I was looking at the blurb for a new product here in the MP which includes this statement:-
"This is not a merchants resource pack and may not be used as a base for other textures or products, commercial or non commercial.
Do not redistribute and do not rebuild (partial or complete) any of the included files in this product. No portion of the included texture files may be used."

To me that says tat you can't use the texture to create other textures ie you can render with it but you can't modify the texture and render with it??
I know it probably doesn't mean to say this but that is sort of what it is saying dont you think?
Actually I think it implies you can't modify the character either even for your own project.
Love esther

This is what happens when people who don't know legalese try writing EULA's!

I think it means that you can't use the product to create a marketable product of your own.

I don't think it means you can't modify it for your own renders, just for redistribution.  I've seen a couple of things like that here in the MP.

Of course, reading the disclaimer again, I may be wrong.

To me it's just a restatement of one of the clauses in the RMP standard license (the one that says you can't redistribute any part of a product), so it's just for emphasis and additional clarity.

Merchants aren't supposed to add arbitrary usage restrictions over and above the standards terms (which doesn't appear to be the case here), but they can grant additional privileges (e.g. for things intended as merchant resources).

 but "may not be used as a base for other textures or products" could mean don't use it to make any other textures even for one's own render?
Say I want to make a picture to sell.  I want to alter the texture eg put lipstick on or something.
Love esther

For some reason that I can't comprehend it sounds like the product author doesn't want any type of modifications made but I would still fire off a site mail and ask permission for that type of usage since it's not a competing product, especially if it's a female texture and needs some makeup of some kind.

 actually I'm not sure I want to buy the product, but I normally assume we can do anything with renders if we buy the goods from renderosity or daz, so I always get worried if I see EULAs that seem to suggest you can only render in a certain way.
Love esther

I agree.  If it's a texture set that's not a resource and the creator states NO MODIFICATIONS WHATSOEVER I probably won't buy it because I might want to add my own eyeshadow or lipstick or, even, beauty marks for a render.

Listen. There is no difference between applying makeup in the material room and applying it in the texture itself. The material room can overlay any number of layers just as Photoshop can and give the appearance of a flattened version of the texture.

In other words, for your own use, there is no difference between blending colors in the mat room and in Photoshop.

Thus, the injunction is moot. I can easily demonstrate a "modified" texture on a rendered female without actually modifying the texture.

So - the interpretation being considered here has no teeth. So even if that is the intent, it is meaningless.

 that's a very good point.
But I am worried that the intent also applies to morphing the character differently too.  Not to use as base for other textures or products
do not rebuild any of the included files
??

That's why I prefer to make my own textures from photos and try to create something unique.  Hope I don't get canned for this, but it doesn't hurt. 

Quote - That's why I prefer to make my own textures from photos and try to create something unique.  Hope I don't get canned for this, but it doesn't hurt. 

Brave soul, you are, or one with way too much time on your hands (if you're refering to skin textures). I started on one for V4, but discovered that there was way too much to do to the texture to make it usable and kind-of burnt out on it whilst still on the face/head. :unsure: All that burnt in specular and lipstick-colour and eyeshadow and-and-and... SHEESH!

 wel I have your molly-jo texture and it is amazing!  so don't give up.  But yes it's not something I want to start doing or I'll never ever finish my comic.
Love esther

Aren't you lovely, Esther! thank You! I hope you enjoy it!

I know that creating artificial skin textures hasn't met with heaps of success, but I might have a go with that... it's bound to be heaps faster than trying to clean up poorly photographed skin... by "poorly photographed" I don't mean to bag the photographers, but making a photograph in any lighting is going to create skin with artefacts at the worst possible places that are going to be difficult to deal with by anyone but a skilled image manipulator (to which group I do not belong).

ETA: cross-posted... you are having fun with Molly :biggrin: good to see. Please remember, if you do decide to use Poser-Pro 2010's gamma-correction, you'll need to turn off Molly Jo's GC. The pdf explains how - if you run into any dramas, feel free to PM me...

Quote -  that's a very good point.
But I am worried that the intent also applies to morphing the character differently too.  Not to use as base for other textures or products
do not rebuild any of the included files
??

Most likey means that you cannot take the morph make the nose for example a bit bigger then either sell it or post as a freebie. I would think that you could use any render that you created with it for artwork including for selling a product like clothing (best to state character not included thought).
My understanding is for free stuff, someone can say "Not for commercial use" meaning do not use for commercial renders and do not redistribute any of the files in the package.

For paid for content someone can say "Do not redistribute any of the included files". If someone pays for something they can use it to create rendered art, free or commercial but not distribute or modify and distribute any of included the files.
If someone was selling a product that you couldn't use in renders that you create, they would make no money because why would anyone want to buy it?

 No, actually they can say whatever they like for paid content too.  remember the anna marie goddard morph for V3 at renderosity where they said you couldn't use your renders for porn for example?
I'm sure the vendor meant exactly as you said, only it isn't clear which puts me off the product.

Quote - No, actually they can say whatever they like for paid content too.  remember the anna marie goddard morph for V3 at renderosity where they said you couldn't use your renders for porn for example?
I'm sure the vendor meant exactly as you said, only it isn't clear which puts me off the product.

That's a DAZ product, so it's not a relevant example.
Other stores (the small ones, and CP) do allow vendors to publish products under the vendor's own terms.

Products for sale here are supposed to be under a standard set of usage terms (the only exception being those classed as software).

If you think that the vendor has added extra restrictions, then contact the MP staff to have the situation reviewed.

 well I would contact rendero if I decided to buy it. I just wondered if anyone else saw any ambiguity in those instructions.  I certainly felt the wording could have been clearer.
I am totally certain that the vast majority of us who buy stuff want to use it for rendering only.  And are interested in what we can do with our renders. I wish the EULAs were more detailed about what we can do with them.  I would like the renders to say, change the morphs, textures etc and do anything you like with your renders, privately or commercially.
Love esther

 Here's an example of what I call a REALLY really GOOD EULA.  It's unambiguous and tells the use what they want to know as well as what they need to know:-

Quote

"This model is an original creation and is Copyright ©2007 by greenpots.

You may use renderings of this model in your personal or commercial projects 

royalty-free, but you may not redistribute the model(s) and/or material(s) 

under any circumstances without express permission from the author."

This is short and exactly to the point.

Love esther
PS wish everyone did the same.

Quote -  No, actually they can say whatever they like for paid content too.  remember the anna marie goddard morph for V3 at renderosity where they said you couldn't use your renders for porn for example?

I think that the only reason that this applied was that the morphs and textures were created using the actual Anna Marie Goddard as the model for them. I can understand her wanting restrictions put on what her "likeness" is used for. One of the reasons other people coined the term "Poser-porn" is that there is some pretty hard-core stuff out there on the net created with Poser. I know that if there was a Poser figure created to look like me, I wouldn't want it used for stuff like that.
This is also why celebrity-look-alike morphs could also include a restricted use policy.

 "I know that if there was a Poser figure created to look like me, I wouldn't want it used for stuff like that."
Your poser clone might have different ideas.

I'm not saying I don't think it is unreasonable.  But I think differences in the usual EULA need to be very clear to the buyer.  Especially if usually we can use anything for whatever we like when we buy from DAZ or rendero.

I do like that last EULA example I gave.  I think it should be template for all.  (and if a vendor wants something different it should be in big red letters on the product page.)

Love esther

Love esther

The first part of the EULA makes it clear: "This is not a merchant resource pack". The author is just saying not to use their work as a base for something you want to sell or give away. When they try to make it clear that you can't take bits and pieces out of it to sell or give away, then it sort of falls apart.

 yes, the first sentence was fine. 

A good example of trying to make things so clear, it gets very unclear.

Quote - A good example of trying to make things so clear, it gets very unclear.

Which is precisely why merchants are supposed to stick to the standard RMP license except when giving additional rights or for software.

Quote -  I was looking at the blurb for a new product here in the MP which includes this statement:-
"This is not a merchants resource pack and may not be used as a base for other textures or products, commercial or non commercial.
Do not redistribute and do not rebuild (partial or complete) any of the included files in this product. No portion of the included texture files may be used."

To me that says tat you can't use the texture to create other textures ie you can render with it but you can't modify the texture and render with it??
I know it probably doesn't mean to say this but that is sort of what it is saying dont you think?
Actually I think it implies you can't modify the character either even for your own project.
Love esther

It's simple, just go by the standard EULA here and that is mostly all you need. Otherwise authors could impose such ridiculous terms for every product it would be a mess and no one would know what to do. Renderosity would be swamped every day with users asking questions about every single product if that were the case.

To be able to sell a product here, you must use their standard EULA policy. You can modify it to give the user more freedom, but I have yet to see anyone attempt to make a policy that would go against the standard EULA here. If so, contact Renderosity and ask them to look into it personally and talk with the Author.

Now, I majored in Computer Science and had several Business Law classes for a Business Management. I can read and write legal terms in the USA to a good understanding, but no where close to someone that is an actual lawyer. However, in my opinion given what I do know, what the author is trying to say is:

"This is not a merchants resource pack and may not be used as a base for other textures or products, commercial or non commercial."

1. You may NOT use this product to make your own textures or products for distribution in any form, rather paid or freely given away.

"Do not redistribute and do not rebuild (partial or complete) any of the included files in this product. No portion of the included texture files may be used."

1. You may NOT redistribute or rebuild (i.e. reconstitute/reverse engineer) any files in this product, including the texture files. 

So, that would clearly mean you are free to modify this product (i.e. make your own texture) as you like for your own personal use and then use those modifications in your renders as you see fit. You just can not do anything with those modified files other than use for your own renders. In other words, even though this product appears to be a merchant resource base, you have NOT been given permission to sell anything derived from any modifications that are made using any part of this product.