Nvidia announces new RTX 4000 series graphic cards. These cards look awesome with a hefty price tag to boot.

"Nvidia RTX 4080 16GB and 12GB have starting prices of $1199* and $899*, respectively" *USD

"the RTX 4090 is between 2x and 4x faster than RTX 3090 Ti,"

"The Nvidia RTX 4090 will feature 24GB GDDR6X memory, while the RTX 4080 will be available in two different flavours: 16GB GDDR6X and 12GB GDDR6X."

"the RTX 4090 is between 2x and 4x faster than RTX 3090 Ti,"

I would suggest you look at the fine print - the 2x to 4x (MS Flight Sim only) claims are based on using DLSS 3.0 - Poser doesn't use DLSS.  In rasterization, there is very little improvement, based on their own slides.  Nvidia pulled the same stunt moving from the 20 series of cards to the 30 series.  The actual uplift was less than 50%, not 200% - 300%.

Oh, and that "RTX 4080 12Gb model"? - you might want to look at it's actual specs - it is a completely different die, and it's performance when not using DLSS is less than an RTX 3080.  It is an RTX 4070.  Nvidia realizes that if they told their gaming base that a 70 series card is now 900USD, there would be riots at Nvidia's HQ.

If you want to spend 900USD - get an RTX 3090 - they are selling at the same price as the faux 4080, and will be much better for rendering.  The 3090 has twice the ram (24Gb), 33% more CUDA cores (which is what we care about.  3090 - 10496 CUDA cores.  Faux 4080 - 7680 CUDA cores).  The 3090 also has twice the bandwidth.

If you are getting a 4090 (FE are triple expansion cards, so you need to factor that in) don't forget to budget for both a new Power Supply (450 watt board power means you will probably want a 1000 watt PSU to deal with transients) and check your wiring in the house (USA only); you will be pulling right at what the circuit breaker can handle.  Ask me how I know.....

The good news is that if you have a 20 or 30 series card - Poser will use multiple GPUs for rendering.  I asked about this and the Poser team said that adding a 2nd card for rendering cut render times by 30% in their tests.  You can get a pair of 2060 (12Gb) for about 600USD

In the next month or so, there are going to be literally thousands of 30 series cards popping up on ebay since Etherum has finally moved to PoS.

In addition - most AIBs are sitting on literally months worth of 30 series cards.  EVGA is exiting the GPU business, but according to their CEO, they are sitting on about a year's worth of 30 series cards

I am looking to get 2 RTX 3080 (12Gb) for my next system (1 new, 1 used).

Okay that's pretty interesting.. but this is the Daz Studio forum.

It seems like for most of this you're comparing a top of the range 3000 series with a mid range 4000 series. If you look at the bottom you can draw a direct comparison between a 3090 and a 4090.

I am sure dual 3080 would be awesome too.

The usual sneaky marketing psychology from Nvidia. The 12GB 4080 (has that lower spec. AD104 core) it really should be called a 4070 but Nvidia know they can charge $300 extra if they call it a 4080!

prixat posted at 1:37 AM Thu, 22 September 2022 - #4445007

The usual sneaky marketing psychology from Nvidia. The 12GB 4080 (has that lower spec. AD104 core) it really should be called a 4070 but Nvidia know they can charge $300 extra if they call it a 4080!

Yeah I did see some talk about that, I just noticed the graph above lists both 4080s with the 103.

Found a confirmation note regarding the different chipsets, quite a big difference. Here are the specs:

Razor42 posted at 1:05 AM Thu, 22 September 2022 - #4445005

Okay that's pretty interesting.. but this is the Daz Studio forum.

It seems like for most of this you're comparing a top of the range 3000 series with a mid range 4000 series. If you look at the bottom you can draw a direct comparison between a 3090 and a 4090.

I am sure dual 3080 would be awesome too.

Does Daz Studio use DLSS?  If it doesn't, then the performance gains (that are almost entirely based on DLSS) are irrelevant.  CUDA cores do matter, and that mislabeled 4070 has less than half of the 4090 CUDA corse - but it isn't half the price.

The 1st comparison between the 3090 and the 4090 is the price.  New 3090s can be had for 900USD (used will be less in about 60 days) - a 4090 will start at 1599USD (FE); AIB boards will be around 2,000USD. 

A 4090 isn't going to be twice as good as a 3090 - Nvidia's own slides show that almost all of the performance is based on DLSS. 

The 4090 Ti will have a board power of 660 watts, not 800 watts - and it will need a 1600 watt PSU.

I am comparing the 3090 with the faux 4080 because they have the same price - they won't have the same performance - between the ram, the cuda cores, and the bandwith, the 3090 is a much better deal.

Poser can use dual GPUs, which is why I am looking at going that route (along with a beefier power supply).

LOL, that table still has AD104 and AD103 cores the wrong way round!

ssgbryan posted at 2:24 AM Thu, 22 September 2022 - #4445010

Razor42 posted at 1:05 AM Thu, 22 September 2022 - #4445005

Okay that's pretty interesting.. but this is the Daz Studio forum.

It seems like for most of this you're comparing a top of the range 3000 series with a mid range 4000 series. If you look at the bottom you can draw a direct comparison between a 3090 and a 4090.

I am sure dual 3080 would be awesome too.

Does Daz Studio use DLSS?  If it doesn't, then the performance gains (that are almost entirely based on DLSS) are irrelevant.  CUDA cores do matter, and that mislabeled 4070 has less than half of the 4090 CUDA corse - but it isn't half the price.

The 1st comparison between the 3090 and the 4090 is the price.  New 3090s can be had for 900USD (used will be less in about 60 days) - a 4090 will start at 1599USD (FE); AIB boards will be around 2,000USD. 

A 4090 isn't going to be twice as good as a 3090 - Nvidia's own slides show that almost all of the performance is based on DLSS. 

The 4090 Ti will have a board power of 660 watts, not 800 watts - and it will need a 1600 watt PSU.

I am comparing the 3090 with the faux 4080 because they have the same price - they won't have the same performance - between the ram, the cuda cores, and the bandwith, the 3090 is a much better deal.

Poser can use dual GPUs, which is why I am looking at them (along with a beefier power supply).

I am not sure but as far as I know DLSS isn't currently supported by DS Iray, but who knows what's around the corner. I wouldn't buy it on the notion that it would be implemented anytime soon though. From the stats I can see there does seems to be a fair increase in Cuda cores, clock speeds and l2 cache between a 3090 and 4090. But you're right, it's hard to say if that increase justifies the price tags and power reqs of these newer cards. Especially with the changes in the Crypto arena affecting the second hand market.

The initial versions of Iray did use DLSS in the (now removed) 'Realtime' mode.

But the new DLSS 3.0 is very different. It has a frame creation/insertion mode, not just the old resolution scaling of the previous DLSS. That's good for gaming, not much use for rendering.

Improved Tensor cores will make a difference in the Nvidia Denoiser.

prixat posted at 2:44 AM Thu, 22 September 2022 - #4445015

The initial versions of Iray did use DLSS in the (now removed) 'Realtime' mode.

But the new DLSS 3.0 is very different. It has a frame creation/insertion mode, not just the old resolution scaling of the previous DLSS. That's good for gaming, not much use for rendering.

Improved Tensor cores will make a difference in the Nvidia Denoiser.

Interesting. I wonder if it could somehow be implemented in the Iray render setting for the viewport, to increase speeds when the camera or an item is moved.

Information on board partner 4090s is now available.  It is clear why EVGA (which had 40% of the North American market) got out of the GPU business.

4090s are 4 slot cards if air-cooled; one by Zotac is a 5 slot design.  They are coming with supports to hold the cards up so they don't bend the PCIe slot.

I can't see people buying these in mass.  The 3090's will give a better price to performance ratio.  Nvidia has overbought on TSMCs 4nm process and TSMC isn't letting Nvidia cancel their orders.  There is going to be a mountain of 30 series of cards (most board partners are sitting on up to a year's worth of 30 series cards) and an over supply of 40 series chips.  I suspect that most of the 40 series chips will end up in data center products rather than gaming cards.

If you want a 40 series you also need to get one of the newer ATX 3.0 PSU, they have the ability to "talk" with the GPU to control it's power draw, or you'll end up with a desk fire rather than a PC

No doubt, the Nvidia RTX 4000 series GPUs are making some serious waves in the gaming world! The RTX 4080 and 4090 are packing a punch, but it's true. They come with a hefty price tag.I mean, the RTX 4090's 2x to 4x boost over the 3090 Ti is seriously impressive, especially for those who crave top-notch gaming performance. And that 24GB GDDR6X memory is like a dream come true for gamers who want to max out settings without breaking a sweat.If you're patient and keep your eyes peeled, you might just stumble upon RTX 4090 at a good price.No doubt, the Nvidia RTX 4000 series GPUs are making some serious waves in the gaming world! The RTX 4080 and 4090 are packing a punch, but it's true. They come with a hefty price tag.I mean, the RTX 4090's 2x to 4x boost over the 3090 Ti is seriously impressive, especially for those who crave top-notch gaming performance. And that 24GB GDDR6X memory is like a dream come true for gamers who want to max out settings without breaking a sweat.If you're patient and keep your eyes peeled, you might just stumble upon RTX 4090 at a good price.