Quote -
If you're busy having fun and playing with a new program, chances are you won't have TIME to bitch about it in a forum.

Yeah, sure, maybe with Poser, but don't make the blanket statement that one may not have the "TIME to bitch about it in a forum".
I assure you if you are trying to get something accomplished and something out of your control is blocking that, there is plenty of time for bitching.

Sounds like a blind fanboy response to me, as if people who complain are all of the same ilk; a lesser breed than they who simply accept what they're given.

Quote -
Thing is.. there's a select "vocal minority" who is always making a lot of noise and it can trick people into believing they're actually the majority. Works in politics and it sure woris in Poser, too.

...She said as if to imply most complaints were based solely on a desire to spread lies....

Quote -
But most people are NOT having problems here. People leave feedback when they have anything to complain about (well generally speaking, of course there are exceptions) - as long as things work, why should they make a fuss of themselves?

For those who ARE having problems, it's kind of a big deal. You know?
To the person who IS having problems, all the statistics that place him in the minority mean exactly nothing.

And there goes the shining knight charging to the fray in self righteous fury. And who's that he's jousting? Why, thin air, there's nobody there. Poor senile old knight, charging left and right, righting every self perceived wrong. :lol:

K, this thread is quickly devolving into ANOTHER bitch and blame session. Can we just keep SOMETHING light for once?

Laurie

dances past wearing nothing but some woad and a kilt doing the dance of the sugarplum nutcase

Quote - K, this thread is quickly devolving into ANOTHER bitch and blame session. Can we just keep SOMETHING light for once?

Laurie

Now you wouldn't beat a poor little red headed dwarf would you? I'm just the jester, here to pester, and molest the high and mighty.

Hmm.

Just set up the CG box.
Installed Vista Ultimate 64.
Base Motherboard drivers.
Video drivers.
USB 2 drivers.
Space navigator driver.
LG software for the blue ray burner I have to wait until I get Premiere CS4 to really get to use.
Flash 10
MS C++ redist 2005
MS C++ redist 2008
Poser Pro on D:
Poser 8 and all content on D:

Currently copying my approx. 60 gig external runtime to be installed on the graphics box.

So far P8 has fired up fine, Library visible and functional. Switching tabs no problem. Whether that holds true with the older runtime is a couple of hours yet to be seen, but so far I =like= what I see.

Oh, I -did- have minimal crawlies, but they went bye bye when I upped the video retrace to 70hz. Just in the name of utter disclosure.

I'm already wondering why I never separated my program sets before this. Once Poser is set, then DS3advanced, Modo, Premiere, AE, Photoshop, Vue 7.5, etc. And this will let me leave open office, storyboard quick, and scriptwriter pro on the main box with the audio apps and games. Worth it worth it and worth it.

Quote - For someone who's busy having fun and playing with a new program you seems to post a lot..... sorry, just couldn't resist posting that ;-)

Ah but then.. I don't have a LIFE... I live in forums LOL

And since Poser renders generally take quite a while, even if Poser 8 is generally faster than previous versons.. it still gives me lots of time to post. 

And again.. while I'm at work I can post in forums and nothing else .. So there L

And MikeJ - I'm in no way a "blind fanboy"- if anything I'm a fanGIRL - but still.. I know that people are having problems with Poser 8 - and I'm not saying that is not the case at all.. I'm just saying that we are a lot who DO NOT have any major problems with the program, and those people rarely post flaming endorsements of the program - to the majority who is NOT having problems, it's nothing to talk about - to them, the program is just working as expected and that's hardly something you'd make a forum post about, right?

"YAY Poser 8 works as I assumed it would"--- see.. that isnt' likely, whereas "DAMMIT, POSER 8 CRASHED AGAIN is a much more likely post.

Sorry but it's just the way things work.. people post whenever they have questions or complaints. They rarely post when something is working just fine.

And while I certainly feel for the people who are having problems, I can just say that I'm not one of them. I've caught - and reported -  a few bugs. My main peevee is that the comma doesn't work. It's annoying to me because I use the numerical keyboard exclusively to enter numbers, and now I can't use the comma as normal. But it's being fixed in SR1 from what I can tell so why should I continue to whine about it? I'll live with the issues until SR1 comes out.

Then again.. I never even had major problems with Poser 5. I must be weird I guess...

And for the record, it's NOT that I'm a "happy go lucky" kind of peep in general. Quite the contrary. But I won't bitch and whine just to be part of the chorus when I dont' have anything to bitch and whine about!

Oh and remember this post is started by someone too timid to even state their true self. I find that amusing... That poster STILL has only one post.

Food for thoughts, eh?

Quote - dances past wearing nothing but some woad and a kilt doing the dance of the sugarplum nutcase

Whew.. saw dances, and was afraid you were going to say  in Pasties and a G-String, had an image of Bond (blonde guy with two guns looks like Craig) in Pasties and G-String suddenly.....

Try getting that image out of your head... (That almost calls for a Poser Render of that!)

"Bond, Bond... over here"  ... "Oh, Bond... not the Pasties and the G-String again.. yeah it makes the enemies less accurate when shooting at us because they are laughing so hard, but it is just wrong, so wrong!"

Quote -
...to the majority who is NOT having problems, it's nothing to talk about - to them, the program is just working as expected and that's hardly something you'd make a forum post about, right?

If you say so.
maybe you wouldn't, but I've seen a whole lot of posts like that in other forums, discussing other software. I've made quite a few myself for that matter, and there are at least a couple of "Yay, Poser 8 works!" posts here.
Maybe Poser users don't see a need to discuss things that are working, but people using, say, Maya, seem far more inclined to bring up subjects such as that so as to encourage the people they have to work with to feel safe to update.

Quote -
And MikeJ - I'm in no way a "blind fanboy"- if anything I'm a fanGIRL - but still

Sorry about that. Yes, I know you're a girl, what with the avatar and the user name and all that. I also have surmised you're a trekkie, even without seeing the necessary logo on your (non-com) uniform.
However, you rarely hear of fangirls, for the same reason you don't often hear of Postwomen, Maytag repairwomen, Best Girls, or womankind, and you probably won't hear a purser loudly declare "woman overboard" on a cruise liner.

Quote -

And for the record, it's NOT that I'm a "happy go lucky" kind of peep in general. Quite the contrary. But I won't bitch and whine just to be part of the chorus when I dont' have anything to bitch and whine about!

Oh and remember this post is started by someone too timid to even state their true self. I find that amusing... That poster STILL has only one post.

Maybe not, but you seem all too happy to cut down they who do have legitimate complaints, and point out that you have no problems. Which makes your posting in a complaint thread completely irrelevant and off topic, unless you're just in it to "be part of the chorus" to do your part to help lynch the people who complain.
And yes, my posting here simply to argue with you is almost just as irrelevant, but not entirely. My girlfriend bought Poser 8 and I checked it out today at her place. While I didn't see any glaring problems with it, I think I'd put it in the "ho-hum, yet another half-assed Poser release" category, if I had to state an early opinion on it.
That's not a dig at the skill of the developers or the programmers, by the way, but a dig at the people who make the decisions and write the checks for the development.

As for the OP using an alias... who cares? I don't see that as even remotely relevant, and in pointing that out, you are trying to discredit the person on a personal level.
Then again, does anybody know for sure that that person is an alias? I can't remember, and this stupid forum software makes it a pain to check earlier replies while making a quoted reply, but is it necessary to assume all long-time Poser users have had an account here for a while? There is, in fact, a first post for everyone. I don't know - maybe you managed to skip straight to post #55 or something, but for all the rest of us it doesn't seem to work that way.

That about covers it I guess. Any other completely irrelevant points you'd care to make to try to change the subject?

Quote - > Quote - Although I have to admit, being a Poser Pro user, I'm really not big on the idea of "reverting" to a mere 32 bit render engine.

I too am a Poser pro user but I bought P8 so Now I only have to pay the difference when Pro2010 comes out. Makes it a bit easier to spread the cost out in two payments. Plus the chance to beta P8 and the pro when they finally let us.

P8 right now is a PITA but on my p7 core 64 bit, rendering uses all 4 cores X 2.  renders much faster than p4-7.  a few service packs and It will be a kicker.  One bug of note, a hr2 item texture if it begins with numbers will not apply the materials.  my solution set up in p7 and reload in p8.

Yeah P8 is faster, but I'm more concerned with how much RAM I can use.

P8 seems to make more demands on the processor(s). I can leave P7 rendering (on Tiger) and work in Photoshop, but when rendering in P8 (on Leopard) other applications including Photoshop are sluggish. Checked Activity Monitor and P8 grabs as much as it can.

Quote - OK.. while there certainly ARE issues with Poser 8... am I the only one who smells a Sock Puppet here? I always find it interesting when apparently old and seasoned Poser users sign up the very same day as they make one very harsh post.. often never to be seen again...

just seems funny to me...

Good call. Neat way of point it out to.

BTW it's not like I don't have my own complaints(not bugs, those will get fixed) but I'll save it for another time and another thread.

Quote - Yeah P8 is faster, but I'm more concerned with how much RAM I can use.

Frankly that is a lot improved in Poser 8, even compared to version 7.  It's not effectively unlimited like a 64-bit version would be, but even doing very large renders, to me it's a lot better about shedding unneeded memory that it's done with, compared to earlier versions.

Quote - P8 seems to make more demands on the processor(s). I can leave P7 rendering (on Tiger) and work in Photoshop, but when rendering in P8 (on Leopard) other applications including Photoshop are sluggish. Checked Activity Monitor and P8 grabs as much as it can.

While technically this is a GOOD thing, I understand what you're saying, that it makes it a lot less convenient to try to multi-task and do other things while a render is going.  On the PC there is a workaround for this, in that you can make a custom shortcut that will run an application at lower priority - this doesn't make it run slower, it just makes the operating system interrupt the render briefly when you need something else done, like tasks in another application.  Working in Photoshop is still a bit sluggish, but it's doable.  I don't know about Macintosh, but maybe there is a way to do the same there.  Maybe they'll add this as a feature that can be set within Poser in the near future.

Quote - Try these RobbyBobby...

http://support.smithmicro.com/cs/smkb.cfg/php.exe/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=2211

OK, so I'm partway there.  In diagnostic mode, I'm able to see the library.  This is the first time that I've been able to check that out (it's been a busy week). 

Anyway, before I start monkeying around with any settings, I would really like a dummy's guide to step-by-step through this.  At work, I'm the systems guru for queries and mainframes, but I hesitate to do too much on the old laptop.  I've known too many people who have screwed things up royally by touching something that they shouldn't.

So, can you elaborate on what (and where) to start looking for?

If you contact Smith Micro Support (and send me a Site mail of the Incident Number)... I will try to help you out

I just wanted to say that I had a bit of an epiphany today.  Simply put, I figured that, since Poser 8 worked fine in Diagnostic mode, why not just use it in Diagnostic mode?  There's nothing else running to interfere with it and it actually runs faster.  I did the attached pic this afternoon and it didn't take that long...even with the Indirect Lighting.

Thanks for your willingness to help.

Cool Robinhood Bobby!

The fact it works well in Diagnostic Mode, means we may be able to help sort out the conflict. If you are willing, I am able!

If you do contact Support, Site Mail me the Incident Number so I can find it and respond.

Quote - The fact it works well in Diagnostic Mode, means we may be able to help sort out the conflict. If you are willing, I am able!

If you do contact Support, Site Mail me the Incident Number so I can find it and respond.

Although I appreciate the offer, my friend, I've been spending way too much time trying to diagnose this problem and not enough time actually doing anything with the program.  For now, I'll let sleeping dogs lie and just utilize the program this way.  At least I'm able to use it instead of seriously contemplating returning it.

I'll see what happens after SR1 comes out...maybe I'll revisit this then.  In the meantime, I'm just going to play for a bit.  Thanks.

I'll probably just wait until SR1 comes out.  The only problem with that is that if the SR1 takes too late coming out it will be past most of our 30-day return policy.  My 30 days will expire in about a week.  There should be an extension for after SR1.

I like the new interface, but they need to make all the scroll bars larger and not have them shrink as they do in the Library when there are a lot of runtime folders or items.  I also hope they enlarge the images or give us that option.  Also, many of the tool items that can be docked could me smaller like the memory dots all in one row (I've inquired about that one and they said they couldn't change it) and others that just take up too much space.  Also I haven't found a way to dock tools on the same row as other tools.

I find the modeling area getting smaller and smaller because of all the crap above and next to it.  I'm tempted to reinstall Poser 7 at least until they fix some of these things.

Quote - but they need to make all the scroll bars larger and not have them shrink as they do in the Library when there are a lot of runtime folders or items.

It's quite hard to get the scroll bar at times, and I'm tending to set things up in Poser 7 and then transfer to Poser 8 to finish off (or add P8 items). I just hope they get SR1 out soon to make things easier!

At least Poser 8 hasn't crashed on me yet.  Poser 7 crashes all the time and is slow saving scenes.  I'm going to use Poser 7 until the SR1 comes out.  I do like the Library better than in earlier versions, but the scroll bar issue makes it difficult to work with because as you said it disappears or is so tiny it's hard to grasp onto it.

The scroll bar for the Library should also be on the left side, not the right.  Widening the library to get to the scroll bar just wastes more space.  I don't need to read all the entry text in the library.  The image is good enough.

Quote - The scroll bar for the Library should also be on the left side, not the right.  Widening the library to get to the scroll bar just wastes more space.  I don't need to read all the entry text in the library.  The image is good enough.

The same here. i don't like how the scroll bar disapears when you change the width. Complete waste of space and time. I know what my content is and don't need all that text.

I really hope they fix that small scroll bar too. That has been brought up in just about every thread about the new library and it has not been just the same few repeting it as has been with many other complaints.

 One thing strikes me.. what if you put the library on the left? Now that everything is dockable it should be possible. And then the scroll bar couldn't disappear.

Of course it would take some time getting used to.. I routinely rearrange my Posers so they look as close as Poser 4 as possible L Old habits and all that. But perhaps it would work. 

The best thing of course would be if it was changed. But if it isn't, that might be a workaround?

What I would like to see is SM extending the "Warranty" period until after SR1.
Chances are there would be fewer returns, but I can't see this happening.

Quote -  One thing strikes me.. what if you put the library on the left? Now that everything is dockable it should be possible. And then the scroll bar couldn't disappear.

Of course it would take some time getting used to.. I routinely rearrange my Posers so they look as close as Poser 4 as possible L Old habits and all that. But perhaps it would work. 

The best thing of course would be if it was changed. But if it isn't, that might be a workaround?

I never thought about that. So use to having it set up the same as you. LOL. I would rather have a fix though instead of having to move things around and it still would not fix the thin scroll bar problem.

I know, pretty petty problem but so far it's one of only 2 things I've had something to complain about. That and the default content placement. I kind of fell left out not having much to complain about. LOL.

This thread is exemplary of why I never but never rush to buy a new version of Poser as soon as it's released.

;)

Quote - This thread is exemplary of why I never but never rush to buy a new version of Poser as soon as it's released.

;)

Wise words oh Padiwan!

Quote - This thread is exemplary of why I never but never rush to buy a new version of Poser as soon as it's released.

;)

You're right about that..... I normally do so also. But SM made me an offer I could not refuse, so I went ahead and bought it. Since I got it, I may as well use it.

It seems like there are a mixed bag of users here, so I'll ask this question...
I've been out of it for the last year, "it" being messing around with 3D; lots of weird stuff in my life, adopting the son of deceased user navysquid ,etc, etc.
Anyway, things are getting back to the point where I have some free time, so I'll ask: I usually use Poser 6 for characters, layout & motion design, then do my "world", lighting, some mainly static props and environment in Vue d'esprit 5, then use the mini-renderfarm in Vue to process things out. There are some drawbacks and limitations to this, but it actually works pretty well.
Do I need to upgrade either Poser or Vue or both? is there a new method for creating 15-60 second animations that has come out in the last year or so that is fantastically better or faster? Or just as good and faster? (I get tired of waiting 8 hours for 4 computers to finish rendering a 30 second animation).
I really doubt that a multi-system-render version of poser has come out, but if the hair room has improved drastically in regards to creating "flowing" hair that looks good in an animation...
I'd appreciate any opinion you might have.

Quote - This thread is exemplary of why I never but never rush to buy a new version of Poser as soon as it's released.

;)

Well, the earlier you can report a bug that may only bother you the better the chance that it'll get fixed in a n SR rather than in the next version, so buying Poser early has its advantages, too :-)

Quote - I really doubt that a multi-system-render version of poser has come out

There is, it's called Poser Pro store.smithmicro.com/home.tpl Don't rush off to buy, wait for Poser Pro 2010 to be released.

Quote - Do I need to upgrade either Poser or Vue or both? is there a new method for creating 15-60 second animations that has come out in the last year or so that is fantastically better or faster? Or just as good and faster? (I get tired of waiting 8 hours for 4 computers to finish rendering a 30 second animation).

Can't comment for Vue, I stopped using it, for me it didn't deliver the increased render speeds promised in Vue6. Poser has done some changes to the animation system, but I'm not doing animation, others will be able to help you much better.

Poser 7 and Poser Pro will not give you any significant render speed improvement, but the new Poser 8 will. They've optimized it and now Poser will use a multi core (and perhaps even a single core) much more efficient, giving you a very good increase of render speeds. At least twice as fast, but I've had scenes that render 6 times faster.

*There is, it's called Poser Pro

• I Just took another look at the ad, " Get the most out of your hardware and leverage your network to render massive scenes using the network render queue." as far as i can tell, no details on how it works anywhere on the site, so you might have to buy the extra render engines...I'm not asking anyone to tell me if you do, it's just strange in a bad way that they don't just tell potential customers about that little detail. I've also heard that the 64-bit processing works well, and there was something about GPU support.
  I'll look into it some more, but I might not wait until 2010; might not be a good upgrade price from Poser 6 for 2010.

"I stopped using it, for me it didn't deliver the increased render speeds promised in Vue6"

Not having Vue6 I can't really say, but Vue 5 rendering on 4 machines is at least 4 times faster than Poser 6 rendering on 1 machine, if set to similar resolution settings; is 6 that much slower than 5?
Having been burned buying Poser 3 & 5, I'm strictly on the even numbered poser purchase rule; hearing that Poser 8 will make GOOD use of multicore hardware is good news. I assume Poser Pro 2010 will be the pro version of Poser 8; makes sense.
Thank you for the good info.

Vue6 is not slower than Vue5 on anything I've done OK, I use the infinity versions so I can't tell you what the lower versions are like.

No you don't have to buy extra render engines for poser. But with Vue7 you have to buy the rendering network separate. They have pretty much out priced the average user unless you want to downgrade. But Vue 6 and up uses poser to pose and can use the poser shader tree. So Vue has it's advantages for poser users.

Now P8 has been a improvement over rendering. The upgrade price to P8 is the same price for P6 as it it is for P7. So you really can't go wrong with that. Then the upgrade to Pro2010 would not be as steep.

No matter what complaining you here, P8 has been the most stable version I have had out of the box, P4/5/6/7/Pro since P4 and I got P4 when it was it's full updated version. It's the same as all software. There will be some system setups/machines that will have problems. But the majority don't have those problems. The few are just more vocal.

Quote -
No matter what complaining you here, P8 has been the most stable version I have had out of the box, P4/5/6/7/Pro since P4 and I got P4 when it was it's full updated version. It's the same as all software. There will be some system setups/machines that will have problems. But the majority don't have those problems. The few are just more vocal.

Amen to that. Most users arebn't having any major problems with Poser 8. And don't listen to sock puppets who come in to complain then disappear into thin air afterwards (like the OP of this thread) - they're not to be taken seriously IMO.

And yes it DOES matter. If you're too much of a chicken to stand by your complaints it suggest to me that you've got your Poser 8 off a Torrent rather than off SmithMicro or Content Paradise. So yes, I'm accusing you of warezing until proven otherwise, in whic case I will duly apologize.

But sock puppets aren't in high regards here (well.. except my own of course, but at least I do not pretend it's NOT a sock puppet L)

Accusing someone of "warezing" because they've made a negative post about P8 is a tad nonsensical, don't you think? You might as well have just labeled him/her a troll, a whore, an idiot, or any number of other things that have no relevance whatsoever.

Just sayin'.

Quote - And yes it DOES matter. If you're too much of a chicken to stand by your complaints it suggest to me that you've got your Poser 8 off a Torrent rather than off SmithMicro or Content Paradise. So yes, I'm accusing you of warezing until proven otherwise, in whic case I will duly apologize.

As far as I know, someone is still innocent until proved guilty..... I think you're taking this a bit too far now.

Quote - No matter what complaining you here, P8 has been the most stable version I have had out of the box, P4/5/6/7/Pro since P4 and I got P4 when it was it's full updated version. It's the same as all software. There will be some system setups/machines that will have problems. But the majority don't have those problems. The few are just more vocal.

There's no way for us to know if the majority has or doesn't have problems at all. The majority of users never post anything at all, neither good or bad. Only a hand full of users post in these forums, the majority never interacts. We could as well assume that the majority of users does have problems, we just don't know.

Besides if you add up all the people who do have problems, it's not exactly a few anymore.

"I'm accusing you of warezing until proven otherwise, in whic case" 

Yeah, make 'em show the birth certificate!

Quote -> Quote - No matter what complaining you here, P8 has been the most stable version I have had out of the box, P4/5/6/7/Pro since P4 and I got P4 when it was it's full updated version. It's the same as all software. There will be some system setups/machines that will have problems. But the majority don't have those problems. The few are just more vocal.

There's no way for us to know if the majority has or doesn't have problems at all. The majority of users never post anything at all, neither good or bad. Only a hand full of users post in these forums, the majority never interacts. We could as well assume that the majority of users does have problems, we just don't know.

Besides if you add up all the people who do have problems, it's not exactly a few anymore.*

I can see what your trying to say but it's hard to believe when you Are one of the focal few that tell people that it was the worst release even though you only payed a couple of bucks for it. One would think that it's more than just the software that your outraged at, by your posts. Nothing wrong with that. keeps things interesting. Hey, I don't like the new library system but it is working for me and P8 does not crash on me.

TG, got to agree with others. let it go. Not worth getting worked up about.

poser 5 first release was worse than poser 8 first release IMVHO.  but there are still some users who are loyal to poser 5.  perhaps in time they'll become accustomed to poser 8.

Poser 5 was terrible. Too many new features, they never did get it working properly IMO. Poser 6 I've been pretty happy with, from the start. I wish the dynamic hair was a little easier to work with, but overall I like it. I tried 7 and didn't see why they bothered to release it.... I don't know anyone that has a poser 8 I can check out, but if they are holding to the even numbered versions rule, it should be good.

Well all I can hope is that the SR1 fixes a lot of the problems I've had. I like the P8 interface (apart from the Library menu- good idea, but VERY fiddly), I've had issues with importing my old runtimes and have had to re-install everything manually, and I had a 'silent crash' today with a fairly medium-sized render just making Poser 8 disappear half way through.

My fairly aged P4-based machine (with 4GB RAM) seems to be coping with P8, today's crash aside, but UK Sales of Goods act states you can be refunded in full for up to 3 months if the goods are 'unfit for purpose'.

I hope that's not the case with P8, and the first SR comes out soon.

UK Sales of Goods Act is not applicable here if you bought it as a download from Smith Micro or a Disc from Smith Micro. only applies to goods purchased in UK.
software also comes under its own rules, downloads have no rules applied to them. packaged software, i believe, relies on whether the data is corrupted ( bad disc).
and because of the millions of different hardware configs, you cannot say  that a program is 'unfit for use' if it runs on most configurations, and just won't work that well on a particular system.
sorry you are having problems.

thumbs up----------------Nice on the dockable menue pop ups.

thumbs down------------Bad on library loading problems due to browser driven ui.

thumbs up-----------------new rendering power

thumbs down-------------menue lag

thumbs down--------------crappy poser figures

thumbs down --------------legacy content rather then new content presented by thier co.

thumbs down---------------was hopeing for z b rush plugin or a new room that can do what z brush does, were up to 8 now guys a built in mud box is long past due.

Quote - thumbs down --------------legacy content rather then new content presented by thier co.

thumbs down---------------was hopeing for z b rush plugin or a new room that can do what z brush does, were up to 8 now guys a built in mud box is long past due.

I got 1.7Gb of new content besides the 1 gb+ of legacy. Did you download the new content?

Just think what the price would be if they did add an new room like that. If you want higer end tools, then buy higher end software at a higher end price. A separate 3rd party plug for z brush that you can buy that I don't have to pay for would be fine. Besides who knows, there might be one in Pro2010.That is where the plugins for higher end software seem to be in.

Edit to add. I think they do need to add a couple extra functions to te morph brush. Move, twist and so on. Push and Pull are missleading in terms as they are nothing more than inflate and deflate.

I don't think the price would be much difference. Let's be honest, what we've seen for new stuff in Poser 7 and Poser 8 isn't really worth the upgrade price at all. For $129 one would expect a bit more, perhaps quite a bit more. I've got a number of applications that are in the same price league then Poser is and comparing new features on all of them, Poser doesn't even offer 25% of what the others offer. I expected a lot more, when going from Poser 4 or 5 it will be worth upgrading, you get something good for your money. But not really when going from  P7 to P8.

When looking at D/S and all it offers for free and what you get when do go up one number, I wonder how SM still gets away with offering so little in a new version. One would thing they would be awake by now, but it appears they're still sleeping. I really wonder how the odds will be when we have D/S 4 and Poser 8. DAZ seems to go a bit faster then SM and offers a good selection of additional features with each major (and at times even minor) release. How long will it take DAZ to catch up or even overtake? If Poser 9 will be another one of these mediocre releases (and the odds are that it will be) then the choice will be a lot harder then it is now. Poser still has the edge for me, but if SM  isn't going to act soon, they will loose the edge.

I love Poser, but I'm fed up with mediocre new versions. We, as users, deserve more for what they're asking us to pay.

Quote - I got 1.7Gb of new content besides the 1 gb+ of legacy. Did you download the new content?

I got that also and I'm still wondering why in the world this download was even 1.7Gb. There's hardly anything in it. I'm even wondering why I even bothered to download it at all. I've browsed through the content and 90% of it will be added to all the other content that came with previous versions of Poser...... it has been gathering dust on my hard drive for years now. Will the time ever come that something really worthwhile will be released with a new Poser version? It's getting worse with each new version, especially the new figures.

Only the DS Base is free. To match a Poser version you end up paying way more than poser and still can't do some things. I don't know why that is such a hard concept for so many to understand but it is. I have nothing agaist DS, just that silly free mentality.

Just because you don't use the content does not mean others don't.

What DAZ has done in a short time compared to Poser is such an easy answer but again another concept to hard to understand my many. Poser did all the grunt work in 4/5 versions. Daz did not have to start from scratch.

The only thing I will agree with is I think the library sucks big time I don't like it or how it is done but that is a personal preference.

Quote - The only thing I will agree with is I think the library sucks big time I don't like it or how it is done but that is a personal preference.

Because the P8 library crashes sometimes on Mac's running 10.5.x, and constantly on 10.6.x, I had no choice but to use PoserPro while waiting for SR1. After 10 days of using PoserPro, I can't believe how fast it is to set up a scene (navigate to what I want to load) browse my PPro library. Granted I have two monitors side by side and my library sits on my second monitor. But being able to spread the legacy library out will be sorely missed whenever SR1 comes out. Hope somebody writes an addon for Mac's like they have for Windows. I agree the P8 library even if it gets bigger icons, with its vertical layout....(insert curse words here)