Not a lot of money mind you. And not just by selling content. I'm wondering how you would go about selling renders and artwork you create with Poser?

did you ever searched the internet for images made with 3D ?

10000000000 of images and many of them are for sale as posters etc etc  ..

So unless you can compare yourself with them top images on the net, you cant make money with it..

just check http://www.deviantart.com many many many images on that site are for sale as poster ..

i know alot of people who have amzing images there but never sold one copy ...

Dont get you hope up ...

its a hobby ..and hobbys cost money .. not make it

Sell shovels.

Quote - Sell shovels.

LOL but only when it snows ...

Chris

AKA.. BAR-CODE

You sell your renders exactly the way you sell anything else.

You promote, advertise, and market.

The old "build it and they will come (buy)" is absolute bullshit.

Brilliant stuff is ignored while crap sells, and the difference is marketing.

If you're not interested in promoting yourself in lots of different nooks and crannies and niches far, far away from the Poser world, you probably won't make any money. Several million people on DeviantArt and many complaining that they can't sell anything. And they never will because stuff doesn't sell itself.

Get your own domain, code your own site (this is essential if you want to have very good and clean code that the spiders like and reward with better rankings), read everything you can on SEO, blog on a very consistent and regular basis, write articles for all the major article farms and link your site to them, give away 2d freebies, do high quality directly related link exchanges...

If you do all that, you can sell the most remarkable crap because the truth is, despite everyone saying how awful the economy is, a whole lotta people apparently still have way, way too much money to spend on dumb stuff.

If your stuff is high quality, well, even better. You'll be able to sleep at night. :)

I honestly hope you did not expect an anser. 
The GOLDEN years are over.

Some might make some, but most slutwear has been build, and build over and all over again.

Renders??? There are thousands out there that sell something once in while. 

Building a reputation is the hard part, and Poser or DS are just tools in your toolbox.
Poser or DS are a hobby. Have fun.

Wanna make money?
Find a Job.
Wanna have some learning fun?
Play with 3D.

Wanna make content? Great.
Start with free items here, show the quality you can deliver.

Build a reputation.

Then and only then, you can start selling. (and hopefully make some pocket money)

Those that HAVE a reputation and KNOW the anser will not come here and give it to you on a gold plate.

Moriador is completely right on marketing.

With good marketing, you can sell anything.

But??
You WILL have to invest lots and lots and more time then the standard 24 hrs a day.

This is:  A.R.T.

300 $ please.

Quote - Moriador is completely right on marketing.

With good marketing, you can sell anything.

But??
You WILL have to invest lots and lots and more time then the standard 24 hrs a day.

The biggest problem with poser "ART" is that anybody can buy the items in the render and do it themself .. 

And its not seen as ART by many many people online when you use 99,9 % other peoples stuff to compile a image..

The most sold images ar 100% made by the creator of the image..

The years that a NVIATWAS image was selling nice is a long time gone..

So promoting other peoples stuff in images is difficult to promote as ART ..

So selling shovels aint that bad idea :} 

De groente! 

Chris

Correct Chris.

Poser does what it does. It Poses content.

Most end users do not create (few of us do) , but most just Pose @ render.

Those that ""create"" are the true artists.

Quote - So selling shovels aint that bad idea :} 

 

 

De groente! 

Chris

Buy from China, sell in the US with a markup of 200+%. Or do like I do. Sell wholesale (b2b only) with a markup of only 100 - 150%, but keep a better class of customer, possibly with a minimum order requirement.

The biggest issues are:

1. Marketing (as already mentioned - the web is big)

2. Honest suppliers (if they rip you off, you are powerless to do anything so you need to be able to find good ones

3. Enough cash to fulfill your suppliers' minimum orders (often around $4000) plus shipping and import duties

4. Somewhere to store the goods, or enough starting capital to pay for a fulfillment center

There are thousands of manufacturers, primarily in China (but also India) who are desperate to sell to merchants in the US, and plenty of customers in North American and Europe who want those products.

I sell jewelry, not shovels. But the principle is the same.

Online, though, I woudn't recommend selling anything HEAVY. Shipping is a huge part of the costs. :) So maybe not shovels... unless you get someone to design some ultra light ones, suitable for very elderly gardeners, perhaps.

Create a store and broker for vendors for a percentage, :)  in my eyes they are the winners in this game (although having said that there is probably a tonne of overheads and responsibility that goes with it)

Yep, brokers are definitely the winners. Amazon. Ebay.

I'd think the biggest tasks for brokers would be marketing, administration, and web coding.

You have to have a well run store.

hehe Rendo-bay  :)

I agree....got good marketing and you can sell ice water to Eskimos. It's that simple ;).

Remember betamax.

Laurie

How to make a Monkey with Poser, you say?

Oh wait... I misread that.

;-)

Well lets face it, your competition is very steep, that being said, you really have to learn how to market your product, whether it be creating 3D models or renders.  We marketed ourselves first for about 2 years straight, everyday, contacting people, annoying many and finally after years of constent marketing made a name, but it was constent work.  And that time you don't get paid for.....so there you go.  Best of luck and plan on not seeing the sun for a long time.....that is if it comes out in your area.  LOL

Hmmm... actually if I total up what I spent on content since I got Poser, I think someone has made a monkey out of me...

A pretty happy monkey though ;-)

If you are good enough you can try book covers, postcards, calanders, and posters. You need a place with the right clients for whatever genre you are producing.  Its a tough market to get a start in but there are sites where you license your work for sale , and they handle the actual printing and distribution.

Comics. You  can produce your own comics and sell them on the internet as a downloadable product.  

Also there is PORN. Call it erotica, porn, adult themed entertainment there is money in it. Quality standards for some sites is not that high and they just want volume or you can make your own adult themed comic.  Be very careful you understand the local and state laws in both the area you live/work and the places you sell to. Defending your work against obscenity charges gets expensive.  

You could try making prints, framing them and selling them at craft shows/ county fairs. If you've never been to one of these, you'd be suprised at what you can get there. And some of the sellers actually make good money.

So much negativity!  Poser is a tool, like an airbrush.  It could be used to make stills for book-covers, magazine covers, posters, web-sites, comic books, etc.  Can be used as a pre-production tool for murals, stained-glass windows, sand-etched glass, paintings and drawings.

Animations could be made for games, web-media, websites and tv.  Have you seen some of the low-budget 3d animation on SyFy movies?  

What percentage of all the airbrushes purchased are used to make the owners money? Or electric guitars?  Probably about the same proportion as Poser.  Thirty years ago Poser and the devices it runs on were science fiction.  Why is it so easy to dismiss it as a hobbyist's toy?

Quote - Why is it so easy to dismiss it as a hobbyist's toy?

People just don't want to get his hopes up in what can be a dog-eat-dog situation. It's better to let him know how hard it is from the get-go than lead him on for failure down the road. Don't ya think?

The reality is sobering. No reason he shouldn't know that going in.

Laurie

LaurieA, I did not say it was easy or difficult.  That is not what the OP asked.  There ARE ways to make money with renders.  It is up to the talent, creativity and motivation of the artist to find success.

I used a render as a preliminary design for a wall mural.  I projected the image onto a large sheet of paper which I then used as a template and stencil to lay out and mask the wall.  I also used a print as a reference while painting.  Even at the beginning, I took a photo of the wall and used it as a background behind the render, to get everything lined up correctly and in proportion.  This also served to get the approval to do the job.

There is no reason to inject negativity into an answer to the OP.  I made some suggestions, some of which have worked for me.  If you have no ideas about how to use Poser or any other similar tool in a profitable manner why would you reply?

Where did you get that I have nothing to add? I have used Poser and other tools in a profitable manner. And it's NOT easy. But I never said he shouldn't try. And in addition to everything else everyone else has mentioned, he could also try selling his models. He's made some clothing that's really very nice.

I now leave the floor open to whomever.

Good luck EClark.

Laurie

NVIATWAS T-Shirts. If you can find a process to make durable decals, some ol boys would probably pay to have a bodacious custom babe on their pick em up trucks. Any venue where alcohol is likely to lower buyer resistance.

Quote - NVIATWAS T-Shirts. If you can find a process to make durable decals, some ol boys would probably pay to have a bodacious custom babe on their pick em up trucks. Any venue where alcohol is likely to lower buyer resistance.

There is a perfect solution for this.  Many auto shops can do it.  They call it a "wrap".  A big print on a plastic which adheres to the vehicle.  They look amazing!

search "vehicular wrap" and there is your answer.  Another big direction to make cash from renders.

I recently chatted with artist Bryan Adams (not the singer), who built his name in oils on canvas, but who recently went into iPad finger-painted art, using a professional grade iPad art app (I do not know which one).  

I wanted to know if he was trying to sell the digital work or a hard copy of it.  I found out he actually has the digital version printed in acrylic on back-lit screen, and the physical frames are rigged with LED lights and signed as limited edition "prints".  He says after X number are sold, he will delete the original file.

Upshot is, this artist has produced what is effectively a material version of his digital painting.  He was asking for about USD1,000 for such a techno-painting, but claims it is too low.  I don't know if he sold any at the art fair where we met.  

You could always use Poser for what it was intended to be, an artists reference tool.

I make comics with Poser and I'm bringing in about $800-1,000/month before taxes. Have been at that level of payout for the past two years. Not enough to drive a Porsche or build a in-ground pool in the backyard... but enough to pay my rent and still retain a total love for what I'm doing. I still work my daytime job part-time, but my comics are my life.

I think if you wanna sell portraits, then your art has to be unique and really well honed. It DOES NOT have to be photorealistic renders or ten day IDL renders. Most of the really incredible works in galleries are not photorealistic. Forumites worship realism. Picasso wasn't about photorealism.. he sold his uniqueness. Your unique view of this life has a value some folks will be willing to pay to see. That's for portraits.

For stories...

Since I tell stories with pictures, I can get away with less than art school pro level visuals. My customers are hooked by the story and visuals... not just the visuals. Since I render with Poser instead of hand draw ( and the most time consuming aspect - coloring/shading ) I can crank out comics at a rate hand drawn artists cannot without a whole team that Marvel or DC brings. You can make good rent money off of graphic stories rendered with Poser.

For modelers...

For modelers, I can only guess at what the average modeler makes in the Poser stores. I have commissioned modelers to make specific content I could not ever find in any store. I have commissioned 3 different modelers this year to make very specific props. It's stuff they probably would not be able to sell to the universal Poser customer - so I paid them pretty well. An untapped arena - commissioned modeling.

Role model...

Find some artist/vendor you really like and reach out to them. Ask them how they did it. I think you'd be surprized that they are all just average folks and most will be flattered by your interest and love to give advice... ha ha... we ALL love to give advice... but coming from someone you admire, it will be actually useful.

You CAN make money off of Poser. It's not all gloom and doom.

Quote - I make comics with Poser and I'm bringing in about $800-1,000/month before taxes. Have been at that level of payout for the past two years. Not enough to drive a Porsche or build a in-ground pool in the backyard... but enough to pay my rent and still retain a total love for what I'm doing. I still work my daytime job part-time, but my comics are my life.

Can you show a sample of your comic?

Quote - Where did you get that I have nothing to add? I have used Poser and other tools in a profitable manner. And it's NOT easy. But I never said he shouldn't try. And in addition to everything else everyone else has mentioned, he could also try selling his models. He's made some clothing that's really very nice.

I now leave the floor open to whomever.

Good luck EClark.

Laurie

Yeah, Earl, I'd definitely say, in the first instance, why not look to dip your toe in the water selling some of the clothing modelling you're doing... maybe pose packs too?

I'd agree with Laurie there.

Relative to rendering, I think the T-shirt idea is pretty good. Decal idea too. Although you likely want to avoid the need to outlay in advance on anything like this.

That's why DA's T-shirt, mug, poster, printed canvas etc. fulfillment model is good on those fronts, I think. Although as pointed out, it's just so hard to stand out from the crowd there.

If it was me, what I'd probably do is use DA or something similar for producing prints... but either get out there... either in person... e.g. at an event, festival, rally... down the pub (bar)... or on forums (e.g. car enthusiast forums, to cite lmckenzie's example) and do some touting of my wares.... rather than just putting it up on a site like DA and hoping someone might stumble across it and want to buy it.

;-)

I like your comments, coleman.

When I was younger I was really into this underground comix artist by the name of Richard Corben... If you've ever read Heavy Metal magazine from the 70's and early 80's then you've probably seen his work. He was rather marginalized for his subject matter but was highly regarded within the field for his unique sort of hyper-realist technique and fantastical imagery. Imagine Pumping Iron blended with Russ Meyer blended with Frank Frazetta and you sort of get the idea.

Anyway, I feel sorry for ol' Rich Corben since poser has come along, I can't tell you how many countless poser images I've seen that look like they were torn right out of a Corben comic. It's a tool that allows the user, with some imagination, to create imagery comparable to the works of someone who was considered a peculiar genius within the realm of comics. My point is I would bet on comics if I wanted to make some kind of steady income with poser. Of course having some great stories to tell, knowledge of the particular visual language of comics (and ways to 'Break' that language), and the ability to create dynamic compositions would be some of the "talent" requirements that would (might) determine your success.

That's not to say that comics are a necessarily lucrative endeavor, but who ever expected to get rich by becoming an artist (except maybe Jeff Koons).

Then there's CG animated Hentai...

Yeah, I know I'm not qualified to comment - the only steady income I'm making off of Poser at present is a negative one. He he ;-)

I have to sell my mind to the man to subsidise that...

But I certainly enjoyed reading both your Android and Cricket McGuire comics Earl.

I am always a sucker for a good comic story. I've not made a comic myself for some time. But I spent a big portion of my childhood drawing them.

I am a firm believer in doing what you love. If you love doing something, pull out all the stops to do it... and don't be shy in telling others about doing it too...

If you can entice enough people to read your online comics and you have banner ads up, you'll get a little revenue from that... and you could sell models and poses of the back of that too perhaps?

Try to think of ways to get a bit of return on what it is you love doing, without compromising what it is about that you love doing, and you're onto a winner, I reckon.

Course... as I said, I have to sell my mind to the man to manage to really afford to do and have and be with who and what I love... ;-)

But, that said, a lot of what I find in the garage sale of my mind is "experientially worthwhile" to me personally too. He he.

I certainly hope some of this thread... not necessarily my own contributions... will inspire you to find your own way to get the return from Poser that you're hoping for though!

Quote - I make comics with Poser and I'm bringing in about $800-1,000/month before taxes. Have been at that level of payout for the past two years. Not enough to drive a Porsche or build a in-ground pool in the backyard... but enough to pay my rent and still retain a total love for what I'm doing. I still work my daytime job part-time, but my comics are my life.

I think if you wanna sell portraits, then your art has to be unique and really well honed. It DOES NOT have to be photorealistic renders or ten day IDL renders. Most of the really incredible works in galleries are not photorealistic. Forumites worship realism. Picasso wasn't about photorealism.. he sold his uniqueness. Your unique view of this life has a value some folks will be willing to pay to see. That's for portraits.

For stories...

Since I tell stories with pictures, I can get away with less than art school pro level visuals. My customers are hooked by the story and visuals... not just the visuals. Since I render with Poser instead of hand draw ( and the most time consuming aspect - coloring/shading ) I can crank out comics at a rate hand drawn artists cannot without a whole team that Marvel or DC brings. You can make good rent money off of graphic stories rendered with Poser.

For modelers...

For modelers, I can only guess at what the average modeler makes in the Poser stores. I have commissioned modelers to make specific content I could not ever find in any store. I have commissioned 3 different modelers this year to make very specific props. It's stuff they probably would not be able to sell to the universal Poser customer - so I paid them pretty well. An untapped arena - commissioned modeling.

Role model...

Find some artist/vendor you really like and reach out to them. Ask them how they did it. I think you'd be surprized that they are all just average folks and most will be flattered by your interest and love to give advice... ha ha... we ALL love to give advice... but coming from someone you admire, it will be actually useful.

You CAN make money off of Poser. It's not all gloom and doom.

Don't know about your comic ,but your marketing skills ...

Might I suggest a url ;)

Quote - Not a lot of money mind you. And not just by selling content. I'm wondering how you would go about selling renders and artwork you create with Poser?

In Art only the best make it.
Angelo ,Da Vinci ,Royo ,Boris ,AerySoul ,Stone Mason.

Paint ,Sculpt ,Renders or make Content All you half to do is be one of the best to make it.

No pressure. ;)

In CGI when ILM,Blizzard calls you up to hire you then you know ,your one of the best.

My biggest sale of Poser renders was a company logo and a series of very high resolution images for product packaging.

Not Vickie, you understand. But animals, rendered and then stylized in postwork.

A fairly profitable local company makes cards and sells them in most of the local grocery stores and pharmacies. They are "regional": meaning West Coast Canadiana - wolves, whales, eagles, in sillouette against a sunset. They would be simple to re-create in Poser.

But if I planned to sell physical prints locally, I wouldn't use an online shop like DA or Zazzle. They take a huge cut because their setup permits them to act as payment gateway and webstore. It would be better to make a deal with a local print shop, or find one online who would ship the prints. Print on demand is very expensive, but if you do it the old fashioned way, by ordering multiple prints from a real printer, the unit cost is much lower.

i've pinned a lot of hope on a zazzle store.  and get rich quick

there's no such thing as get rich quick with Poser...lol. It takes long, hard work, and in the end...you're not rich ;). You do however get to do what you love and something you enjoy.

Laurie

I agree with laurie. You want to make renders that sell? This is the standard you should be trying to aim at.

http://isikol.deviantart.com/gallery/

His galleries are a good example of using Poser combined with Postwork.

Quote - > Quote - I make comics with Poser and I'm bringing in about $800-1,000/month before taxes. Have been at that level of payout for the past two years. Not enough to drive a Porsche or build a in-ground pool in the backyard... but enough to pay my rent and still retain a total love for what I'm doing. I still work my daytime job part-time, but my comics are my life.

 

Can you show a sample of your comic?

They're 'adult' comics at a subscription site. I can give a link in PM.

To be honest, it's easier to make money off of adult comics as an independent than mainstream. I dunno. It'd be interesting to hear how mainstream Poser comic creators fare with sales.

"They're 'adult' comics at a subscription site. I can give a link in PM.

To be honest, it's easier to make money off of adult comics as an independent than mainstream. I dunno. It'd be interesting to hear how mainstream Poser comic creators fare with sales."

Perhaps the OP should have clarified that he wanted to make money with with poser without going into the internet porn business.

Animation is lucrative especially forensic stuff for court cases/lawsuits.
its not easy to come by but pays very well when one can get the work.

all of this talk about selling ( non porn) poser stills ( poster ,t-shirts, coffee mugs etc.) , is just so much pie in the sky pipe dreams. IMHO.

Cheers
 

Quote - I agree with laurie. You want to make renders that sell? This is the standard you should be trying to aim at.

http://isikol.deviantart.com/gallery/

His galleries are a good example of using Poser combined with Postwork.

Thank you zev! 

@eclark Zev is right...you must learn postwork in order to expand your clients and to seperate your art from the rest...

I make some good money from commissions...and i really dont go after it...cause i have a creative office of my own here in Greece...so you could say that poser illustrations are a part time work for me...

I became good after a lot of hard work, detication and money spent on private painting lessons...

If you really want it inside your heart you can do it! 

it's hard to postwork without losing the z depth.

Going slightly off-piste here, perhaps... sorry... but are there any good postwork technique tutorials or walk throughs etc published online?

I originally studied drawing and painting at college... in a previous life. But with the renders I'm doing in Poser, so far, haven't tried doing any postwork on those... in terms of overpainting, anything like that.

At least nothing aside from some basic levels adjustments in Photoshop. Not even cropping generally... in fact. I'm just relying on shaders, lighting and composition. At the moment, I kind of think there's sort of a magic... a form of alchemy in doing it this way. So that's part of the joy of it... for me, just now.

But I think, it would be very interesting and useful to see what established Poser artists, for whom postwork is integral to their style, do... and how they do it.

To be honest, I'm just always really intrigued to see how other artists work... ;-)

isikol: Killer Gallery.

zBrush has some wicked shaders.fast at tweaking meshes.

http://www.topazlabs.com/ has some cool filters.

Coleman : a PM will work

Was part of a thread at DAZ forums commons about comics.
Can't find the thread.

A lot of info in that thread.
Think there was maybe 2 making full time comics with Poser/DAZ

Quote - Going slightly off-piste here, perhaps... sorry... but are there any good postwork technique tutorials or walk throughs etc published online?

I originally studied drawing and painting at college... in a previous life. But with the renders I'm doing in Poser, so far, haven't tried doing any postwork on those... in terms of overpainting, anything like that.

At least nothing aside from some basic levels adjustments in Photoshop. Not even cropping generally... in fact. I'm just relying on shaders, lighting and composition. At the moment, I kind of think there's sort of a magic... a form of alchemy in doing it this way. So that's part of the joy of it... for me, just now.

But I think, it would be very interesting and useful to see what established Poser artists, for whom postwork is integral to their style, do... and how they do it.

To be honest, I'm just always really intrigued to see how other artists work... ;-)

The secret..? Get the right filters:) or packages for Photoshop. Rons brushes is a must. Saves you lots of time and delivers professional results. Might have to splash out some cash but they are worth it. Filterforge is a good package to start off with. You can use it for free for a month and download all the filters you want.

Quote - The secret..? Get the right filters:) or packages for Photoshop. Rons brushes is a must. Saves you lots of time and delivers professional results. Might have to splash out some cash but they are worth it. Filterforge is a good package to start off with. You can use it for free for a month and download all the filters you want.

Thanks Zev0... yeah I've seen filterforge... the topazlabs stuff RorrKonn mentions looks good too... that said, it's possible to do a heck of a lot I find, in terms of image processing, just with the built in Filters and levels / curves etc in the PS Image menu.

PS CS5 Extended has some other pretty nifty tricks up it's sleeve for 3d stuff too of course... like puppet warp for example.

I've certainly been considering some pre-made brushes recently... specifically now I'm getting into considering featuring more effects... explosions, fire and so forth in scenes.

However I was really meaning more stuff like overpainting techniques I guess. It's my oil painter's brain thinking here about how one might work (PS brush work, etc) on top of a render... without just obliterating it, of course...

...I know this is largely just about layering, and building up in increments... guess I'm just interested to know what different folk do in terms of postwork...

If you want free awesome brushes, look on deviant art:) You will be amazed at what you will find:)

Quote - If you want free awesome brushes, look on deviant art:) You will be amazed at what you will find:)

Cool - I will :-) Thanks for the tip!

monkeycloud :

I like experimenting with different medians n styles.

Has some $$$ saved for Photoshop ,had to buy a fuel pump assembly system for the car ...

These are post in gimp I just mask/blurred a lot /cropped mask.painted hair n lines.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2150100&user_id=48237&np&np

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2069860&user_id=48237&np&np

This is where I turned hot spots up real high think it works better.