I hope I don't have to come in here again and say this, but you folks need to start acting like adults in these forums.  The reason that Nerd3D isn't saying anything in his post is because he and his company keeps getting bashed.  Calling software companies losers is NOT acceptable. Read the ToS.  You can voice your opinion, but do so in a constructive and civil manner.  If you can post civil in other places, I would advise you to do the same here.  So start acting like appropriately.

Thank you for your intervention, I really do wish you all the success in your aims.  I will try and behave but I have to admit I do find this a frustrating forum to be part of.  I stick with it because it has so much potential and has been great in the past.   I will try hard not to do anything to upset your plans but if you do feel I have stepped out on line at any point please site mail me and let me know as I really do support your stated aims.

You're right Razor, it does start with one small step. :)

Hornet,

Thank you. :)  Believe me, I understand how frustrating it can be.  And yes, it can be a great forum again but it takes a village.

Giana,

It was culture shock when I went from P6 to PP2012 but it wasn't that much different in most areas. The jump to PP 2014 only seemed a natural advancement for me. I think adding Cycles is a big leap and I'm happy to hear it.  I'm even a little excited about strand based hair.  :)

BB is awesome and I think the reason he's being referenced so much is because of not only his generosity, but also for his ability to do just about anything in any version of Poser quite easily.

     That's an excellent point, Giana.  Ease of transition from Firefly to Superfly is a very desirable goal.  When a studio adds a physics renderer, you don't want to have to learn a whole new material/lighting system from scratch.  The ability to have materials translated is an important feature in its own right.  Without automatic material translation, most people aren't going to use a physics renderer.

     That said, there is always a first time for a given method to be discovered, and BB will likely be the forerunner for a lot of techniques to use in Superfly.  But there won't be anything stopping anyone else from doing so.  It's just that those who love to experiment and explore - and have a command of math and physics- will hit upon things pretty quickly.

     Some of us have already been cogitating on the idea that we should develop a library of material presets and demo props for everybody else to use so they get a head start.   So, I think it won't be long after the P11 release that you'll see such goodies appear.  Well, assuming we can figure it out.

BB is awesome and I think the reason he's being referenced so much is because of not only his generosity, but also for his ability to do just about anything in any version of Poser quite easily.

yes, i absolutely agree with you on that. 

but my point is that i shouldn't have to be some uber-Poser genius to use the bloody program and use it well... ;)

and yes, i'm braced from a bit of stiff work if i upgrade :D

I don't think it will be as bad as you expect.  I'll be honest, I started with DS2 and transitioned to Poser 6 when it was dirt cheap.  It sat for a long time and when DS 3 came out, I lost interest.  Now that was a culture shock to say the least.  But when PP2012 came out, I fell in love with the ability to do Dynamics without buying something extra.  I was so far from a Uber Poser genius it wasn't funny. :D

I'm dense too sometimes, so it was a super big jump for me but now that I'm getting the hang of it, I'm glad I switched. The learning curve didn't seem all that bad even for me. :)

well, i'm still struggling with figuring out node usage, and building my own shader trees.  i was telling someone the other day that i want, at some point, to be able to walk through say a supermarket, or a Wally World since they've a large mix of stuff, and in my head as i look at things, i'm building shader trees automatically.  i believe that i can do this, actually, to think in what i've dubbed for myself 'node language', i just need to get certain verbiage down, figuratively speaking, as i excel at conjugation.  [silly grin]

     Giana, I started in P6 myself.  When we first got computers for entering incident reports at the fire department, I was surfing one evening and saw an ad for P6.  I was intrigued at the idea:  being able to do 3D on my own computer!  I bought my first PC, and Poser 6.  I crashed and burned a lot before someone in the PhotoBucket forum pointed me to 3D forums.

     If you upgrade, I can help with material nodework.  I can help with P6 nodework, for that matter.  But the newer Poser can do special effects tricks that P6 can't do.

[edited for quoting deleted content]

I think once the rendering engine is in the customers hands, the rendering will be much improved as tips and hints are shared. The same thing happened with iray and luxrender, so this is no different. However, until all the questions are answers and the feature set more clearer, I would advise against preordering so that the features are properly fleshed out. There's no incentive if they already have your money. Make sure all your questions are answered before committing, I think everyone can agree to that.

Back to lurking.

obm890 Wrote:
"I bought Marvelous Designer 2 when it was $100. Now that would buy me 6 weeks of 'rental' of MD4. Not gonna happen. MD4 can do some nice tricks, but it's not $450 better than what's in MD2."

I wish I'd bought it when it was $100, it's a great program but that's about all it's worth to me ($100 for a permanent licence).  But same here, I will not rent software (under any circumstances), and every time a software publisher puts on a slimey Adobe-Greed-Suit, I just smile at Blender, GIMP, and Make Human more and more and more :-)

@Teyon
Thanks for the renders you've been posting, and of curiosity, are those green circles colour indicators that will change depending on compatibility with the current render mode chosen (though I understand if you're not allowed to say)?

Which green circles are you referring to?

[edited for reference to deleted content]

     I myself would like to learn D/S materials -oh, and rigging- so as to be able to offer D/S-ready versions of my models, as I do with making Vue versions.  I get requests for D/S versions fairly often.  I have modo, but I've never rendered with it;  I only use it to work on meshes.  I use Silo to model, but modo has some tools which Silo lacks.  I will probably never learn modo's material/lighting, but I would be willing to learn D/S.

[quote:  OBM890]  are those green circles colour indicators that will change depending on compatibility with the current render mode chosen?  ]

     I think what you're referring to are the "sockets" into which one can plug node "wires".

Ah, yes, if that's the green circles in question, those are the sockets for the nodes. I don't think they change color on the fly.

How about this.  Stick to the subject this thread is about and stop derailing it with arguing about this group or that one.  STOP.  This isn't helping.

If you upgrade, I can help with material nodework.  I can help with P6 nodework, for that matter.

[that's] very kind of you to offer, seachnasaigh, and at some point, i just may take you up on your generosity.  thanks so much. :))

I like both.  Each does what it does.  Right now - as in at this moment - DS has the superior render engine, without spending extra money.  So I'm using it.  

LOL I guess that makes me a whore.  Guilty! :D

Oh, really? So on July 26th, in this thread, you didn't quote a post from the forums over at RDNA in which it was explicitly stated " Of course there will be advanced settings that need some time to learn but you will be able to lean those as you go." but which you proceeded to ignore while complaining that there would be no advanced settings?

Odd, because I certainly responded to that post by pointing out your own post demonstrated your complaint had some issues.

If you had the faintest idea of what you are talking about, which you definitely don't, you would know that the late Nerd3D was talking about the parametrization of the Cycles engine, not of the structure of shaders. Keith, go to Blenderartits and read carefully the 755 page thread about Cycles, get Blender, go thru a couple of hundreds of tutorials ranging from a trivial matte material to volumetric fogs and clouds and then, only then, come back to discuss about Cycles because then, only then, you will know it enough to have an opinion about what Cycles is and is not, about what Cycles does and does not.

Signed: somebody who started using Cycles the next day after the nightly build included it for the first time, i.e. about 4 years ago.

As far as I can tell, having read that same post, he said nothing of the sort. He didn't say anything to come to any sort of final conclusion about what or might not be incorporated in the final version. You made assumptions about what he meant, didn't seek any clarification of what he meant, and then proceeded to complain about what you interpreted he meant while assuming that of course you had to be correct. Just as you don't have the faintest idea what I may or may not know about Blender, what I may or may not have read about it, whether I may or may not use Blender and Cycles. You just assume that because I don't complain about Poser incessantly, as you do, that there's no possible way I can know anything about it.

I will admit I'm not up on the latest changes in Blender and Cycles since the last version I have is 2.69 since I prefer modelling in modo, and that release is almost two years old now so i haven't bothered upgrading. Just out of curiosity I should look in my archive and see...why look at that. My original download of 2.41. Why, that can't be right. That came out in 2006! That would mean I've had Blender for...carry the one...9 years now. Peculiar.

But you've been using Cycles for a whole four years! How could you possibly be wrong? Clearly something else must be at fault. Perhaps a timewarp? You just can't trust those singularities.

I like both.  Each does what it does.  Right now - as in at this moment - DS has the superior render engine, without spending extra money.  So I'm using it.  

LOL I guess that makes me a whore.  Guilty! :D

No, I suspect that makes you someone who is enjoying their art and uses whatever software available to get the results you are looking for.   I think the saddest part of this thread is that it could mean we get no further sneek peeks which degrades the forum still further.  

For my part I am not at all sure that I will upgrade to the new Poser for very different reasons but a glimpse behind the scenes like this may convince me otherwise.  It was the same when they first introduced Sub Surface Scattering, I was not sure I would upgrade and then I saw what BB was doing with SSS and I was hooked.  Threads like this tell you a lot more about a feature than a marketing description when the product is launched but you do have to accept that, at this stage, they will not have all the answers.

This thread was meant to be a sneak peek of what is coming in the new version of Poser. It is not meant to bash DS or Poser..Please quit trying to derailing this thread and please stay on topic of the discussion of what it was intended for! 

Still interested to know what new features are going to be happening on the content/creation aspect of things, I think maybe cycles implementation might be getting blown out of proportion in comparison. Nerd did say Content is King

Still don't know how to use some of the text formatting thingies on this forum. :/

At the moment we're not publicly discussing content creation tools. That will probably be a separate reveal. Especially now. It would get lost among all the bickering.

Teyon,

I'm very sorry that this thread has become a platform for bickering.  :( 

We've added new forum coordinators to help combat this issue.  What is disturbing is that they can behave elsewhere but they feel the need to misbehave here and that is going to stop. None of us like coming in here every couple of days and having to post a message for them to act like adults. We want to have a fun, enjoyable forum like it used to be here. They are chasing people away and now the winds of change are blowing...

[edited for quoting deleted content]

Whatever needs to be done I hope it results in us seeing a few more sneak peeks with open discussion and no bickering.

At the moment we're not publicly discussing content creation tools. That will probably be a separate reveal. Especially now. It would get lost among all the bickering.

That's what I'm looking forward to (updated content creations tool's)

Anyway, any new renders to share from the Poser peeps?  I'd like to see some exterior renders done in SuperFly, please.

Some exterior render example would be great.  I do  lot of portraits and while SuperFly looks good I get close to what I want with Firefly. It is external scenes where I often step out of firefly to either Reality or Vue.  I know BB has shown some stunning external scenes with the present Poser but it would be good to see if SuperFly can help those of us that do not have his skill set.  

Hello all,

Here are my favourite things not in order: Air(breathing) Food (See food and eat it diet) Beer (See Beer and drink it diet)  POSER! (I think this would be No 1 !!!) been using it since version 4 (posette is still cute!)

I am waiting patiently for the new version ( a Pro user) and appreciate the sneak peek, it looks excitingly promising. I have been saving for a system that would run the octane plug in with justice, but maybe don't need to go that high anymore, anyway, new system budget will come in about the time new Poser arrives (no date yet, but that is my budget)

Saved at least five hundred lately as DAZ models recently are not POSER usable anymore that I can tell, so the money is put into savings for new system and new POSER .Plus this has inspired to learn some modelling for myself and I also love to "kit bash" a lot of content to the nth degree to get the look I am after. New system,New POSER.....have I stopped drooling yet?

I hope superfly will be as quick as firefly, I have my scenes and settings tweeked to be as fast as possible, that is why I originally want to go with octane, as my experiments with it were awesome, just did not have a NVidia card to do appropriately sized and detailed images-texture adjustments were easy, that is why octane is a benchmark for me personally, I look at many artists work with iray and vray and such, and find them ( the rendering engines that is) not quite there. Reality(luxrender) is very user friendly and good results, but way to slow for my requirements(hopefully its coming update will change this) . Firefly is still very usable, I am very influenced by the work of Erogenisis on deviantart and renderotica, the most realistic renders out of firefly ever I would say, it just comes down to a lot of work on materials and lighting. To paraphrase his own words about new Poser, I would feel like a god with PBR rendering integrated into the Poser workflow. 

Sorry I had a little DAZ bash, but given the current circumstances I had to say it.(just my opinion, don't reply or loose sleep over it). Maybe Smith Micro are building full Daz usability into this new version-it would make marketing(dollars) sense for both companies to work together on this. I believe this would be beneficial for them, and all content creators, and the positive flow on to this is happy artists and customers like us, there  is no need to split the market in half.

Thank you Smith Micro for a great program and I am sure it will get ever better, I am patient like I said, but a few more sneek peeks would be nice, pretty please.....

Cheers

Hi Maldowns! I too started using Poser back at version 4 and am a Pro user. It is exciting getting a new system AND a new Poser! New toys/tools are always fun and exciting to look forward too! I also would love to see some more sneak peeks of what is to come! Anticipation is keeping us waiting :)

That's what I'm looking forward to (updated content creations tool's)

I'm looking forward to, the updated content conversion tools! I'm not familiar with Cycles, does it have an interactive mode like Iray?

Yes, Dreamin'Girl. You are right.  When the bans start getting handed out like samples to kids in a candy store, this behavior will stop. 

All I can say to the problem folks is this: I warned you!

Please start!!  I hadn't checked this thread in a few days, and sadly, I haven't missed a darn thing of substance except Teyon saying that a sneak peak of content creation tools wasn't possible now, but might be forthcoming.  Practically everything else was unrelated stuff.  At least 3/4 of the posts in this thread (including this one!!!) ought to be deleted... >:(

I'm not familiar with Cycles, does it have an interactive mode like Iray?

Nevermind, I looked up a bit more about cycles. Looks like interactivity will have to wait till GPU support is added.

Nevermind, I looked up a bit more about cycles. Looks like interactivity will have to wait till GPU support is added.

You should have looked better. Anyway, SuperFly is not Cycles and therefore the argument is off topic.

I'm already seeing less "heads up" notices on this page, so thanks for stepping in.

teyon, please post more human skin/hair renders if possible.  my apologies for the bickering.

( I'm looking forward to, the updated content conversion tools! )

To convert which content into what ?

 

Please keep this thread positive and on-topic. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion and are only looking to spread negativity then just don't post.

You can express your opinion in a positive manner without making disparaging remarks about users or companies.

Poser 11 should be an exciting new upgrade for everyone that uses Poser and our goal is to make this forum a more productive place for everyone involved. 

I found this a couple of days ago and thought is was rather interesting, and can give you a great idea regarding what Cycles can do for architectural/still life type renders. The author uses cycles almost exclusively in GPU mode, but since all the features available in GPU are also available for CPU, I thought some people here might be interested.

http://www.chocofur.com/cycles-in-production.html

I still wish GPU was going to be included in "Superfly" (nudge, nudge) - but that's life, and definitely better than no PBR at all 

Edit to add the link 

Thanks for the link, I'm still calling it Cycles but I meant Superfly, 

I want to applaud all members who have made the effort to return and keep this thread on topic. We are working on making the forum more positive and enjoyable, your contribution is valued.

Boni

I don't do a lot of outdoor scenes but I'll see if I can squeeze one in over the week or this weekend. Meanwhile...

Looks Great!!

I will go through the thread tomorrow and see what I can do ... and things are changing. Our forum will be friendlier. 

Boni

Thanks for the latest render Teyon, that looks great and I get more excited about SuperFly with each render up upload.

Wow, Teyon, that looks fantastic!  Woods are such a hard thing to get to look natural.  Can't wait to see your outdoor renders. :)

Request for future Poser ... Yes, having yet again had to download a new version of Flash, today, due to a "Blocked plug-in" blanking out my Libraries ...

Please get rid of dependance on Flash.

"Nevermind, I looked up a bit more about cycles. Looks like interactivity will have to wait till GPU support is added."

Hi I am not sure what you "Looked up"

But the Blender Version of Cycles will interactively render in CPU only mode if you set the viewport Display to "rendered"

I cant speak about  the poser 11 "superfly"
and will defer to teyon and others

I don't do a lot of outdoor scenes but I'll see if I can squeeze one in over the week or this weekend. Meanwhile...

Fantastic Render! This looks so real! I love this wood texture..great job! :)

"I don't do a lot of outdoor scenes but I'll see if I can squeeze one in over the week or this weekend. Meanwhile...

Again  Nice wood texture....... but nothing we have not seen in the last five years with firefly.

IMHO if you truly wish to showcase the advantages of your new internal PBR you should 

include outdoor ,daylight renders with HDRI/IBL

light sources.

These" inside a black empty poser universe" renders with point lights do very little to convince users that this will be a major step forward.

I understand that the majority are "portrait makers"

so do some outside "portrait" shots.

Attached is a little quicky preview render from Blender 2.7 of Syyd raven 's "vanilla Sky" texture on the G2 Female.

Lit using the FREE Smart IBL standalone UI from HDRlabs.

Cycles looks as good as Vray , Mental Ray,Maxwell,LUX, IRay.

Can you at least post an actual poser figure with a decent skin & IBL out in broad daylight so people can see how much better cycles is than the old firefly that  it is presumably replacing???

 ............. the FREE Smart IBL manager for Blender cycles

Thanks for the render, Teyon. The wood looks real, you got the weather worn  look down.  I would like to see an outdoor render too. :)

I don't do a lot of outdoor scenes but I'll see if I can squeeze one in over the week or this weekend. Meanwhile...

This looks fantastic!

I'd like to formally bicker about the bickering about complaining. Lol.

On topic, those wood textures are indeed very very nice. That's all procedural? Still not quite sure how pbr materials work although it seems to be all the rage, everywhere. Roughness and Metalness apparently, are these new nodes in Poser?

Request for future Poser ... Yes, having yet again had to download a new version of Flash, today, due to a "Blocked plug-in" blanking out my Libraries ...

Please get rid of dependance on Flash.

I am curious. I used to have this kind of problem with pp12, but I have never had this problem with Poser 10 or PP14? What version are  you using?