Hello all you poser experts,

I am a modeller using Wings3d to create, UVMap and export my models as .obj format.

I know that models that are in Poser format, and sized correctly, with all their correct textures can be sold for more than just .obj models can, but I only have the free version of Poser 5 - and absolutely no money at all.  So I can't buy the super duper higher versions of Poser. (so please don't just say that.)

Is there any way to find out:

a) what is meant by and how to 'correctly size' models?

b) what else needs to be done to models in Poser and

c) what format (and how to find it) to export as or save as or whatever it is you do.

d) is there anything else I need to do and can it be done in Poser 5?

 

Oh, P.S. The current models I want to do this for are a pack of various lanterns, one is to hold in the hand, one is a desk lantern and one is a standard or floor lantern, and one is a carriage lantern for cars or horse drawn carriages, some are just wall lanterns with brackets.

But I have various other models too, like a table, a dog, and various others...

Here are my suggestions:

a) there are a few 'utility' props that will help you correctly scale things: Dr Geep's are very useful

b) simple props just need to have materials applied to them. Since most users are way past version 5, keep the materials very simple. If the props have moving parts and / or morphs, you'll need to make sure these all work correctly.

c) you save completed props to your content library in the 'Props' folder. When you navigate to that folder on your PC or Mac, you'll see that the prop has a .pz2 extension. You should also see a corresponding file with an .rsr extension. .rsr files were phased out with Poser 7, and .png is now used: in Poser 8 and up, the icons for your items will not be recognised. There's a free RSR Converter which you could run to get round this.

d) OK, I'm going to say it: for f*ck's save up for a recent version of Poser: whatever you create in Poser 5 may well be fine, but if you're planning to sell your props, your customers with recent versions will expect them to work correctly, and you have no way of testing them: this is a recipe for disaster!

 

Good luck!

cspear is on the right track, but stated the wrong extension.

Here's the main extensions in Poser:

Props = .pp2 (.ppz if compressed)

Poses = .pz2

Figures = .cr2

I also use Wings, but I have Poser 7, and recently upgraded to Poser 9. But even with Poser 7, anything I make in it, will work in Poser 9. So backwards compatibility comes into play, most things you make in Poser 5 [should] work in higher versions.

I have yet to have something I made in Poser 7 not work in 9.

You could always find someone to collaborate with and sell as a joint vendor? you could model the props and the other could texture and make into a prop in poser in a higher v ersion so the mats are up to date and work fine in all versions.

I just import the obj file and scale it to suit the figure. Most things dont need to be measured. Once its scaled export the obj and re-import. It will now be the correct size at scale 100%.

For ptops just save to the prop library preferably in a folder named for example

runtime/libraries/prop/vendor/product  then check the obj file is in eunrime/geometries/vendor    and see that the prop file is pointing to it. (poser tends to create a new obj file or embed the obj in the prop file.

Same for a figure but do the tigging. For simple machines you can use phibuilder and just edit the figure poser creates from the phi file.

 

Poser 5 will do anything you need to do.

to Scale things, just load P5 Don or Judy and use them for reference, human figure alway are good reference for objects size.

Look this tutorials http://www.drgeep.com/ are fun and you will learn a lot from them.

Figures are things WITH moving/working parts. Props are things WITHOUT moving parts. Figures need rigging - kinda like a invisible skeleton. Props don't. For rigging and other tutorials... http://www.cocs.com/poser/index.htm Poser 5 is more than adequate to create content. What works in Poser 5 will work fine in other versions.

Quote - ima70 said:
to Scale things, just load P5 Don or Judy and use them for reference, human figure alway are good reference for objects size.

Look this tutorials http://www.drgeep.com/ are fun and you will learn a lot from them.

That Don or Judy idea sound like a very good notion, thanks for that.

But I'm afraid I simply cannot stand DrGeeps tutorials, I find the tone of them patronising and he will stuff his tutorials full of lots of irrelevancies that just get so much in the way of following the tut. I am not a child and deeply resent being treated like one, and hate to waste time on trying to unravel the meat from all the froth.

It's a terrible shame as I'm sure he actually knows quite a lot - but there we are.  Some things just don't suit everyone.

I will now try out your excellent idea about Don and Judy.

Quote - Lully said:
You could always find someone to collaborate with and sell as a joint vendor? you could model the props and the other could texture and make into a prop in poser in a higher v ersion so the mats are up to date and work fine in all versions.

Thank you for the suggestion Lully, but I have already worked very hard on all the textures for all my models and do not want someone else changing all that just to suit them.

I am very happy with my textures and think they are pretty good, thanks all the same.

Quote - markschum said:
I just import the obj file and scale it to suit the figure. Most things dont need to be measured. Once its scaled export the obj and re-import. It will now be the correct size at scale 100%.

Yes, I do that in all the 3d progs I use since most other people's models are never the right size for my scene, but there we are.

Quote - For ptops just save to the prop library preferably in a folder named for example runtime/libraries/prop/vendor/product  then check the obj file is in eunrime/geometries/vendor    and see that the prop file is pointing to it. (poser tends to create a new obj file or embed the obj in the prop file.

Thanks for that I'll add that to the list of things to do, much obliged.

Quote - Same for a figure but do the tigging. For simple machines you can use phibuilder and just edit the figure poser creates from the phi file.

Oh?  I've not heard of that before, is it free or does it cost?  where can you get if from?

Quote - Poser 5 will do anything you need to do.

That's good to know - I was about to give up on it.

Although there is backward compatibility, there are features in the current versions which do not exist in P5.  It would strictly mean that those users will modify the existing shaders and textures to suit.

Quote - mrsparky said: Figures are things WITH moving/working parts.

Props are things WITHOUT moving parts.

Figures need rigging - kinda like a invisible skeleton.

Props don't.

For rigging and other tutorials... http://www.cocs.com/poser/index.htm Poser 5 is more than adequate to create content. What works in Poser 5 will work fine in other versions.

Thanks, that at last answers a question I've often wondered about for many many years (just what the difference between props and figure is), the naming is so counter intuitive - since in normal speech a figure is something with bones and flesh, or something that looks like that - a human or a manequin, or a dog or a dinosaur - and a prop has always meant something that actors use on stage - aka a thing, whether that be a table or a telephone that appears to ring. 

Poser would have to be confusing about this... lol.

So thanks for the clarification.

 

Thank you all so much, you've all been very helpful - I very much appreciate it.

Quote - hborre said: Although there is backward compatibility, there are features in the current versions which do not exist in P5.  It would strictly mean that those users will modify the existing shaders and textures to suit.

I don't doubt that people may adjust things to suite their own scene, or lighting thereof - that's to be expected.

But what exactly does your staement mean to me with just Poser5?

Do you mean that some textures may appear totally black (for instance) simply because I've used Poser5 and their fancy Poser 903 (or whatever they have) can't render my texture properly - or do you mean what I said above about specific lighting etc?

All my models render okay in Poser5, Cinema4D and Bryce7Pro - I have supplied bump and normal maps for extra 'bite' if required - does that make a difference?

Quote - But what exactly does your staement mean to me with just Poser5?

 

here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poser#Program_history compare Poser 5 onwards. this does not include simple bugfixes, just major updates and feature addons.

so. in answer, your using a Dinosaur that had issues anyway and is known as the worst version of poser. it has been superceeded in many core features. to give an example. glass shaders in poser 7 take days to render in poser 8. and that was just 1 version change. you want to use a version thats 9 years old and 4 revisions ago. you may get shaders that run just fine upto say poser 7... then be broken for poser 8.

*just so your warned about the frustration you'll probably going to run into....

Khai-J-Bach,

Thanks for your reply but look, please don't assume because I'm asking for help with Poser 5 that I am just being stubborn, I don't necessarily want to use Poser 5 - it's just that it was free (if it has bugs that'll be why it was free) and I can't buy anything now - maybe in a month or two, but not now.

When you mention 'shaders' those are things created inside Poser - right?  Using some sort of math, right?

Well I won't be using those, I'll just be using my own textures which are either derived from my own photographs (brass, copper, verdigris etc) or else are totally designed and created by me in PhotoShop - so hopefully I won't have 'shader' bug type problems - will I?

Yes I do have glass in the lanterns - but this 'glass' has designs on it, since it's meant for 'stained glass'.  If the lanterns are saved with just the designs in place and not turned into 'glass' in Poser 5 (adding transparency etc) - will that be okay?

Does just adding transparency in Poser 5 make that a 'shader'?

Thanks for the link, I will look at it when I have time.

*When you mention 'shaders' those are things created inside Poser - right? Using some sort of math, right?* Pretty much. Think of it like this.. Textures are bitmaps - JPG/BMP - think photos. Whereas shaders and materials can be both photos and stuff created with maths. But one isn't any better than another. All depends on what results you want to get. Take a look at this picture..here to get super shiny metal shaders work better, whereas for the woodwork I've used a texture. The image also shows one downside of shaders, they tend to be app specific. So a silver shader for poser wouldn't work in studio. Though if you design the material zones for your models carefully it's not a big issue. Then if someone wants to change a texture for a shader it's a 2 second job.

Forget to add... Does just adding transparency in Poser 5 make that a 'shader'? Nope. You're only adjusting the transparency levels of that material. Using transmaps - for things like your idea of adding designs into glass will work fine as well.

Well I don't really want super shiny, this is what I've managed with 'Don' so far:

You can see that the lighting is abysmal - I have no idea how to get lights inside the lanterns and how to get them to react correctly, but apart from that...

Quote - > Quote - ima70 said:

to Scale things, just load P5 Don or Judy and use them for reference, human figure alway are good reference for objects size.

Look this tutorials http://www.drgeep.com/ are fun and you will learn a lot from them.

That Don or Judy idea sound like a very good notion, thanks for that.

But I'm afraid I simply cannot stand DrGeeps tutorials, I find the tone of them patronising and he will stuff his tutorials full of lots of irrelevancies that just get so much in the way of following the tut. I am not a child and deeply resent being treated like one, and hate to waste time on trying to unravel the meat from all the froth.

It's a terrible shame as I'm sure he actually knows quite a lot - but there we are.  Some things just don't suit everyone.

I will now try out your excellent idea about Don and Judy.

LOL, believe me I understand you, my mother lenguage is not English, is Spanish, and I never understand everything he put in his tutorials, when I was a beginer some years ago (p4 age) I use to open notepad and make a list of the basics of an specific tutorial, almost all the information I needed to use Poser was there, even this was an extra work, it was part of my new hobby, and I've found funny all the expressions he was able to make out of P4 people, not the words.

Good Luck.

Quote - Well I don't really want super shiny, this is what I've managed with 'Don' so far:

You can see that the lighting is abysmal - I have no idea how to get lights inside the lanterns and how to get them to react correctly, but apart from that...

those are beautiful!

In P5 I'd use ambient in the screens of the tantern and use a wide spot light located just outside of every screen giving them a color similar to the screen one, people with P6 P7 may use a point light inside the lamp (lamp not casting shadow) and P8 P9 may use just the ambient of the screens and let IDL do its magic, everybody can find a solution.

I've tried your suggestions and using ambient in each face of the stained glass works quite well, but I've also tried a spotlight with one of the textures on it and that makes no difference whatsoever, so obviously there's something I'm not doing right with that.

I've no idea how to make a spotlight 'wide' or what to do with it otherwise.

Here's what I've got so far:

Here are the light settings:

 

By the way - does all of the light have to be outside of the lantern - or is there a specific part of it that must be outside?

Quote - Figures are things WITH moving/working parts. Props are things WITHOUT moving parts. Figures need rigging - kinda like a invisible skeleton. Props don't.

What would you call a heirarchical prop, such as an office chair with adjustable height and seatback? 

I always thought the difference between a prop and a figure was whether or not there is a skeleton.

What would you call a heirarchical prop, such as an office chair with adjustable height and seatback? If it's a PP2 file with lots of parts, I'd say that was a parented prop. I always thought the difference between a prop and a figure was whether or not there is a skeleton Kinda. You can have a figure without them. Like when you need to make something static, but it needs to conform rather than parent. Or be able to bend. Mostly though I use the filetype to denote what things are, thats the easiest way. Personally I try not to get to bogged down what's called what. I'll use whatever works best for a project. For example on my UFO freebie, so the user can easily change things, I used a mix of prop like figures and parented smart props. Mostly it's about having fun :)

Well whatever these are called, things, props or figures, is there any way to get better light from the lanterns?

Something like this, maybe?:

 

Or this:

 

Both of those were rendered in C4D - I'd like to get a bit closer to that sort of thing in P5 if it's in any way possible???

the only way i know of is to add a light, select the lights properties. Make it a spot light, dial into place- so it's inside the semi transparent prop/figure- using the trans dials and up the intensity.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/details.php?item_id=23836

This lightball maker may help if you can't setup you lights, but you won't get the projection of the screen over the wall, for that you must conect the same texture as the screen to an spot light and place it the way Mrsparky say.