Quote - Stunning work ODF, are they your own lights you've used there, if so, which set?

Those are my default lights now in Poser8. If I remember right, they are the same as the "Portrait IBL" set that comes with Antonia.

Unrelatedly, the "propagating scale" settings I'm currently experimenting with worked fine in Poser6. So whatever caused my earlier problems must have been in Antonia's CR2 back then, and seems to be fixed now. No clue what it was, but I'm not complaining (and my apologies to whoever suggested using propagating scale for the hands and feet - turns out you were absolutely spot on).

Anyway, I've just uploaded 123 and already have a few things sorted out for 124. Funny how that goes sometimes.

I always use that set with Antonia myself, it's a great light set.

CHEERS!

Hmmm, I think I might have said something about propagating scale. I never actually tried it, I just saw a tutorial in a magazine and remembered it.

CHEERS!

The neck-scaling pose helps a lot.  Thank you!  :woot:

Hmm.  The Quor-Toth would be a Buffy reference?   

Quote - Anyway, I've just uploaded 123 and already have a few things sorted out for 124. Funny how that goes sometimes.

I find this happening a lot, myself.  I tend to end up repeatedly futzing with the same things, if left to myself.  Progress really speeds up once there's some feedback and suggestions from others.  For me, anyways.  :lol:

I can't get over this mage with the swan-neck :lol:

Thanks for the eye-morph -  I'll try it out immediatly! Squeezing textures a bit to avoid massive stretching is something that one has to do with any kind of figure so that's no biggie. I just was kind of helpless as any kind of stretching just caused a different kind of "makeup puree"

Nice work, I promise I will play with her soon.

CHEERS!

Thanks a lot! It's still not easy to place an eyeshadow in a nice way - but that's quite normal, with every new figure I have the same problems. As soon as the first Makeup is created that looks believable it can be used as a template. Much more important is that I have less stretching now. Results will follow, at the moment I am involved in a commercial project and take the makeup-experiments for relaxing

You all are doing killer with Antonia

I decided to terrorize 2D ,lol ,well thay gave me gimp.
Diamonds going to have seperated peaces like a robot.no rigs.[
Phantome3D , guess ya could say Diamond's going to be riged for 2D.lol

Had to show ODF Diamonds progress

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2051037&np](http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2051037&np)

Hi;
looks like everyone is busy lately.
I've been taking time off my 3d work and stuff because I've been feeling awful.

Today is almost pain free and no headache...yay! 
I'm going to have mom call and get me an appointment at the clinic so my doctor can figure out some pain meds.
There's got to be something to at least reduce the pain a little...sigh.

I'll try to do some more work on my Toni project tonight.
I found a seam issue around the pubic area that I thought I'd fixed, drat!
That is frustrating to say the least. :cursing:

We all get frustrated at times. I get a bad back on occasion and it means I can't sit here.

Take it easy

CHEERS!

Oh yeah, pain does get frustrating, but I was referring to the seam issue.
On back pain, I know the feeling, can't sit long, can't stand long and the pain doesn't ease much either way.

I wish Antonia's mapping on the genitals was still like MikeJ did for them.
I like the torso except for the gens being separate...sigh.

And that brings a question to mind...
odf, can we use Mikej's UV mapping with this newer Antonia?
If so, I can eliminate my seam issues really easy...lol.

Quote - Oh yeah, pain does get frustrating, but I was referring to the seam issue.
On back pain, I know the feeling, can't sit long, can't stand long and the pain doesn't ease much either way.

BE.....You know I suffer from multiple back issues with severe chronic pain as well as AI issues. My arthritus/rhuematologist finally came across something I can use that doesn't get my AI worked up and pretty much does away with the pain. I thought you might like to know the name of the medicine so you can ask your doctor about it. I will warn that it does have side effects that could be bad if you're in a risk zone for them, so be very sure to ask about those as well. The medicine is called Arthrotec.

I truly hope something does help you to feel better.

I'll keep that in mind, thanks.
My problem with medications is because I have allergies to so many and never know when another allergy will surface...sigh.

Getting antibiotics for any kind of infection is really a dilly...lol.

Still don't know why I'm getting the seam issues but will be fixing them after supper is done and over, least I hope I will. 

Quote - I'll keep that in mind, thanks.
My problem with medications is because I have allergies to so many and never know when another allergy will surface...sigh.

Getting antibiotics for any kind of infection is really a dilly...lol.
 

Which is why I counseled checking about the side effects with your doctor first. I sympathize about the allergies. While that's not my particular problem, I also have to be careful of what medicines I take as they all effect the liver and my AI boils down to my immune system attacking my liver. So as to prevent any extra damage, there are certain medicines I cannot ever take. Even with this one, I have to have liver panels done about every 3 months to insure it isn't causing damage.

Quote -
odf, can we use Mikej's UV mapping with this newer Antonia?

I'm not sure what you mean. Antonia comes with two UV mappings. One by MikeJ (Antonia-123.cr2 and Antonia-123-lo.cr2) and an older one by yours truly (Antonia-123A.cr2 and Antonia-123A-lo.cr2). Both will be supported all the way to Version 1.0.

The templates for the 'A' versions are under RuntimetexturesAntoniaTemplatesOldMapping (probably better to use a more obvious name in the future). As you can see, the 'A' mapping has only the region inside the labia majora separate from the body, whereas the default mapping makes the whole mons its own island.

There are two more mappings I'm aware off. MikeJ showed pictures of a single-overlay one he'd been working on at some point, but I've never seen that finished. dphoadley did a V3 remap which I've tested and found pretty useful. I'm not sure what his plans on releasing that are, but I'll be happy to generate the necessary files for him for any version of Antonia he wants to use or publish it for.

I'm still trying to understand how to apply lesbentley's 2-ways JCM.  I would like to come up with something that can be reused for another clothing for Antonia.

odf, I used MikeJ's UV map for a test texture and it doesn't do well with either of the newer 123a or 123 sets.
The UV map I referred to had the gens on the torso, not separate. 
All other textures work fine with the newer versions.

I finally worked out my seam issues and polished the textures up a bit too.
I'm doing a little extra with it if I can get it right and then I need to start my pormo images.

I hate doing promos!!! lol.

Quote - odf, I used MikeJ's UV map for a test texture and it doesn't do well with either of the newer 123a or 123 sets.
The UV map I referred to had the gens on the torso, not separate. 

That must have been either an earlier version of the current mapping, or the alternative all-in-one mapping he was working on. If you have a way to contact MikeJ (haven't seen him around here for some time), you should probably just ask him.

In principle, you can use any mapping you want (and that you have permission to redistribute). But since I'm still going to make little changes to Antonia's "master" OBJ file, it's probably better to wait until Version 1.0. Otherwise, I'd have to send you a separate new OBJ file for every UV mapping in existence whenever there's a new release (or you'd have to create that OBJ file yourself, possibly using UVMapper).

odf, i'm just going to go with what you are doing on mapping.

I think the one I'm referring to is the one for alternative uv maps.
But since what I'm doing is for the current Toni and her future release I don't need to do any changes overs.

Just thought how much easier it seemed to do the gen tex not separate but knowing me, I'd end up with seam issues anyway...lol.

Quote - I'm still trying to understand how to apply lesbentley's 2-ways JCM.  I would like to come up with something that can be reused for another clothing for Antonia.

It's not that complicated once you get the idea, at least as far as the ERC is concerned, but I guess that innitial leap to understanding what is happening is not that easy. I'll try to explain it again. Perhaps a simplified example will help.

Attahed above is a zip containing two figures "FIGURE.cr2" and "CONFORMER.cr2". You will need to delete the ".TXT" part of the zips file name in order to use it.

If you extract the zip to your main Poser folder the files will be placed in the path:

RuntimelibrariesCharacter2-ways JCM

I'll try to explain how it works in my next post.

amy_aimei, Re: the FIGURE and CONFORMER from my last post.

Load the FIGURE first, then the CONFORMER, it's important that it happens in that order because the FIGURE needs to be the the selected item when the CONFORMER loads. The figure will be in WireFrame Display Style, the CONFORMER will load slightly to the side. It may be easier to follow what is happening if you don't conform it at this stage. Both figures have two actors, BODY and hip. The hip is represented by a cube. The conformer has one morph, Morph-01 lifts the right back corner of the hip cube. The morphs will only be expressed if the hip of the FIGURE is rotated round both the x and z axes. After a rotation you may need to move the cursor into the Document (scene) window in order to refresh the view. Below is the relevant code from the hip actor of the conformer. It consists of a targetGeom channel and a valueParm channel.

            valueParm z-ratio
                {
                name z-ratio
                initValue 0
                hidden 0
                forceLimits 0
                min -100000
                max 100000
                trackingScale 0.004
                keys
                    {
                    static  0
                    k  0  0
                    }
                interpStyleLocked 0
                valueOpDeltaAdd
                    Figure
                    hip
                    zrot
                deltaAddDelta 0.011111
                }
        targetGeom Morph-01
            {
            name Morph-01
            initValue 0
            hidden 0
            forceLimits 1
            min -100000
            max 100000
            trackingScale 0.02
            keys
                {
                static  0
                k  0  0
                }
            interpStyleLocked 0

                valueOpDeltaAdd
                    Figure
                    hip
                    xrot
                deltaAddDelta 0.011111

                valueOpTimes
                    Figure 1
                    hip:1
                    z-ratio

            indexes 1
            numbDeltas 8
            deltas
                {
                d 2 0 0.1 0
                }
            blendType 0
            }

I know the above probably looks very perplexing, but I will try to make it clear. Morph-01 is slaved to the FIGURE's hip xrot channel via valueOpDeltaAdd. It is also slaved to the z-ratio channel in the CONFORMER. This last block of slaving code uses valueOpTimes, valueOpTimes tells the channel to multiple the value of the morph channel by the value of the z-ratio channel. The z-ratio channel is slaved to zrot in the FIGURE's hip. Thus if zrot in the FIGURE's hip remains at zero, the value of the morph channel is multiplied by zero. Zero times any number equals zero, so as long as the zrot channel remains at zero the morph will not be expressed, no matter what the value of xrot is.

OK, so what about the deltaAddDelta value of "0.011111"? If a deltaAddDelta of 1 was used then the morph would be fully expressed when both xrot and zrot were at one degree. If one of the rotations was 1 degree and the other was 0.5 degrees thye expression of the morph would be at 50%. Whilst it is possible to make a very weak morph, and use a deltaAddDelta of 1, I find it easier to make a morph designed to be fully expressed when the joint is bent 90°. For full expression at a 90° bend, 0.011111 is the correct deltaAddDelta value.

So with the above CONFORMER figure, the expression of the morph will will equal one when the value in degrees of xrot multiplied by zedrot equals 90. Obviously you can set things up so that the morph reaches full expression for any value of rotation that you desire, by varying the deltaAddDelta value, and you can set the minimum and maximum expression of the morph by forcing the limits on the morph channel.

I'm still not satisfied that I have explained this very well, but can't think of what else to say at the moment. Perhaps the best thing is to try it for yourself. For example, use a magnet to make a new morph on the CONFORMER and try slaving it in the same way. If anyone feels they can add to the explanation, or give a better one, please feel free to chime in.

One last point. Some of the slaving is to channels within the CONFORMER, and such slaving needs to use the figure number (:1), other slaving is to channels in the FIGURE and should NOT use the figure number.

If you have any questions, please ask. I want to make this method accessible to as many people as I can. I'm just not sure of the best way to explain it. Perhaps with questions and answers, more people can come to an understanding of this method.

Not sure where to start!

CHEERS!

amy_aimei: Your basicwear for Antonia looks lovely. I really like how well it fits and how it's just simple and elegant.

lesbentley: Thanks for figuring this out and educating us all!

Since no major blunders were brought to my attention, I've made the 0.9.123 release official as of today, and updated the download page and the wiki.

Saintfox & Digital-Lion: I've temporarily removed the link to your mirror download from the wiki page while it is out-of-date. Maybe the link should just go to your main Antonia page, and the accompanying text could be saying that the latest version can be found there within a couple of days after each release or something like that?

Now to get to work on 0.9.124...

Great stuff ODF, take your time, this is too good a job to rush!

CHEERS!

amy_aimei,

Where can I download the latest version of your Antonia Basicwear? I suspect it's the same place as the old version, but this thread is so big that it's getting very hard to find old posts. Perhaps you could put a link in the "Links to Free add-on Content" of the Antonia wiki, or post the files to the Antonia's Free Site, or here at Rosity.

Good idea, I was wondering if I'd missed something myself.

CHEERS!

Hi;
I have some questions that is sort of OT.

This is for someone who has their own store going.
When you have your own store and you deal by PayPal or credit card, how do you handle the charge backs in case someone claims lost or stolen credit on the charges?

I am thinking of adding a store to my other web site but really don't like the idea of the charge-backs because so much of it is faked just to get free products.

This site will be for some of my 3d and some 2d products.
My brother wants me to make some things, he would print out and ship to the buyer but we need a site to sell from.
So since I want to sell my 3d items, for Antonia as well, why not use my own site.

Any advice and feedback on the issue is appreciated.

lesbentley, thank you for explaining the 2-way JCM.  I think I got it.  Now, I'm trying to put it into work.  I wonder if the two directions (x-rot and z-rot) both with cascaded JCM, is it necessary to make the 2-way JCM "cascaded"?

Quote - amy_aimei: Your basicwear for Antonia looks lovely. I really like how well it fits and how it's just simple and elegant.

Thanks, the top is simple but the bottom is too complicated for me to make, may be it is simple from the users' perspective.

Quote - amy_aimei,
Where can I download the latest version of your Antonia Basicwear? I suspect it's the same place as the old version, but this thread is so big that it's getting very hard to find old posts. Perhaps you could put a link in the "Links to Free add-on Content" of the Antonia wiki, or post the files to the Antonia's Free Site, or here at Rosity.

I haven't upload my latest version yet.  The top is done, without texture, but with the texture reference.  Once the bottom is completed, I will upload it as a set.

I hope I can simplify the making of the JCM, which I can move it onto another active wear for Antonia.  The next one may be based on my TYR max-back swimsuit or a yoga set.

Quote -

Quote - amy_aimei: Your basicwear for Antonia looks lovely. I really like how well it fits and how it's just simple and elegant.

Thanks, the top is simple but the bottom is too complicated for me to make, may be it is simple from the users' perspective.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply that it was easy to make. I very much appreciate your hard work trying to make it fit well in all poses. I just meant to say that I liked the style.

You mean without the z-ratio channel? Yes you can do that. The only function of the ratio channel is to provide a deltaAddDelta ratio for the valueOpTimes slaving, which can't in itself accept a deltaAddDelta line. Without the ratio channel the morph in my last example would be way to strong. To get the same effect from the same rotations the morph needs to be much weaker. In the CONFORMER-02.cr2 file attached above there is no z-ratio channel. The valueOpTimes is slaved directly to the zrot channel.

So this works, but one note of caution. The morph needs to be so weak that the delta value is starting to get close to the limit of precision that Poser can handle accurately.

Here is the code from the CONFORMER-02.cr2:

                targetGeom Morph-01
                        {
                        name Morph-01
                        initValue 0
                        hidden 0
                        forceLimits 1
                        min -100000
                        max 100000
                        trackingScale 0.02
                        keys
                                {
                                static  0
                                k  0  0
                                }
                        interpStyleLocked 0

                    valueOpDeltaAdd
                        Figure
                        hip
                        xrot
                    deltaAddDelta 1.000000

                    valueOpTimes
<span style="color:rgb(0,255,0);">                   Figure<br></br>                    hip<br></br>                       zrot</span>

                        indexes 1
                        numbDeltas 8
                        deltas 
                                { 
                                d 2 0 0.00001235 0 
                                } 
                        blendType 0
                        }

Quote - Hi;
I have some questions that is sort of OT.

This is for someone who has their own store going.
When you have your own store and you deal by PayPal or credit card, how do you handle the charge backs in case someone claims lost or stolen credit on the charges?

I am thinking of adding a store to my other web site but really don't like the idea of the charge-backs because so much of it is faked just to get free products.

This site will be for some of my 3d and some 2d products.
My brother wants me to make some things, he would print out and ship to the buyer but we need a site to sell from.
So since I want to sell my 3d items, for Antonia as well, why not use my own site.

Any advice and feedback on the issue is appreciated.

This is not pay pal or anything like that.

Your own store.
We had one company that there online software did not work.
Thay still wanted paid thou ,lol.
was under contract to the cridtcard people for $3000.
So we had to sue the software company that did not work.
Had to get another company that there software did work.
one company was in California the other in NewYork.
We where in Alanta.had layers in all 3 states.

once it all did work still only got 73% of sells and Spent $500 a week to keep it all on line and working.cost alot to have your own online store.and it is a mager pain.

I would advise stuff like renderosity & paypal..

I sincerely apologize for going this far OT.

I started working on the thumb JCMs today. Looks like I'll have to make three for each hand: Grasp, Grasp-Negative and Spread. Looking pretty good so far, but I'll do more testing and probably refine what I have. Pictures later...

It came to my attention (or maybe I was reminded) today that DAZ Studio 2.3 does not support propagating scale. Does anyone know if 3.0 does, or if there's any other way to get it to work in Studio? I only use it for the hands and feet, not the head, but I don't see any other way to get those to scale correctly in Poser. I guess scaling that only works in Poser is better than no scaling at all, but still... :sad:

Somewhat related: has anyone managed to get recent versions of Studio to work decently in Ubuntu or other Linuxes via Wine? I've managed to get 2.3 to somewhat run, but it's a bit of a pain. I have 3.0, but never use it, and before I upgrade and jump through the hoops necessary to get it installed under Wine at all, I'd like some idea of whether it's worth the effort or not.

(I know, somewhat off topic. But it's all for Antonia, you know... :lol:)

I've been told that Ubuntu 9.10 with kernal 2.6.31-19(I think) and Wine 1.1.40 is actually running DS3 Advanced. I imagine it also might need a install of C++ separately as well.  I haven't had time to verify any of it though.  What I do know is Wine versions prior to that wouldn't run DS3. As for DS2 I haven't tried installing it on any Linux since failing to get it to work with Wine about a year ago.

Thanks mylemonblue! That's very helpful. I have Wine 1.1.31 installed at the moment. I might go and check what Ubuntu 10.4 comes with, since I'll probably upgrade fairly soon.

Quote - It came to my attention (or maybe I was reminded) today that DAZ Studio 2.3 does not support propagating scale. Does anyone know if 3.0 does, or if there's any other way to get it to work in Studio? I only use it for the hands and feet, not the head, but I don't see any other way to get those to scale correctly in Poser. I guess scaling that only works in Poser is better than no scaling at all, but still...

I don't know anything about D|S. Whilst I think it is important that Antonia should try to be compatable with D|S, there are limits to how many hoops Antonia should have to jump through to achive that compatibility. If D|S does not support propagatingscale, that is after all a a limitation of D|S, not Antonia.

I can't off the top of my head think of any reason why ERC could not be used to scale the fingers when the hands are scaled. However I think that any such ERC should come packaged in a pz2 as a an optional extra, as separate download from the main Antonia package, and should not be built into Antonia.

I have DS3 Advanced but I don't a Linux system, mine is windows 7.

So far I haven't tried Antonia in DFS because I'm still feeling my way around the program. LOL.
Maybe later tonight I'll test her in DS and see how she does.

Humm, when you say D|S does not support propagatingScale, do you mean that it does not support propogation of the scale to child actors, or do you mean that it does not even recognise "propagatingScale" to do normal scaling. The latter would be a very severe deficiency.

The former.

Looks like I was wrong, and there are problems with using ERC to scale the fingers. At first sight it seems that there are diffrences in the way 'scale' and 'propagatingScale' interact with the smoothScale channels, that cause deformations when normal 'scale' is used in this way.

Quote - Looks like I was wrong, and there are problems with using ERC to scale the fingers. At first sight it seems that there are diffrences in the way 'scale' and 'propagatingScale' interact with the smoothScale channels, that cause deformations when normal 'scale' is used in this way.

That's why I resorted to propagatingScale. The smoothScale settings seems extremely tricky for hands, if they can be made to work properly at all. From what I've seen so far, propagatingScale seems to ignore the smoothScale settings completely, which means I'll have to resort to scale-controlled morphs for the wrists and such. But at least it works predictably and is ridiculously simple to set up.

For the head I was able to use a control channel with the head and all its children slaved to it. I much prefer doing it that way (if I can) than using propagatingScale.

Here is a radical idea.

Question: How useful are the smoothScale channels in the fingers and hands?

I just did a quick test. I deleted all the smooth scale channels in the fingers and hand, except the one that relates to the ForeArm. This allows the use of normal 'scale' via ERC, without the deformations brought in by the smoothScale channels.

It seems to me that smoothScale channels often cause more problems that they solve, and that this is particularly true of the hands and fingers. So why not just delete them (except ForeArm_smooX)?

I only did a quick test, and this idea undoubtedly needs to be investigated more deeply, but on the face of it, deleting the smoothScale channels looks like a good idea to me, as it seems it would allow ERC scaling for D|S users.

I think that's an excellent idea. For some reason it never occurred to me that we were "allowed" to just remove smoothScale channels. When they work, they are very helpful. But the ones between fingers and hand are in fact just in the way, and the fingers scale nicely without any smoothing towards the hand.

I'll definitely try that out.

Quote - I'll definitely try that out.

Good. I still think you should change 'scale' to 'propagatingScale' in the hands and feet, as I see no good reason why Poser users should should carry extra ERC that is only needed in D|S. I'll make a pz2 to inject the ERC slaving for the hands and feet.

odf,

I just noticed something strange. yScale on the hand makes it wider, but yScale on the fingers make them deeper. I don't think it matters too much from the point of the scaling pz2 I'm making, as I can just slave yScale in the fingers to zScale in the hands. On the other hand [ pun], it would make a big difference if propagatingScale was to be used for the individual x, y, z, scale of the hands!

Well I just went through all PayPal's info on marketing.
I have decided to just sell my Antonia products here and/or at CP as with all my digital stuff.

So as soon as I know when we can start submitting our Antonia retail items I will do so. :)

All I need to do on the main one is the promo images (I hate doing promos...sigh).

Interesting! Of course the problem here is that the axis orientations are different for the hand and fingers, which is most notable for the thumb. I should have foreseen this. I don't think I've seen this problem with propagatingScale, but I wouldn't swear by it.

For the hand and thumb to work correctly, it is necessary that the axes are oriented differently from each other, so we can't fix the scaling problem by aligning the axes. It may be possible to compute a combination of x-, y- and z- scale values for the thumb that would make it scale consistently with the hand. If I find time, I'll give that a go tonight. There might still be problems with the origins, though.

To anyone listening in and getting worried: at this point, I definitely agree with Les that this stuff should go into a .pz2 file (if we ever get it to work) and that the much simpler propagatingScale method should be built into Antonia.

I agree, propagating scale for the hands and feet saves alot of trouble and broken scaling. I have been thinking to try to use both propagaing scale for the hands and also smooth scale for the fingers, but I dont know if its possible to combine the two. Brads fingers are all bent too and so the axis dont match up. Scaling is such a headache, you can see why I didn't want to do it.  :laugh:

Good work on Antonia, I am watching and learning from your progress.

Cheers.

Hi odf,

I am using DAZ Studio 3.  If you want, I can test it for you.

I think scaling may not be a good idea.  I used it on my morph for Aiko 3 in the past.  It works in DAZ Studio but not Poser.  We need someone know how to "hack" the Poser file.