I'm about to remove the procedural bump map nodes from EZskins tree and just use an actual bump map. I was wondering if there are any repercussions to this? Do you guys prefer the procedural over an actual bump map?  I was thinking of using both but wouldn't they clash too hard?

This is probably a dumb question but I need to weed out any possibility and get confirmation from you guys.

A bump map designed to work with a specific texture/figure is going to give better results than anything procedural - of course, that's dependent on the quality of the texture/bump map.

99.9% of the time, EZSkin's procedural bump is more than sufficient.

Laurie

I check out the supplied bump map with a texture and see if it's been done correctly. Most aren't. Seriously... about 99.99% are just so obviously the colour texture turned into a grayscale image. Human texture makers: PLEASE DON'T DO THIS! It is seriously bad because, for example, on a face it will make dark eyebrows appear to sink into the face rather than stand out, moles will not be raised but will be cavities, and so on.

The EZSkin procedural is quite good in most cases, and the best would be to take a blend of the procedural and a properly-made bump texture.

The only bump maps I have ever seen that are better than EXSkin's are the vein maps I have for M4. For everything else, I use EZSkin.

Bump texture maps are good for creases in the skin, veins, and wrinkles; that sort of thing. Try doing that with a procedural. On the other hand, EZ Skin’s pores won’t get pixilated when you zoom in. Content creators can do the creases, veins and wrinkles as a normal map and still run an EZ Skin bump procedural for the pores and whatnot.

To my understanding, EZSkin will do either/or, not both.  If the textures do not have any bump mapping, you can elect to create a procedural set.  If bump mapping already exists, you can elect to continue using the original or have it replaced by a procedural set.  The third option, have the script decide for you; create a procedural if bump mapping doesn't exist or default to the original bump map if it is already there. 

hborre is correct. It is either/or. It cannot mix the two.

Reviewing the procedural nodes for my Renithra figure reveils that a procedural bump node as well as a normal map is loaded. A normal map works like a bump map, but it loads into a different channel. I think the procedural bump is working. I'm sure the normal map is.

Quote - It is either/or. It cannot mix the two.

You can. It needs some amending in the Mat Room but there's a Blend node that allows you to mix them. Look at any the material for and area of skin and you'll see it.

Quote - > Quote - It is either/or. It cannot mix the two.

 

You can. It needs some amending in the Mat Room but there's a Blend node that allows you to mix them. Look at any area of skin and you'll see it.

I'm sure you are correct. However, the script on it's own does not do this.

I've bought dozens and dozens of characters over the years and there are very few that have properly produced bump and specular maps. By that I mean that they are designed from the ground up for their purpose, not cack-handed derivatives of the main (colour) diffuse texture map.

The procedural stuff that EZSkin produces is preferable to 99% of what the vendors here and elsewhere produce.

If you want to see how it should be done, this product's bump / spec maps are in the 1% that are (IMO) better than EZSkin's procedurals.

The Blend node circled in red allows you to choose which to use. If the Blend value is 0 (as it is in the screenshot) then it is all procedural. If it is set to 1 then it will take whatever is in the Image node that's sitting next to it (which should be the bump map texture, of course!). Any value between 0 and 1 will take a mixture, with 0.5 being exactly half-and-half.

Verrrry Innntresting

I knew the script would not mix them, but had never noticed the blender node sitting there to let the user do it! PRRRRROLLLLLLY something I should document in the user's manual. I'll get with Snarley and chat about it.

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Quote - Here's the bit I mean.

 

The Blend node circled in red allows you to choose which to use. If the Blend value is 0 (as it is in the screenshot) then it is all procedural. If it is set to 1 then it will take whatever is in the Image node that's sitting next to it (which should be the bump map texture, of course!). Any value between 0 and 1 will take a mixture, with 0.5 being exactly half-and-half.

If you set the blend to .25 will it mix input 1 by .25 and .75 of input 2?

The math function next to it, that should always be set to multiply followed by the bump map correct?

Thanks for the image, btw ;)

My gut instinct tells me .2 of procedural mixed with .8 of bump map would produce excellent results.

Guys i'm sorry, one more question. Do I have to put a gamma node before the bump map and set it to 1.0 since I'm rendering with gamma of 2.2 ?

DAMN, I can't believe how powerful of a solution this is. You have so much damn control, i love it.

Quote - If you set the blend to .25 will it mix input 1 by .25 and .75 of input 2?

Not quite but your thinking is perfectly accurate with regard to how the number influences the blending.

Think of it more as a slider with "0.0" being the Input 1 end and "1.0" as the Input 2 end. The blend value is how far along the slider you're setting it, so 0.25 will mean that it's nearer to Input 1 than Input 2. In numerical terms, 0.25 will result in the output being 75% of Input 1 and 25% of Input 2.

Quote - The math function next to it, that should always be set to multiply followed by the bump map correct?

That's multiplying the image map values by the number you entered in the "Use custom bump value" when running EZSkin. It lets you adjust the strength of the image map on the overall bumpiness (reducing it by putting in a value from 0 to 1; increasing it by putting a value greater than 1). Changing the function to something other than Multiply will change the effect that your entered number has on the image's bumpiness. Which could be useful in some situations, I guess, but generally just leave it as Multiply.

Quote -> Quote - If you set the blend to .25 will it mix input 1 by .25 and .75 of input 2?

***Not quite but your thinking is perfectly accurate with regard to how the number influences the blending.***Think of it more as a slider with "0.0" being the Input 1 end and "1.0" as the Input 2 end. The blend value is how far along the slider you're setting it, so 0.25 will mean that it's nearer to Input 1 than Input 2. In numerical terms, 0.25 will result in the output being 75% of Input 1 and 25% of Input 2.

Quote - The math function next to it, that should always be set to multiply followed by the bump map correct?

That's multiplying the image map values by the number you entered in the "Use custom bump value" when running EZSkin. It lets you adjust the strength of the image map on the overall bumpiness (reducing it by putting in a value from 0 to 1; increasing it by putting a value greater than 1). Changing the function to something other than Multiply will change the effect that your entered number has on the image's bumpiness. Which could be useful in some situations, I guess, but generally just leave it as Multiply.

I appreciate this, I've got some great results so far. My only last concern is the whole gamma correction 2.2 & multiple bump map issue.

Is this how you setup a gamma node for a bump map?

I'm such a noob, you can just click the image source file in the bump map, it opens up another window and you set the gamma right there. I'm set, thanks everyone!

The bump map has it's own gamma settings in the texture manager.  Click on the bump map node's image.

Interesting. I have that character and am going to take a look.

Quote - I've bought dozens and dozens of characters over the years and there are very few that have properly produced bump and specular maps. By that I mean that they are designed from the ground up for their purpose, not cack-handed derivatives of the main (colour) diffuse texture map.

The procedural stuff that EZSkin produces is preferable to 99% of what the vendors here and elsewhere produce.

If you want to see how it should be done, this product's bump / spec maps are in the 1% that are (IMO) better than EZSkin's procedurals.

Great render!

Quote - this is a mix of ez skin and bump/displacement