Hi, I have been looking at Marvelous Designer for a while now but wanted to ask if anyone is using it with poser? Does it work with poser? Do you like it? How hard is the software to learn? 

I don't need ever question answered however I would like some reviews on the software before spending that kind of money.

Good, Bad and the Ugly - What do you think of Marvelous Designer?

Thanks
Kimberly

Probably speaking out of turn, but, I've noticed alot of people seem to be using it. Specifically , I've visited many japanese poser blog sites in search of clothing freebies and stuff for Deco, Kururu, and A3 and it looks like it's really popular for Poser content creation over there.

I've made some robes for G2 male figures.  Works fine.  Not complicated.  Some licensing restrictions in the low-cost version I use, so cannot distribute meshes but can do renders.

Expensive if you plan to sell your work on sites other than the Marvelous Designer site. Works fine for loose drapey clothes. Special skill and aptitude required to do structured and tailored clothing. I found the learning curve steep, but others swear by it. I find that I prefer to construct my clothing meshes in Blender. There is a trial version I believe, see if it suits the way you like to work before spending the money.

I love it! I make loads of stuff with it and use them in Poser and Vue. I'd say it's fairly easy to learn - and I have no real-life sewing skills whatsoever. People who actually know how patterns work can do some amazing things with it.

You can use it to make objects that can be draped in the Poser cloth room. I've never done that because I started using MD before using Poser, so I drape everything inside MD (works nice and fast!) and then export the draped object and import to Vue or Poser.

Rosemaryr does amazing MD work - you can see it in her gallery here:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?username=Rosemaryr

There's usually a month's free trial so you can download it and give it a go.

Thank you for all your input, it is very helpful. I didn't realize there was a trial version and will try it out before deciding on the $700.00 version.

The trial version can be used to create images, which can be posted in the MD gallery.  If you choose, you can participate in the monthly themed contest to win %-off coupons for the full paid license.  This month's theme is "Halloween costumes"; November's theme is "Non-human--monster, animal, furniture, object.."  

Be aware that the trial starts from the day of the download, not  the date of installation, so be careful there.

The trial version is fully operational, and you can export .obj files, which can be used in Poser's Cloth room.  But, as toastie said, the cloth simulation inside MD is (IMHO) much more robust and interactive than Poser, so you may want to do your cloth sims there.

Other than that, it's become my #1  program now, and I rarely buy clothing from vendors any more (they really have to have a lot of extras to make me bite! grin)

I like the carrara software a lot and but I really want to get serious on making clothing content for a freebie web site and to sell so I'm really considering Marvelous Designer.

It has the great advantage of a realistic clothing model. The approach is fairly new so the tool follows the experience gained and is much driven by user requests. 

Users with a (cheaper) personal license can distribute the meshes they build with MD2, but not ask money for them or for the patterns. Selling on the MD site is allowed though.

For me this program is the way ahead in creating clothing. I have a library of patterns that I adapt for different figures. Fitting a pattern to a new figure takes between 5 minutes and an hour, depending on the start position.

Prime asset is the flat unstretched UV's to scale. Lay the pieces as cut from broadcloth, assign the cloth texture and you are done. 

I jumped on the wagon as soon as I could, and have not regretted it a second.

This site (Modern sewing patterns) is a great resource of ideas and patterns for users of Marvelous Designer.

http://m-sewing.com/

Quote - This site (Modern sewing patterns) is a great resource of ideas and patterns for users of Marvelous Designer.

http://m-sewing.com/

Great! ,

For historical patterns there is: http://www.tudorlinks.com/treasury/freepatterns/index.html

The (original) instructions are directed to the experienced seamstress of the time (gone are the days girls learned this at school) and they sometimes seem outright obfuscated to the modern user, but it gives nice material to experiment with. As said, the workflow is still under development.

The original flow: arrange patterns around the avatar, define the seams, and simulate, is fastest, but depends on how the simulation evolves. In later versions this was improved and one can 'pin' the pieces of fabric to the environment or to the avatar, let them drape, correct the size and orientaion, and gradually add the stitches. This process simulates the work of a tailor working on a mannequin.

There is a lot to be said about this, and in my opinion Marvelous Designer deserves a dedicated forum here at Rendo.     

Real patterns mean nothing to me, I seem to have a total blindspot about how clothes are put together :)

But just drawing out the item you want and then splitting it up so that MD can sew it back together again works reasonably well too and I've managed to create clothing that looks fine for what I need - luckily no one ever needs to see the side that's facing away from the camera! LOL.

I'd never be able to create clothing that anyone else could use due to my total lack of sewing skills, but making clothing that looks good in my own renders is pretty simple. Luckily!

Thanks for everyone's feedback. I downloaded the trial version and working on something to enter in the Halloween contest for a discount.

Love the MD software, it is pretty simple since I worked with nodes for years in corel draw. However I have a few question about MD with poser.

I was using the Dev Miki 4 exported to MD at a COLLADA.

When I exported the obj to poser the clothing pattern didn't export.  Am I doing something wrong or is that just how it worked.

The shirt I made import into poser a lot bigger than miki figure, is that normal?

I have been readying MD help guide but I am a bit lost. http://manualen.clo3d.com:1975/02fa9d1951420761#cd98faa8cb5b0137#SEARCH

Can I do clothing morphs in MD?

Thanks

I've never tried using Collada so I don't know about that, but with object files you need to get the scale right for importing/exporting.

I think.... (but don't have MD or Poser on this machine to check so hopefully someone else can confirm this for you!).... to import the Avatar object into MD you need to use the Autoscale option and to export from MD ready to import back into Poser use the 8' Poser size option. Then the clothing should go back into Poser at the same scale as the avatar figure you used.

You will need to do a few things on export/import to help.

 Texturing: 

1.  IF you want the texture to stay just as it was when you applied it in inside MD, then DO NOT click on the "Unified UV Coordinates.   This should preserve any texture rotation, scaling, etc. used inside MD, ...(but that information doesn't always transfer nicely into other programs.  Some programs will read it and give you a good job of the texture, some won't.)  

2.  If you want to make a really nice UV map, for easy mapping/texturing after the fact, (if you have experience in that), then DO click that box, but don't expect the MD texture job to be retained.  You then go in and create a regular texture map image.

3. If you like to use material zones for texturing (I often find this a useful thing), then give each section, that you want to be a different zone, a different color inside MD.  Then on import to (say Poser) you can select each section as desired.  Otherwise the .obj will come in as one material zone.  (It is also useful to re-name those sections in something like UVMapper to something you can remember... they get numbered by default...)

Sizing on export/import:

 On export, select the target program you are going to work in.   (I usually use Poser, so I select the top one of the two Poser scales given... it seems to work much more consistently.)

I'm not sure how it is inside Daz Studio, but in Poser, in the import .obj box, I UNCLICK  the options for "Centered", "Place on Floor", and "Percent of Standard figure size" boxes.   Then when the dress/cloth item comes in, it is in the exact position/size that it was created for (I still would have the morphed/posed figure, that I used for the final simulation in MD, in that position inside Poser...see my comments in the MD forum...)

[Just ran a quick test in D/S...just export with the D/s settings, and import into Studio in the Daz scale setting...works fine.) 

Thank you, I printed all that out.

Let me ask you one more thing.  I have watched several tutors on poser cloth room where people pose the figure then run a simulation. (I think that is what is is called) but I also read you can import target poses and/or morphs into MD.

I just learned rigging for conform to clothing and not well, my dresses, between the legs keep getting split into two parts and look more like pants. LOL, for now I stick to pants.

So which should I learn, poser or MD to add morphs and making the clothing fix in a pose?

I've never really done much with rigging/conforming of garments, so I can't offer help in that area.

 If you have the time and energy, learn both.  

Each has something to offer: Poser conforming items are more usable by folks that don't like/use/want dynamic items.  MD and Poser cloth simulations are like by folks that want the 'realistic' flow of cloth over a body.   You may have to decide which group (or even both...) you want to develop your garments for. 

I will probably learn both in time but I'm so ready to get done learning and do some real work-work. 

:) 

Collada works well ... this reply will come in several steps so that I can include a few screen shots.  Here we go.

For COLLADA import/export from Poser Pro, here's how you get things to and from Marvelous Designer while keeping them in scale:

1. Load the figure into your scene.
2. Choose Figure > Zero Figure to put the figure in default pose.
3. Choose File > Export > Collada/RWY (I have to verify if this is also an option in Poser 9).
4. In the Export Range dialog, choose Single Frame.
5. In the Select Objects dialog, click Universe to uncheck everything. Then check the figure name (Example: Miki 4). Click OK.

1. In the Export Options dialog, you can do one of two things. From the Preset drop-down, choose 3DS Max/Maya, or choose the following settings (all other options are unchecked): - Export Standard Units: Centimeters

• Scale: 100%
• Include Rigging can be checked or unchecked.
• UNCHECK “Bake All Morphs”

In Marvelous Designer:

1. Choose File > New to create a new project.
2. Choose File > Import > Collada. Locate the file you created in the above steps and click Open.
3. In the Load Collada screen, check Load as Avatar. Set scale to 100%.
4. The file will take some time to load. Once it does you can choose File > Save As > Avatar so that you can reuse it at any time by choosing the File > Open > Avatar command.

Create your clothing in Marvelous Designer as you normally do.

1. From Marvelous Designer, choose File > Export > OBJ
2. Name the file and choose the location to save it.
3. When the Export OBJ dialog appears, select the Cloth Shape. Do not export the figure shape (Miki 4 Shape in this case).
4. In the SCALE Section, choose 8.6 ft (Poser).

Use the cloth room to pose the dress with the figure.

That's it!

Quote - Locate the OBJ file that you saved from Marvelous Designer. It should import properly sized and positioned.

Use the cloth room to pose the dress with the figure.

 

That's it!

Thank for all the help, I will print this out and add to 3d notebook.

Amazing dress in the picture. I have been working all day on learning long sleeves and adding extra bones to a long skirt, slowly getting there.  :)  

This is my first MD dress. It a pumpkin pregnancy dress if anyone wants to see: http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/gallery/1232/holloween-pumpkin-pregnancy-dress

It's cute! LOL

Good job!

It largely lines up with my workflow, but since we're at it let me add a few more tips that may smooth the learning curve:

• When making the avatar think ahead want you want to do. If you want to make conforming clothing taking the base figure is fine. If you want to make dynamic clothing keep in mind that any stretch and stress in the clothing is lost when you take the mesh from MD into Poser. If you start your dynamic fitting in Poser, the cloth starts to stretch again and the result look like clothing that is over-washed and saggy. So best is to export also a morphed figure to MD with less pronounced/shunk curves in the places where there is pressure, typically breasts, buttocks. MD can show where the stretch/pressure in the clothing is. The draping step in the Poser cloth room (at least in Version 9/Pro2012) in general can handle the poke-trough.

• A second thing to decide is whether you use an avatar with the arms say 50 degrees down (MD default) or horizontal like most Poser figures. If you do stiff clothing like jackets (see image), arms down will give the best results. Jackets are tailored that way and if you model them with arms level in neutral position in a dynamic cloth you will get very un-natural behavior (squeezing in) of the sides of the jacket if the poser figure lowers his arms. In conforming cloth you get ugly stretch of the fabric at the shoulder if the figure lowers his arms. Most natural solution is therefore to use a pose with the arms lowered, but this makes injecting the rig more difficult. 
  Alternative solution, fit the clothing to the avatar with lowered arms, but raise them horizontal before exporting the mesh does not give optimal results either. The folds that occur are 'frozen' in the mesh and will not disappear when the arms of the conformer are lowered. The Poser Setup Room does (did?) not accept a posed rig for injection.

• My preferred solution is therefore to use a base figure with lowered arms. Angela and Ang by Ali (available at Mankahoo) have lowered arms in zero position and are good candidates. They are also quite similar in shape to the default MD avatar and can wear a lot of the clothing patterns in the MD store as-built or with only minor tweaking. Anyone who wants to try the MD-Poser bridge without going too deep into MD cloth tweaking should give these figures serious consideration.  I add a few images of Angela with 'straight from the rack' clothing by Marvelous Designer.      

• Whether you use an avatar with arms lowered or on in T-pose, in any case make sure the arms are straight when you fit the clothes on. Bent elbows like Antonia and some of the Victorias are a nuisance when fititing. 

• Last but not least: Miki4's rigging is not supported well in MD. Zero pose is OK, but posing her there with lowered arms or loading a so-posed avatar yields a situation where the upper half of the upper arm reamins horizontal and the reat of the arm goes down. So for Miki4 best use .obj prop avatars and load poses as morphs. 

There are some startup problems, true, the technique is fairly new, but it is very doable right now to make clothing for Poser with MD and has great potential. 

Have fun.     

Remember none of these dresses has dedicated texture files, and would accept any cloth pattern generated from e.g. Bagginsbill's loom. 

Strange. I have to export as 8' Poser. If I use the 8'6 setting then not only is the scale off, but the obj actually comes in in a weird position. But, whatever works, eh? ;)

Quote - Strange. I have to export as 8' Poser. If I use the 8'6 setting then not only is the scale off, but the obj actually comes in in a weird position. But, whatever works, eh? ;)

What format and scale did you export from Poser in?

Quote - > Quote - Strange. I have to export as 8' Poser. If I use the 8'6 setting then not only is the scale off, but the obj actually comes in in a weird position. But, whatever works, eh? ;)

What format and scale did you export from Poser in?

I export as an Obj from Poser and import with Autoscale to MD. Those were the instructions Rosemaryr gave me when I first started using Poser and that's what works for me. Guess it must be different if you use Collada?

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - Strange. I have to export as 8' Poser. If I use the 8'6 setting then not only is the scale off, but the obj actually comes in in a weird position. But, whatever works, eh? ;)

What format and scale did you export from Poser in?

I export as an Obj from Poser and import with Autoscale to MD. Those were the instructions Rosemaryr gave me when I first started using Poser and that's what works for me. Guess it must be different if you use Collada?

 

Yup, because Collada appears to have more control over scaling. The settings I recommended above don't need any other fiddling. Very predictable, and out to MD, back in to Poser.

Quote -  Anyone who wants to try the MD-Poser bridge without going too deep into MD cloth tweaking should give these figures serious consideration.  I add a few images of Angela with 'straight from the rack' clothing by Marvelous Designer.  

What MD-Poser bridge?  Is there a plug in?

If you use V4 in the zero pose, would it be best to click the show arrangement bounds volume and move the dots to the right places on the avatar to fix correctly?

Attached Link: V4, M4 arrangement volumes/points for MD

You can do that, and if you want to, save those arrangement settings for later use.

Also, there  are some pre-made arrangement point set-ups here:
http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/freestuff/49/arrangement-bounding-volume-for-v4-m4

and here:

http://www.marvelousdesigner.com/freestuff/51/a-pose-for-v4-m4 

Quote -
What MD-Poser bridge?  Is there a plug in?

Yes, a human one. ;-)

You export the clothing in .obj format (use 1 Poser unit is 8.6 foot) and import it in Poser, no scaling.  

And for a plug-in? who knows what will come but not announced yet. 

Quote - > Quote -

What MD-Poser bridge?  Is there a plug in?

Yes, a human one. ;-)

You export the clothing in .obj format (use 1 Poser unit is 8.6 foot) and import it in Poser, no scaling.  

And for a plug-in? who knows what will come but not announced yet. 

Yes the human plug-in!  I know that type of plug-in well..   :)

Marvelous Designer is an outstanding piece of software. I've been using it for a couple of years now. I don't really have anything technical to add to this discussion, but I do have examples of what it can do. I recently completed a personal project called 'The Jenny Wren Project'.

http://cgandme.com/?gallery=the-jenny-wren-project

All the clothing for the project was created in Marvelous Designer and exported to Poser Pro 2012.

Quote - Marvelous Designer is an outstanding piece of software. I've been using it for a couple of years now. I don't really have anything technical to add to this discussion, but I do have examples of what it can do. I recently completed a personal project called 'The Jenny Wren Project'.

http://cgandme.com/?gallery=the-jenny-wren-project

All the clothing for the project was created in Marvelous Designer and exported to Poser Pro 2012.

Wow, great gallery pictures.

Quote - > Quote - Marvelous Designer is an outstanding piece of software. I've been using it for a couple of years now. I don't really have anything technical to add to this discussion, but I do have examples of what it can do. I recently completed a personal project called 'The Jenny Wren Project'.

http://cgandme.com/?gallery=the-jenny-wren-project

All the clothing for the project was created in Marvelous Designer and exported to Poser Pro 2012.

 

Wow, great gallery pictures.

Thank you very much. I'm more at home in Carrara. I used that project to get me back into Poser. I haven't used Poser since version 6 (and I wasn't very good at it).

Marvelous Designer is loads of fun once you get the hang of it. The MD team keep adding features and they are very responsive to the users.

Ok, I have my shirt made for k4 in MD and put in poser 2012, did the rigging and removed extra bone.  Now, when I was using DAZ I had to save it as figure or prop before listing it on sharecg but I have never done this in Poser.

If I understand correctly I have to save the shirt as a figure and then put together a runtime file with the object and material. However the material was added in MD and I am not sure if there any extra steps when saving it so I can get it all in one runtime folder. Plus I really not sure what folder inside the runtime the shirt object goes in.

How do I save it in poser so I can list it on sharecg?

Thanks - I really lose on what how to save this for someone else to use.
Kimberly

In poser is same. You have to save it as a figure.

Easiest is to create a new external Runtime and there save a copy of all files your figure refers to and that you want to include in the package. Typicaly this will be the geometry file and the texture files. Open your figure from where you placed it and check the loaded texture files. Make sure all materials refer to the texture file in that new folder. Save toyr figure in the new library you made. Close Poser and open the .cr2 file in Wordpad. You will see that the referred geometry file (.obj) refers to the location where you initially placed it. Fix that reference. Search for other occurrences of '.obj' in the file. There is a second reference to the .obj. Fix that one too.

Search the file for occurrences of '.jpg' (or other file types when you used those) and check that all refernces are to files in that Runtime.

Add readme's and promo material, auxiliary content as you see fit to the Runtime and finally zip the file which you submit.