I have Poser 7 Pro and love the 64 bit rendering capabilities.

If Poser 8 Pro was 64 bit even for the Pose Room and such... wouldn't you be able to do more? Or is that a false rumor?

I'd like Poser to be able to use as much RAM as a computer had available.

There is no program called Poser 7 Pro. It is called Poser Pro.

There is no upcoming program called Poser 8 Pro. It is called Poser Pro 2010.

The programs are Poser, and Poser Pro. The versions of Poser are 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, etc. The first updated version of Poser Pro will be called 2010.

And it is 64 bit.

Most users would never see any effect, but if you build complex scenes it would be an asset. 

Geometry or texture-heavy scenes, complicated animations, running multiple dynamic cloth simulations, and 100+ particle effects could make use of a 64bit Poser executable.

~  edit:  cross-posted with bagginsbill  ~

Bagginsbill, do you mean that the Poser Pro 2010 executable is 64bit?  I have the beta installed on two 64bit machines, but I installed outside of the usual program files folder in order to avoid Vista's UAC antics, so I would not be able to distinguish.  I have pulled about eight and a half gigs total while rendering in separate process, but that says nothing of the executable.

Quote - There is no program called Poser 7 Pro. It is called Poser Pro.

There is no upcoming program called Poser 8 Pro. It is called Poser Pro 2010.

The programs are Poser, and Poser Pro. The versions of Poser are 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, etc. The first updated version of Poser Pro will be called 2010.

And it is 64 bit.

Thanks for jumping my ass. Congratulations. You knew it was 64 bit - what was I talking about? Apparently you knew even though I 'named it wrong" god forbid.

Poser 4 had a Poser Pro version... this is why I named it Poser  7 Pro... but okay Poser Pro 2010... lemme write that on the board ten thousand times. Not Poser fcking Pro 7 or Poser fcking 7 pro.. but I'm bagginsbill on payroll and i say it is Pro Poser ten years of 2nd millennium and I am right!!
 
It's 64 bit render engine or 64 bit Pose Room as well? Like I asked... does it make a difference if Poser can access more RAM?

thanks

Quote - Poser 4 had a Poser Pro version... this is why I named it Poser  7 Pro... but okay Poser Pro 2010.

Actually it was called Poser ProPack.

Tell him what he won, Johnny!

nice edit.
went from polite to nasty. you bipolar or something?

Quote -
Poser 4 had a Poser Pro version... this is why I named it Poser  7 Pro...

This is why you just won the title of "Coleman Minus Pack". Congratulations!

At least that's original. Bravo. I liked that.

I knew Poser pro whatever Render engine is 64 bit..

Is the Pose Room 64 bit?

Does it make a difference?

If you don't know then please just correct how products are named and sound important OR just correct some mundane aspect of this thread to make yourself sound important without really answering the question.

If you DO know - please please please... illuminate us

Has anyone seen the cat..?  Schrodinger's gone and lost it again..!!!   #;o)

how about you just stop. right now, take a breath and calm down? before you get a mod on your back yelling at you?

Good advice.

Poser Pro 2010 is NOT Pose Room 64 bit so I'll stop asking about it.

Coleman PM'd me to make sure I understand that I don't know what I'm talking about.

I PM'd back, with no rancor. Not sure who shoved a stick up his ass, but it wasn't me.

Anyway, Poser Pro 2010 is only in beta at the moment, and only the 32-bit Pose room has been given to beta testers. However, drawing conclusions from that is incorrect.

The product will be fully 64-bit, in the UI, in the Pose Room scene data model, and in the renderer.

It will be simultaneously delivered as 64-bit and 32-bit versions, so that those who have only a 32-bit OS can still use Poser Pro 2010.

I am working on the 64-bit GUI as we speak. Coleman, perhaps you don't realize that I'm one of the developers. I say that only because you didn't believe me the first time I answered, and now you're asking "if you know say so". I know. I'm saying so.

I can't get the cork out of my Klein Bottle...;)

64-bit allows you to address more memory (beyond the 3 gig 'barrier') so you could probably make more complex scenes...

Each computer instruction is twice as long, so you might see some increase in speed...

but, as with anything else, you're really limited by the slowest component, so you'd have to know on a case-by-case basis...

 Ok, guys, that's QUITE enough of the bickering over things that really don't matter.  Let's get back to the topic at hand, without the personal attacks.

Jeni

Why ride someone for naming your product wrong?

You now state it will be 64 bit... my question was about whether that would enhance use-ability. You'd think as someone working on the damned thing you'd wanna promote it and say a few erudite words about how YES the 64 bit UI WILL enhance such and such. But instead you took the opportunity to point out TO A PROSPECTIVE BUYER that the product was named such and such and NOT answer my question... which STILL has not been even mentioned!! F*ck!

Whatever man, you're right. You named it right and it is 64 bit.

I asked will the fish in the water jug swim faster if the water is cold.

You answered: It is called a fishbowl and the water is cold.

I apologize for PMing you out of anger - that was not right.

I'll go back to lurking - jezus.

Coleman,

I understand what you're asking now. I didn't in my first response, which I don't consider to be riding you. Go read it again, but imagine you found that paragraph in a FAQ, where the question was: What are the various versions of Poser called?

I was not meaning to insult you, and I'm pretty sure nothing in my phrasing is, in fact, insulting. It's just that I see lots of new Poser users who are not familiar with the (somewhat unhelpful) naming schemes applied to Poser, and thought that a recapitulation of that information (which I have typed many times in the past) would be helpful to other readers, not you in particular. Lots of people read these threads, even though they don't post. They learn from lurking, and it helps them if they learn things clearly. I was just trying to be clear, not insulting.

Anwyay, I didn't answer your question correctly because:

1) It was really early in my morning, after a late night of coding, and the coffee was still brewing.
2) In my brain, 64-bit automatically equates to "can deal with more data".  I read your question more like this: "If the Mercury Mariner came in 4-wheel drive, would it handle snow better?" And my answer would have been "The Mercury Mariner comes in 4-wheel drive - it's not a question of if", forgetting to say that all 4-wheel drive cars handle snow better than 2-wheel drive cars, because that is the crux of the question. See what I mean? To me, your question parsed as "will it come in 64-bit", not "is 64-bit Poser better than 32-bit Poser". Of course its better - 64-bit anything is better than 32-bit when it comes to handling more than 4GB of data. 32-bit apps are completely incapable of addressing more than 4GB of data.

Now, to really answer your question, will Poser Pro 2010 in 64-bit mode really work better or will it actually fall over dead becomes of some other internal limitation when dealing with a billion polygons. Nobody truly knows that yet. In theory, yes. But that's not based on knowledge of Poser in particular, but in how 64-bit is generally better than 32-bit.

Good answer BB ... Thanks for the clarification.

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

hey bagginsbill did you get to beta test P 2010? and in your words is it going to be any good, I'm still using P7 because I hear to many bad things about P8 Hoping P2010 will be better plus I'm planing on moving to 64bit system, cause of my other work... (no cause of poser)

Quote - bagginsbill:

The product will be fully 64-bit, in the UI, in the Pose Room scene data model, and in the renderer.

It will be simultaneously delivered as 64-bit and 32-bit versions, so that those who have only a 32-bit OS can still use Poser Pro 2010.

I am working on the 64-bit GUI as we speak.

Whoa, that is big news, bagginsbill!  And good news!  ^^

Quote - > Quote - bagginsbill:

The product will be fully 64-bit, in the UI, in the Pose Room scene data model, and in the renderer.

It will be simultaneously delivered as 64-bit and 32-bit versions, so that those who have only a 32-bit OS can still use Poser Pro 2010.

I am working on the 64-bit GUI as we speak.

Whoa, that is big news, bagginsbill!  And good news!  ^^

Yeah, that made my eyes gleam too. Now I have to start checking behind and underneath the sofa for stray pennies.

Quote - hey bagginsbill did you get to beta test P 2010? and in your words is it going to be any good, I'm still using P7 because I hear to many bad things about P8 Hoping P2010 will be better plus I'm planing on moving to 64bit system, cause of my other work... (no cause of poser)

Haha. What a loaded question.

First, there's no doubt that one can find some fault with Poser 8. It isn't a perfect application, it crashes occasionally, and while the GUI and library are a favorable improvement to many users, there are some users who think it was a step backward or for whom it isn't working right. Those who are vocal about the step backward tend also to be people who, for reasons I don't fully comprehend, think the improvements in performance and lighting are underwhelming. Leaving aside how we feel about the GUI changes, the ability to do inverse square falloff lighitng, GI, much faster handling of real hair - these are things that make P8 very compelling. Even if I felt the new GUI was a step backward (which I don't) the ability to render more interesting and accurate images than before is enough for me that I have never once fired up Poser 7 or Poser Pro since I got Poser 8.

Poser Pro 2010 will take all that and add built-in GC, as well as the ability to render scenes with a lot more content, use multiple computers to render even faster, and it will have more major improvements to the library. Once PPro 2010 is finished, I will never fire up P8 again, either.

what apps will we need to have loaded on our computer ahead of tyme before 2010 will work?and will we still see the creation of thousands of (make believe)files?

BB

So does this mean that I can finally use almost all of my 32Gigs of ram for Poser?

Quote - what apps will we need to have loaded on our computer ahead of tyme before 2010 will work?and will we still see the creation of thousands of (make believe)files?

That's an interesting question. The library will still be in Flex, but updated. For the 32-bit version, it will work the same (or not work, however the case may be) as Poser 8. However, there is a problem. The Flex GUI needs Flash to run, and Adobe has not released a 64-bit Flash player. Which means that it can't be embedded in the app. We're currently thinking to make the library a separate application, running under AIR instead of the Flash player. This means two things:

1) The library will be its own window which you can move/resize independently of the docking system. If you have two monitors, you could easily move it to the second monitor and maximize it. If you only have one, then it will be in front of or behind Poser, and you switch with Alt-Tab same as switching between any two applications. We're thinking about other ways to it to the front. We're also thinking of perhaps getting it to behave sort of like a docked window, but not sure how at the moment.

1. Being an AIR app, it will not be embedded inside IE, so that part would go away. No IE, no Flash. It would just work.

As for the mysterious cached XML files that are not supposed to be there, we're still working on trying to make the OS stop caching them. In any case, we're changing the protocol between the library and the Poser server so that HTTP is not involved in the continuous polling for state info that is happening now. So that will eliminate 99% of those files, for sure.

Quote - BB

So does this mean that I can finally use almost all of my 32Gigs of ram for Poser?

That's precisely what the 64-bit version will do for you.

Quote - ...will we still see the creation of thousands of (make believe)files?

I have been checking for orphaned IE5 XML files after running Poser Pro 2010 beta and have not seen any accumulation on either of my 64bit machines.

Quote - So does this mean that I can finally use almost all of my 32Gigs of ram for Poser?

I pulled eight and a half gigs rendering a wallpaper the other night.  No problem!  :D

I have it on very good sources that Poser 128-bit is just around the corner.

(The source is my cat.)

Can't wait for Poser Pro 2010.  I really miss the separate render capabilities from Poser Pro.  Poser Pro 2010 will render in a separate process, right?       ....right?!

yes

Ah'm gunna wate fer da 256 bit virgin, yeah !

Is there an ETA on PP 2010 yet?

Theoretically, sometime in 2010...;)

I know the ETA, but as with the P8 release, I'm not allowed to say. Sorry.

But I got away with some crazy leaking last time, so I'll probably get away with a light slap on the wrist from Cooper for this: before May.

Get excited.

Oh wow!  That's sooner then I had hoped!  Thank you for making from now to May an unbearable existence bagginsbill! ;)  Will you, as a developer, be adding any material magic to the 2010 version?

Not to throw fuel on this, now that it died down, but since some were clarifying the naming of the products, I thought I would clarify a bit more...  There was Pro Pack for Poser 4 not a Poser Pro version of Poser 4. (PPP was the intials everyone attached to it at the time) You had to have Poser 4 to get the Pro Pack, unlike Poser Pro, which is a stand alone program. I do not believe they ever combined the Pro Pack into Poser 4 as one product, but I do believe they were sold Bundled before Poser 5 was released.

Wow, native 64 bit, not just renderer... that really is huge news.

Now I REALLY gotta get a new machine and upgrade my OS to 64 bit....

I need to clarify that the Mac will not get the 64-bit editor, only Windows gets the 64-bit editor. There are insurmountable difficulties with a 64-bit GUI on Mac. That's why Photoshop is still a 32-bit app on Mac.

Both will have a 64-bit renderer.

jeffg3 your cat signed a NDA so get ready for the lawyer, my cat...heheh

The issue of NDA - This came up during P8 beta when I talked about stuff and one or two members here accused me of violating the NDA.

I know you're joking, but lest the crapola start again, let's clarify something.

A Non Disclosure Agreement does not prevent me from revealing knowledge I gain during beta. It prevents me from making the decision to reveal on my own. If, however, an officer of SM decides to give me permission to reveal something, then the NDA does not apply to that bit of information anymore.

I hope that's clear. I talk to the Poser powers-that-be every week. I just had a 2 hour conversation last night with Steve Cooper, Uli Klumpp, and Larry Weinberg. How many of you get to converse with the founder of Poser every week? In that conversation, we discussed this discussion of the 64-bit capability of Poser Pro 2010, and specifically we discussed this thread.

So any NDA nannies out there should just relax and assume I'm not violating NDA, OK?

 Bagginsbill, I didn't know you are one of the Poser developers -  now I do, so please put the GUI back to what it was in versions prior to 8 - please :)

Heh. That isn't my decision - I just build what they tell me to build. The entire GUI was written from scratch for Poser 8, and the new library component is being improved, not removed. For reasons I've explained before and some I'm not allowed to talk about, the old one is never coming back.

There are more display options than before, so you can actually configure it to be a lot more like the old one. But there's more to it than that. The library has its own evolutionary path, which we are only on the beginning of. And it will not be just a Poser library as it is now.

Just think of it as growing pains. After some time, when it is all grown up, it will be far superior to the old one. The old implementation was a dead end and very difficult to expand upon.

Notice that there is now a tree, a tiled list, and a detail panel. You can use these in any combination - tile list only (like Poser 7), tree only (like Poser 8), tile list + detail panel, tree + detail panel, all three (as seen here) and more.

The current folder path components in the breadcrumb bar are clickable. You can go back to any of the parent folders in one click.

DAZ Studio wants its library back.

Heh heh.

Quote - DAZ Studio wants its library back.

Heh heh.

Heheh
To me, this looks much like P3DOExplorer, and that was certainly a pre-DS app... 

So.. chicken and egg thingie here... 

But still funny ;)

I could show you guys this same layout I built in 1989 for a network management application - graphical - before there even was a Windows OS.

I wrote my own OS for multithreading and direct-to-hardware API for graphics. It ran on MSDOS but it looked like that.

So - there.

If this user's opinion carries any weight, the separate window for the library sounds delightful....and a godsend for those with two monitors. Or who need an excuse for 2 monitors..... 

Quote - If this user's opinion carries any weight, the separate window for the library sounds delightful....and a godsend for those with two monitors. Or who need an excuse for 2 monitors..... 

That's Me...!!!!

Quote - I need to clarify that the Mac will not get the 64-bit editor, only Windows gets the 64-bit editor. There are insurmountable difficulties with a 64-bit GUI on Mac. That's why Photoshop is still a 32-bit app on Mac.

Both will have a 64-bit renderer.

The reason Photoshop is still 32 bit is because it was written with the Carbon libraries. 

Carbon was a temporary fix to bridge from OS9 to OSX.  Apple has been telling developers for almost a decade now not to make long-term plans with anything that uses Carbon. 

They would have to start using the Cocoa libraries. 

If Adobe or anyone else needed any clue it should have been 2 years ago when Apple dropped development of the Carbon 64 libraries.

The "insurmountable" difficulties with a 64-bit GUI are the need to move from the Carbon libraries to the Cocoa libraries.

Correct. That ain't gonna happen in the next couple of months.

Have you used Apple's scripts?  They have a web page in the Developer Connection that is supposed to do a lot of the leg work for you (swapping out the Carbon to Cocoa libraries).  I found it while looking for something completely different - which seems to be how the Apple search function works - I can never find what I am looking for.

As long as I can address more that 4GB of ram, I don't care if the GUI is 32 bit or not.  I like the new look.  It has taken a little getting used to, but I like the speed.