I thought all the bought rendero products that you could do whatever you liked with the render provided the original texture could not be extracted.
However the readme in a product I have paid for says:-
"If this product is to be used in a game or video, the creator (hhfspinball) must be notified and a written release must be obtaind from the creator before the sale of any muchandise."

I thought a video is just a collection of renders.
I can understand video game restrictions but that should be covered by the bit that says you shouldn't be able to extract the textures.
This is the first time I've really come across this problem at rendero.
I bought it and downloaded it quite awhile ago and only just got around to trying to install it when I found this in the readme.  Lucky I checked the readme. Not that I really make animations, but I might want to one day, and I don't want restrictions like that on my content in my beautiful runtime that I've so carefully set up to contain things that I can render without needing permissions or giving credit etc.

I'm quite upset by this.  The scene is rathe nice but I think I'll have to send it back and get a refund.
Love esther

 Before you do that, you should get in touch with the vendor and find out about the details...

It may be a mistake.  I had a similar issue. The readme file in Empress Biata by Reciecup says that it's only for non-commercial use, which it doesn't say in the renderosity licence. I contacted her about it, and she told me it was a mistake in the readme file or something to that effect, and that it can be used for commercial renders.

 I normally only check the readme for instructions as restrictions from bought products are normally in the renderosity EULA - which  says:-
"The Buyer may copyright any newly created rendered images using the purchased, original Product files, provided the original Product files remain protected from being extracted from the derivative work.  The Buyer may use the Product in rendered images for any personal or commercial projects, as long as the Artistís work is protected from extraction and the Buyer has not violated any other terms of the License."

So now a contradiction has slipped in.
Why oh why would a vendor feel he should do this. I mean I know it's their product and they have the right to do with it what they like, but there is such a thing as fairness, and it's fair to follow what is normal practice in this MP so buyers don't make mistakes, wreck their runtimes and jeopardize their profits from future projects.
I think the rendero EULA is perfectly fair.  Why go changing it?
Love esther

 well maybe it is a mistake, but now you have to keep that email forever and remember it as proof if someone asks.  And an email may not be enough evidence.
Love esther

 The vendor may not understand the EULA fully and feel he/she needs to have additional protection from infringement..  Also I've seen in some products the same readme file used when the product is released on several different sites. (On which they have different EULAs) so..  contacting the vendor is always a good idea. :)

I've released a bunch of products and done a lot of mistakes in readme files that weren't noticed in the approval process either.

 Yes, but all I'll probably end up with is a cut and paste of an IM saying all is well, that I can paste at the bottom of the readme in my runtime, and meanwhile the product readme will probably still contain the old lines.  I just don't know if I"ll feel secure enough to put the thing in my runtime now.
Love esther

That vendor should go back and change the readme or rendo should pull that and all products from the store until it's changed. Also they should not take for granted that the readme doesn't state something like this. It is the broker's responsiblility to make sure these things don't slip through. I understand if someone gives away a product with restrictions but to sell one with restrictions like that is not acceptable. If you want to put your items out with the hope some company might see them and want to use them for a game or whatever then give them away with those restrictions, don't sell them. I wouldn't use that product based on an email, I would demand either a rewritten readme with the product or my money back in full. And thank you for the heads up, I need to be more vigilant in reading before I buy, the way I used to be. 

Quote - I understand if someone gives away a product with restrictions but to sell one with restrictions like that is not acceptable.

Not really. It's perfectly acceptable to sell with whatever restrictions you want, as long as you make them available before purchase.

 "Refunds will be issued only after the Buyer has worked with the Vendor to fix the problem. " 

Trust me, sometimes just talking to people and being friendly to start out with helps solve a lot of problems..
[
http://www.renderosity.com/news.php?viewStory=13100

](http://www.renderosity.com/news.php?viewStory=13100)

 and I should think as long as the EULA from renderosity matches the readme, particularly as the readme usually only contains instructions for use of a product when you buy a product here, and none of us read those until we get stuck.
Also I think the readme and the EULA should not contradict.
I really think this is bad.
Love esther

 Yes, I see.  Hmmm.  I've IMed him or her.  I  will keep you all posted.
You realize it wasn't just the readme for this particular product but the fact that it has happened here in this MP.  That is why I posted.  I was quite shocked.
Love esther

Esther, i'm glad you contacted the vendor - this will solve the issue hopefully for you.

It might be an idea to contact the vendor first in future and not post about your findings here but instead post about the find and the solution all in one?

Sorry I think it's rendo's responsibility to read the readme's and make it clear to the vendor what the rules are. I appreciate that she posted it here, makes me remember to read the readme's before I buy a product. She's not beating up the vendor just stating what it says. And you should know that Artemis. We are your customers as well as forum folks you'd do well not to forget that since without customers there is no renderosity, look at 3d commune whenever you forget that.

There is a default readme that all vendors use but some vendors may feel that they need to add some more things to it .....
however i think that the poser forum is not the place to post these kind of concerns - maybe email admin@renderosity.com. Or even the marketplace support forum where it can be seen by the appropriate people.

thanks
:)

Beg to differ this is a forum for all things poser and I believe that includes the marketplace. As I said before she did not slam the vendor if she had done that I would agree with you. I understand that you want to keep it civil and she did, as did I. I would hate to think that our comments are so censored here that we are not allowed to voice opinions on vendors, products or the store. One of the reasons I quit leaving reviews on most products is because unless it is a good review you don't post it, so why bother. If you don't want us to post concerns about products here you should have a forum specifically for that, not a forum for what we want vendors to create, one that allows an open discussion when there is a problem.  

Yes and the marketplace support forum would be the place for that because it will be seen by the right people.

That is all i am going to say...
have a great day.

contact the marketplace manager. Rendo have stated before that the marketplace license is the primary document, and that the vendor cannot impose more restrictions on use in the readme. That shoyuld have been caught during product testing though and the item flagged if the usual marketplace license does not apply.

At least thats what I believe has been stated.

Quote - Beg to differ this is a forum for all things poser and I believe that includes the marketplace. As I said before she did not slam the vendor if she had done that I would agree with you. I understand that you want to keep it civil and she did, as did I. I would hate to think that our comments are so censored here that we are not allowed to voice opinions on vendors, products or the store. One of the reasons I quit leaving reviews on most products is because unless it is a good review you don't post it, so why bother. If you don't want us to post concerns about products here you should have a forum specifically for that, not a forum for what we want vendors to create, one that allows an open discussion when there is a problem.  

There is a forum for that.  It's the Marketplace Customer Support forum, which we've pointed members to on serveral occasions, and even moved threads there when necessary.  The store staff does NOT visit the Poser forum.  If you have a Marketplace concern, we can't help you here, because none of us are marketplace staff.

Quote -  I thought all the bought rendero products that you could do whatever you liked with the render provided the original texture could not be extracted.
However the readme in a product I have paid for says:-
"If this product is to be used in a game or video, the creator (hhfspinball) must be notified and a written release must be obtaind from the creator before the sale of any muchandise."

Video as in for selling?  Or for just posting online to watch?

Quote - > Quote -  I thought all the bought rendero products that you could do whatever you liked with the render provided the original texture could not be extracted.

However the readme in a product I have paid for says:-
"If this product is to be used in a game or video, the creator (hhfspinball) must be notified and a written release must be obtaind from the creator before the sale of any muchandise."

Video as in for selling?  Or for just posting online to watch?

Why should it matter if someone wants to sell a video made with the product or not? You can't extract the product from a render or a video so what would be the problem?

Unless the item in question is copied from some copyrighted property. (eg.  Star  Wars DeathStar corridor setting. In that case you could definitely not use it in a commercial project, but then again it should not even be in the store in a case like that.)

Quote - Why should it matter if someone wants to sell a video made with the product or not? You can't extract the product from a render or a video so what would be the problem?

Unless the item in question is copied from some copyrighted property. (eg.  Star  Wars DeathStar corridor setting. In that case you could definitely not use it in a commercial project, but then again it should not even be in the store in a case like that.)

There's way more copyrighted property than just Star Wars items.  And some of it is sold at Renderosity.

Rendo's license also says this:

For Merchant Resource Products, additional permissions or limitations of rights will be specified in of each Product's readme file. Software programs and utilities may have an additional license from the company or vendor that developed it. The Buyer agrees to be bound by the additional permissions and limitations contained in the Merchant Resource Products and Software Programs or utilities. For any product to be considered a Merchant Resource, Software program or utility, it must be clearly stated as such.

This means that only products that classify as merchant resource, Software program or utility can have additional restrictions in their read-me, otherwise, if the product in question isn't one of those, rendo's license is the only one that matters.

 Guys - an update.
The vendor emailed me back and the readme was a mistake. He hired someone else to write the readme.
He's emailing me a release.  I guess an email should be evidence enough hey.
but I still think some useful points came out of this thread so it was still worth me posting about all this.
Love esther

Good outcome.  Your thread was an important one.

I hope he's going to update his readme as well.

 I hope he updates the readme too and checks the other readmes, as I may want some more of his products in the future.
Love esther