Quote - Well, you of course read only the negative comments normally. As someone in the registered user forum said very truely. The only truth is on your own system. Means you simply have to try out. what is happening on your own system. And pester technical support when something goes wrong.

I agree, but as of late I have noticed several people have been complaining about their support help when opening a ticket. Lee is only one person and usually the only one to respond. It seems e-on is operating on a shoestring budget and there is no REAL tech help except of course the PAID help. This was not the case before, but the past few months I have noticed a trend on the e-on forums and other sites complaining about questions either going unanswered or only briefly without any real solutions provided.

It would not surprise me to see them bought out by someone like Autodesk since they really don't have a program in that category.

I do not have this problem on my Mac Pro, you can check out my system specs in my signature below. This may not be Vue related but rather Mac related. Have you tried running a program like Tech Tools Pro or Drive Genius to check for sure? If not, I HIGHLY recommend both programs, I use a few of these better ones and find them quite valuable to have at my disposal.

I do know what you mean, I still have an open support ticket with e-on about the cloud layer issue in the "atmosphere editor" I am having and they only said they knew about the render time issues, but not what or when it would be fixed. Also, 7.4 does seem to have several bugs and there is another patch coming soon that is now in Beta as you know. One thing that does seem to be bad is even magazines like 3D World have written about the Mac as gaining wide popularity yet sometimes it takes a while for e-on and others to catch up.

Also, look for version 8 sometime later this year I am told as it is being shown in August at one of the shows. This is a BIG gripe for a lot of people I know in that it seems like e-on (and some others too) dosn't take time to make a ROCK SOLID version and fix everything and tweak what they have before moving on to another version with more features with the same bugs and/or new bugs. I know Mac users were REALLY upset at ZBrush for the way they handled things which was documented in magazines like 3D World. It may be too late for them to win back Mac users as many have found programs like Mudbox to do the job just fine and have better support from a company with more money like Autodesk does.

Let me know if things work out for you and if you have tried those programs to see if it may be something else besides Vue. Most have demos you can try and I would advise that. Otherwise I am at a loss to help.

Quote - I just updated to the new beta update, so it may not be relevant, and I just tested this on a scene that wasn't saved.

That's OK, since it is not the same version build it would not apply. I know e-on has told me they are working on an update for Vue 7.4 so hopefully some bugs get worked out. Thanks anyway.

Quote - No, works fine here, build 42999.

Can you send me a sample file that works for you? Anything is fine, doesn't need to be a full scene, only one that has both "simple" and "mixed" material layers in it. It would help to test because if you have one that works and the same file does not work for me, then something is wrong.

It's possible if it is a bug then it is a combo of things or random, but having a KNOWN good working file on the same Vue version build will help.

If you can send it, drop me a PM here and I will send you my email address for you to send the sample file to.

Thanks.

Quote - I have the same problem.  I have 7.4 infinite, latest actual build (not the new beta that came out today), and XP 64.

Edit:  I actually noticed this the past day or so, as I've been trying to work with the layers again... it's been frustrating to say the least.

Yes, I too am using the latest build of 7.4 42999 and like I said, even though I was not using the Material Editor in much detail prior to version 7.4, I don't recall this problem before. It also does not matter if it is Mac or PC, 32 or 64 bit, as it is the same issue regardless.  They are looking at the sample file I sent them so hopefully they will have an answer or at least something to say regarding possible bugs in 7.4 causing this.

It must be something going on because you and two others I have heard from are having this problem too.

You may also want to look into C4D as well. I have not tried this as I am more focused on static images at this time. From what I have seen briefly of working with it some, it is quite powerful and has an easy workflow and integration like with Vue. I know some of them over there and several have done impressive animations for sure. May not be what you need, but at least worth looking into. Plus, it is free to try.

Quote - Excellent Info thanks a lot. I have not used C4D as yet but may try it soon if I do I will buy some more Ram too. Whats the render engine like compared to Vue? 

In terms of memory, you may want to read this article. Even though it is Mac related, it is a good general read about memory use in general. Keep in mind that even if an application is 32 bit, you will find more RAM useful if there are more applications opened or processes working in the background.

www.interrupt19.com/2009/06/15/os-x-memory-usage-explained/

forums.luxology.com/discussion/topic.aspx

The other article I referenced to show a user of MODO that upgraded RAM found it better as well. There are some good posts in that thread too.

In terms of your C4D question, I am still very much a beginner and could not give you a real firm answer as to which render engine is better. I have played around with it some and found it to be a VERY good program in terms of animating, importing Poser figures with plug-ins, community, etc. The guys over there are GREAT and have even supported both Mac and PC with 64 bit and written their code very well. Personally, I view both Vue and C4D and two totally different applications though. Vue is a superior scene render program and C4D more so for animation and such.

Hope that helps some, best of luck in your work.

Quote - How did you get a copy that last until Windows 7 is released? 

The only Norton Internet Security 2010 beta I found was a 14 day trial? Or did you just mean its in beta until Windows 7 is released?

Cheers
Jon

I am on their press list since I am a Tech writer and my key may be different than the public key because it was supplied from their press department. It should go "gold" shortly before Windows 7 ships. At which time new keys or a new download will be required. So far, works great on Windows 7 RC and it does seem to consume fewer resources from times past.

RE: Anti-Virus software on the PC

The new Norton Internet Security Suite 2010 is now in open Beta until Windows 7 is released. Maximum PC has done a review and found 2009 and now 10 to be VERY much improved over all prior Norton software. They note the fact it takes a LOT less processing for system resources away and is a very secure and good package above the rest. It use to not be the case, but this time Norton is winning people back.

In terms of someone saying once infected it attacks the virus program and not much use this is simply not true. This is a broad and very general statement, but I suggest if you don't know much about security or anti-virus software you refer to sites like Steve Gibson that does "Security Now" and is considered a leading expert in the field. I won't waste time on this as I think it is best to read for yourself the various magazines and experts on this subject for yourself and see just how the software works.

I would not touch a Windows OS without a VERY good anti-virus package and even make sure I have a "clean" install if I do when starting out. But then again, I don't really worry because I am a Mac guy. :)

More RAM will indeed help with several applications, including Vue. It all depends upon what you are doing and what software. Keep in mind it must be a 64 bit application and 64 bit OS like Windows 7 64 or Mac Leopard to take advantage of the full RAM use.

3DWorld did several comparisons on this a while back, I think in 2008 sometime. Software like C4D often took advantage of as much RAM as it can handle. They also did video card roundup and yes, water cooling kits are fantastic for both CPU and video cards. I always use a quality system somewhere around $700-1000 and do some cool UV and liquid coolant colors. Be sure you know what you are doing and read up on this if it is your first time. You don't want to ruin your computer by having a leak or it not installed right and frying something you think is working.

I run several applications on my Mac under both the Mac OS and Windows 7 RC and know that memory does make a BIG difference. But like I said, it depends on the software or what you are doing in that software that matters to the usage. Personally, I would recommend 10-16GB of RAM for any new system where you are doing a lot of graphic or video work with it.

Best of luck.

Quote - I tried some - no scene just added clouds, 640x480 final.
My pleasure to say I have no problems with that. Very similar to Gill's results:
no clouds 11"
Dark Cumulus (spectral 2) 2'38"
Swirly cumulus (volumetric) 12"
Large cummulus 2 (spectral 1) 47"

My computer is a macbooc pro intel core 2 Duo, 2.16 GHz, 3GB memory
ATY,RadeonX1600

I hope they sort it for you - good luck!

Hi,

I will note your results and send to them as I do at the end of the week from other sites as well. If you would not mind, could you do the tutorial link in my first post at "geekatplay.com" and post your render times with that file? That would help because if you see MUCH better speeds than myself on your Macbook then obviously it has to be something funky with my Mac hardware, be it graphics card or otherwise.

Right now I am strongly leaning to the 8800GT being the culprit as I have yet to hear from anyone with that same card, especially on a 2008 Mac Pro. I know there was some issue with NVIDIA in the Mac notebooks but nothing that pointed to Mac Pro graphics cards. We are still trying to narrow it down more but if you have success with your hardware then I will certainly pass that along.

Also, can you confirm the model year of your Macbook and OS version?

Thanks for letting me know, hope it gives us some more clues.

Update -

A problem has been confirmed and it is being looked into as the specific cause. It has to do with HUGE render time discrepancies between the Mac and PC using the same file I sent to e-on, with several causes to investigate.

1. It is affected by both Mac OS 10.5.7 and Windows 7 RC running on Macs.

2. At this time no one has reported with PC hardware and Windows Vista either 32 bit or 64 bit have this render time problem.

3. Since both Mac and Windows 7 OS seem affected it may point to hardware rather than the OS or Vue (unknown though at this time). Otherwise if it was just one or the other OS that would narrow it down more. It may be:

A. The Mac hardware running Windows even in native mode via Boot Camp.

B. The graphics card NVIDIA 8800GT having a defect of some sort.

1. If the graphics card is the problem, it must be determined if it is the 8800GT model made specifically for Apple or if it is an issue with the 8800GT on the PC as well.

They have looked at my file and are continuing to examine the cause since they found the render time issue as well. I will keep this thread updated as I learn more.

Quote - Well, I'm on Vista so can't be much help.  I don't get any slowing down or crashing but here's some sample render times - just a small 640x400 at Final render setting:

no clouds     11 secs
spectral1 'Storm Clouds'   51 secs
spectral2 'Dark Cumulus' 2m 57 secs
non-spectral clouds
Aggregated Cumulus  13 secs
Swirly Cumulus (volumetric) 13 secs

Gill,

Thanks for letting me know.

If you could followup and let me know what your system specs are and if you are using Vue 7.4 it would help. I am still in the process of trouble shooting this with them.

It has got to be something strange because I checked with one other person that has the same Apple Mac Pro 2008 I do with the NVIDIA 8800GT and he too is having the same problem.

It may not be on other Apple models, graphic cards, etc.

I am sending more data in I have collected from other posters on some sites later this week.

OK, this is my last update until I return on the 5th, heading out for a BIG 4th of July weekend with friends and family.

Update -

Here is the time it takes to render the scene linked to in my first post, using the "Final" settings, in just the standard size view port window:

WITH the cloud layer added in the "Cloud" tab in "Atmosphere Editor" -

Windows 7 RC - 46 Minutes to finish.

Mac OS - Not possible so far.

WITHOUT any cloud layer in the link above but same scene otherwise -

Windows 7 RC - 7 seconds

Mac OS - 12 seconds.

Obviously there is some sort of strange issue going on and we are still working on it. Once I get back I will report any updates from them or other findings.

Quote - I don't have this, but maybe your system can't handle the openGL cloud preview, You can disable this in the options panel, display tab and see if it gets better.

No, I tried that and also a few other options as well turned off as suggested by the e-on support and it did not solve the issue. Like I mentioned, it did help a little to turn them down to "fast", but not nearly as good as without any "clouds" in the "Atmosphere Editor".

Right now it is being looked into as a possible bug or may be some sort of configuration problem. The question is, does it just happen in 7.4 or is it there in 7.2 and 7.5 versions too? Also, it may or may not be others, no one is sure at this point. A copy of several source files were sent for private testing and when done I will report back any findings on this.

If anyone has Vue 7.4 and can test with either Mac OS 10.5.7 or Windows 7 RC it would help to know what you get. But please follow the link in the first post and do those steps as outlined in the video tutorial and post the results. It would be helpful to know:

1. Your system specs - like motherboard, CPU, video card, video card driver, amount of RAM, etc.

2. Your Vue 7.4 settings.

3. Your system resources after completing the scene in the video tutorial as reported by Vue 7.4.

4. How much time does it take to render the finished scene linked to in my first post using "Final" settings at 800X600 or better and at least 120DPI, 16X9.

Like I said, I know its not the OS because the render times are VERY much increased with any "cloud layer" in the "Atmosphere Editor" regardless and the system resources report 92% for Windows 7 RC Vue 7.4 64 bit and 79% in Mac OS 10.5.7 with Vue 7.4 32 bit.