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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2025 Jan 06 7:01 am)
Subject: WIP: Heads-up Angela fans ;o)
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I like the style, and good hems are a great finishing touch to give sensible clothing a bit more realism. With ready-made zones, I think this may be the dress that will entice me into the material room at last. I'm looking forward to a new challenge!
"If I were a shadow, I know I wouldn't like to be half of
what I should be."
Mr Otsuka, the old black tomcat in Kafka on the Shore (Haruki
Murakami)
To echo Kaibach: YAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY sensible yet elegant clothing. Please-please-PLEASE let this be the start of a trend, Laurie. If you weren't so far away, I'd make a special trip to your house and hug you.
This is elegant. It is graceful. It is Beautiful! Wow-wow-wow... I am ever so impressed.
I do want to get into dynamic clothing and actually had a bit of a go a bit ago, but following the stickied links gave me no joy. I do think dynamic clothing has an incredible future, but like *everything Poser needs a lot more documentation than what's available.
Be happy to trade you: I'll share what I know about shaders if you wanna show me how to do dynamics... :biggrin:
Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand]
Well (for this dress anyway) the process is very simple. I used the default of 30 frames to run the simulation. At frame one, the figure is in the default position. Load the dress prop from the library. Go to the cloth room, go to frame 30. Apply a pose to your figure or pose it manually (your dress won't be in the right place here, but that's ok). Choose a new simulation (default is start frame at 1, end frame at 30). Check the "Cloth Self-collision" checkbox and type in the amount of frames you want it to drape (I believe this can actually be one, but I normally put 20 or so in there, just cause I still don't quite know what I'm doing...lol). Close that window. Click on the "Clothify" button and choose the dress prop. Click on the "Collide Against" button and select your figure (in this case Angela). You can uncheck the "start draping from zero pose" if you want to and check the "Ignore Head and Feet Collisions" checkboxes if you want. Click the "Edit Constrained Groups" button and then click the "Add Material" button in that window. Select neckline, bow, bow knot and waistband (we want those parts to stick where they are and not migrate anywhere). Close the group editor. Select the settings you want like the cloth density and what not and run the simulation. That's about it ;o).
I'll put my settings in the readme when I gather it all up for upload :o).
Laurie
Hems. Thank goodness.
All dynamic designers...YOU SHOULD MAKE HEMS!
clothing does not end in cloth!
Laurie do the straps have double hems all the way from the dress in front to the dress in back? And around the arm openings?
That finishing touch would be wonderful. Don't be afreaid to show stitching, either.
I like your dress. Anyone wanting to kick it up from 'sensible' can do that with textures.
Looking forward to seeing this. Good job.
There are raised hems the whole way around the sleeves, the neckline and the bottom of the skirt. I normally don't do stitching because at distance you can't really see it anyway ;o). I'll give it some thought. The main reason I added the hems was so the openings would look like they have some thickness, like the real thing ;o).
Laurie
Yeah! Someone making REAL CLOTHES for REAL GIRLS! And dynamic no less! Good for you, Laurie!
I notice on your site it's not for V4. Any chance of a fit for her? Or will the clothroom take care of that? (I suspect if I change the scale a bit that would be all that would be needed... but you never know until you ask.)
About stitching: not being a modeller, instinct tells me this is the sort of detail that would best be done with texture and displacement maps.
Hmm... in my excitement at seeing the dress, I missed what basicwiz just pointed out. Who is Angela?
EDIT: oops, never mind. I didn't have signatures enabled, so I didn't see the link to your site. I've got it now!
EDIT 2: I think the phrase "the whole way around the sleeves" already gave the answer to operaguy's question about the hem on the outside of the strap - yes!
"If I were a shadow, I know I wouldn't like to be half of
what I should be."
Mr Otsuka, the old black tomcat in Kafka on the Shore (Haruki
Murakami)
Thank you for the concise dynamic clothing tutorial, Laurie. I'll be making use of that! May I ask: what software do you model in?
Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand]
I use Wings 3D to model. I'm poor and it's simple and free...lol. Actually, I got Carrara 7 Pro for Christmas, but so far Wings has pretty much had everything I need in it and I already know how to use it (I use the term "use" loosely...hehe). So I prefer the free program over the 500 dollar one. Go figure ;o). I'll explore Carrara later when I'm really ready to tear my hair out...
As for stitching, I think operaguy did mean on the texture and not modeled stitching...hehe. I've also been thinking about what he meant by "front to back". If he meant like a cuff on a sweatshirt where the cuff is sort of rolled around the edge of the sleeve opening, then yes, the hems are front to back. The main part of the dress is one sided, but the hems are sort of like donuts with holes - thin torus...they go the whole way round or the hems start to pull apart when Poser smooths them and you can see daylight thru them close up ;o). It's been a challenge learning by trial and error what I think is a decent model and what Poser wants to mangle - looks great in Wings, but not so much in Poser ;o). I've found out that even when everything is welded, Poser still likes to pull it apart or worse yet, take corners and flat sides and bulge them out like a loaf of bread ;o). I get more upset at Poser than at Wings...hehe. A lot of it too is my lack of knowledge about modeling in general...I'm pretty much just "winging" this so to speak and learning as I go. I like it though and if it weren't for a very good friend I'd have never really tried to model anything more complicated than a cardboard box. For all my protestations that I couldn't model, he assured me that I could ;o). I guess he was right...lol.
Anyway, as far as fitting the dresses to other figures, I was going to give it the old college try at some point :o). Too bad CrossDresser can't refit a prop or I could do it lickety split...
Laurie
Laurie, you are taking the finishing touches, namely the cuff/hems, farther then most for-sale vendors! Kudos to you for that.
To get these hems to stay put and lie right? It might be an issue with the smoothing settings in Poser. Also, maybe move the model into Poser and use the PoserMorphBrushTool (which in Pro2010 now goes across groups) and flatten/tug it into place, then export back into Wings for more work. That is a pure guess on my part, i have not done anything like that myself.
Also for fitting to other figures..really it simply has to generally fit the bodice. With dynamic clothing it is often the case that you locate the dress "around" your target model, then dial-down the z and y axis of the model until there is no poke thru, animated to return to normal at frame 30. What happens? As the first 30 frames of animation execute during the simulation, the model returns to correct size and "pushes" the mesh of the dress into place.
That has worked for me pretty well.
::::: Opera ::::::
Quote - ...
Also for fitting to other figures..really it simply has to generally fit the bodice. With dynamic clothing it is often the case that you locate the dress "around" your target model, then dial-down the z and y axis of the model until there is no poke thru, animated to return to normal at frame 30. What happens? As the first 30 frames of animation execute during the simulation, the model returns to correct size and "pushes" the mesh of the dress into place.
That has worked for me pretty well.
::::: Opera ::::::
But wouldn't that sort of pre-drape the dress? Sorry...like I said before - new to dynamic clothing ;o).
Laurie
As the thread title sez... it's for Angela. She's an Ali product, available at mankahoo.com. A very nice figure, from what I've used her so far.
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Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM
Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3
Yeah. Angela is similar in height to V4, but thinner, so there may be a bit of x and z enlargement necessary (I'm guessing - still very early in the curve with dynamics, myself).
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Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM
Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3
I was looking at the promo clips showing the way she bends. I was very impressed, and nearly bought her right away. But then I thought, hold on, it is so not difficult for me to be impressed by this stuff. So I'll wait a bit and see what those less impressionable than me think of her. :O)
"If I were a shadow, I know I wouldn't like to be half of
what I should be."
Mr Otsuka, the old black tomcat in Kafka on the Shore (Haruki
Murakami)
Quote - I was looking at the promo clips showing the way she bends. I was very impressed, and nearly bought her right away. But then I thought, hold on, it is so not difficult for me to be impressed by this stuff. So I'll wait a bit and see what those less impressionable than me think of her. :O)
Think I might follow suit, IsaoShi... I bought another figure at RDNA recently and was stung a bit because there were... issues. Besides, I'm a bit over budget this month so...
Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand]
Quote -
Think I might follow suit, IsaoShi... I bought another figure at RDNA recently and was stung a bit because there were... issues. Besides, I'm a bit over budget this month so...
Not to get OT too far, but I find it interesting that nobody continued to use her after she was yanked, no matter how much stuff they bought. Why? Most Poser users own the figure she was reputedly based off of, anyway; ergo, we have every right to render that mesh. If she was good enough to render before, she's good enough to render now.
At any rate, given the number of unique humanoid figures Ali has created, not to mention the rep she has built up over a long period of time, I'm not too concerned about Angela on that front.
I certainly hear ya on the budget issue, though....
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Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM
Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3
my first impression of her is: great shoulders (which really count for me) and just enough facial morphs included to turn her into a different person. The included texture is good. The mesh and texture around the eyes are primitive. However, the morphs for the fold above the eye work well.
I like her so far.
Who's angela?
WARK!
Thus Spoketh Winterclaw: a blog about a Winterclaw who speaks from time to time.
(using Poser Pro 2014 SR3, on 64 bit Win 7, poser units are inches.)
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Poser really, really, really hates 90 degree angles.
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Poser doesn't like the two sided rolled edges on the hems. Dynamics pushes the back sides into the front sides and it makes a beautiful mess. Sorry operaguy ;o). I tried.
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If I open up the back of the hems on the inside of the dress, dynamics just pulls them out flat anyway.
I guess that's why dynamic clothes creators don't make hems operaguy ;o). I did figure out that if the neckline has a modeled hem and it's part of the constrained group, the raised hem stays nice and pretty. But the sleeve openings get pulled flat. If you add the sleeve openings to the constrained group too then they look nice. However, you can't add the skirt hem to the constrained group or it won't drape correctly, so the hem will just end in - well - cloth ;o). I'll have to texture a displacement map for the hem.
Anyway, perhaps you folks could tell me how hi a res you generally like for a dynamic item? I've noticed in sitting positions, my dress doesn't look too good because there's not enough mesh to bend around folds nicely. But if I subdivide it, it looks beautiful. Of course by subdividing it, the dress is now as high a res as most figures (and more than some!)...lol.
Welp, time for bed. I'll pick this up tomorrow :o).
Laurie
(edit): the image is the ultra hi res mesh...that's why the folds look nicer than they would have ;o).
IC. The dynamic engine unfolds the folds. Well there may or may not be a welding situation out there, but indeed i hardly ever see hems on dynamic clothing.
Laurie could you offer both res? I can tell you right now I'd want that hi res. For an anmiation, however, it might be overkill so you'd want the lo
Quote -
Poser doesn't like the two sided rolled edges on the hems. Dynamics pushes the back sides into the front sides and it makes a beautiful mess. Sorry operaguy ;o). I tried.
If I open up the back of the hems on the inside of the dress, dynamics just pulls them out flat anyway.
I guess that's why dynamic clothes creators don't make hems operaguy ;o)
Dynamic clothing creators DO make hems - have a look at svdl's things in freestuff for examples. They can probably explain things more easily than I can with words; but the secret is to roll the hem right round and join it on again in a sort of "P" shaped cross-section. Then it can't open out again, but it does make UV mapping more tricky, with the tools I have anyway.
I think I have a screen shot somewhere, but I can't find it right now. Should be working anyway. ;)
That's a shame - but, healthier...
Another option might be to assign the rolled-over but unjoined hem to the soft decorated group. I can't remember if I've done this or not, but it's worth a try anyway. It should force the simulator to retain the shape of the hem relative to the underlying cloth. If you assign the hem to a different material zone, it makes it easy to experiment with settings because all the vertices you want to use can be selected in one go by using the "add material" button in the group editor. Then you can try things like alternate dynamic groups as well, if you want.
The hems are indeed all a separate material. Makes things much simpler in the dynamic cloth room. I didn't realize this either until I started to make this new dress. My dress currently in freestuff didn't have a separate material zone for the neckline. Might have to do an update...
At any rate, I'll try the soft decorated thing and see how that works :o). I can add the skirt hem to that too and it'll still drape, right?
Laurie
I've included an image of all the previously offending parts of the dress.
The sleeve hems are within the constrained group. I tried them in the soft decorated group, but they sunk into her arms on the inside with this pose. The good thing is that the bodice of this dress is so fitted that including the sleeve hems in the constrained group turns out to look better in this case. The skirt hem is in the soft decorated group and kept it's approximate shape and still draped nice. Thanks so much guys! You're a huge help :o).
In the image I used the original resolution of the dress which is already a whopping 8537 verts. You can see the mesh break a little bit in this pose around the center hip area. Subdividing sends it over 20,000 (even though it does look great I wouldn't use a mesh that high unless I was doing a cameo with few other props or objects in the scene ;o)). How big is too big for a dynamic dress? I have no idea...lol. Judging by the dynamic cloth plane included in Poser, the resolution is fairly high on that too. Anyway...
I guess I'll call it finished then so now I can uv map and texture it :o). Wish me luck with that...gonna take some fancy mapping and I'm not sure I'm the one to do it, but I'll give it a shot...lol.
(edit): I guess I should mention that the smoothing on the dress is set at 110 and that the hems are all rolled completely around and welded from the front edge to the inside of the dress :o).
Laurie
That's excellent, Laurie!
I'd prefer that the bodice be not quite so tight, but I suppose that can be loosened up somewhat with some Z-scaling.
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Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM
Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3
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I was thinking about the Oscars the other day (never watch 'em) and this dress popped out ;o). It's dynamic and I think I'll make one without the belt just for fun. It's much better than the last dress I made: I thought ahead this time and made material zones for the neckline and belt so that it could be easily added to the constrained group for running your dynamic simulations, relieving users from having to manually select verts :o). Live and learn. I'm still so new to this modeling stuff (and dynamics too).What do ya think? Yeah, I know it's not risque or revealing, but I tend to more "sensible" or "realistic" things...lol.
If and when I get it done, I'll drop it in freestuff. I've got to texture it now, and I'm still in a modeling mood.
Laurie