I found a V4 to V3 figure in my characters library. I must've acquired it a long time ago probably when there was the transition from V3 to V4.

I tried to apply some V3 morphs and MATS to it but it didn't work and the figure remained unaffected. However, although a V4 MAT did work, a V4 morph did not.

Is this not become a true V3 figure to which V3 MATs and morphs can apply, and also not quite a V4 figure either since the V4 morphs don't seem to work? If so, then what exactly is the purpose of such a figure?

I was hoping that I could use V3 morphs and MATs on this figure but have the flexibility of a V4 figure (including all the morph ++ injections).

I've never been able to get V4toV3 to work at all. I load the figure and get an error about missing pz2 files like (locate V4toV3BODYGrps.pz2)  after I cancel it still wants me to find every missing file for the figure and I have to open the task manager and force quit. I could not locate these files on my drive. I do have files in the Libraries/!DAZ/V4toV3/filename but they are not the same files. I have folders with individual body part names and in those folders are files like: 02-ps_pe070inj_Chnnls and 02-ps_pe070inj_Grps

V4toV3 was made so V4 could easily wear V3 clothing without the need for cloth conversion.

She is the same mesh as V4, but grouped differently, so neither V3 nor V4 bodymorphs work. She can use V4 textures and V4 headmorphs as well as V3 clothing and V3 poses.

If you want to expand her functionality, you can transfer V3 bodymorphs to her using MorphingClothes. PP-2014 should also be able to transfer the V3 bodymorphs.

And if you have PP-2012 or PP-2014 you can also try transferring the weightmaps I made for my V3WM over to her to improve the rigging.

This is the last of the DAZ legacy figures.  DAZ would take the new figure, morph the body and rig it to match the previous generation's figure so you could use the clothes from the previous generation.

There was even P4 Vicki, P4 Mike and P4 Stephanie.  They did this for the Gen 3 figures as well. 

V3 to V4 can use V4 head morphs but is rigged for V3 conformers and does not have injection channels.  It also uses V4 textures.

Quote - This is the last of the DAZ legacy figures.  DAZ would take the new figure, morph the body and rig it to match the previous generation's figure so you could use the clothes from the previous generation.

There was even P4 Vicki, P4 Mike and P4 Stephanie.  They did this for the Gen 3 figures as well. 

V3 to V4 can use V4 head morphs but is rigged for V3 conformers and does not have injection channels.  It also uses V4 textures.

What are DAZ legacy figures?

V3 is on the whole pretty useless to me now. As for any earlier models like V1 and V2, they're completely obsolete. But will V4 become outdated with V5? The thing is that nearly everything I have is geared towards V4. I don't even have the V5 model.

BTW is V5 also known as Genesis or are they two separate things?

V5 is a morph of Genesis. There are no standalone DAZ figures anymore. All new Daz figures are based on the Genesis mesh.

And yes, eventually V4 will become obsolete like V3, V2, V1 and Posette before her.

As soon as Genesis/V5 works as well in Poser as she already does in Studio, or another Poser figure of similar quality enters the market, V4 will (finally) be replaced by something better.

Doesn't mean you have to stop using her, but the vendors supporting her now will move on, just as they moved from V2 to V3 and then to V4.

Just like the DAZ vendors who already dropped V4 the second V5 was released.

Currently V4 is still "safe" in Poser, as V5 compatibility is still limited. But she's at the very end of her devlopment cycle.

The majority usually wants the latest, greatest, that's where the money is, so sooner or later everybody will look for greener pastures.

Quote -  

And if you have PP-2012 or PP-2014 you can also try transferring the weightmaps I made for my V3WM over to her to improve the rigging.

Is there a post or URL for V3WM, Joe? I still use V3 all the time.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2864342&page=1

Here you go:

Quote - "Is there a post or URL for V3WM, Joe? I still use V3 all the time."

Here you go:

Sweet! Thank you!

Quote - V5 is a morph of Genesis. There are no standalone DAZ figures anymore. All new Daz figures are based on the Genesis mesh.

And yes, eventually V4 will become obsolete like V3, V2, V1 and Posette before her.

As soon as Genesis/V5 works as well in Poser as she already does in Studio, or another Poser figure of similar quality enters the market, V4 will (finally) be replaced by something better.

Doesn't mean you have to stop using her, but the vendors supporting her now will move on, just as they moved from V2 to V3 and then to V4.

Just like the DAZ vendors who already dropped V4 the second V5 was released.

Currently V4 is still "safe" in Poser, as V5 compatibility is still limited. But she's at the very end of her devlopment cycle.

The majority usually wants the latest, greatest, that's where the money is, so sooner or later everybody will look for greener pastures.

 

 

 

 

Which one is Genesis though? I can never find the male or female base figure available on sites like Daz3d or elsewhere, but only morphs for it. Is it known by something else? Or did it come with something?

Quote - > Quote - V5 is a morph of Genesis. There are no standalone DAZ figures anymore. All new Daz figures are based on the Genesis mesh.

And yes, eventually V4 will become obsolete like V3, V2, V1 and Posette before her.

As soon as Genesis/V5 works as well in Poser as she already does in Studio, or another Poser figure of similar quality enters the market, V4 will (finally) be replaced by something better.

Doesn't mean you have to stop using her, but the vendors supporting her now will move on, just as they moved from V2 to V3 and then to V4.

Just like the DAZ vendors who already dropped V4 the second V5 was released.

Currently V4 is still "safe" in Poser, as V5 compatibility is still limited. But she's at the very end of her devlopment cycle.

The majority usually wants the latest, greatest, that's where the money is, so sooner or later everybody will look for greener pastures.

 

 

 

 Genesis itself comes free with Daz Studio 4.x. You get a basic man, woman, child figures. Morphs and other characters are to be paid for, as has always been the case with Daz.

 

 

 

Quote -
 

Which one is Genesis though? I can never find the male or female base figure available on sites like Daz3d or elsewhere, but only morphs for it. Is it known by something else? Or did it come with something?

Genesis is part of DAZ studio. It's built into the program. It doesn't work in Poser without some wedging and crobars, commonly referred to as D-SON importer, which is available at daz's website. 

V5, M5, etc *5th gen figures are all morphs of Genesis. They don't work very well in Poser, from the various threads all over the forums here and elsewhere. They're designed for DAZ Studio. Results may vary. 

~Shane

Quote - > Quote -

 

Which one is Genesis though? I can never find the male or female base figure available on sites like Daz3d or elsewhere, but only morphs for it. Is it known by something else? Or did it come with something?

 

Genesis is part of DAZ studio. It's built into the program. It doesn't work in Poser without some wedging and crobars, commonly referred to as D-SON importer, which is available at daz's website. 

V5, M5, etc *5th gen figures are all morphs of Genesis. They don't work very well in Poser, from the various threads all over the forums here and elsewhere. They're designed for DAZ Studio. Results may vary. 

 

~Shane

I see. I don't use Daz Studio, which is probably why I don't really know about Genesis directly. But since V5, M5 etc doesn't work well with Poser then will they actually replace figures like V4 and M4 for Poser users? And how does one even use those Genesis figures if you don't use Daz Studio in the first place?

What is the standard figure that comes with Poser 2014? Is it typically not as advanced, like the standard figures that used to come with earlier poser versions (eg Simon G2, Simone etc)?

Genesis is just the base mesh. It's neither male or female or old or young.

It comes free with DAZ Studio. To use it in Poser, you need the DSON importer and at least Poser 9.

V5 and M5 and the other 5th generation DAZ figures are just morph/character packs for Genesis you buy separately.

V3, M3, David, Sp3, Luke, Laura, Matt,Maddie, MilBaby 3, Freak-3, Aiko 3,Hiro 3, they were all the same mesh but standalone cr2's with separate morphs.

Then V4, M4 and Kids4 were standalone cr2's but Freak-4, Aiko-4, Girl, etc were just morphs.

Now everthing is a morph of Genesis, so all figures can be mixed with each other and they also all can share their clothing.

But as I said, Genesis is still a bit problematic in Poser,so most people still prefer V4.

Ray and Roxie are the PP-2014 standard figures.

And no, they are not as advanced as the DAZ figures.

I'm curious why smith micro hasn't managed to create figures that can rival the Daz figures (which seems to be the general concensus), is it simply a matter of money and resulting talent resources or does development in this regard take a backseat to concerns with the the software itself. Seems like Daz's business model is to have their proprietary figures tightly integrated into the software... Hope this isn't a contentious question.

It's both financial and structure. For years Daz has been structured to create content for Poser while SM were happy just to release their app annually and rely on Daz and 3rd party for support. But that has been their structure. Here is Poser, now create stuff for it. Hense why they do not have a lot of content themselves. It has never been a requirement for them to invest in. Why make when others did it for you? Poser has been surviving on V4 for years, but she is getting old. And since they do not want to adopt DSON, they are going to have to up their game in order to offer their users something of similar quality or functionality to Genesis tech, and that will cost money. Rex and Roxie doesn't cut it in my opinion, in terms of support and functionality. Put it this way, they can easily just be a shape for Genesis, with endless content support from multiple generations, but on their own offer very little, and that is the difference. Not slamming anyone or wanting to start an app war, but that is the situation. It is up to them to change it, not anybody else. 3rd party and users can only do so much, and without the backing from the mother company will always fall short. Hense why so many alternative figures are just sitting in runtimes.

E-Frontier tried to put out advanced figures with Poser 7, the G2 figures.   They provided a large selection of clothing, but there were issues with the figures, and they never caught on, which is a shame, as they are pretty good looking figures. 

Shvrdavid weightmapped Sydney, and I think pulled out half his hair during the process because of the issues with lack of symmetry and stray verts... 

Did they ever fix those issues on G2?

Quote - Did they ever fix those issues on G2?

No, these issues still existed last year.  Fixing them would likely break existing content...

Quote -    

I see. I don't use Daz Studio, which is probably why I don't really know about Genesis directly. But since V5, M5 etc doesn't work well with Poser then will they actually replace figures like V4 and M4 for Poser users? And how does one even use those Genesis figures if you don't use Daz Studio in the first place?

 What is the standard figure that comes with Poser 2014? Is it typically not as advanced, like the standard figures that used to come with earlier poser versions (eg Simon G2, Simone etc)?

For a lot of people, no.    The reality is any figure not named Victoria 4 is a niche figure - and that includes genesis and of course, any male figure.

We are slowly moving back to how things were before the "Rise of the Vickies". 

I don't see genesis taking off anytime soon for the same reason none of the other figures have - lack of vendor buy-in.

The good thing is that I can convert clothing to any figure.  As an example, I am working on some Star Trek Fan-Fic. In it, I am using the following:

Daz - All the Gen 2,3, & 4 figures

SM Figures - Miki 1,2,3,4; Judy & Don, P6 Jessie & P6James, Sydney, Jessi, Olivia, James, Kelvin, Koji, Simon, Alyson 1, Alyson 2, Ryan 1, Ryan 2.  (I'll be adding Rex & Roxie this weekend)

Independent Figures - Apollo Maximus, Antonia, Michelle, Kez, Koz, Rikishi, Terai Yuki, Dina, Eroko (if she isn't tied up), FemaSu, & Maya Doll

All of them are wearing either the V4 Courageous outfit or the M4 Valiant outfit, with Star Trek TOS textures.

Apollo Maximus is another figure with limited use for me. There aren't really many skin textures at all, and so few poses that you have to fiddle about with the dials too much making it too difficult to pose. I find it difficult to clothe him in any M4 clothing.

Quote - > Quote -    

I see. I don't use Daz Studio, which is probably why I don't really know about Genesis directly. But since V5, M5 etc doesn't work well with Poser then will they actually replace figures like V4 and M4 for Poser users? And how does one even use those Genesis figures if you don't use Daz Studio in the first place?

 What is the standard figure that comes with Poser 2014? Is it typically not as advanced, like the standard figures that used to come with earlier poser versions (eg Simon G2, Simone etc)?

For a lot of people, no.    The reality is any figure not named Victoria 4 is a niche figure - and that includes genesis and of course, any male figure.

We are slowly moving back to how things were before the "Rise of the Vickies". 

I don't see genesis taking off anytime soon for the same reason none of the other figures have - lack of vendor buy-in.

The good thing is that I can convert clothing to any figure.  As an example, I am working on some Star Trek Fan-Fic. In it, I am using the following:

Daz - All the Gen 2,3, & 4 figures

SM Figures - Miki 1,2,3,4; Judy & Don, P6 Jessie & P6James, Sydney, Jessi, Olivia, James, Kelvin, Koji, Simon, Alyson 1, Alyson 2, Ryan 1, Ryan 2.  (I'll be adding Rex & Roxie this weekend)

Independent Figures - Apollo Maximus, Antonia, Michelle, Kez, Koz, Rikishi, Terai Yuki, Dina, Eroko (if she isn't tied up), FemaSu, & Maya Doll

All of them are wearing either the V4 Courageous outfit or the M4 Valiant outfit, with Star Trek TOS textures.

Genesis niche and hasn't taken off? Are you living in the past? My sales between the two figures beg to differ. They are in fact much stronger than my V4 sales. Please do research before you make assumptions like this. Don't compare Genesis usage only in the Poser market, in that regard niche maybe, since it doesn't work that well. But in DS, it is the figure most used and that is a huge market. And I do not see going back to using old figures as a plus really, that is going backwards, not forwards. I won't start using Miki2 just because the fitting room can make clothing fit. Bottom line is its an old and dated figure, so why waste time playing barbie with it?

Genesis niche and hasn't taken off? Are you living in the past? My sales between the two figures beg to differ. They are in fact much stronger than my V4 sales. Please do research before you make assumptions like this. Don't compare Genesis usage only in the Poser market, in that regard niche maybe, since it doesn't work that well. But in DS, it is the figure most used and that is a huge market. And I do not see going back to using old figures as a plus really, that is going backwards, not forwards. I won't start using Miki2 just because the fitting room can make clothing fit. Bottom line is its an old and dated figure, so why waste time playing barbie with it?

I have done my research, thank you very much.  I am glad that genesis sales of your products are working out for you, but it isn't like you have a lot of competition in the marketplace though, is it?

Yes, any figure not named Victoria 4 is niche - I am not living in the past, I am a customer, not a vendor, so my definitions are very different than yours.  As a customer, I want selection and variety - genesis doesn't have that.

Characters - All Caucasians, all the time.  Miki4 has as many black characters available to her as genesis has (2) - yes, I know that genesis can use V4 textures and morphs - so can V4, and I don't have to fight with her to make her work in Poser.

What I see is the same few vendors making endless minor variations of the same character over and over and over, just like they did with V4.

Clothing - Genesis clothing comes in 3 flavors - Medieval European Fantasy, SF Fantasy, and hookerware.  Try doing anything outside those 3 areas, and there isn't much to choose from.  The first time I made the observation that a lot of genesis content was just reworked Gen4 content, a DAZ moderator deleted my post AND sent me a nastygram for pointing it out - 6 months later - DAZ uses that in their advertising, because apparently, auto-fit doesn't work quite as well as DAZ hoped it would.  And SickleYield ended up making that nifty Rigging and Morphing system for genesis.

Vendor buy-in - I was around for the V3/V4 changeover - looking at your join date, you weren't.  V3 content disappeared in less 30 days - At Daz, at Renderosity, at RNDA, at 3dCommune, at Content Paradise, at Renderotica, everywhere. 

The only people making content for genesis are a few DAZ vendors such as yourself.  Tour storefronts sometime and get a sense of how much is actually available for genesis outside of DAZ. 

There are fewer products available for genesis today (almost 2 years after release) than there were in the first 60 or so days of the V4 release.  That is my definition of niche.  To this day, more content is coming out for V4 than for genesis.  Sorry, but that is what I see every day.

Genesis requires me to start over with respect to content - sorry, but not only is that expensive, but the advances in genesis are no where near as impressive as the advances from the Gen3 series to the Gen4 series. 

I am certainly not willing to dump my production pipeline for a piece of software that not only lacks proper documentation, but has yet to make it out of what the rest of the software world considers beta status.  If DAZ ever develops proper documentation and has DS4 reach feature freeze, I am not adverse to adding it - I don't have any use for genesis, but I would put up with it to use that really, really Cthulhu that Luthbel made.

In my opinion, the only thing I see keeping genesis and DAZ above water is you, Sickleyield, Luthbel, and Stonemason.

Lol Genesis doesnt need us to keep it afloat, but thanks for the compliment. Yes alot of what you say is true but you forget it can use all Gen4 content etc, and with sickle rigging tools they fit even better, so users use Genesis because it is better rigged, has more support and people can still buy v4 content and use it on G. Agree there are not a lot of Genesis clothing, but that doesn't mean it's not being used. EG I for one still buy lots of v4 content that I use on Genesis, because it bends better than the other figures, and has a wider flexability range in terms of morphs and customization. So the figure has taken off, maybe not clothing content etc, but that doesnt mean just because content released is for V4, they are using it on V4. Most have dropped v4 and are using Genesis v4 instead.

I Wish they had made a Mike4-to-Mike3

Ye m3's body shape wasn't bad actually.

You mean like this ?  ;-)

(The other is my weightmapped Mike4-to-David 3)

Sorry, can't distribute him as DAZ are stricter about the V4/M4/K4 mesh than they are about the 3rd Gen mesh.

It was a bit complicated to make him, but as you see, not impossible. Don't know why DAZ never made one. Maybe the same reason there was no David-4 or a Luke/Laura-4. Simply not worth the effort.

Quote - > Quote - This is the last of the DAZ legacy figures.  DAZ would take the new figure, morph the body and rig it to match the previous generation's figure so you could use the clothes from the previous generation.

There was even P4 Vicki, P4 Mike and P4 Stephanie.  They did this for the Gen 3 figures as well. 

V3 to V4 can use V4 head morphs but is rigged for V3 conformers and does not have injection channels.  It also uses V4 textures.

 

What are DAZ legacy figures?

 

V3 is on the whole pretty useless to me now. As for any earlier models like V1 and V2, they're completely obsolete. But will V4 become outdated with V5? The thing is that nearly everything I have is geared towards V4. I don't even have the V5 model.

 

BTW is V5 also known as Genesis or are they two separate things?

Legacy figures were figures that had the main body morph and rigging of the previous generation's figures and the heads of the new figures.

They were designed to allow use of content purchased for the older figures with the new figures.

When DAZ released Vicki and Mike way back when, they came with a P4Vicki and P4Mike figure.  These had Posette's and Dork's body shapes and rigging so you could use the P4 wardrobe with them.  IIRC, they accepted the Vicki and Mike textures.

Stephanie was built from Mike's mesh and did not come with the P4Steph figure.  That was a separate purchase.  Stephanie had separate textures as she used Mike's UV map.

The Gen 3 figures either had the Gen3 to Gen 2 figures, as was the case for V3, M3,and the Kids or as with A3 the figure had A3's head on Steph's body. 

D3 and SP3 had not legacy counterparts.

You could UV map V3 with either the V3 or the V2 uvs using UVmapper Classic as DAZ supplied downloads for both uvs.

V4 was the last figure to have one as in V4 to V3.  This one has the V3 body morph with V4's head.  The body does not take the V3 morphs but the head does take the V4 morphs.  It uses the V4 textures.  I never tried remapping so I don't know if it will take the V3 uvs.

Gen4 has 3 base figures.  V4, M4 and K4.  Everything else is a morph set for one of these.

Genesis drops things down to a single base figure from which everything else is a morph set of it. 

Quote - "I Wish they had made a Mike4-to-Mike3"

You mean like this ?  ;-)

(The other is my weightmapped Mike4-to-David 3)

Sorry, can't distribute him as DAZ are stricter about the V4/M4/K4 mesh than they are about the 3rd Gen mesh.

It was a bit complicated to make him, but as you see, not impossible. Don't know why DAZ never made one. Maybe the same reason there was no David-4 or a Luke/Laura-4. Simply not worth the effort.

I would have happily bought them - as would have a lot of other people.

You have to remember, after the YT's initial roll-out, DAZ released 1 item for them every 6 months.  There was 1 product that was zipped up in it's installers for 5 months before it was put in the store. 

Colorcurvature's M4/K4 script allows me to make Gen 4 YTs & a David 4, and, as an added bonus, the script will do the same thing with the Gen3 & Gen 2 figures.

Clothing has always been a "chicken and egg" issue.  Clothing conversion systems have been around for years, but most people wouldn't spend the 15 minutes are so to use them.  There is even an easier solution today with the fitting room in Poser 2014.

Oh, and 1 other thing - Just because in Poser 2014 subdivision can go to 8, doesn't mean that you can.

I tried it with V4, just to see what would happen.

Not only did I use up all 22Gb of my computer's ram, my swap file was over 18Gb before I pulled the plug on Poser.

Quote - "I Wish they had made a Mike4-to-Mike3"

You mean like this ?  ;-)

(The other is my weightmapped Mike4-to-David 3)

Sorry, can't distribute him as DAZ are stricter about the V4/M4/K4 mesh than they are about the 3rd Gen mesh.

It was a bit complicated to make him, but as you see, not impossible. Don't know why DAZ never made one. Maybe the same reason there was no David-4 or a Luke/Laura-4. Simply not worth the effort.

Great work, JoeQuick!

Quote -
Colorcurvature's M4/K4 script allows me to make Gen 4 YTs & a David 4, and, as an added bonus, the script will do the same thing with the Gen3 & Gen 2 figures.

Cool! Thanks for the tip!

Quote - Sorry, can't distribute him as DAZ are stricter about the V4/M4/K4 mesh than they are about the 3rd Gen mesh.

In what way?  I've seen modified V4 distributed as an RTE file (Shukky had one) and there is at least one commercial product that distributes an unencoded cr2...