You can check out Complete vs Infinite product differences HERE. 

 I suggest you leave this button unchecked unless you do animations. You are correct, it is not 'smart' and can get you in more trouble if left on.

 Just so I'm clear. I don't see a good reason why e-on should should not provide an upgrade path to Vue Infinite from Complete. I think they haven't thought this through well enough at this time, but I believe they will at some time in the future see there is money to be made allowing Complete users to move to Infinite.

My stated points above are based upon trying to look at this situation from e-on's perspective.

Quote - If the deal after a month is that they will simply give Complete owners a voucher for $400 towards the cost of a separate full copy of Infinite, then that means the customer is left with a copy of Complete for which they have no use and basically would then own TWO copies of Vue.

While that may be true for you, it's not necessarily true of others. For instance, a small graphics studio.

Quote - That could be seen as generous on the part of e-on but also a sizeable waste of money for the Customer. Why they can't just charge an extra $350 and then cancel the Complete licence is beyond me.

Probably for the same reason Adobe doesn't allow upgrades from Elements to Photoshop. IOW, they're trying to build a distinction between the Pro line and the Artists line. I'm not saying it's correct, but I believe that is their reasoning.

Pnina,

Quote - (and the fact they dont  say that this is their general arrangement in any official list/publication, also seems...well, underhanded?)

Seems like good business practice to me to provide a solution for a customer who asks. See my post above about SketchUp. That said, I imagine they will have to at some time provide an upgrade path. I suspect they're waiting for a next version of Vue. I imagine they do not now, as it would certainly inflame those, like you, who disagree with the pricing.

As I said previously, they have provided you a path, just not one you are happy with. My guess is after 30 days, they consider you the same as a Vue 7 Complete purchaser, and do not worry about your $99-- especially since you did have a very generous grace period offer as well.

Certainly there's room in this discussion for varying points of view. As I said, I would like to see the voucher to be $50-100 more than it is. Assuming that, it seems fair to me.

best, Chipp

Here's my understanding based upon what's been said and what I read on e-on's website.

e-on allows you to either: a) update Vue 6 Inf to Vue 7 Complete or; b) update Vue 6 Inf to Vue 7 Inf.

In either case, you've used up your update. But, they allow you to switch your update pref from Complete to Infinite within 30 days of purchasing Complete.

After 30 days, you are now a 'Vue 7 Complete' owner-- just as if you've purchased it from e-on. As a Complete owner, there currently is no posted update path to Vue 7 Infinite.

The retail difference between Complete and Infinite is $296-$336 depending on download vs boxed. It's clear to me it wouldn't be a good strategy for e-on to upgrade for the difference-- you want to reward your users for picking the right package the first time, or else most will always choose the lower cost version.  Any marketing person knows this.

So, the question becomes, how much difference does one charge? 

You say:

Quote - their 'best offer' is to give me a $400 voucher for buying v7inf. This means I'll have to pay $500 and if you add the $100 I already paid for complete it's a total of $600.

Now, I'm assuming what you're saying is you can purchase a brand new copy of Vue 7 Infinte AND keep your Vue 7 Complete as well. But you'll have to pay the full price for Infinite minus the $400 voucher-- costing you $499. So, this is somewhere around a $200 difference between the retail difference between the two. Perhaps a bit steep.

Now that you're a Complete owner, (and given a grace period to switch)-- so, in e-on's mind it's not necessary to consider your $99 previous upgrade fee. I'm sure they are thinking they should have only one Vue 7 Complete to Vue 7 Infinite upgrade (now called 'voucher') fee and not have to deal with 'an upgrade from an upgrade.' I'm sure you can understand that.

So, if I'm reading this right, e-on has told you they will honor a $500 fee for moving from a purchased copy of Vue 7 Complete to Infinite. And, you get to keep Complete? If this is the case, then I believe $499 is perhaps a bit more than I would charge (actually $50-100 more), but not a completely unreasonable fee considering the facts above. Perhaps the reason for the higher price, is you still own a seat of Vue 7 Complete, which can be used-- and would be used in a studio environment.

best, Chipp

Quote - But after the first month, their 'best offer' is to give me a $400 voucher for buying v7inf. This means I'll have to pay $500 and if you add the $100 I already paid for complete it's a total of $600.

I don't understand. What voucher are you talking about? Are you saying there does exist an upgrade path, but it's just not priced correctly?

Pnina,

Interesting thread you've started. FWIW-- here's my thinking on the situation.

First of all, you are correct. Any good marketing/sales person worth their salt would allow for an upgrade path from Complete to Infinite-- it just makes sense-- for now.

I believe there are possibly three reasons-- or a combination of the three-  for not allowing it at this time:

1. There are some sort of shell game dynamics where allowing such an upgrade gives a certain group a distinct advantage over another group. I don't know what those groups could be, but I do know e-on gave away a free version of Vue Infinite 5 to Lightwave users who purchased a full version of Lightwave awhile back. If there is a scenario by which a 'workaround' can get someone a new version of Vue 7 Infinite for just the cost of an upgrade, I'm sure e-on would not want to share these 'shell game dynamics' with you or any other user.

2. There are significant serialization and licensing technical issues. Though I think this is a poor excuse, and could be remedied in time.

3 (my guess). It's clear e-on now wishes to create a professional line of products, one which is different from it's standard line-up of mostly small studio/artist type products. To do this, they need to change their business model-- make it very different from the past. They would like to create a product line which they can charge a premium price for, as it will be used by Hollywood FX houses and major animation studios. For these customers, price is not a big deal-- but service is. Thus the new service and upgrade policies. These customers, once they like your product, order dozens of seats at a time. Big business. Big dollars. Allowing them to start at a smaller product line (Esprit) and upgrade all the way to Infinite, might in fact cost them. For instance, 2 seats of Esprit for layout, 1 seat of Infinite for EcoSystem work, etc..

Now, think of Adobe Photoshop vs Adobe Elements. Of course there is no upgrade path from Adobe Elements to Adobe Photoshop-- but in fact Adobe Elements is mostly just a subset of Photoshop functionality. Similar problem.

So, e-on is trying to create a category centric focus for their product line, but they haven't done a good job in understanding their customer, thus the issue. Because, unlike Elements vs Photoshop, Complete and Infinite are very close in functionality-- and e-on supposed the standard users would not need the very few differences in features between the two. That was a mistake. But, they couldn't name Complete "Infinite" and Infinite "Vue Master Studios Only" because the fact is...Vue 7 Complete actually is missing a few features which Vue 6 Infinite has. So, thus a conundrum.

I suspect after taking a bit of time to reflect, e-on will do the right thing and provide an upgrade path.

All that said I have to ask why exactly are you interested in this issue at this time? Are you looking to upgrade right now Complete to Infinite? If so, my suggestion is you contact e-on in a personal way and see if they can't work with you.

Years ago, I wanted to purchase SketchUp, but didn't want to spend the whole $500 for the PC product and then another $500 for the Mac version-- so I called the company directly. Had a very pleasant chat with the head of sales, and he cut me quite a nice deal at the time for both products on the condition I didn't 'spread the word.' Course now, they're owned by Google and the product is free.

So, my advice is to keep a reasonable amount of pressure on this issue-- as you're doing now. If you're archiving these threads, please remove the loons (cobraeye and such) and I believe it will create a very nice case for an upgrade path-- which we should have :-)

 There is a new update for Complete. I suggest you download and install it. Are you installing the 64-bit version? If you're running Vista 64, be sure and download the correct version. Hope you get things worked out.

I'd be glad to try and do a conference screenshare and take a look at the problem. But, I suspect it would be best if you speak english.

-Chipp

This update now has a check box for 'optimize for outdoor rendering' in the atmosphere settings. This is important as now by turning this box OFF, you can do some really great interior renderings in Complete (and the whole Esprit line down to Pioneer).

 Nice job. Very nice job.

 Personally, I'd kill the cloud shadows. Makes the earth look to '3d' imo.

 Yes, Artur, I agree with your conclusions for sky dome lighting gain over a second light. Especially now with Vue 7's super fast radiosity renders, it works very well.

If one wants more control over the sky color/fog/haze, then many times standard atmospheres provide a good solution-- and it renders fast. In these cases, using a second light per Mark's instructions above, works well for me.

Quote - during all that I wonder how to access to Vista Ultimate 64 reg edit .

To delete completely your version of Vue in Vista:

(If you're just reinstalling, then you can skip step 5).

1. Uninstall (when available) from the Vista programs and features section. 

2. Delete the "C:Program Filese-on softwareVue 7 Infinite" folder. 

3. Delete the "C:Users(username)AppDataRoaminge-on software" folder. 

4. Delete the "C:Users(username)Documentse-on softwareVue 7 Infinite" folder. 

5. In the registry, delete the following keys: 
       HKEY_CURRENT_USERSoftwaree-on softwareVue 7 Infinite 
       HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWAREe-on software 

6. If these .REG files are present, they should be removed: 
       "C:Windowse-on License Server 3.reg" 
       "C:WindowsVue 7 Infinite.reg" 

Additional information: 
The user folder is indeed in "C:Users(username)" on Vista. 
but it's in "C:Documents and Settings(username)" on XP/Win2K. 

For 64bit OS, here are the different application folders depending on your application: 
Vue 7 Infinite is located in "C:Program Filese-on softwareVue 7 Infinite" 
Vue 7 xStream 64bit is located in "C:Program Filese-on softwareVue 7 xStream" 
Vue 7 xStream 32bit is located in "C:Program Files (x86)e-on softwareVue 7 xStream" 

On MacOSX, the application folder is in: 
/Applications/Vue 7 Infinite 
or 
/Applications/Vue 7 xStream 

Still on MacOSX, the user folder is in: 
/Users/(username)/.e-on software/ 

Also, don't forget the temp folder: 

C:Users[your name]AppDataLocalTempeon 

Typically there can be lots of files there, too.

 It's because the cylinder is an area light, so it will not create sharp shadows. Try changing the area light to a point light, or make the second cylinder much larger and you will shadows.