Hi everyone,

Just wondering about something. I have an airplane model that I'm working on, that I've rebuilt several times to make it smaller and easier to use. Wow! You should have seen the original mesh.... it was huge and complicated and detailed. But in the interest of making the thing easier on computer resources and just not such a complicated mess, I made it much smaller and far more simple.  I'm building it in Wings and I plan to turn it into a prop. I'd like to make it so the landing gear doors can open and close, and the gear can go up and down, but I don't know how to rig something like that. Is it something I can do via a morph? I mean can I make a morph dial that the user can use to lower and raise the gear?

Thanks -

Steve

Suggest that you go with a rigging scheme rather than a morph. Not least because a morph will move the vertices in a straight line whereas a joint will be able to rotate them.

Group everything that will move as one piece into the same group.

You'll probably find the hierarchy method easier than using the set up room.

Turn bending off for each part.

All you'll need to do in the joint editor is to set the rotation points.

I appreciate that the above is only a brief outline but I hope it will help to clarify your thoughts.

If you want to rig a lot of parts better make figure, as PhilC advised.

If you need move just few parts of airplane you can select them as group. Then create magnets.

In Mag Zone property window find edit falloff zone, shift all points to max, then choose group, which should be moved by magnet.

OK, so morphs are out of the question... but I haven't got the faintest idea how to turn this thing into a character and rig the doors to open and close/gear to go up and down.

Shuy, I've used magnets a few times.... won't a magnet cause the shape (in this case one of the doors for example) to bend?

You can accomplish much of what you are trying to do with simple joint centers with the Joint Editor. Each part that you want to move will need to be imported as a seperate prop, if you have several parts that are moving as a unit then bring those in as one prop, aquaint yourself with the Hierarchy editor to form parent/child relationships. Then if you want to get real fancy learn how to create ERC code and link this stuff through one dial. ERC can be done with props...I've done it.

I actually showed how I rigged a Avatar copter in Poser that I modeled about a year ago in 3d World.

Quote - OK, so morphs are out of the question... but I haven't got the faintest idea how to turn this thing into a character and rig the doors to open and close/gear to go up and down.

Shuy, I've used magnets a few times.... won't a magnet cause the shape (in this case one of the doors for example) to bend?

No if you modify fallof zone - I'll try show some picture tomorrow.

You must place mag base correct as well.

DarkEdge, that's an awesome picture.

I like your idea, but honestly you're talking above my head. I've made a lot of props and such, but when you're talking about using joint editors and the like, I can picture a big question mark over my head. can you give me some details on what you did and how you did it?

Sure, probably the easiest way to explain is go to your Props/Primitives folder and bring a box onto the stage, go to CameraLeft view, then Window/JointEditor...now you'll see a green cross hair at the bottom of the box; this is the one to pay attention to. Grab your x rotate dial and move it, see how the box moves? Go to CameraFront and move the z rotate dial, see how the box moves? Become aquanited with each of the axis x,y, and z and know them spacially.

In either the Left or Front Camera views select the Translate/Pull Editing tool and hover over the green cross hair, when it turns into a bullseye you can move it, move it to one of the corners and try your x or z rotate dial and see how the box responds. What you are doing is rigging in its simpliest form.

Window/HiearchyEditor will bring up the editor panel. Here you can select props and drag them ontop of each other setting up parent/child relationships. These relationships are also a form of rigging and you need to learn them...google is your friend.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the info. I wonder though....

The model I'm working on is a plane, and it is in .obj format, but I'll be turning it into a prop. The same for the landing gear doors.

So when I've converted the plane into a prop, will the landing gear doors have to be separate props? If I understand what you're saying, it sounds like that's the case. The doors I'll make as smart props, and when the plane is loaded into a scene, the doors will automatically show up with it, and if I've used the hierarchy editor correctly they'll be able to swing open or closed with the movement of a dial, correct?

Am I on the right track with it?

You can make it a prop with a series of associated parented props but to do that you'll still need to divide out the model into separate groups. 

I would still make it a figure.

I'll be happy to guide you step by step.

PhilC,

I'd like to have a go at both ways and see which one turns out better. If nothing else, I'll be learning some new things, and I'm all for that. I'm not quite done with the model, but very close. Where should I begin?

Steve

I would make it a figure as well, a group of props is more cumbersome in a scene than just one figure.

Just take care defining your groups.

i need an aeroplane that opens at the back so my hero in my comic can stand looking out the back and fire a rocket from a hand held launcher at an enemy plane,  i have quite a good aircraft from VP but it doesn't have enough detail inside the back area after doors opened so anyway, whilst you are there modelling - hint hint.

Love esther

Estherau, I've thought about modeling one that looks like the one at this address....

http://www.modellversium.de/galerie/8-flugzeuge-modern/2268-fairchild-c-119c-flying-boxcar-italeri.html

Is this the sort of thing you're looking for? For some reason, I just think it's a neat looking old plane, and there's one on permanent display at the Air Force base near where I live. Something about the way it looks just appeals to me. I can't really explain it. If I did model it, I'd probably update it with jet engines instead of propellers.

Philc, When you say defining my groups, is that when I've imported it into Poser, and I open the "group editor" tool? And how should I do so? I mean for example one group might be "airplane wing" and another would be "left Landing Gear door" and so on like that?

I'll check back on here tomorrow.... it's 2:30am, so I'm off to bed. Thanks to everyone who responded and I look forward to hearing back from you!

Steve

You can define the groups in Poser using the grouping tool. Or you may have already defined them in your modeling application, or you could use UVMapper. My choice is a combination of my modeling application and UVMapper.

I've not seen your model but from what you have posted lets say that you have groups defined as fuselage, Canopy, rLandingGear, lLandingGear, rWheel, lWheel. Suggest that unless you want the wings to move independently of the fuselage you include them in the fuselage group.

Where ever possible use the "l" and "r" notation to allow for joint symmetry, it will be a great time saver.

Your next step will be to write a hierarchy file. With the above groups this would be something like:-

objFile: :Runtime:Geometries:Your_Folder:Your_File.obj<br></br>
1 fuselage xyz<br></br>
    2 Canopy<br></br>
    2 rLandingGear xyz<br></br>
        3 rWheel xyz<br></br>
    2 lLandingGear xyz<br></br>
        3 lWheel xyz

Since you will be turning bending off for all body parts the joint rotation order (xyz), will not matter. Line indentation is ignored by Poser, I've used it here to make it easier to comprehend the hierarchy.

Then in Poser use the menu File > Convert Hier file. You will not need to import the OBJ file. The result will be delivered to your New Figure folder, load it into the scene from there.

Use the joint editor to set the center and alignment for each body part. That is the center of the wheel will be the axle, the center for the landing gear will be the point at which it connects to the fuselage.

Turn bending off for each part. 

 Hope that helps.

I think in your model is better to rig as a character or few props parented to each other. Anyway I promised you some explanation about magnets, Maybe you will need it in future.

If you add default magnet, translate mag base in to the place, where should be center of rotation (doors hinge or center of propeller).

On obj which I created was 2 groups - "In" (pink/purple stick) and "Out" (brown base)

Got to love the Flying Boxcar and it's star turn in the original Flight of the Phoenix.

Estherau, are we getting the Poser version of Con Air? (Don't move or the teddy gets it!)

PhilC,

I read what you wrote and I'm going to give it a go.... I didn't want you to think I'd forgotten, but I've been really busy all day. I plan to do it tomorrow - I'll let you know how it goes.

Steve

This is a simple landing gear i created. I used IK to pull in the wheel (no morphs, only bones). It seems to work well. Here is an image.

arrowhead42 that link is the perfect plane I would need. It would be nice if there were a few things in the back interior eg net bags with stuff hanging down the sides, hooks around the place and good texturing inside.

I would need one that had propellers and not jet.  well anyway, it looks very challenging.

You could take some pics of the one near you to give you ideas.

Love esther

Thanks Millighost - I want to look at this a little closer, and I will do so tomorrow. It's after 1am and I just got home from work and decided to check my e-mail and saw your reply.

Estherau, I'll see what I can do. I've found that I really enjoy building these meshes. Even if it's really challenging, which I think this one will be. It's fun and I learn something new with every new mesh I build! I'd like to have a go at it.

looking forward to seeing what you come up with!

Love esther

I'm looking forward to the challenge - be warned though, I'm no professional.... I just love doing this sort of thing. It may take a while, since I'm working on a couple of other projects (and work, and school), including the airplane that this thread is about (think of the movie "Raiders of the Lost Ark" when they're fighting in the desert..... here's a link that'll show you an idea of what I'm building. It's not completely accurate with the movie, but it's definitely inspired by it)

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-lrtX1m5Nm9U/TiJEQhX9FPI/AAAAAAABoAY/MhJ3YiROhz8/s1600/Fwing-1-.jpg

But for the plane you want it'll take at least a few weeks of working here and there. If you'd like I can e-mail you updates, so you can see how it's progressing as I go along.

HI there, no rush.  YOur real life project looks interesting.

I once saw a movie when I was little, where a plane crashed into the desert.  The surivors had to rebuild it. I think they may have used parts from a second crashed plane that they found.  the guy who said he was an engineer I think just built model planes (they found out afterwards when they were safely back home).

My email is esther@pacefiction.com

Love esther

You'd mentioned Flight of the Phoenix inan earlier post. I saw it once, but don't remember much about it. Is that the movie you're referring to?

Thanks for the e-mail address, and I'll get started on it in a couple of days and I'll show you how it's gong with periodic updates. This is going to be a challenge, but I'm kinda excited about it!

OK, let's make this easy.  If you have your parts where you want them in Wings, you can bring them into Poser (individually) in the proper place.  When importing, disable figure scaling, and don't center anything.  Once you have each part in, all you have to do is set each parts' axis in the joint editor, and also make sure each piece has the correct parent in the hierarchy.  It might not be commercial quality, but for your own use it should be just fine.  Set joint limits in the joint editor if you need to restrict movement.

It was about 35 years ago that I saw that movie I think.  I don't know.