It will restore the one peice "Antonia-116-altUVs.obj" to the figure if you have used the "116A-Hi-Geom.pz2", thus allowing textures using MikeJ's UVs to be used again.

I am about as confidant as I can be that that everything is OK, at least as far as P6 goes. Although I have only tested in P6 I am very confidant that this will work in P4, and fairly confidant that it should work in P5. I feel less confidant about P7 and P8, I can think of no obvious reason why it should not work in P8, but Poser is always full of surprises.

On left, MikeJ's Alt UV geom with texture templates loaded (except for inner mouth). On right 116 geom as individual obj files, and with BlueEcho texture.

Looks great, Les. I'll have a closer look when I find the time.

I ran into a problem when splitting MikeJ's modified obj files with the corrected grouping for the lips. I'm not quite sure which program he used for that, but apparently it hates me. :laugh: It shouldn't take too long to either fix or work around it, but that's why I don't have those parts available yet.

Quote - Looks great, Les. I'll have a closer look when I find the time.

I ran into a problem when splitting MikeJ's modified obj files with the corrected grouping for the lips. I'm not quite sure which program he used for that, but apparently it hates me. :laugh: It shouldn't take too long to either fix or work around it, but that's why I don't have those parts available yet.

That was Lightwave Modeler 9.6 I used for that most recent upload. I left the comment lines in, in the OBJ files. ;-)
What kind of problems? LW is one of the few programs that plays well with Poser, siince ity doesn't change anything - size, vertex order, and vertex maps all stay intact on import and export.
But then again, in LW 9.6 they gave us a few new OBJ options and I might have changed something, since I recently reinstalled everything after I bought a new hard drive.

Oh I wonder if it's the vertex groups. Remember that test we did? I don't know if there's anything I could do about that.

MikeJ: I don't know yet what kind of problem. But it's all good. The files work nicely in Poser and Wings; it's only my software that doesn't like them. So I'll just have to find out what went wrong and fix it. Looks like LightWave is the perfect test case generator for obj file parsing software. :laugh: If I don't find the bug right away, I can probably work around it for now, so that Les can have his parts files.

D'oh, comment lines! Should've checked those. But it was more of a rethorical statement, actually.

Ha, cross-post! Yeah, I was wondering whether there might be vertex groups, and whether that could be the reason. But - at least in theory - my software should just ignore them. Instead, it crashes. So I'm suspecting it's something else.

Never mind! I'll find the problem and fix it.

Wow... now that's what you get when you take two days off LOL You guys and girls where busy!!! I just found the orphaned material zones as well but now know that I did not use an old material collection on them by accident (what will, if you allow it, create those useless extra-materials). So I will merrily carry on to create the skin - and as I see BlueEcho has already created a nice outside (that looks even more lifelike with vss!!).

I kept the kind of sparse trans I made for the first UV-version as several people said they liked them and added a fake/mascara look and an idealized "fluffy" version like it's often used in the galleries

Beautiful lashes, SaintFox!  I also like the asymmetry of the brows.

Thanks a lot!!! I was so unsure about if to keep them or not... From a merchant's viewpoint I can say that this is often taken as a glitch by customers but Leo told me to keep them - and so I dared to try out something new. The model on the photos has these asymetric eyebrows although they are plucked - I hope that this is the right term or at least understandable.

Wow, those lashes look great!

The eyebrows look very natural too.

Mmkay, I saw the error of my ways regarding the mesh splitting. It was nothing LightWave-related, just bad handling of geometry with no normals and of empty groups.

Here's the download for the MikeJ-mapped Antonia mesh split into actors:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/rrfilelock/download.php?fileid=39012&key=600

 That eyebrow asymmetry is perfect......

Lookin' good, SaintFox! 

Quote - Mmkay, I saw the error of my ways regarding the mesh splitting. It was nothing LightWave-related, just bad handling of geometry with no normals and of empty groups.

Here's the download for the MikeJ-mapped Antonia mesh split into actors:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/rrfilelock/download.php?fileid=39012&key=600

Well, glad you got it figured out, although I don't know what you mean. ;-)

What are all the parts for, morphing? Or is this some kind of a Create-Your-Own Antonia Kit? :laugh:

@ SaintFox,

What does or does not look good, is of course a matter of personal aesthetic judgement. So I hope you will forgive me me for swimming against the stream of popular opinion, and realise that what I say is only my opinion, and not meant in any way as a criticism.

I don't like the eyebrows. Whilst a little asymmetry is good and adds a more natural look, I feel that the hairs sticking up on the left brow are too distracting and draw attention away from the eyes themselves, which IMO should be the focus of attention. As to the lashes, I think they look really good in the bottom image, but a bit too sparse in the top image. Just my 2 cents worth.

@odf,

Glad you managed to squish the bug. Thanks for the MikeJ-mapped Antonia objs.

Quote -
What are all the parts for, morphing? Or is this some kind of a Create-Your-Own Antonia Kit? :laugh:

At the moment, I'm just helping out Les with his geometry-swapping experiments.

I made a blunder (not unusual for me) :sad:. The "116A-Hi-Geom.pz2" that I posted yesterday, contained an error in the path. It had "16A-Hi" where it should have read "116A-Hi". Please find the corrected version above. Sorry for any inconvenience.

Both of the files mentioned above can be used on either the "Antonia-116-altUVs" figure, or the "Antonia-114" figure, and hopefully on the standard Antonia-116 figure when it is released. They should not be used on the low res figures, I have made separate goem-injection files for the low res figures.

The main idea behind the geometry injection (at the moment) is to allow textures that use different UV mapping to be used on the same figure whilst it is loaded in Poser, with the figure still maintaining the same morphs and morph settings when  either geometry is injected. This would not be the case if you merely used the Poser "Change Figure" (single tick) function. In that case injected morphs and morph settings would be lost.

As odf pointed out, this is only experimental stuff. I'm posting the files here in case anyone is interested in following the progress of these experiments, or wants to help with them, but in truth it is probably only of interest to odf and myself at the moment. Anyone who does want to try out the geom-injection poses will also need to download and install the obj files from these links:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/rrfilelock/download.php?fileid=39006&key=8529

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/rrfilelock/download.php?fileid=39012&key=600

As an offshoot of this geom-injection thing, the question naturally arises as to whether it would be possible to inject the high res head into the low res figure.

I have tried injecting the high res head, eyes, and neck into the low figure. There were two consequences. Consequence number one, Poser started to sulk and did a partial hang. Consequence number two, the high res neck mesh threw a fit where it met the low res chest mesh.

I tried the same thing again, but this time I disabled the "Bend Body Parts" switch in the Display menu. This time Poser did not complain, and everything looks fine, but of course the mesh is no longer welded.

Turning off 'bend' has two consequences, it breaks the welding and turns off the joint parameters. Now if luck is on my side, the problems are caused by the welding and not the JPs. This raises another question. If I had a neck geom that matched the low res chest at the bottom and the high res head at the top, would I be able to transplant the high res head onto the low res body via a pose file?

Perhaps, perhaps not. I don't know the sufficient conditions for welding. Is it sufficient that all the vertices match at the seam, or does the winding order also play a part? Does anyone feel like constructing a hybrid neck so I can test this? My own modelling skills are none existent, so I can't make the neck myself.

You mean a neck with all the right points in all the right places to join at the head, but the lower part that joins the chest to stay the same, right?

Thanks very much for the neck Mike, it's exactly what I wanted. Unfortunately my suspicion that the hybrid neck would solve the problem turned out to be wrong. However I have not completely given up hope. There are still a few things I can try.

Oh well, you're welcome. Sorry it didn't work out though.
There might be a more Poser-friendly way of doing what I did though, but I don't know what it would be, and I suspect it wouldn't make a difference.

@MikeJ,

From the image I posted, it looks like the neck is welding, but that some of the verts are welding to the right place, and some are welding to the wrong place. I'm suspecting that when Poser originally loaded the 'figureResFile', that it created a list of which neck vertices weld to which head and chest vertices. When the hybrid neck is loaded, obviously the vertices are ordered differently in that mesh, and I suspect that to be the cause of the problem. Perhaps I can find a way to make Poser refresh this list, or perhaps odf has some trick up his sleeve to reorder the vertices.

@Lesbentley
Good point! That's exactly the reason why I'll add all three lash tarnsparencies so people have a choice.
I always keep the eyebrows on their own layer when I am creating a face texture. This way I am able to create good bump mapes from them. And I am able to create a second set that looks symetric - well... almost. I will mix the front part of the more ideal brow with the end of the "wild" one.

As this texture set is meant as a base for all Antonia-starters it will be good to have some variety and so I am glad about different opinions.

@odf:

Here's the download for the MikeJ-mapped Antonia mesh split into actors:

Will we texturers need it at the moment or is it just meant for modeling purposes? (If I sound clueless you guessed right: I am!! ).

Quote - Here's the download for the MikeJ-mapped Antonia mesh split into actors:

Will we texturers need it at the moment or is it just meant for modeling purposes? (If I sound clueless you guessed right: I am!! ).

It's just something for Les to play with. I guess I could have just emailed him, but you never know who else lurks in the thread and might find these things interesting.

Tomorrow I will start with the bumpmaps and the specular maps (for the "classic" version).

btw, SaintFox, i really like the difference in the colors in the legs. it is very realistic like that.

Looks great, SaintFox!

Great stuff SaintFox! I'm especially liking the colour and size of the areolae.

Is the little "scar" on the lower abdomen a rendering artifact ?
I'm asking this because, generaly the appendix is on the right side.

I'm more and more impressed by the "tony poly" team this is propbably going to be the best mesh in all poseruniverse !

Quote - Is the little "scar" on the lower abdomen a rendering artifact ?
I'm asking this because, generaly the appendix is on the right side.

It could be something other than the appendix.

That keeps looking better and better, SaintFox!

yvesab: You have eagle-eyes!! This is not a rendering artifact, it's indeed a scar that the first version of the texture has as well. The model who's photos I use has such a scar in excact that place and on the left side (I did not mirror the resource). We where puzzled here as well and I did a little research and found that a) many other surgerys can leave such a scar and, even more interesting, b) some people have their appendix on the opposite site. But as this is caused by a rare and really dangerous prenatal deformation (better: malrotation of the intestine) I think that the scar is caused by a different kind of surgery.

About the areola: I kept the color as is as I found that the original "features" always work best with the skin (except teeth, gums and eyes). So I do not match them to my taste (in fact I have no special preferences here) and this way I can leave parts of the surrounding skin what makes blending into the base skin easy. The size is simply what the UV map told me

I will start with the bump maps now and hopefully come up with some more image in some hours. Meanwhile Leo recreated the tattoo we had with the first version and is now painting a very special extra.

Regarding all those previews and the explanations about the progress: I hope that everybody gets me right! It is not my intention to boast of what we do here!! From the start of this project and the first renders where odf showed every step of Antonia's progress I was fascinated about the insight into the development of a complete new figure. And even if I do not understand everything about modelling, rigging, mapping and joint-control-magic I am excited to be able to follow the progress by reading this thread. And so I think that an insight into the texture-process might be interesting as well. And most of all I like to have your opinions - better change something now then later when everything is done!

 I stopped receiving notices and forgot the thread. I have long and short term memory problems that affect all aspects of my life.

Apparently it affected the morphs I did,too. I must not have completely zeroed the mesh before working on it. Well crap. I can't see for crap, either, so there you go.

Sorry for being so useless on this project.  I thought I was doing better, but obviously, I'm not. Sorry all.

SaintFox: I think one could probably use a mask to achieve a smoother edge. It's a p.i.t.a. though to do that kind of thing by hand, so before I do it again, I'd rather learn to use matmatic and recreate the VSS shaders with it. At any rate, it would be nice if you left the glossier version in as an option.

JOELGLAINE: Don't flog yourself over it. Even if I can't use your morphs directly, they can always serve me as references. Your "open mouth" morph is really good.

MikeJ: Why does your lip material have two polygons more than my lip material? Bug or feature?

Okay, I will release the set with gloss on and off!

About the two polygons more: I hope that it's not my fault that you got this impression. The lip material is covered with skin and the rosy area is made a very little bit smaller to create a natural effect and to avoid a hard edge - this way I could stamp rosy skin into the lip skin and vice versa.

Quote -

MikeJ: Why does your lip material have two polygons more than my lip material? Bug or feature?

It's just where I put the seam that determined that. Since the lip UVs  are separated from the head, what at one time was part of the face material became part of the lips.

Quote -
had some trouble with the lips when I used the material system I used for the first version (the one with slightly tinted lips and more shine on them). The difference between face material and lip material caused a nasty edge under specific light situations. So I changed the lip's material settings and used the same I used for the face.

That "nasty edge" I think is what I was talking about earlier when discussing how SSS can be affected by separate materials, when I was explaining why I eliminated the scalp material and made the head all one mat. The way that SSS is calculated, based on material thickness and other measurements, at least in render engines such as Lightwave and Mental Ray. I also said at the time I didn't know if it would matter or not to Poser, since I don't really know how Poser does its fake SSS.

I did also mention that it could adversely affect the lips for the same reason, but figured it would be minimal. Maybe not. That was in the last paragraph I wrote up where I said I had mixed feelings about the lips being separated or not.

I can reattach them to the face UVs, if you guys want. It might be better for Poser and some of its shaders, but again I'm really not sure.

Quote - > Quote -

MikeJ: Why does your lip material have two polygons more than my lip material? Bug or feature?

It's just where I put the seam that determined that. Since the lip UVs  are separated from the head, what at one time was part of the face material became part of the lips.

Let's rephrase the question then: why did you put the seam where you put the seam? I was just a bit surprised that you included the two polygons between the lips and the philtrum in the lip part, is all.

Quote -
Let's rephrase the question then: why did you put the seam where you put the seam? I was just a bit surprised that you included the two polygons between the lips and the philtrum in the lip part, is all.

Just at the time, looking at the mesh and deciding where to put the seam, that looked like a good place for it. That would be my first guess, based on what I know about how I go about things. There's also a possibility it was just a mistake, since the current version was done with the lo poly mesh, while the original was done with the high poly mesh.

As you may remember, UVLayout doesn't show materials. It would make things much easier if it did, to serve as reminders for such occasions where it might be better to stick with predefined material groups, but then again, it was designed mostly for Maya users, where one would typically UV first and assign materials later.