she got an email from one of the admin marketplace staff, i think the manager or one of the marketplace staff. I don't know the names of everyone. stating they were out of the office part of yesterday and today and would get fully informed later today so someone is either lying or being purposely misleading

anyone reading this thread can pretty much understand why

hopeandlove posted at 10:59AM Fri, 19 February 2016 - #4256067

Her link was removed right before I posted it.

And, just to let you all know - since vendors are supposed to represent our community, they're held accountable for a bit more. We have a Vendor code of conduct, and she's broken that, so that's why all of this took place. This wasn't the first time she broke the rules. Thanks, everyone.

Those rules are not conductive to business, esp. the competition. DAZ especially, which handles PAs with kid gloves on the forums (this is a degree of leniency which I do NOT agree with however-- typically PAs just get a topic closure or no-actioned for things that would get non-PA posts deleted) Basic rule of commerce-- ESPECIALLY community-based commerce like Rendo and DAZ is that you do NOT piss off your vendors. This is not Amazon or Ebay, so an argument that "this is what other businesses do" does not fly.
I feel like a broken record here, but you would do well to look at your competition. DAZ treats their vendors with much more respect, and go way overboard in doing so. Rendo seems to fall on the opposite end, when they should be finding a happy medium between the two (I'm usually greatly opposed to double standards, but there's a huge difference between a double-standard of not deleting PA posts and a double standard of not banning PAs for forum misbehavior.
You know, I'm tempted to make a separate topic solely to repeat so many of the things I've said here, because it seems like the admins here just ignore it-- a non-hostile one unlike my posts in this and other threads, that simply lay out the facts such as the various reasons why someone would upload off-site then link to it here or in the freestuff section (there are SIX reasons for why they would do this, and possibly more)

she got an email from one of the admin marketplace staff, i think the manager or one of the marketplace staff. I don't know the names of everyone. stating they were out of the office part of yesterday and today and would get fully informed later today so someone is either lying or being purposely misleading anyone reading this thread can pretty much understand why

I don't understand what you mean, could you please clarify? Got an email from the marketplace admins about what? Get fully informed about what? Who is lying or being purposefully misleading?

she emailed a staff member and that person is either the marketplace mgr or something. They are in charge of a variety of market stuff. She wanted her sales records and her owed monies. She was told by that person that they had been gone most of yesterday and today and that they (the staff member) would get fully informed about what was going on.

So either it was not a staff decision that included the market staff or it was. I just think it's wrong because I know what she has been trying to do in the background and I know there was stuff she was doing that she was under an nda and couldn't talk about. I know that she did it with no pay for months because her husband kept telling her to let it go but she wanted the site to do well and that was part of why she stayed exclusive here because she genuinely wanted to help. She thought if she left that it would be seen as abandoning ship and that rendo needed exclusive vendors. I told her that her loyalty to rendo was never going to be returned and I am mad that I was right.

Well, if the treatment of 3DArena isn't a reason for me to delete my freebies and never come back, I don't know what is. I LOVE this site. Well, I have love for it. Like an old friend that you spent all of your time with, but grew apart due to life just being what it is. After working here for the better part of a decade as a moderator for several forums and managing some of the contests and challenges, I quit. Not because my colleagues sucked, but because there were members that my hands were tied on and harassed me off site (to the point where they were threatening my then newborn child and sending me photos of my previous residence).

Here's one piece of advice that I repeated to members over and over for years, and, Hope, I feel like you need it right now.

Criticism isn't a personal attack. And if you take every criticism as a personal attack, you will never grow and stagnate as a person. You will never be better than you are right now, and the point of being a human is to become a better version of who you are over time. If you don't, what's the point? So, maybe take a look at how you reacted to not just the initial post 3DArena made (unless they upgraded the software so you can't see the post anymore. I know that, when I worked here, if we deleted a post we could still see it), and take your name out and put someone else's name there. Someone maybe you don't get along with. Re-read it. See if you'd have accepted it if they reacted the same way. If you're honest with yourself, you probably wouldn't. And that's the thing. When you work with artists, of any kind, you learn that opinions are more plentiful than dandelion fluff, and you learn to read people. When you manage a community (that's your title, after all), part of your job is getting to learn personalities and nuances. Critical thinking is a HUGE part of the job, and so is taking verbal abuse. If you can't handle it, maybe this isn't the best job for you. I know it wasn't worth it for me, in the end. I've kept the friends I had, and moved on without the rest, and am better for it.

So, you can see what I've written here, take it as a personal attack, and ban me or whatever you want to do, but the truth is, treating vendors and customers like this is why people are leaving in large numbers and don't come back. And, those that do come back don't spend here, because they're treated terribly by other site members and staff alike.

This used to be home for a lot of us. Now...it's like driving back to your old neighborhood, only to find that they bulldozed your house and put up a convenience store. :/

I'd give ya an ovation Jen, but it seems whenever I applaud shit gets deleted. So I guess you'll hafta settle fer a "Well said" :)

hopeandlove posted at 2:13PM Fri, 19 February 2016 - #4256047

Hi everyone-

I know that I am the Community Manager, but these decisions aren't just made by me, they're decided by the Renderosity staff as a whole. So, please stop saying it is just me who is enforcing this, it's all of us.

Lastly, personal attacks are NOT okay and you guys didn't see it, but 3-darena's last comment was a personal attack on staff (me) as well as the first one she wrote. There's a difference between "bashing the policy" and "bashing someone's character." For personal attacks, we have no choice but to lock it and send that member a warning.

Actually I did see it before she deleted it so did several others it was responded to and the response is still in the thread hanging like a loose chad in the wind, I have a copy of it and it was not a personal attack. I saw all of her posts as well as many others that are now gone, all agreeing with her. It's not just you Hope, it's the whole range of things starting with the site redesign to the dismantling of the Prime Club. Again, the way it was done, telling the community at large that it was essentially the vendors ideas to do so, which was quickly discounted by the vendors.

It's a lot of things, it's not being listened to, it's being told "okay if you don't agree, sure go ahead and leave we don't care" posts and attitude. Renderosity wants their community feel back? Then how about listening to the community, the vendors that make the money to run this place and the membership and customers who pay the vendors to run this place? Would be a good way to start. What will all of you do for jobs, when there is nothing left but skeletal remains of a community? Don't say it can't happen, I've seen it happen to other places. There are other venues they can sell with and their customers will follow them.

Presentation is everything when communicating with a myriad of personalities.

Just wanted to get both sides out there.

Well said Jeni

Thank you for your post, Jen. I'd forgotten that Renderosity staff could show wisdom, and now you and Doug (BasicWiz) have both reminded me, all in one day! Kudos to you.

The last time she had her store closed for disagreeing with some aspects of prime. Her concerns on that were exactly what the store later said was the problem. She did so in a private forum back then as her warning yesterday stated she was supposed to do. She was never ever warned that time, nor was she banned they just closed her store without warning for pointing out that if they did prime as planned it was going to be a problem in a few years. She was brought back by previous administration who agreed she should never have had her store closed in the first place. It wasn't a case of previously breaking the rules when the later admin agreed she didn't do so.

I just think it's wrong because I know what she has been trying to do in the background and I know there was stuff she was doing that she was under an nda and couldn't talk about. I know that she did it with no pay for months because her husband kept telling her to let it go but she wanted the site to do well and that was part of why she stayed exclusive here because she genuinely wanted to help. She thought if she left that it would be seen as abandoning ship and that rendo needed exclusive vendors. I told her that her loyalty to rendo was never going to be returned and I am mad that I was right.

So where's Shawn's store??? She definitely didn't ask for it to be closed. There were no personal attacks. Stating the numerous issues that 99% of this "community" have with our "authority figures" isn't a personal attack, it's fact.

Her 2nd post that you take as a personal attack was simply to address your statement of being an authority and your statement about experience over age concerning the fb page you are in charge of.

Actually I did see it before she deleted it so did several others it was responded to and the response is still in the thread hanging like a loose chad in the wind, I have a copy of it and it was not a personal attack. I saw all of her posts as well as many others that are now gone, all agreeing with her.

OK, I read 3D-Arena's comments, and visited her store earlier in the day. I found it honest and not out of line. Did you seriously ban a respected vendor and delete her store for simply disagreeing with you? Really?

So in other words, Renderosity closed the store of one of its top exclusive vendors for rocking the boat, and are now giving a false narrative about why they did so. Wow. Just wow. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

P3D-Art posted at 3:39PM Fri, 19 February 2016 - #4255993

@Lobo3433 .. I know testers and such are volunteers but stil it has a responsability that we count on since the testers give it a go of approval if I understand well ..

According to the The testers are to make sure the download that are posted to the Renderosity site are with in compliance to the TOS .. Now again if one of the testers are testing a new upload I assume they have to click on the download link to see if it actualy works .. So when clicking on the link you could be refered as you mentioned to f.e. a porn site .. then it should be one of the tasks as a part of the testing process to let Rendo know and question if it is wise to approve from showcasing or not .. As part of a preventive action to keep Rendo clean ..

Does this makes sense explaining in my wonderful English ..??

Yes we do check for the items that are uploaded to the Renderosity site items that are posted in the FreeStuff forum with external links to other sites to down load are not checked by us we are only required to test what is uploaded to our servers. We can only approve the items on our servers so if a download is on another site we have no control on what is in that zip file. That is why we are stressing that FreeStuff items be uploaded to Renderosity you are allowed to up load as much as you like 200mb per item but only one item approved every 24 hours. But if an item is uploaded to CG share for instance then no we will not check it's validity or content. Everything that is available on the Freestuff section of the site is checked what might be posted in Freestuff forum with external links is not tested since those are individual post being made by members and if they use an external link for their item then it does not go thru our process I hope that better explains why the the new Policy is in effect

Malysse posted at 3:04PM Fri, 19 February 2016 - #4256122

Thank you for your post, Jen. I'd forgotten that Renderosity staff could show wisdom, and now you and Doug (BasicWiz) have both reminded me, all in one day! Kudos to you.

There is a post from Jen?

Wow. Just have to say that if the Prime catastrophe and lately allotment of Gen3 content over any other figure didn't already push me away from purchasing from Renderosity, then this (banning a vendor for speaking her mind, and not one personal attack have I seen, and I have seen Shawn's posts) definitely would. Renderosity has been going downhill for a while. I used to buy so much here, getting the Render Rewards many times over the course of a year. Now, I only visit the site to upload to my gallery. And then I'll browse the store for a few minutes...only to find mostly G3 content that I cannot use (being a Poser-only user) and a lot of poor quality "other stuff".

Since the changes, Prime is a joke. I used to put back $12-$16 a month just to get a few Prime items off my wishlist. Back when all Prime products were $3.99. Now, I don't bother. I don't consider anything above $5 a "Prime" product, so don't bother spending the money, unless it's a quality product by a well-known vendor whom I follow. I kept my membership to see if Prime was ever going to return to it's glory days. So far, it hasn't. If it doesn't change back to what it was before by the time my membership expires, I won't be renewing. It's now become a waste of my money.

On top of all the bad changes Renderosity just keeps implementing is this one...no offsite links for fear their precious community might get a virus (as if we're all noobs on the internet and have no idea that a link, ANY link, can potentially be harmful)...and of course, for fear of losing a few bucks to another company. Well, when you have people already not spending because of the content that's available (or not available, as the case may be), and a mass exodus because the head honchos cannot figure out why their site is sinking and just keep implementing bad idea after bad idea, losing a few bucks to competition should be the least of worries.

And THEN, to ban a respected vendor because she spoke up about what is certainly NOT working to keep this site afloat...shakes head. Where is the Renderosity I loved back in the day? Sadly, it's all but sunk into the depths. And if the managers/admins cannot see this ship has pretty much sunk and start listening to the community they pledged to, there's no saving it.

Hi everyone - While I appreciate your comments, opinion and feedback, I have to close this thread because at this point, we're getting way off-topic. I thank you again for your input. Please do reach out if you have any questions/concerns or need anything. Thank you again.