it, no? And, it would undermine both the merchants who do the original dial-spin rig-ups, as well as the store selling them.

Sooooo... why not save the potential headache and heartache and at least try to protect one's own work? It wouldn't take much to list the dial settings used for clothing (if said clothing supported it), and leave out the list of facial settings entirely. Save it as a body morph. Save it as a MOR file. Export the individual morphs (head, body) and re-import them under another name. Something - anything... so that you can credibly say that they are your creation, and have something to back that up with.

I'm not looking to pick an argument. What I am doing is to show in clear terms exactly what pitfalls are there to anyone who sells "character" items made from simple dial spins.

/P

Quote -

Just because you CAN do something doesn't make it legal to do so, and does not make it your own work.

Its no different then someone saying "I want to copy Poser for my freinds... how can I do this?", and someone replying it's illegal and it's protected by copyright, but then someone else [Pengy] popping in providing them methods on duplicating it and redistributing it, and THEN saying "But you really shouldn't do it."

Everything I mentioned is perfectly and 100% legal. Period. You simply cannot copyright a dial setting.

That said, if you do any of it, you deserve whatever pitchforks and flames you get for pulling such stunts.

It's part and parcel of the dangers of selling something, really - and in at least one case someone has already done it!  (at least according to a certain locked thread in the copyrights forum).

Point is simple (and worth repeating): If you're going to sell it, protect it. There are lots of means by which you can do so, which I just mentioned in my previous post.

/P

Ok, so how then Pengy would you protect say, facial morphs from Capsces set as an example? How would you prevent people from combining say 4 of her morphs together, exporting that obj, and then importing that, creating their own  "new" "original" morph?

As far as I know, there IS no way to technically protect that. But I'll bet Capsces would spot that in a second, and be be able to duplicate it, proving that it was derivitive of her morph set, and therefore a breach of her copyright.

As I said, just because you CAN do something doesn't make it ethical or legal to do. I would have NO issue at ALL with someone releasing a character set with a mor pose for that example, but I WOULD have an issue with that if the morphs were presented as "original work", and had been simply exported in one of the many methods, and then imported back in, renamed, and then made injectable.

Pengy, while it may be technically legal, it's not ethical.  While you may not be able to be tried for a crime, you'd certainly be open to a civil lawsuit, if caught and the originating artist decided to go down that road.

On another note, I'm requesting that either we get back to the ORIGINAL topic of making INJ/REM poses for morph dials, or let the thread die.  I don't want to have to lock it just because someone decides to push things too far over the line.

Jeni

shrug - fair enough... let the thread die. I shan't push anything over any invisible lines. /P

Quote - Pengy, while it may be technically legal, it's not ethical.  While you may not be able to be tried for a crime, you'd certainly be open to a civil lawsuit, if caught and the originating artist decided to go down that road.

 

I think that's the point he was trying to make.

Me, I'd also like to see an end to the bickering. This thread has been long on argument, and short on relevant information. I for one would like to know how to do these things myself. I don't have the motivation to be a merchant, but it might help me retain characters/looks/etc for my personal work.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2718282

I posted a tutorial on using IPB ($1.99 at DAZ if you're in the Platinum Club) to save characters....otherwise, you'll have to write it yourself, and I have NO clue how to do that, lol.  Otherwise, I'd tutorialize that, too ;)

If I might add my 1 cent's worth as a potential buyer: I admit that I use mostly Bryce and don't really belong to this Forum. BUT I've been hearing about this thread from my partner for two days now and have an interest in dabbling (as a hobbyist) in the program. So, that said, let me tell you how I see it.

Stop picking on the guy for wanting to give selling something a shot. Just because a few  self-proclaimed experts can twiddle some dials and make something nice, it doesn't mean that everyone can. If someone out there can turn some dials and make exactly what I'm looking for, you can bet I'm right there with my credit card to buy it. And that's my choice. In fact, I'm on the lookout for something very specific myself. Have been since 2005 and STILL haven't seen it, by dial turn or by morph, from ANY of you. So give the guy a chance. There could be lots of people out there, just wanting his product to show up. They might be like me and totally intimidated by the sheer number of dials, or they haven't the time or patience to deal with them all. In either case, he provides us buyers with something ready to go out of the virtual box. I, personally, like that.

To the moderators: please don't close the thread on account of a couple of loud-mouthed posters who are getting too far into the flaming zone. Why penalize everyone for one person's bad deeds? Instead, might I suggest you warn the offending parties to cool their collecive jets or THEY will be ejected from the thread. I fully acknowledge that it very well could mean me, considering my choices of words in the earlier paragraph. Not to worry, I seriously doubt I'll be posting to this thread again. I have said what I felt needed to be said.

Lastly, to RetroDevil: thank you for this interesting thread and good luck to you! I hope you get loads of sales in your Poser future. Don't allow yourself to be scared off by a few blowhard "experts". They were all newbies once and have forgotten what it's like to be just starting out. Go for the gold!  thumbs up!

Quote - Actually, not everyone can (Mac users) and the CR2 can't be distributed in many cases.

PS - I don't redistribute the DEV CR2's that I make with Morph Manager. I only use them to make clean PMD files for my injection Poses. Just thought I should clarify that after re-reading the thread and noticing I'd not made that clear.

"To the moderators: please don't close the thread on account of a couple of loud-mouthed posters who are getting too far into the flaming zone."

Ha! Obviously you haven't been around much.. while there have been some disagreements, this has been a VERY tame discussion, and some excellent facts have been brought to light.

And that's how peopel learn. from opinions and info presented from a number of different parties.

While it might LOOK like I dislike Pengy from some of my replies here, thats NOT the case, and I respect his opinions, and value his information.

Flames? What flames? PJ - you tell 'im what flames are. :p C'mon, guys - saving a character morph is drop-simple: Poser even has some rather prominent main menu items for it ("Create New Figure". "Save As Morph". ) This ain't rocket-science. ===== Here's exactly how you do it: Get your character all set up as you like it in a zero pose. Hit "Save as Morph". Pick a name for your Morph. Load a default figure (and for crissakes, turn off Inverse Kinematics). Load the saved morph onto that figure. "Save New Figure". Zip your brand new .cr2 and its .png file into something. Done. Want an INJ pose instead of a Character? Okay... there are roughly three (prolly four) utilities that make this happen in both Poser and DAZ|Studio that are scattered about - and a quick Google search will show you how to do it by hand at least six different ways. There. Saved everyone a whole lot of discussion. Now everyone please file out to the RMP and have your credit cards ready. ===== Oh, wait... maybe someone might want to know more about the ins and outs of all this, and maybe some of the pitfalls? I won't bring it up again (after all, I promised), but I'll have an "I told you so" all warm and waiting when it finally does blow up, and odds are good that it probably will at some point. It almost did a few days ago. But... I'll let it rest. Lookit - This is just a discussion, not a flame-fest. Yes we tend to debate about things, but it is productive, and (hopefully) it gets people to thinking. Sorry if that hurt anyone's sensibilities. Well, no I'm not - this is the real world and not Romper Room, TOS be damned. I suspect I might have struck a few merchants' nerves (judging by some responses, I know I probably have), but that's not my problem, so long as I merely tell the truth and do so without intentional insult. ===== Gareee... blush. Flattery will get you everywhere, dah-ling. Truth be told though, I learn lots of neat things, just as much as everyone else in a discussion... though it doesn't always appear so. :p /P

Thing is that many places you can't distribute the CR2 ... That is all I was saying :)

Quote - Thing is that many places you can't distribute the CR2 ... That is all I was saying :)

This is true. Most of the DAZ figures have blank .cr2 files you can use, Vicky2 (if anyone still uses it) can have morphs made for it distributed on Vicky 1 .cr2 files (so long as you don't include any actual DAZ-built V2 morph dials), and IIRC all the default Poser stuff is totally cool with distributing .cr2's (after all, you already get 'em in Poser, would already have to have the .obj file, so...)

Oh, and if you're making morphs and have V4 w/ the Morphs++ thingy, use the blank .cr2 to put the morphs on, and do NOT include any DAZ-built morphs. It'd be like giving away the Morphs++ product thingy away for free (or reduced cost), y'know?

I can't think of any offhand figures that won't allow .cr2 redistribution but at the same time wouldn't already have a blank .cr2 included or available to use instead, though. Maybe Terai Yuki/Miki/some other 3rd-party popular figure?

/P

True .. There is also the after effect of that though. You have a CR2 with your morph but none of the other ones and how to get things to be more usable. A lot of people would be baffled by it and a lot of people would be SOL.

Thanks JenX im planning on buying IPB soon so ill check that tutorial out .

---

Talisman: Thanks for the support :D Im happy to hear this thread has become a talking point LOL

Yeah, I saw that tutorial as well.
Very nice touch JenX.

Thanks.  A couple of others have posted alternate means as well ;)

Also, you can add other figures to IPB in that manner, as well.  I prefer working that way, because that's always been my workflow.  Others may have different ways to get to their end result.  ;)