I have Photoshop 5 and Paint Shop Pro 6 and want to use these programs to develop art with paint-like effects. On other forums, however, I've been told that I need Painter to truly do this. My question is, surely with Photoshop's brushes, masks, filters, tools, etc. I could achieve the same "painter" detail without having to buy another program like MetaCreation's Painter ... right ? Or, am I missing something here -- does Painter offer something that I cannot achieve within the realm of PhotoShop alone ? Thanks for your help - Ken

I do paint like images using Photoshop and paint shop. The only tools I use are the brushes, primarily the airbrush, and the smudge tool to blend. I've tried painter, and while it does some nice things, it doesn't give me the paint like effects I want and the method of picking colors is a pain in the ass. You can do it in photoshop, and while I'm not crazy about the brush choices in Paint Shop, you can do it there as well.

Thanks, bonestructure ... I thought so. So many folks out there want to get our hard-earned cash on apps that are more hype than useful. I appreciate your reply - Ken

well, I love ps, for airbrush looks, but if I want to paint with a brush, it is Painter for me. Pastels, Charcoal, Watercolors (with bleed and shore marks), oil paint, markers, impasto oils, are incredible. Also, the lighting of the 3d brushstrokes, so the peaks get a little highlight, and the valleys get a touch of shaddow, I just cannot get ps to do that sort of thing.

Ken: I use Photoshop for everything. I have painter too, but I like Bonestructure, hate certain elements of it. I really could never get used to the program. Pam: Try the dodge, burn, and saturation tools. I use them all the time to add highlight and shadows. -Trav

Painter is a toy, and a user unfriendly toy at that. It simply isn't precise enough for me to do anything useful with. The only thing I use it for at all are a few of the special effects filters it offers. I find it extremely user unfriendly.

same here.

To each their own. Painter sings to me, and I would not willingly do without it. This is an old argument. If it doesn't sing for you, then don't use it.

I agree, Painter is definitly unfriendly (I still can't make a decent mask with it), but you can't beat it for certain things (like making paint strokes look like real paint strokes). If you are using Windows, there's a plugin for PhotoShop that's supposed to do some of what Painter does -- it's called "Deep Paint" by Right Hemisphere and costs $219. It will also work as a stand alone application. I have no idea of whether or not it lives up to it's promises as I use a Mac. -Jim

I was just popping thru and I Have to say that Painter 6 rocks! I use Photoshop and Painter equally. It's image hoses are superior to anything on the market. The pattern pens are incredibly useful. Photoshop has nothing like its FX brushes native to the program. A toy??? Not likely. Since Painter 6 transformed the way it handles layers to match Photoshops it has become the Perfect complementary program to Photoshop itself. Like you Jim I find Painters mask system confusing and retreat to Photoshop for that kind of work. But I have to say that I find it no more confusing than when I first took up Photoshop lo these many years ago. But like Pam says.. to each their own. I wouldnt willingly do without it. But I also wouldn't willingly be without Photoshop either. And sings? Yes it sings to me strongly and with a clear voice ;) Tartan

How could you ever paint this in Photoshop? Painter's brushes just work so nicely when you have a tablet, I just couldn't live without them. With Painters's "just add water" you can actually push colors all the way across the screen, something you could never do with PS "smudge" tool. On the other hand Painter reached it's high point in version 2X,the interface sucks, and the newer versions crash. And you would still need PS for everything but the actual brush strokes!

I could paint that quite easily in photoshop. Check the gallery for my pictures basket case or stardancer

Bonestructure- From scratch? No scan, no render, no Poser, no Bryce? Starting from a white screen? I didn't even have a color scanner then.

I have no scanner, no printer, no poser. How could I use bryce in photoshop, Besides, Bryce has no models of cute little kitties in baskets which is the image I recommended you go see lol. I'm not saying painter is a piece of shit or anything. Just that I find it very unfriendly. I do have it, the demo at least. But what you can do with any program is only dependent on how hard you're willing to work at it. If I wanted to spend hours and hours doing it, I suspect I could even duplicate 3D brush strokes. If you like painter and can use it effectively, by all means do so. I would never put anyone down for doing good work. I only answered the question that was asked which was if you NEEDED painter to do a painting on the computer. You don't. You can do it in Photoshop, you can do it in PSP, you can do it in Painter, Illustrator, Corel, whatever. It just all depends on how hard you're willing to work and how much time you're willing to spend on it.

I stumbled across Bonestructure's kitten picture last night and have to say I am impressed. It's quite skillful, looks painted, and skillfully so. It's a good example that the capabilities of the program depend largely on the capabilities of the person using it. I say find the program that you find most comfortable working in, and improve your skillset for that program instead of trying to learn a new program because it has a different toolset.