I'm looking to set up a silky or velvet fabric studded with rhinestones--the kind of thing you'd see on an expensive evening gown. Ideally, of course, this would be done by actually placing rhinestones on a dress, but since the dress model I'm working with doesn't have that I'd like to do it procedurally rather than try to hand place gem models on the dress.

On the topic of silk, I've yet to find a silk shader I've been satisfied with--so many come off as cheap silk immitations. Marieah's look lovely in the DS renders, but the translation to Poser just doesn't look right. I'd love to be able to replicate both the almost-sheer look seen, for example, in Arwen's dream gown (http://www.freewebs.com/the_leaves_of_lorien/arwen_dream2.jpg) from The Two Towers, as well as thicker, heavier silk/brocade.

BB has a sequin shader at his freebie site, IIRC, that you could play around with for the rhinestone effect...maybe with a mask and a blender node?

As for silk, I always use anisotropic combined with a bit of a weave bump. For brocade, I tend to use masks and blender nodes to get the effect of the different parts of the fabric. For lighter silks, like a charmeuse, just a faint bump texture and some transparency with the anisotropic...maybe an edge blend?

Iunno. I've never actually been able to get it to work to my satisfaction, but it's at least a starting point?

Does the item have absolutely uniform UV scale? If you put a checkerboard texture on it, are all the squares the same size?

re silk: Did you see this blouse? Right direction or no?

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2348196

Note - this absolutely requires two coincident surfaces. One for the glass and cloth (outside), and one for the metal base (inside, under the glass).

This is one of those shaders I just cannot do as a single layer of geometry. There have to be two interfaces with space between them.

I have suggested to SM that I need a "clone" shader, where I get to use two shaders for each bit of mesh - a surface and a subsurface. This is useful for things like this and others, where there is a clear coating of some kind with its own shape and something buried inside with its own, different shape, but both follow the general shape of the mesh. Another example is wood under a thick coating of varnish.

Anyway, I despair of this working. The base of each stone needs to be flat, not curved by the mesh. I don't know how to counteract that curve.

Quote - Does the item have absolutely uniform UV scale? If you put a checkerboard texture on it, are all the squares the same size?

I'm not absolutely certain. I'll be working with [url=http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/1930s-collection-/62321]this gown[/url] by Tabala.

Quote - First try.

Note - this absolutely requires two coincident surfaces. One for the glass and cloth (outside), and one for the metal base (inside, under the glass).

This is one of those shaders I just cannot do as a single layer of geometry. There have to be two interfaces with space between them.

I have suggested to SM that I need a "clone" shader, where I get to use two shaders for each bit of mesh - a surface and a subsurface. This is useful for things like this and others, where there is a clear coating of some kind with its own shape and something buried inside with its own, different shape, but both follow the general shape of the mesh. Another example is wood under a thick coating of varnish.

Anyway, I despair of this working. The base of each stone needs to be flat, not curved by the mesh. I don't know how to counteract that curve.

Perhaps it could be faked? I probably won't have camera close enough to observe every single stone. The end effect I'm goiing for is something like [url=http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-8QE15DjqTRE/Tl6bp4BKdMI/AAAAAAAAA1A/CLeyXbDzlDo/s1600/Diane-von-Furstenberg-Fall-2011-Red-Evening-Dress-Sigrid-Agren%255B1%255D.jpg]this[/url]--I suppose you could say I'm after the shimmering effect of a lot of small rhinestones.

Quote - re silk: Did you see this blouse? Right direction or no?

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2348196

I hadn't seen it, no. It does look good for modern machined silk, though I think [url=http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-u7OF9oX1Af4/TxsmLxfArPI/AAAAAAAAFF0/tymszS_H1fY/s1600/Blue+Color+Pure+Tusser+Silk+Saree+-+Indian+Silk+Sarees+2011.jpg]traditional silk[/url] tends to be...glossier? The reflection seems...sharper and less blurred, I think? And just in general shinier, I think.

What are you doing to URLs there? Just paste them.

On Windows they become links automatically. On my mac I have to select the words and hit the chain link button in the toolbar, but it's no manual markup.

First link

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/1930s-collection-/62321

Second link

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-8QE15DjqTRE/Tl6bp4BKdMI/AAAAAAAAA1A/CLeyXbDzlDo/s1600/Diane-von-Furstenberg-Fall-2011-Red-Evening-Dress-Sigrid-Agren%255B1%255D.jpg

Third link

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-u7OF9oX1Af4/TxsmLxfArPI/AAAAAAAAFF0/tymszS_H1fY/s1600/Blue+Color+Pure+Tusser+Silk+Saree+-+Indian+Silk+Sarees+2011.jpg

Quote - re silk: Did you see this blouse? Right direction or no? http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2348196

This is actually really pretty far in the direction for a silk charmeuse (imho)...The only thing I'd say is that the specular should be a little more...shimmery?

Quote - What are you doing to URLs there? Just paste them.

On Windows they become links automatically. On my mac I have to select the words and hit the chain link button in the toolbar, but it's no manual markup.

Sorry. I'm used to BBCode enabled boards... 

The Furstenberg dress is sequins, not rhinestones. Get my sequins shader. Should work perfectly.

http://www.lyst.com/clothing/diane-von-furstenberg-red-marisa-gown/

Hmm, and now that I see it like that I think it's a tad much for what I'm going for--I want more of a subtle shimmer than the more in-your-face shininess of sequins. Something that has sparkle, but isn't going to blind you if the light hits you. Something perhaps more like this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_iyrya8fis-4/SyH7ZilEwwI/AAAAAAAACKY/yRisWeKiQFE/s400/vintage+SILVER+MERMAID+shimmer+dress3.jpg

http://static.becomegorgeous.com/gallery/pictures/carrieunderwood-2011goldenglobeawards.jpg 

http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/gallery/100504/GAL-10May04-4461/media/PHO-10May04-221648.jpg

http://www.myeveningdress.co.uk/82-256-large/dark-green-evening-gown.jpg 

I think the key here is I want sparkles, but I want it subtle and I want the look of soft fabric--as opposed to the over-sparkly and hard sequins. I'd go with velvet, but I intend to use velvet on a shawl over the dress.

Quote - Hmm, and now that I see it like that I think it's a tad much for what I'm going for--I want more of a subtle shimmer than the more in-your-face shininess of sequins. Something that has sparkle, but isn't going to blind you if the light hits you. Something perhaps more like this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_iyrya8fis-4/SyH7ZilEwwI/AAAAAAAACKY/yRisWeKiQFE/s400/vintage+SILVER+MERMAID+shimmer+dress3.jpg

http://static.becomegorgeous.com/gallery/pictures/carrieunderwood-2011goldenglobeawards.jpg 

http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/gallery/100504/GAL-10May04-4461/media/PHO-10May04-221648.jpg

http://www.myeveningdress.co.uk/82-256-large/dark-green-evening-gown.jpg 

I think the key here is I want sparkles, but I want it subtle and I want the look of soft fabric--as opposed to the over-sparkly and hard sequins. I'd go with velvet, but I intend to use velvet on a shawl over the dress.

Why don't you use a shimmery satin or silk?  Tabala had some shimmery satin materials and Fabiana has some great sparkly materials in her sets if you have any of those.

Like I was saying, I've never really seen any silk I've been terribly happy with, but I could use a nice satin. Thanks for bringing that to my mind--also, I hadn't thought about any of Fabiana's lovely materials either. Thanks. :)

Sorry to double post but I think I found something useful and worth sharing. Namely, I've actually found a way to do sheer silk that looks good. I'll post renders and material screenshots soonish, but in short it relies on SSS--no wonder I never felt satisfied with silk before. ;) 

Soonish is when? I'm perched conveniently at the edge of my seat, here. ^_~

Hopefully later today--I ran into a hitch, found it only looks right in certain lighting conditions. But I'm working on it and will hopefully have something to post as soon as I find it looks right in most conditions. ;)

Any thoughts on the silk?

Those look great! Thanks so much!

I like it too!  ISTR bill said to use  fresnel blend node in  trans channel for COE.

p.s:  scatter node may also be used for transmitted trans colour, which some users associate with caustics.  I haven't tried it much but Believable3D and bill did, using scatter/custom scatter.

Thanks! They could probably use plenty more experimenting, so let me know if you come up with anything good. :)

Hrm. Tried the Shimmery Light Silk today and got a strange return in the render. It was almost glowing white with thin (almost marble-like) bands of green and blue. Was with one spotlight and IDL, with somewhere in the neighborhood of a 50% exposure (I estimate, obviously) according to BB's LightMeter. I didn't save it, but I'll see if I can reproduce the effect after I'm done with this project I'm working on.

Quote - Hrm. Tried the Shimmery Light Silk today and got a strange return in the render. It was almost glowing white with thin (almost marble-like) bands of green and blue. Was with one spotlight and IDL, with somewhere in the neighborhood of a 50% exposure (I estimate, obviously) according to BB's LightMeter. I didn't save it, but I'll see if I can reproduce the effect after I'm done with this project I'm working on.

I'm not surprised, honestly--it could easily give some weird effects with the colorramp. 

one minor note: in OS X the desktop icon doesn't display correctly on Ivory Crêpe de Chine.mt5 until I change the ê to e.  however the ê doesn't affect poser similarly.

I probably should have figured accent marks don't play with everyone nicely.

on the sari silk

they use a very thin silk thread (usually fairly high gum) and often it is a brocade weave with a strong colored thread one way and a silver or gold thread the other. the pattern is woven in.  The side effect is that folds and shadows where the fabric changes angle the metallic threads show through

I've also seen it done in contrasting colors, but not usually on sari fabric.  I've seen some nice shot silk and duipionis that show blue/pink or green/red depending on angles

I think you might get that shimmerred beaded effect by looking at the visual effect of small clear glass or silver rocaille beads scatterred on a solid base.  The beads themselves are very small, so would not be all that evil to simulate on a shader.

Another option is silver or gold threadwork - though how you can do that via shader and not have simple straight lines I think on BB can tell us :)

BB those rhinestones look fantastic.  I'm almost tempted to make you a double layered gown just for that shader.

Lyrra

Quote - on the sari silk

they use a very thin silk thread (usually fairly high gum) and often it is a brocade weave with a strong colored thread one way and a silver or gold thread the other. the pattern is woven in.  The side effect is that folds and shadows where the fabric changes angle the metallic threads show through

I've also seen it done in contrasting colors, but not usually on sari fabric.  I've seen some nice shot silk and duipionis that show blue/pink or green/red depending on angles

I think you might get that shimmerred beaded effect by looking at the visual effect of small clear glass or silver rocaille beads scatterred on a solid base.  The beads themselves are very small, so would not be all that evil to simulate on a shader.

Another option is silver or gold threadwork - though how you can do that via shader and not have simple straight lines I think on BB can tell us :)

BB those rhinestones look fantastic.  I'm almost tempted to make you a double layered gown just for that shader.

Lyrra

Thanks for the info, Lyrra. That explains why sari silk is so gorgeous. But that's way beyond my skill to replicate in the material room. ;) 

beautiful mats and that image is very cool

The shifting colors talked about above in dupioni silk (dupioni meaning 'two threads,' btw) are caused by the warp being threaded in one color and the weft woven in another, meaning the colors are at 90-degree angles to one another, and the dominant color depends on the angle the fabric is viewed from. It's a super-cool effect.

I don't know any of the math behind it, but I'll bet with some more experimentation of the Edge Blend node could be fruitful on that front.