I'm guessing the answer is no but I thought I'd ask anyhow. Specifically, from V4 to PEOne, or even the other way round. Now, I can do it the hard way but tbh, it's a royal pain in the hind end so if there's a shortcut - or a series of shortcuts - that'd be great.

It isn't perfect, but if you save your pose as a universal pose it is much easier to share poses between figures. When you have you pose tweaked to the new figure, save to that figure.

Boni posted at 4:02AM Tue, 31 December 2019 - #4375035

It isn't perfect, but if you save your pose as a universal pose it is much easier to share poses between figures. When you have you pose tweaked to the new figure, save to that figure.

How'd I do that? I've seen Universal Poses in the library but never used or tried to create 'em.

The days of Poser Puppet is all gone, I'm afraid. However, Nagra_00_ created Poseconverter for Poser to convert V4 poses to PE and GND Anastasia (Alyson2). It can do single or batched files and copy the thumbnails to a new folder, very convenient and works well. It can be found here in the free stuff section: https://www.renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/poseconverter-data-update-v04-for-pe/80991. It's too bad that the script hasn't been updated to other models like Dawn and La Femme, even some of the older models like Miki 4, Roxy, etc.

Universal Pose script does not work correctly with all poses because the majority are not saved properly to the library. I believe it has something to do with resetting the hip translation to 0 after the pose is created. Not quite sure, I will need to go back and look at that information to be certain.

Contrary to most other figures, the hip bone of PE is not vertical. Y-rotations of the hip therefore result in tilting the figure. Best zero the hip y_rotation and rotate the figure with the body dial instead. This does not solve the whole issue but is is a first step.

Universal poses, and all pose conversion between different figure type suffer from the conceptual problems of how to deal with differing limb proportions.

If you imagine a bent knee pose on a figure with a short shin and a long thigh, what are the parameter references you will use to define the pose? Just the joint rotations? The joint rotations AND the origins and endpoints of each limb as a whole, or the joint rotations, origins and endpoints of each actor within that limb?

Now imagine applying that pose to a figure with a long shin and a short thigh, but the same overall leg length. What are your criteria for the pose to match? Just the joint rotations? The short thigh will have the knee at its endpoint in a different position to the first figure, so if the shin bend is the same angle as the first figure, the shins will be parallel, but the foot at the shin's endpoint will be in a different position to the first figure. Does that mean the poses are a match or not? If you want the limb endpoints to correspond, it can probably be done, but the second figure's joint angles will need to be different to put the foot in the same place as the first figure.

For figures with more or less the same proportions, but different zeroed joint angles, simple additions to angles can be a useful adjustment. Some figures have hands laid out differently, with the thumb either parallel to the fingers, or out at right angles (or some other angle). If their joint rotation orders are different, then matrix conversions need to be applied to swap axial rotations to match.

Every such circumstance of meaningful difference between a pair of figures needs to be treated appropriately, and the pose match criteria explicitly specified or know to achieve an approximate match of poses. That is all conceptually possible, but the simplest solutions may not give the required results, if different figures have to interact with props scaled to match a particular figure. Can a child sit on an adult seat with their feet on the ground? Perhaps not.

The other problem with saved poses, that @hborre alludes to is that the pose only refers to the figure geometry name. The pose does not detail the joint configurations stored in the figure's CR2 file, nor does the geometry OBJ file. Using a reference figure as an intermediary requires joint comparisons between the source figure and the reference figure, and then again between the reference figure and the figure the universal pose will be applied to. Unfortunately, none of the criteria for those translations (meaning joint angle conversions, not axial displacements) are documented anywhere, so the results are unpredictable and cannot be adjusted in any case. Change the scaling of limbs on your target figure and who knows whether that will modify the applied universal pose?

I have no criticism for any of the scripts which attempt to convert poses between figures. I've written some myself and they served a need at the time, but they're not a perfect solution unless they allow the user to specify what kind of matching the converted pose must adhere to and be able to analyse any new figure presented and act appropriately when converting poses to or from that figure.

To convert V4 to PE you can use my Poseconverter available in my free stuff here at Rendo. Its not perfect but comes close and does take care of the above mentioned hip bone translation. I had plans to add conversions for more figures but fine tuning the translation between figures is an extremly time consuming task…

Sam, I really have to ask: why do we have to automate everything in order to enjoy using this program? I mean, yes, apply the pose, then tweak it to make it work for the character mesh of choice — that's part of the fun of working with this stuff, IMHO. And at the end of it, you may find you've created something even better along the way.

why do we have to automate everything in order to enjoy using this program?

Fine tuning will always remain, but because the hip is in the very root differences there result in gross differences all over. Compensating for those differences via a script gives you at least a decent starting point to play, adjusting arm and hand positions etc.

This being said, LaFemmee takes Victoria3 poses very well. I did dig up some old pose sets by Schlabber and found they needed very few adjustments.

Thanks for all the replies, folks.

@ SeanMartin - I love creating poses from scratch and, given time, that's what I'd do. Unfortunately, I have limited time to spend faffing around with Poser, there are thousands of decent poses already in my Runtime - all of which I'd adjust anyhow - and I'd like to be able to get this done before the nail down the lid and throw me on the bonfire.

Nagra_00_ posted at 4:51PM Tue, 31 December 2019 - #4375048

To convert V4 to PE you can use my Poseconverter available in my free stuff here at Rendo. Its not perfect but comes close and does take care of the above mentioned hip bone translation. I had plans to add conversions for more figures but fine tuning the translation between figures is an extremly time consuming task…

Thank you! I'll give it a shot.

about 100 years ago (hah) someone posted a way of tweaking poses using Microsoft Excel and entering the various limb values. I have searched for that info at least 25 times already because I wanted to try this: If you can tweak an individual figures pose why couldn't you extrapolate that to a different figure? Its probably useless unless someone has that original post and I can't find it :(

movida posted at 7:34PM Tue, 31 December 2019 - #4375122

about 100 years ago (hah) someone posted a way of tweaking poses using Microsoft Excel and entering the various limb values. I have searched for that info at least 25 times already because I wanted to try this: If you can tweak an individual figures pose why couldn't you extrapolate that to a different figure? Its probably useless unless someone has that original post and I can't find it :(

I can think of at least one reason why it wouldn't be an ideal solution: There's no set way of rigging a figure. Think of the old DAZ models which had a Buttocks joint, then later other figures across the different makers have added extra bits here and there. Simple limb corrections are potentially easy but a straightforward conversion wouldn't be possible. Even so, it'd probably be a good starting point.

what she did was just plug in and finesse the numbers. It wasn't a direct transfer from one model to another. She was working with the same model. I wanted to play with it and see if there was a way to use the values as a base. I can't find the post though so it's irrelevant - one of those instances in life where you think "I should save that" and rt storms in and then you forget :)

Genesis 2 poses seem to work well with every figure I use other than V4 and M4, so they’re sort of universal.

@ Nagra_00_

Your Pose Convertor works very well on PE One. I've converted a load of V4 poses, and so far they all look extremely good. Thank you for creating this; I hope you add to it, and maybe allow conversion from V3 to other models.

Nagra_00_ posted at 10:19PM Fri, 03 January 2020 - #4375048

To convert V4 to PE you can use my Poseconverter available in my free stuff here at Rendo. …

Just downloaded it and found it works ike a charm for PE.

Thanks!

Just converted several poses for GND A4, and they all work well, too.

Once again, many thanks.

You are welcome, just don’t hold your breath for support of other figures. It’s way too time consuming as everything has to be done manually. If somebody knows about some useful scripts that could help in creating values for the transformation matrixes per joint, i would give it another try.

Fair point. In any case, what you achieved is pretty damn spectacular.