carodan: I had a pretty well proportioned version awhile back in another thread, you may remember it. Much slimmer. I will likely just go back to that and work from there. Very unlikely in this area of the US that I may find someone to model in the flesh, without getting beat up LOL. But I have some books with human proportions in them and I have tons of reference photo's. A few human motion movies. So that will have to do.

Thanks for the input.

rjjack: That is a good idea to wait befor making any conforming clothing, since much may change. I will do my best to keep the JCM's down or whatever you suggest from a clothing creators viewpoint to make your job easier.

I was just looking at the earlier version - yes, much better proportions. I'll keep watching and help as best I can.

Is it really that bad where you live? Wow. I could pretty easily find any number of willing models where I am in the UK without any fear that what I was proposing would be even remotely frowned upon.
It is just a creative endeavour, after all.

Yes it's pretty nasty in most of Idaho and particularly here. Much of Wyoming as well. Close minded and brutal come to mind. People beaten to death from time to time. Prejudice and hatred, alot of it passed on generation to generation.

 Mike, no matter my eagerness.I haven't yet had the chance to try out the new download of Brad  myself yet.

So based on rjjack's  render,and because I'm so mad-eager to see this extraordinarily rigged baby housed in an attractive figure that everyone will want to use I'm going to throw at you my  immediate and quick observations. I agree that the head is too long the ears too small, the neck too thick and short  which should narrow at the base of the skullt. Also upper arms I find too short as in the  inside elbow  crease being too high up  and the forearms  too thick for the upper arms.
A longer leaner look rather than stocky would be my wish also.

 I think you are right to consider using your earlier shaping of Brad  which was better and more attractively proportioned to my eyes and it might be less work in the end.  Since you are going to work on the face  yet my wish would be for a bit more definition and angularity to get away from the too rounded baby-face look. The brows a bit more jutting the eyes a tad more inset, the nostrils less wide the chin less long and more angular.  I realize if the ability to dial these features in will be available it makes for more versitility to start with a sort of generic face though..
 
Mike I think you asked for feed-back so I hope my input is not too terse and critical considering that I'm not even a modeler   Brad's 'abilities' are thrilling and I'm sure his appearance will catch up with it with a bit more trial and error. Thanks for sharing it with us and letting us contribute with our observations.  Keep on keeping on!!

Cheers!

 Hi, I actually like a more stocky look to him with the thicker forearms but perhaps they could be a little thinner to wards the wrist.
Love esther
PS head scale will be adjustable of course by the user but it will be nice to have  a really good default look.
I'd like his default to be muscular though (more so than M4) like a body builder

masha: Thanks for the input. And no worries I dont personalize critique. I like the earlier shape better too and its fairly easy to get back to in Zbrush. I need to get it all worked out before I do any UV's So I will post some pics of the results for more critique. The face and head I will have to work from scratch.

estherau: He will be muscular. I have this idea that it will be much better for the UV's and rigging to slim the figure down instead of bulking him up, and will give a wider range of figure from huge to anemic, with less distortion of the UV's and better joint handling within that range. Plus I just dont want a "pretty boy" look for default, it's been over done.

 IDAHO? Holy crap! That's a LOT worse than the south (where I live) because  in Utah,Idaho, and some other of the western states are more close minded. I used to live in northern Utah and was appalled! I moved back to Tennessee in a flash!

ANYWAY-- I like the stockier version,too. You could do another figure if you wanted to. NO ONE said you can only have ONE! Look at DRAKELOT! He has tons of figures! You can too. If you want.:laugh:

Hi Joel :)

Had to get some sleep.  Yes I agree, and with these joint insertion pose files you may have as many base figure types as you want  and still use the same geometry. With the joint insertion pose you can make all the little changes to the rigging that are needed to make the rigging work well with the new shape. So a much slimmer twink style body is easily achieved. And I will do a version like that that can be loaded with a click.

Personally though for the original "Brad" I wished a cornfed, hay bailin, bib overall wearin, country boy. Stocky, well built, used to hard work kind of guy. Good lookin but not effeminate. Clear rocks all day from the field, and huck hay bails half the night.

 "Personally though for the original "Brad" I wished a cornfed, hay bailin, bib overall wearin, country boy. Stocky, well built, used to hard work kind of guy. Good lookin but not effeminate. Clear rocks all day from the field, and huck hay bails half the night."

 FANTASTIC!!!!

Esther ! .... didn't know you were a novelist, really like some of the images on your website :)
BTW, in case you didn't know, this praise is brought to you by a fellow Aussie !

 Hi mathman,
well I actually wrote Avenging Angel originally in the form of a TV series ie episodic and I am planning to bring that back in the form of a comic using poser.  Brad will be an ideal character in my comic.  
I live in sunny Q'land, where are you?
Love esther

I am in Melbourne.

 ah, good skiing, fine dining - lots of fun.

where in qld are you, esther ?

 brisvegas

ah beautiful Brissy...I'm planning to head up that way in May, actually staying at the Gold Coast.

Where is this Australia you're speaking of?

  a land far far away...

Quote - Where is this Australia you're speaking of?

Quote - a land far far away...

Ooh!  I know!  That's the one in Europe, kind of near Germany.  Right?  :lol:

(Runs away quickly, squealing, "Don't hit me!")

There are kangaroos hopping down the streets of Melbourne...

Quote - There are kangaroos hopping down the streets of Melbourne...

That's where they went. I  was starting to wonder... :lol:

 You might be surprised but we actually do sometimes have wallabies hopping around our garden (small kangaroo like critters - about2 feet tall)
Not kidding.
Love esther
PS come back here Cage!

Quote - > Quote - Where is this Australia you're speaking of?

Quote - a land far far away...

Ooh!  I know!  That's the one in Europe, kind of near Germany.  Right?  :lol:

Huh? I thought it was in Texas.....

:tongue1:

 Y'all wrong.

Heehee. I know, I'm pretty good at geography, since I'm not an American. (dig, dig) :tongue2:

Er...

Yay, Brad!

.. and kookaburras !

We also very occasionally get snakes in the garden in summer, especially if we are in drought.

I killed a copperhead snake one summer, I thought it was my mother's corgi brushing against my ankle, can you imagine my surprise when I looked down... !!

Quote -  You might be surprised but we actually do sometimes have wallabies hopping around our garden (small kangaroo like critters - about2 feet tall)
Not kidding.
Love esther
PS come back here Cage!

The hills around here are all nature preserves (or whatever it's called) and in some suburbs you can see ones quite a bit taller than 2 feet hop around at night.

I  hear all Australian men are shaped like Brad, is that true?

(Just to subtly steer the thread back on topic. :lol:)

Brad who ?

Quote - I  hear all Australian men are shaped like Brad, is that true?

[montypython]
Shouldn't he be named Bruce?
[/montypython]

Umm.  Apologies to phantom3D.  Apparently this is a night when Rosity needs its old Off Topic Lounge. 

 mathman started it.

quote "I  hear all Australian men are shaped like Brad, is that true?"

I wish!

sorry...
OK folks back on topic...

 which page has got brad's download link?

Quote - which page has got brad's download link?

Page twelve, near the bottom.

Here's the link:

http://www.poserpub.phantom3d.net/attachments/File/Brad_Low_Trial.zip

 just tried him. He really does bend very very well.
When I use poses not meant to him it does really bad things to the hand and restore doesn't fix the hands.  Then I tried locking the hand parts and applying a pose from somewhere but it still didn't help.
Love esther

 he's got a surprising amount of definition for a low poly figure.  with a good texture he would be great as a cameo character in my comic.
Love esther

 I actually like his default face quite a lot. He looks like the hard working country boy.  that GQ hair suits him too.

Thanks Esther for the renders. You will definitely have trouble with the hands and feet with poses from other figures untill I get them set up. You see he has the bones for fingers and toes already but no geometry assigned. So what you get is ghostbone like bends in the parent actors LOL

Next upload will have all parts working. I have been working on the face, cutting in some eyelids and I made the head a bit less long (Y) Also I have been fitting the eyesockets to the bagginsbill eyes. I made the ears a little bigger And his neck a little less stocky

I am changing the position of the collar slightly to get a better ability to shrug. Also I move the poly's around in the face to solve some of what odf mentioned with the poly lines fitting the contours better, I think I was able to solve alot of it without changing too many of the 5 edge points.

Next I am adding a few poly's in the wrist and just behind the toes for a smoother bend in those areas. And trying to figure out what to do with those ugly little pieces above the knees. I want to keep the flow of lines in the legs but figure out a way to tie them in better. Oh and I moved the bicep down a bit on the arm , and taking a little bulk out of the forearms.

Glad you like him Esther. He may be a little stocky but that really was what I wanted. Others may not like a stocky figure, so I will make a slimmed down version that can be loaded with a click, and will have the same good bends. Especially for ballet he should have a slimmer more compact body, an arabian race horse as opposed to a Clydesdale. For each purpose an appropriate form.

Off topic? No problems, I often ramble myself.  The link for the downloads will also be in my signature from now on so they can always be easily accessed. I will post the latest version befor I take off, promise. The critique is good, it helps to see things. And settles in my mind a plan of action to solve the problems.

 I must have missed something.  where are you going?  You can't leave brad unattended.  He may look fully grown, but really he's just a baby. Please don't go.
Love esther

Esther, I have a piece of land up north that needs attendance at least once a year to fix the road and clean up the winter mess, though this time of year it is still winter up there. I could wait for my next break this fall I suppose, but I also have a newly purchased home in Wyoming that needs some renovation before anyone moves in, so finding time to get everything done gets hectic. But I will upload a updated Brad before I leave and  will only be gone for 10 days maybe.

 on no.  A newly purchased home that needs renovating will actually take you months and months.  Let them make the best of it as it is.  Then do it up later and call it repairs.  you'll get better tax deductions and brad will get finished.
there is no way in the world you will be back in 10 days.
Love esther
sob sob

 I' not crying - there's just some dust in my eyes.

The house will be this fall and I am just going down to get some crews started on it.

I am staying home for the first days of my vacation which starts this Thursday to work exclusively on Brad so there will be lots of improvements for the next version which will be the first Alpha version. So no worries, I only have to grade the road and burn some deadfall, brush, etc, and I'll be back, maybe early even (so cold up there this time of year.) I am not abandoning Brad you'll see.

 okay, have fun.  see you soon (I hope)

Quote - I am a pestering mooch and I will take full advantage of your talents if you let me. 

Oh, man!  :lol:  You put it in your signature!  :lol:  Self-deprication is s'posed to be Cage's shtick.  :laugh:  Phantom3D is far more giving than mooching.  :thumbupboth:

Quote - last one

I like!

I have fans? :scared:   Quick! I better do something mean and nasty. I am much better as that wrestler that everyone loves to hate. :)

Hi Cage. :)

Well here is a slender version Masha, Still bends good. Not going to get much nore detail with only 14K poly's. You could add a displacement map but that kind of defeats the purpose of having low poly for animation. Still too stocky?