Bonjour

I have seen in the past some hints about how to reduce noise in Luxrender after use Reality plugin in DAZ STudio

I don't remember where i have see it

Someone have suggestions?

 I have tried the new update of Reality 2,5  and my render is noisy even after many hours

Thanks

Is this a new issue with the latest version, or are you new to reality / luxrender?

You will need to post the render and some idea of settings, but I also suggest you post the question in the Reality thread here... http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2849428&page=1

If you are new to Reality/Luxrender;-

In general, (without seeing the render or knowing any settings), noisy images that take a long time to clear up are due to poor lighting, something preventing the light source from getting to the scene (I think light domes were mentioned at one point?), and is similar to trying to take a photo of a scene at night without a flash or someother lighting... the result is dim and grainy as the aperture of the camera is wide open.

The opposite can be true, where you get a lot of light 'amplification' due to material surfaces glossyness etc... which will result eventually in large 'blotches' that will end up 'whiting out' an image.

I suggest posting to the Reality thread above, and you will soon have several people trying to help; but you will need to give further information. A screen grab of the luxrender window would be good to start with, and then we can start to understand what you are having a problem with!

Incidently, to do a test, simple add an object to a scene and add either a reality softbox or mesh light to the scene, (ensuring the light is in the right direction) and render...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVch_4d8C3w

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0R8lGZVQmE

although these are for an earlier version, they concepts still apply... `¬)

...at work at the moment, I will try and check back this evening... (If not already answered!)

Thanks for reply

I have Reality since beginning (version1) but didn't use so much because until recently i didn't use so much DazStudio

Now i surprise me to use DAZSTudio 4,5 more and more often

And i want to use Reality 2,5 more often too

But i don't like the noise Ok i see an option in Luxrender for reucing noise but it reduce detail too much Anyway i can reduce noise in post production with Topaz plugin

But i have some render when version 2 was bought with nice looking render without too much noise and i don't remember what i did for it

And one other thing

I see and try to follow the tube with the links you put on the message ;i don't know why but with softbox i can select the snoot but i cannot do nothing with it (yscale don't work,for example) I know that the version of DAZ Studio used in video is older but i cannot see where are the snoot proprieties we see  in the video (not in parameters,not in posing ,neither in shape)

Noise is caused by lack of samples. How many samples do you have in your image? Can you please post a link ti the image? Without seeing it it's impossible to give you a meaningful answer.

Thanks in advance. 

Hello

Thanks for reply

Where can i control the samples ?

I am rendering one now with luxrender Later i will post the result  on this thread

I have also seen during the last days that , with Reality prop lights or with other lights , when i click Render Reality sometime i have acces to Realty parameters window and can continue to LuxRender but sometime i just see a little windows in the center that popup very fast and close and return to DAZStudio interfacve without give me access to Reality interface

The sample count is at the bottom of the Luxrender window, in the satatus bar. As the Reality User's Guide states, you need to have a few hundreds or a couple of thousand samples to get an image without noise. You can find all details in the Reality User's Guide, wich is installed in the docs folder of Studio.

After manage some parameters on Luxrender i got this , not too noisy for test

Light prop from Reality 

I note problem with the eyes

This statistical was at the bottom

2,44 8thresds 1,27 ks/s 120.59 ks/s  359.62 kc/s 289 % eff

Quote - here is the reality render

After manage some parameters on Luxrender i got this , not too noisy for test

It's not noisy, I can't see any noise in it. It is overexposed though. You need to adjust the exposure to bring those overblown highlights down.

If you are not useing the linear tonemapper then you need to switch to it. The autolinear has limitations.

Switch to Linear and then adjust the film speed, shutter speed and fstop. It will look correct as soon as you do that.

Hope this helps.

Many thanks for your help

I will follow yours suggestions

I Hope  someday to use Reality render in Poserpro 2012 , maybe before the end of this year 2013 !

Paolo and everyone else using Reality,

1. What film speed are you using or do you recommend? For best results, we should use the lowest possible ISO I would think, right? For the least amount of noise/grain like with film?

2. Pardon my ignorance, but the DAZ version of martial's render looks much better.

By the way martial, I'd love to see a lighting diagram showing how you lit her in DAZ. From the top and also at a lower angle so I can see how high you placed the lights and what kind of lights you used.

1. I think the noise martial might be referring to is on the front of her neck.

Hello.

There is no "best film speed". Film in Lux doesn't have grain. Exposure is defined by all three elements (film speed, shutter speed and aperture) , we cannot isolate one element alone. It's exactly the same of using a camera.

About 3., that is not noise, it's overblown highlights. About the results, yes, the image is not lit in the most flattering way, the metal material is not set properly and the image is overexposed.

I don't know what lights were used, but if there are spots of, god forbid, distant lights, then the result will not be very flattering. Lighting does the magic. If you look at some of Callads render you will see in fact how the careful use of mesh lights gives a very flattering result. Spots and D.L. should be avoided with Lux. They are unflattering in real life and the result will reflect that physical property. If you use a single mesh light you generally get a much more pleasant result.

Hope this helps.

Another question then. I understand the use of different film speed(ISO) and aperture, but shutter speed?

In a camera, it could be anywhere from several seconds up to something super fast like 1/8000 sec. But usually around 1/60 to 1/500 for most people's normal photography.

BUT in Reality & LuxRender, your typical exposure times or "render" times are going to be at least several hours & sometimes days. Actually it never stops until we make it stop  right? Otherwise as you say, the light just keeps bouncing around all over.

So what is the difference between shutter speed in recording the image of our subjects and render times?

The shutter speed has nothing to do with the render time. The render time is not the time light hits the camera film, it's just the time Lux takes to sample each oixel for light hits. The shutter speed of the exposure settings works exactly like the same adjustmnet on a real camera.

Hope this helps.

This might be a good moment to clarify that the camera settings you see in the sidebar of Lux are all merely scaling factors that make the image brighter or darker. That's all. They don't affect the render. They're calibrated so that they match real camera settings for real-world light intensity, but if it wasn't for that, they'd just be arbitrary numbers.

Quote - The shutter speed has nothing to do with the render time. The render time is not the time light hits the camera film, it's just the time Lux takes to sample each oixel for light hits. The shutter speed of the exposure settings works exactly like the same adjustmnet on a real camera.

Hope this helps.

No, I'm afraid not. If we are supposed to think or treat Reality & LR like a real photo studio or on location photo shoot with cameras, camera settings, different lights, etc then(scratching my head here) why does the shutter speed(exposure duration)not correlate to render times? 

How do you know what shutter speed to set unless you do a lengthy test render each time? Does 1/30th of a second shutter speed instead of 1/60th not matter? Is the render going to look the same anyway regardless of whether I use 1/30, 1/60 or 1/125? And if so, why even have shutter speeds in Reality & LR program?

The shutter speed is the same of a physical camera. Setting it at 1/60" will bring half the light to the film plane than 1/30", which will result in a darker image. Because Lux renders the whole image right away, instead of using line-scanning like 3Delight, you can see the result after a few seconds, and you can adjust the exposure on the fly, while the image renders. The first pass is very grainy and successive passes reduce the noise until it goes away. 

The render time is, if you want to make a parallel with real life, the time that it takes to develop the image on paper after it's taken. The exposure settings mimic exactly the exposure settings of a physical camera. That is one of the great features of Lux which is possible because the renderer does not render in RGB, but instead it calculates the light spectrum. So, once you set the exposure the time spent doesn't change the darkness or lightness of the image. It will change the amount of noise.

Going back to the image that started this thread, that is the reason why I pointed out the overexposure. The image does not show noise as in grain, it breaks up because of the overblown highlights. That will not change with render time, it's a matter of adjusting how much light hits the film plane.

All the best.

Thanks Paolo. It's beginning to make sense.

One more question in another thread about Reality.

Go here and drop to bottom of page to the last 3 messages, including between mbin & me:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2862963

I agree with mbin. There is no way to tell you in advance how much memory you need for a given scene until you make it. The higher the resolution the higher the RAM needed. Technically you can start wth 1GB but that will run out of gas very soon. I consider 4GB a good starting point. If you have a 64-bit system you can add as much memory as you need. The more, the better.

Hello

Now i understand  how to manage Luxrender

But this afternoon i am trying to use Reality in three (3) different scenes, each time using only light props coming with Reality

And each time i got the problem i mention earlier in this thread  

''i just see a little windows in the center that popup very fast and close and return to DAZStudio interface without give me access to Reality interface ''

Same with the snoot of softbox:impossible to change its dimensions when i select  it 

Martial,

what version of Reality are you using (all four numbers please), what version of Studio are you using (all four numbers), and what OS?

If you simply add a cube to the scene, and nothing else, does the Reality window show up?

Please look at the end of the Studio log file and see if there are error messages that can be from Reality. If so, please post that text.

Thanks in advance. 

I just tri with defaut scene when DazStudio open

And i have access to reality interface

My version :Reality version 2.5 -- Build: 2.50.1.122

Here what i did :i load a scene  saved before,remove all the lights and put one of the light prop coming with Reality (here sun light because it a beach scene but i meet the same problem with other prop lights)  after position the prop i click Render Reality 

Sometime it works and i have acces to Reality interface sometime it just pop up and return to DAzStudio   

Here the last lines of the log from one try with popup without acces

DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
WARNING: Unhandled error while executing DAZ Script.
DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
DEBUG: 2: Reality Toolkit v.2.0
DEBUG: 3: UI created in 0.414 seconds.
DEBUG: 4: Shutting down the material preview task...
DEBUG: 5: Done.
DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
WARNING: Unhandled error while executing DAZ Script.

the worst problem is the one like this ,intermittent

For info my system is Windows 8 64 bits,Intel i7 ,32 gigs ram, GtX660 video card,Intel SSD 240 gigs and two hard disk (1 terta and 2 tetra)

martial, the issue is probably caused by a specific model. It's not intermittent, it's something in the materials of a specific model. If you load the scene that is blocking Reality and start removing one model at the time and then call Reality, you will be able to isolate the problem model. When you do, let me know what product it is and I'll see if I can find a solution.

Anyway, for learning purposes it's best to start with new scenes instead of loading old ones. I think that that is also the suggested strategy in the Reality User's Guide.

All the best.

Ok i will try it during the week end

I usually use a mix of DAZStudio objets and Poser ones

And for the snoot problem with softbox .when i try the gadget for move (like the arrow ) the gadget move but not the snoot and i cannot see the parameters slider like you show in the you tube video  ,the one Mbin suggest  earlier in this thread

In a scene  i thaugh the problem was coming from the texture applied to genesis

So i change it for another material 

and got same pop up without acces to Reality interface

Here two logs from this scene when i try to render with Reality

This first was the first one with all the scene:

Ran tdlmake on image F:/Textures Scan Photos references/Textures 2013/laschae_steam-eternal-backgrounds_70581/SEBrown2.jpg
Ran tdlmake on image D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/My Library/Runtime/Textures/Michelle/PHLovely/ValPHLovelyHB_Bump.jpg
Rendering image
WARNING: QColor::setHsv: HSV parameters out of range
WARNING: QColor::setHsv: HSV parameters out of range
Saved image: C:UsersMFAppDataRoamingDAZ 3DStudio4temprenderr.png
Finished Rendering
Total Rendering Time: 7.91 seconds
Loaded image r.png
Saved image: C:UsersMFAppDataRoamingDAZ 3DStudio4tempRenderAlbumTmpRender 3.jpg
DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
WARNING: Unhandled error while executing DAZ Script.

This second from another try after remove all objets except genesis and after changing material on her

WARNING: QPainter::drawRects: Painter not active
DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
WARNING: Unhandled error while executing DAZ Script.
Rendering image
3Delight message #43 (Severity 0): R2093: object '' (displacement 'dzdisplace', surface 'dzplastic') used only 30% of its displacement bound
Saved image: C:UsersMFAppDataRoamingDAZ 3DStudio4temprenderr.png
Finished Rendering
Total Rendering Time: 0.72 seconds
Loaded image r.png
Saved image: C:UsersMFAppDataRoamingDAZ 3DStudio4tempRenderAlbumTmpRender 4.jpg
DEBUG: 0: Toolkit found: D:/DAZStudio4 64 bits/scripts/Reality/RealityToolkit.dse
DEBUG: 1: Toolkit included
WARNING: Unhandled error while executing DAZ Script.

Martial, the log file is telling us that a problem has been found but there are no other details.
What you need to do is to remove one figure at the time and then run Reality until you find out what is the object that is causing the problem.
Thank you in advance.

Hello

that what i did for this scene (the one for the last log extract) : i remove backdrop,remove clothes on genesis ,remove hair  and finally i just got Genesis and reality prop light

I will try with another scene

Quote - Ok i will try it during the week end

I usually use a mix of DAZStudio objets and Poser ones

And for the snoot problem with softbox .when i try the gadget for move (like the arrow ) the gadget move but not the snoot and i cannot see the parameters slider like you show in the you tube video  ,the one Mbin suggest  earlier in this thread

In ds3 (I assume it is the same in ds4), in the 'scene' tab where the scene items are listed, you need to make the snoot visible. Then to extend the snoot, drag on the z-scale box rather than move it with the arrow. The very first time I tried it, I ended up moving it rather than extending it too! `¬)

Thanks Mbin

My problem was about visibility 

Glad it is solved! `¬)

I did many tests and conclude that the intermitent problem ( little windows pop without acces to Reality interface)is not caused by one or another piece of my scene

Sometime i just reclick 4-5 time and finally i got it like in this scene, rendered with Reality  (original has 2658 by 2505 pixels here reduced  of course)

I can also conclude that the more i use Rality render the more i like it very much

Many thanks to developper for this excellent plugin