Hey all,

I'm new to Poser 8, just purchased and installed it today and am having a go.  I'm very amateur at this sort of thing and would love any and all guidance I can get.

First thing I did was download the 4.2 Victoria figure from DAZ's site and installed it into Poser.  I then added her to the scene, upped the render quality to beyond "Final" or whatever with the slider and saved the picture.  I thought it turned out alright until I started to browse around other sites and see how ridiculously good their renders are and I would love some tips on what I'm doing wrong.

Here's what my render looks like:
http://www.grozzler.com/dump/v4.png

Here's the sort of thing I would love to end up with:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=73226

I think the biggest issue right now is the skin.   The skin in my render is so splotchy and bland looking and the one in those Allure renders looks a lot more rich.  The eyes and lips are also very glossy and reflective, giving them a more 'alive' look then mine.

So can anyone give me some advice on how to improve the quality of the render, mainly the skin / eyes / lips?  I'm not sure how many extra addons I need to download or what, I see some galleries claiming they don't use any additional content besides the V4 model and some hair.

Thanks guys!

It will take time,  but You will learn by trying different light sets and adjusting them to suit Your Own preferences...  Keep on trying things out.  But most of all HAVE FUN...!!

Welcome to the world of Poser.  If you look towards the bottom of the promo, there is a list of products used which include skin textures created for specific characters.  Although the basic package provides a starting point, IMO it is not the best quality to achieve realistic results.  I am going to refer you to a link created by Acadia which will give you an overview on how to approach and work with Poser.  It is wellworth the read and it will give you insight on what to expect.  Poser 8 is a fine addition to the Poser family but there are still issues to be resolved which will hopefully addressed in SR1.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2722867

Welcome to Posering.  1. The default lighting SUCKS !  there I said it .  The default three lights are colored and affect the skin textures , and all three cast shadows.  You may get better control of your lights if you change one at least to a spotlight, and have only one light making shadows . 

Any book on photography studio lighting will be a help, its not exact because of the way Poser treats light but a good start. 

You will also get lots of opinions on what works best, just try a few things and go with whatever looks best to you.

Hi there!  A few things to note:

1. Unless noted otherwise, many renders you see are postworked.  Postworking is any enhancement or additional artwork done in a separate software program after rendering.  Spending some time studying Photoshop and other postworking software to hone your skills is a good idea.  Look for tutorials on postworking.  To be frank, the 3D community is both very supportive and sharing...but also somewhat proprietary/secretive.  Some people are very liberal in sharing their "seven herbs and spices."  So, you'll really have to dig to find the "recipes" for good postworking (and rendering, for that matter).

2. Getting good renders in Poser has a lot to do with your understanding of photography and art.  (I'm not claiming to have mastered this.)  This means that you have to work on...

• Composition
• Color
• Lighting
• Camera / Focus
• Storyline
  (And, render quality)

Lighting is vital to any good render.  I'd suggest buying the "Digital Lighting and Rendering" book (available at Amazon).

So, studying up on the core concepts (apart from Poser) is vital. 

3)  Then, you have to master the software.  Study the Poser manual and try out the tutorials.  Then, dig around on RuntimeDNA and here to find some good tutorials on lighting and rendering and other topics that interest you.  You might also want to check out Dr. Geep's site.  He has a zillion Poser tutorials.  Personally, I really zero in on anything written by Bagginsbill or Vince Bagna about lighting and rendering, but there are tons of other amazing experts around. You just have to be patient and watch the forums here, at DAZ and at Runtime DNA.

Also...higher render settings doesn't always yield the best (or time-efficient results).  For example, it's easy to go overboard on pixel samples and not get what you need.  Or, sometimes you need to smooth polygons for best results...and other times not.  Sometimes you want complex lighting...other times just one light will do.  Sometimes you want lights with shadows...sometimes not.  Playing around with Poser and doing test renders by tweaking camera and lighting settings, etc. will help you find a look that you like.

If you want to jump-start the process, I'd suggest investing in a few tools.  I really found RenderStudio (Runtime DNA) helpful in the beginning for lighting (although Poser 8's indirect lighting is really nice for outdoor scenes).  Also at Runtime DNA is Semidieu's Advanced Render Settings tool.  That was well worth the money.  You should also go to Bagginsbill's site and get his VSS tool which provides advanced shaders and lighting.  For gorgeous V4 textures, you should invest in the Elite textures over at DAZ.  They are extremely well done. (I should say that good textures and shaders on items can make or break a render, so you should learn how to tweak shaders especially so you can even improve the products you get).

These are just a few ideas off the top of my head.  I know this is pretty random and high-level (and perhaps parts are debatable) but I hope this helps get you going.

One more note: I took a look at your render.  Your lighting is probably OK...if you had some good textures on V4 instead of the default low-res one. 

Try buying a character with good textures (give one of RebelMommy's characters for V4 a try OR buy the DAZ Elite textures for V4) and see what difference decent shaders and textures make.

Hi ya :)

Like they said- Lighting is almost everything. Play with different sets, there are thousands of them available, may free.
But sets are just a starting point- move them around- add lights, change intensity.
Play with them!!! it;s the very best way to learn. Each picture is unique and demans it's own lighting.

Play with Poser- it's really such a big program that studing alone isn't enough. The BEST things happen by accident.
Many will say you have to plan out each aspect of your render before you start. Personally, I never had a pic end up as the image I had in mind, lol. Just see my last one- it was SUPPOSE to be a bird sitting on a branch. See what planing gets ya, lol

Poser is a collectors dream and nightmare- the more you gather the wider the range of ideas you'll have, lol, and the bigger your runtime will get.

And lastly, Poser is  a stage. Use it for more then character rendering.

.......Have fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Those renders use the full morph sets and high quality skin textures and probably "skin shaders".

Definately you need skin texture... I don't know what is free but maybe you could look at http://www.sharecg.com/b/11/poser? for maybe a character with free texture. People like BaginsBill's VSS but I don't understand it... There are "shader" products by face_off and 3Dream that apply fancy shaders to any texture and they do good results... I have used face_off's Real Skin Shader with plane "bucket fill" textures and had them look good. face_off has a tutorial on how to build the shaders without purchasing his products... it worked for me when I started but then I bought his product for convenience.

You need to morph the face too... there are free character heads at that freebie site above and at http://www.most-digital-creations.com/ if you don't want to or can't afford the full DAZ morph set... those characters can be blended to make new ones. If you have no budget you should find a "Poser Magnet" tutorial... I recommend one by Traveler, Dr. Geep, or PhilC. Magnets can reshape a face or other body part to create original morphs. Also most-digital has both magnet sets and original non-DAZ morph sets.

For a free male figure fully loaded with morphs find byAnton's Apollo Maximus. Maybe someone can recommend a good free female with morphs. In freestuff here dphoadly has Posette-V3 which has many morphs but requires the P4 Nude Woman from the Poser Legacy content. That takes Victoria 3 textures of which many free skins are around.  Also there are Nea and Zenon Poser 4 figures by pitklad  which are free and take Victoria 2 textures and Micheal 2 textures of which some free are around. http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.php?userid=63835

The Poser 5 and Poser 6 Poser 7 and Poser 8  built in figures have morphs and can be played with in Face Room to create new skins and characters (as can Apollo).

If you have $29 DAZ used to have a great 3D Content Starter Pack that had Reduced Resolution Micheal 3 and Victoria 3 with all their morphs along with texture hair, clothes, animals a dragon and a nice forest setting. There is still a lot of free stuff for those characters around. I like Reduced Resolution Victoria 3 even for male characters.

There are some "how to start" tutorials at DAZ under support that suggest how to make renders without purchasing additional content.

Quote -
Many will say you have to plan out each aspect of your render before you start. Personally, I never had a pic end up as the image I had in mind, lol.

I couldn't agree more!!

Attached Link: V4 Freestuff...

That link is a search here for V4 characters... some are dial settings that require the Daz morph sets but some are "original  morphs" probably and some might have textures.

Just make sure that you get something with really good shaders and not just textures.  Many free packages don't have good shaders.  If I remember right, V4 Francesca (or Francisca; I don't remember) on ShareCG has really nice shaders and textures.  She has a medium skin tone.  But, if you're serious about this, I think $5-$20 is a logical amount to spend to invest in some decent textures and shaders.  I do agree that the morph is also important, so look for a package with a realistic (or interesting) face as well.

Attached Link: How-to-Create-Your-Own-Beauty

And of course with Poser it is ALL about the lighting.

Can anyone point to a good starters tutorial?

All I can think of is http://www.sharecg.com/v/25244/PDF-Tutorial/How-to-Create-Your-Own-Beauty-3.5

Hey all,

Thanks a lot for your feedback and tips.

So it looks like the first thing I should consider is buying a character with high-resolution textures and such to fix up the skin?

Can anyone make any recommendations for a good starting character to buy that doesn't require a lot of "extra" content to also purchase to make work?

Thanks guys!

There are dozens and dozens of characters to choose, and each vendor have particular techniques in creating these characters.  On the other hand, there are excellent free textures available in the free section which can be used as a learning tools.  My suggestion, get your hands on Bagginsbill's VSSProp which is currently a skin texture shader enhancement system and any free V4 skin texture.  The following link will give you an overview and recommendation how to set up the prop as well as suggested lighting to achieve good results.  It does have a learning curve but you should be able to catch on quickly.  Face_off's system is very good but it is highly dependent on lighting arrangement; whenever you change your lighting, you must rerun your script.  And BB boasts that the initial skin texture does not have to be the greatest.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2737823&page=1

You can not buy a character and use it without also most likely buying the DAZ morph sets... few vendors sell "original" morph characters that do not use the DAZ sets. To economize you might just buy a good "Merchant Resource" such as the one by MINT that includes ready to apply textures and poses to apply them (N.B. some bare bones "MR" are rough image samples not good textures with nice seems and poses to apply them). These resources are the source of most textures found in commercial character products these days... people just spin a character with DAZ morphs and stick some fantasy makeup on a merchant resource. The resource you buy should be a set of skins and alternate texture ellements that are mixed and modified to make most of the so-called "dial spin" characters in the market... just choose a resource that includes MATposes to apply the basic textures... those poses can be easily modified to call any new modified textures you make.

the promo img in OP's first post has been postworked (fade-out of figure on left), but that's probly allowed by their marketplace rules.  technically they're not sposeta postwork promos because users wouldn't be able to duplicate the results.  however, for posting an img in gallery here, postwork is often needed, whether photos or renders.

Half of promos are post worked to hell... new thing at Daz is to render from above the product at an angle as though from a ceiling fan... can`t tell what the hell the mesh looks like. It is getting harder and harder to tell what in the promo image is the product in a lot of cases... the pose? the clothes? the character? the shoes?

Since you are using Poser, if you are bold, you can give the Versatile Shader System a whirl:

http://poserbagginsbill.googlepages.com/vsshomepage

He hasn't yet optimised it for Poser 8, but it's free.

(edited to correct lousy spelling)

I'm a big fan of great textures, particularly for a closeup. But the main reason your pic doesn't look like mine (click for full size), even though we're using the same craptastic default texture, is shaders and lighting.

The shaders here are my free VSS shaders, with a couple of parameter tweaks. The lighting is simple - one IBL+AO and a pair of infinite lights, slightly apart.

So you can go a long way towards realism without buying textures, although good ones do help.

Who would like a tutorial on how I made this image in P8?

Anyway, I found this one: Fabienne - Complete Char for V4

Upon loading the "default" mat pose, this is what I get.

Turns out that:

1. The bump settings is messed up - it is set to 1 inch.
   2) The bump map is not a real bump map - it is just a gray scale copy of the color map. This is pointless for a number of reasons.
   3) There was no "shader" there whatsoever.

You might conclude this is a terrible texture set. Not so.

I would like to see tutorial on VSS in P8, bill.

Here's another demo image. This is the same Fabienne texture, but using only 4 clicks I change the skin color across all the zones. Just by modifying the "Tint" parameter in the VSS Template Skin shader you can get many different variations from the same texture.

 I would likte to see the tutorial too. A video sounds great.