With all the excitement about Bella, Michelle, Miki and Tyler, I believe we should also take a look at Cynthia, now in development by BVH. The base figure will be free. BVH says she is high poly, but I would consider her a medium-poly figure compared to most of the ones we actually use. Anatomically complete, and with the full body morphs, a physical type to please everyone, And only in April she was a simple collection of basic shapes - the work of one man, and look how far she has come. I personally can't wait for this lady, and I'll buy and make textures and clothes for her. (Nudity in the link).

http://bvh3d.com/cynthia.php

The banner at the top shoes Angela, not Cynthia. You may need to scroll down to see Cynthia "in all her glory".

Awesome. It says she's going to be fully anatomically correct, that's one thing I love about the Poser figures, they're 'complete' right out of the box as well. I'm looking forward to this. :)

I'll stick with my remapped Posette and Judy, thank you all the same!

dph

I get a 403 Forbidden error from the link to Cynthia.

Don't forget Kirwyn's Kez-WM in there too... a great free figure I reckon

Look forward to checking out Cynthia in due course too then

sigh Another figure with foot and ankle issues....lol. I'll pass. I have so many stylized figures already.

Laurie

@ Nanette
The first post about that figure was about a week ago.
Every day, I went to take a look and study.
This is my personal conclusion:

• Mesh,
• Rigging
• Texture
• Morphs

Mesh
Over 20.000 so, over my personal limitation. Poly distribution looks fine.

Rigging
All looks fine for the rigging, my complements the builder for the rigging.

Texture
This is my NO-GO for buyng her.
5 texture maps? Hello??? What about??

Any figure that wants to become popular HAS to be material room friendly.
If anybody has questions about this feel free to contact me. I have tons of info here.

4 Texture Maps is a material room nightmare, and now 5???????????????????????????

OK,
For a figure to be material room , end user friendly, and content creator friendly??

As few materail zones as possible.
Put the texture on ONE MAP and ONE MAP only.

Why continue with obsolete limitations ????????????

Poser can handle 8192x8192 textures with ease. My personal standard.
Need more room?
Poser can handle 16K textures with ease. => need RAM

ONE single texture map; is user friendly, is content creator friendly, is material room friendly.

Morphs
What I have seen so far is pretty good.

My humble and honest opinion.

looks good, will give it a spin and shock horror, its anatomically correct,about time for poser figures,lol

still waiting for a realistic figure....

Laurie

Quote - still waiting for a realistic figure....

Laurie

I noticed from a thread the other day that Shane's onto doing some rigging...

Quote - I noticed from a thread the other day that Shane's onto doing some rigging...

I saw!

i dont think we will see realistic for a while, elbow skin deformation is non-existant in all poser figures and extremely hard to do, but would be awesome if it was included

Quote - i dont think we will see realistic for a while, elbow skin deformation is non-existant in all poser figures and extremely hard to do, but would be awesome if it was included

That is truly picking a bit at nits, and could be easily corrected by postwork!! The more that is expected from a figure, the more it will become a case of diminishing returns for effort invested!  Properly posing such a comples figure will require a specialist with a Phd in 'Poseology!'

Quote - > Quote - I noticed from a thread the other day that Shane's onto doing some rigging...

I saw!

I am holding out for more news on the Lucas (and his future companions?) front above all else, I'd say

Quote - i dont think we will see realistic for a while, elbow skin deformation is non-existant in all poser figures and extremely hard to do, but would be awesome if it was included

Um, right.

You can have a realistic figure without elbow skin deformation, ie. Vicky, Mike, etc. By realistic I mean real body proportions, modeled from real human references and not one's imagination, with decent looking hands, feet and ankles (most recent figures don't even have ankles...part of the calf or something). This particular figure included. I realize Vicky is a titan, but you can still make a realistic looking human out of her. She has ankles.

Laurie

People look at different things. I thought the ankles looked fine. They didn't bother me at all. But now I see it.

I am not sure how the texture maps will be subdivided - I can't really tell from the images. For texture painting in a 3d program, one map is much easier. But working in a 2d paint program, I don't find extremely large images nice to work with. I need to be able to see where I am putting the detail.

I hope she has good expressions, or at least that I would be able to create them. A good smile is a selling point for me. The face seems to have enough polygons for that. Her expressiveness will determine how much I use her.

I see quite a lot of these deformed genitals on new figures.  I don't know if it is men modeling them or what but they are terrible.  I worked on a character with a man before and he wanted to give her the same type of messed up girl parts.  Do people actually study what this part looks like before they go modeling it?  

I don't mean to be mean.  The figure seems fine otherwise, but it's hard for me to get past that.  People are calling it anatomically correct just because SOMETHING is there.  It doesn't look correct at all to me.

LOL..yep. "The Slit" with the inner parts hanging out and no contour at all outside. If I'd woke up like that one morning, I'd go see the doctor...lol. I however, can't get past the calves ending on the top of the foot. So many figures like that nowdays you'd think it was hard to make a thinner ankle :P To be fair tho, her overall proportions and head seem a bit better than some I've seen lately.

Laurie

I guess there are lots of people modelling from memory, who only start to look at reference pictures when they get feedback suggesting some changes.

I'm still excited about Shane's project. Very realistic bodies are important, but so is a good face, and his model looks in previews to have a very good face indeed.

DP!

Where ya been? I'm glad you are still banging the drum for Posette! :-)  A PhD in Poseology! Where can I get that degree?

Quote - > Quote - i dont think we will see realistic for a while, elbow skin deformation is non-existant in all poser figures and extremely hard to do, but would be awesome if it was included

That is truly picking a bit at nits, and could be easily corrected by postwork!! The more that is expected from a figure, the more it will become a case of diminishing returns for effort invested!  Properly posing such a comples figure will require a specialist with a Phd in 'Poseology!'

Quote - @ Nanette

Texture
This is my NO-GO for buyng her.
5 texture maps? Hello??? What about??

Any figure that wants to become popular HAS to be material room friendly.
If anybody has questions about this feel free to contact me. I have tons of info here.

4 Texture Maps is a material room nightmare, and now 5???????????????????????????

OK,
For a figure to be material room , end user friendly, and content creator friendly??

As few materail zones as possible.
Put the texture on ONE MAP and ONE MAP only.

For ease of use in Photoshop, I prefer a zone for the finger nails, another for the toenails and one for the face to do my own makeups. Easier to move around working with a smaller file in the view port inside PS. Another for the body makes 4. Split the torso off from the limbs so you can easily add suntan lines to the torso and you have 5.

edit to add eye color and eyebrow color and the most import area to texture on any character---getting the nostril glow to look right with SSS and GC and you have 8. No idea how they did it with 5 :)

He he - suntan lines! I wasn't considering that. I want to take the Amazon morph, pad it a little about the rump and turn her into an African mama, sculpting the face if needed. And for an African mama, thick ankles are not an issue at all.

I paint my dark textures from scratch, and I can adapt my way of working to how the textures are laid out. In the material room I can cope with multiple maps, I am used to it, and EZskin helps a lot.

The shoulders look ok with the arms down. The Baron knows how to make JCMs, I suspect. There's something going on with the jaw line...maybe it's too low where it reaches the ear. I don't like the face, but to each his own. The body looks good, except the feet. *checks his own figure's feet and winces...

I'm not sure why more than one texture map becomes "a material room nightmare" for some. EZ skin isn't complicated by this, and Poser's material library makes saving sets of materials trivial. If one area of the body needs more texture resolution, it's the face, and since Poser isn't a real time animation engine, a separate texture map for the head is sensible.

JCMs for realistic elbow skin deformation are easy if you have colorcurvature's morphloader, Zbrush and enough polygons in the area to shape things.

Well he did ask for feedback on the genitals so ladies, compile your lists. I agree that what's shown is looks pretty much like a 'tick off that box' feature but I guess he gave it what he thought was reasonable. Looks to me like doing proper labia majora and minora, clitoris, clitoral hood etc. would require more polygons and if you want realism, enough morphs to accomodate natural variation to some degree. You also need a good selection of detailed textures that would work decently with different skin tones. I haven't seen anything, including the add-ons that really is all that great. 

For something built into the figure, I reckon the thinking is usually that only people who do 'porn' would want that level of quality. How long was it before DAZ deigned to give Vickie a 'crease?'  I don't think it's lack of talent or reference material, just a perverse notion that it isn't needed - or is it that if you need it you're perverse :-)

In terms of the gens, I take it folk are looking at the close up, further down the page, of this part of the mesh?

403 forbidden too

yeah, face needs some work and the genitals are definitely deformed. but kudos to the guy for even attempting to sculpt such a complicated part of the anatomy. most would only sculpt the minimum and make it 'work' with morphs.

agreeing with others, to get a 'realistic' look there would require a really dense mesh to accomodate just a few variations on shape etc.

plus i agree with Laurie, the feet/shin area needs refining as well

I don't do porn.  I mean I'm not ruling it out but I haven't done any yet.  Yet I was dissatisfied with V4s and created the Vmorph for her.   The age on the barbie box is like 10+ , so I assumed, I guess, that once I hit a certain age my barbie should be fully featured.

When doing it I know I thought I would be happier if she had more polys in that area to work with, because she is kinda sparse in that area - but I was able to get most of the correct features in there, though truthfully I often look back and think even now * I could do better.

It did require many hours of staring at detailed reference images - that gave me nightmares after a while.  Some might be a little shy of that endeavor.  /chills

My point is, I don't know how many polys you are working with in that area or what the shape of them is.  V4 started with a decent shape.  But you don't need that many to look more realistic than what is there now.

I think Gabe has the realistic female genitals covered ;). Whether they work or not is something I'll leave to someone else to find out (I don't do porn either). They look real good from the outside tho ;).

Laurie

Actually the most important part of a figure is its textures!  More important that the modeling of the vagina is the correct texturing of it!  A good texture can cover up 1000 sins!  Just check out my Posette and Judy V3 remaps (with my own homemade vagina texture) in my gallery!

dph

I can not tell you how deeply I disagree with everything you just said. Textures are important, yes, but to suggest they are more important than getting the forms right is laughable. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude but I have seen way too many crap models with decent textures in my day to even consider the possiblity that all you need is a good texture. 

No. And NO again.

hi DP,

tried to reply to your PM earlier and just now, but i keep getting 'bondware system event' errors.

i have sent you an email to the addy you gave me.  :))

Just to send that home - if that were even kind of true, the basic figures that come with Poser would get no complaints. Their textures are good. In some cases, the textures are the best parts of the figures. So really, just no.

A good mesh
A good texture
A good rig
Some good morphs.

its the combination of those that makes a figure.

I thought KEZ was a good figure, untill I discovered her head falls off.
Well, it is not welded......

Oh, that hurts.

Quote - Just to send that home - if that were even kind of true, the basic figures that come with Poser would get no complaints. Their textures are good. In some cases, the textures are the best parts of the figures. So really, just no.

Yeah, I don't buy that either ;).

Laurie

Quote - I thought KEZ was a good figure, untill I discovered her head falls off.
Well, it is not welded......

Oh, that hurts.

Maybe it's a feature. You know, for all those beheading animations that people are fond of doing....

Attached Link: Take That, you SOB!

From my personal experience of remapping and texturing figures, I have 1st hand knowledge of just how wrong you are!  I even got really good results from remapping the Poser 2 figures to V3 and M3 textures!  So, texture is 90% of the equation, whereas geometry is only 10%!

dph

Are YOU talking to ME?!

Hey Mister! Looking for a good time?

Hello David, You know I mostly agree with you.
Texture, texture, and texture.

But each figure has its limitations.

But? As you , I am sure one never needs anything above 20.000 poly's.
I 'll take good poly distribution over poly count any day of the year.
With a good texture of course.

Ever tried 8192x8192 textures?
Man, a new world opens up when you do that.

how much modeling you done Hoadley? not Remapping someone elses work for someone elses work, but actual modeling?

and please be honest.

*actually he's got a broken arm. tho that would explain the Angle of death.

Quote - @Teyon;

From my personal experience of remapping and texturing figures, I have 1st hand knowledge of just how wrong you are!  I even got really good results from remapping the Poser 2 figures to V3 and M3 textures!  So, texture is 90% of the equation, whereas geometry is only 10%!

dph

 

Are YOU talking to ME?!

Hey Mister! Looking for a good time?

Sorry if I have a different opinion but that looks like &$@#. You can tell how low res the figure is - ain't NO amount of texture is gonna hide that. His hand looks really low res and his beard is smeared. How is that a good argument for Teyon?

Laurie

Quote - Here's another Poser 2 figure I created after I remapped them.  He's either Michael Jackson, or the 'Angle of Death' from the movie Untouchables!

Still doesn't look desireable to me. I could do that with my old Celeron with 128 megs of ram in Poser 4. I have a quad core and 6 gigs of ram now. Time marches forward...

BTW, this WHOLE argument and the V4 to V3 mapping thing needs it's OWN thread directs you toward the title of THIS thread

Laurie

Quote - how much modeling you done Hoadley? not Remapping someone elses work for someone elses work, but actual modeling?

and please be honest.

I built this in Max, and articulated it in Poser: !!!Mea Culpa: I have Sinned!!!

Also a few other things, including a two masted steamer: The Emberglow Steamer

Quote - how much modeling you done Hoadley? not Remapping someone elses work for someone elses work, but actual modeling?

and please be honest.

I built this in Max, and articulated it in Poser: !!!Mea Culpa: I have Sinned!!!

Also a few other things, including a two masted steamer: The Emberglow Steamer

I knew you know how to model, but if you wanna talk about your things and making money and what not, you should make a new thread rather than hijack this one with your commerical stuff.

Laurie

Quote - how much modeling you done Hoadley? not Remapping someone elses work for someone elses work, but actual modeling?

and please be honest.

I built this in Max, and articulated it in Poser: !!!Mea Culpa: I have Sinned!!!

Also a few other things, including a two masted steamer: The Emberglow Steamer

well the steamer I can't make out anything... and the house.. hmm. well I can't say anything. it'll be against the rules.. but. that should be in another thread. not this one.

What's with the quadruple posts? LOL

Laurie

I built this in Max, and articulated it in Poser: !!!Mea Culpa: I have Sinned!!!

Also a few other things, including a two masted steamer: The Emberglow Steamer

And.....let's go for 5. Do you pride yourself on littering posts of a different topic with your stuff? CYNTHIA is the name. ;) Got a render? I do like your image, but...different thread dude....you can start your own for free last time I checked ;).

Laurie