Omniverse supports Maya,Houdini,Blender & Iclone.

So why wasn't Poser in trouble back then? Answer, it >wasn't until DAZ figures stopped working natively in >Poser (i.e. Genesis), >that Studio had any actual inroads. >Even with Genesis, DAZ had to sabotage Poser once >again by dropping support for the >DSON Importer.

Daz chose to make Genesis 3 more "exotic" in its basic structure and removed the ability to export it as a poser CR2. IMHO opinion Genesis 2 was the best version of Genesis with the highest level of compatibility with external apps via basic FBX export.. but its all water under the bridge now.

"Sabotage" is bit melodramatic ..yes??

Did bondware "Sabotage" Maxon C4D or Autodesk Max when they dropped the "Poser fusion" plugins??

Genesis 8.1 does not work with the Genesis conversion tool in Reallusion Character creator 3 and Reallusion (wisely) does not appear to be in any real hurry to further chaser after the golden unicorn with an update ..nor are they crying "sabotage".

They spent their resources on a new realistic hair /beard system and connecting CC3 figures to the realtime RTX based "Omniverse" System being heavily pushed by the GPU behemoth NVIDIA.

The obvious lesson is to NEVER let someone else's external tech become the single point of failure for your business model.

which is why Daz studio was created at all during that highly unstable E-frontier era of poser

And why Reallusion Created Character creator 1 after genesis 3 Broke the genesis Auto recognition template in Iclone 3Dxchange.

I recommend Easy HDRI for quick HDR lighting set ups

The Epic metahumans is targeted toward Corporate Clients needing realistic animated Digital spokes people high end Game developers , Realtime Animated filmakers. and hollywood studios needing ready to use digital filler people and stunt actors etc.

The only external 3DCC that will be supported is Autodesk Maya and the Data set for a full res metahuman is huge, dozens of Gigabytes!!

The notable lack of early 20's, ldeal BMI, waifish,white girls in bikinis/nude, in the marketing videos, tells you that Epic,wisely, has no interest in being affiliated with the Poser/Daz brands or user base.

Wolf all I am saying is pretty much what you are putting

forth without any "tribalism" involved. I did not, nor will

I; wax on about how one system is better than another

unlike yourself.

We agree that $200 is NOT a burdensome cost of entry for a potential poser vendor or even a hobbiest end user IMHO.

However if we tell Davo that making poser free is not a

solution for getting more vendor support we have to have an intellectually honest conversation about why even a free version of poser is not an attractive proposition for a content creator.

There was no discussion of characters or app features by

me. I strictly stuck to the premise of the thread as to

weather or not a free version of the software would be a

benefit for vendors. ....... I never spouted the benefits or

faults of any software.

Of course you did not like many here, the subject of posers current standing,viability ( in this market space) can only be discussed in a vacuum where any comparison its next nearest competitors is taboo for some odd reason.

As I've stated above; If you are good enough the

brokerage (studio, production house, ect.) will come to

you same as they came to me. Isn't that why you post

your website and IMDB listing in your sig.? True believer

hoping to be discovered.

Wrong ..not a" true believer" in anything except my Religon where "true belief" belongs.

Oh and Retired &occasionally freelance to keep the old brain active certainly not looking to be "discovered" by any"industry"... LOL!!

For software I am a cold hearted pragmatist. used Maxon C4D for over Decade, even made a feature

length marvel Fan film with C4D/Poser/Daz studio and Iclone.

Dispassionately Dumped C4D when maxon Went Subscription(or punitively priced perpetual),

when Blender actually became usable (2.8& beyond) Now primarily a Blender user with Reallusion as the humanoid figure resource.

The entire premise of this thread is that the average $200 cost of Poser 12 is what is keeping vendors from developing for poser.

I disagree that $200 dollars is the reason.

I think the reason is the lack of a cloth rigging system that is as easy as the one in Daz studio or the $200 Reallusion CC3Pipeline.

I think the reason is the that people look at their options and they see a choice either support 15+ year old Daz Figures(V4/M4) or LF&LH which many people have not embraced having chosen to cling to those tired 15+ year old Daz figures instead.

After all, you folk seem to think Poser users aren't

looking for more than, or are capable of; anything other

than load, pose, render.

Yet whenever there is a discussion about how the poser feature sets have fallen behind Daz studio or Iclone. in competitive areas such as Character animation etc, there is an immediate chorus of people who assert that they are just hobby makers who Click/load/render still art and do not need "all of that fancy stuff" in poser.

As an animator (and former Renderosity merchant) who is planning to start vending animation products again, I see very little potential for ROI in making bespoke motion files for any poser native figure when the users say they dont care about "fancy stuff" like Character animation

I Will be supporting the G8 female with native Daz studio formats but plan to sell them here in the RMP as I refuse to partner with Daz inc. for business reasons

If Poser users are only going to >buy your products and

then load pose and render; the >only reason for Poser to

exist is to sell your assets. That >sounds a lot like DS to

me.

Well looking at it from a non tribal, unemotional business perspective that is the only reason any brokerage exists ..yes??

Do you really believe that every person who sells at app at the Apple store is a "true believer" in Apple inc and all that they do/stand for or uses a Mac at home & work for everything.

For many it's $$just business$$ welcome to Capitalism

I had two posts approved in the metahumans thread in less than an hour.

Apparently some subjects are "safe" for me to comment .... or maybe the weekend moderator is just lazy.?

You have to own every bit of the code to take an app open source.

I laid out my thinking of what their biggest flaw seems to >be. They develop a feature up to a point then it seems >they lose interest in developing it any further. Look at >Studio. Except for the figure, Poser had each of Studio's >features first, but they stalled. Poser's done some minor >tinkering around the edges, but Studio has literally blown >past them with every feature. Yeah, I still think that if >Poser would fix and IMPROVE it;s feature sets, they'd >recapture some of users they lost to Studio. If they could >figure out a way to make Genesis work natively in Poser >so much the better,

I do not see why you believe any DS user, who left poser, would pay bondware to return to poser and abandon all of his IRay materials & other DS specific based content/ plugins .

I never predicted that everyone would leave poser for DS or Iclone.

You people seem to think there is some static number of users and the only way to "win" is to steal them from another application in a zero sum game.

That is not how market growth works you grow by gaining new users annually. This is where poser is way the behind competition even in its price range.

The Poser software does not have to "Die" completely to become irrelevant as long as some company is willing to keep it available on full life support, as Daz does with vestigial relics such as Bryce ,Carrara& Hexgon.

@Earl Sure Chris and a few dedicated others, are still "making figures" but where are they being marketed and sold??

If you say at Renderosity then "Hivewire" is really just a dedicated group of poser content merchants selling poser stuff here amongst the wheat & chaff like any other group of poser or Daz genesis,Iclone/CC3 merchants in the RMP.

And sorry but this narrative that" I closed my commercial store front (that was started to be a direct competitor to the DAZ store) , to focus on making figures myself"

sounds a bit too much like a failed resturaunt owner saying he closed his business & fired most of his staff so the remaining loyalists could focus on the joy of cooking ourselves and peddle our dishes at the local mall food court next to "Chick fillet" and "Boardwalk fries"

In this figure & content market you need to be either $$$huge$$ and wealthy enough to have a team of
content makers employed full time by your company ,Like Epic games with the Meta-humans for UE4.

Or you need to have brokered , third party creators
contract with you because they see your product/software eco-system as competitive in the current market and a good bet to possibly earn a living.

I think you're misreading the market, Wolf.

So Earl, what is your analysis of the 3D figure animation & content market, regarding posers ability to compete with Daz studio& Genesis 8x, Reallusion Iclone/CC3&Actorcore, or NVIDIA Ominverse or the Epic MetaHumans in 2021??

what am I missing here??

Poser users Deluded themselves into thinking that Daz Studio will never be a "replacement for poser" based on the very weak feature set of the versions of DS prior to 4.x

Daz did not need to "replace poser" or even convince poser end users to switch over they only needed a platform for selling their higher quality figures& content and a better render engine, so they could focus on adding features (mostly third party like the aniblock system), to Daz studio ,while keeping it free with ALL of the better clothing rigging tools for NEW vendors and the major content vendors left poser behind.

Most Poser users do not really want to go deep into the

3D creation universe they just want there Barbies with the

clothes that come with them not more. As for the minority

would be the ones who provide these addons for the ones

who just want to create a little 3D universe. Like a Game

just setting up your Characters it is also the main reason

why Poser DS survived all these years......Poser will just

Vanish just like an old Game but Blender Iclone or

Metahumans will not really be a replacement for it , these

users will then rather buy a PS5 console and build up there

little 3D worlds in there.

That is my exact point. There are many other options now and all of them have nice looking, young ,white women now.

The old poser die hards ,you see lingering here, are not

really anyone's target demographic anymore except bondware who actually owns the program.

The new younger smartphone generation is very tech savvy and not so intimidated by Blender Iclone or UE4. and not even vehemently opposed to subscription based services

They are the future market for 3D figure interaction.

Like it or not selling Genesis content is still lucrative as it has a very loyal following.

Any attempt to force vendors to support other figures is a fools gambit, as hivewire discovered when they required and sellers of Daz genesis content to make a matching product for the hivewire natives.

Where is the hivewire store today???

Bondware should sell whatever vendors choose to make

IMHO poser is a commercial dead end for content creators....dead... end!!

And frankly even Daz's days may be numbered if Epic Games provides a really easy way to create custom third party content for those incredible Metahumans

Reallusion has wisely hedged their bets.

Their online ActorCore Character motion store is better than Mixamo, as it delivers quality motion capture in the native format of the major 3DCC's (Maya ,Blender, C4D)-no Daz studio support.

Reallusion Already has a beta connector app for NVIDIA's Realtime ,RTX based "Omniverse"system that supports the major 3DCC's (Maya, Blender ,C4D)-no Daz studio support. And the $199 CC3 pipeline app can convert any genesis figure ,clothing & hair (prior to 8.1),to a native Iclone look alike avatar

We even have a free Autoset up tool for Blender that easily converts our native CC3 Avatar textures to blender nodes upon import via FBX

The 3D Character market is moving forward at rapid pace and is very competitive with many NEW options beyond the old Daz studio or poser paradigm.

A potential content developer will need a full version of poser to test his/her products under the ideal conditions of lighting and rendering, particularly for product promo renders, so a "limited feature" free version,of poser would be of ZERO usefulness.

I used to make my own custom clothing for the Genesis 1,2,3 figures before leaving the DAZ genesis eco-system for Reallusion/CC3. rigging a clothing item for Genesis is three mouse clicks in Daz studio

It is even easier with the Autoweighting tools in CC3 pipeline and we have better adjustment options in Reallusion CC3 pipeline than Daz studio.

I have tried the "Fitting room" in poser pro 2014 ( it is not very good)

IMHO unless they have made some major upgrades since then, making poser free wont attract new incoming content creators nor will it sway any existing Daz content creators to start developing for LF&LH and learning to make "superfly" materials along with Iray.

Correct!!

it is a huge problem for us all when ONE hardware manufacturer becomes the single point of failure for our pipelines.

Thankfully Blender supports AMD cards as well as NVIDIA RTX and even allows CPU rendering for those willing to wait longer.

and Blender will be directly supported by the USD based, Omniverse system along side Maya and the other major 3DCC's

Even with that being the case, it ironicly also creates more incentive for people who have been forced to get RTX cards, to look at other non daz eco-systems that have better postioned themselves to use those RTX cards for the REALTIME GI rendering for which they were designed.

People are already testing the Realtime omniverse system connector in beta for Reallusion CC3.

The Metahumans are already in the realtime UE4 ,engine eliminating the need for CG professionals to bother with the Dazstudio kiddieware and its "bridges& Genesis Bloatware, and it is only a matter of time before we see more sexy ,young waifs from the Metahumans to cover that user demographic.

Daz has no native realtime GI solution for users who are not comfortable venturing outside of the Daz studio comfort bubble via their "bridges"

I was mostly using the Blender forum on the Daz site because so much horribly bad information about blender is disseminated over there by people who only use cycles as an alternative to Iray and know very little about blender otherwise

I am permanently banned from posting in the Daz forum after posting a link to the DAZ/Tafi Unity store page.

Daz is apparently very embarrased at how badly their Multiple game content efforts have failed

They admitted outright ,by Email, that the are "pre-moderating"( ie banning) me because I dont buy their content ( I make my own in Blender) and I use other Character software( Iclone & CC3).. not any specific TOS violations

Fair enough their forums... their petty fiefdom

Yet people in the NFT "righteous indignation" thread can look up linkedin profiles on Daz inc executives and post all kinds of speculation about their presumed nefarious intentions.

You see as long as you regularly buy content AND use Daz studio as your primary Software, they will tolorate nearly anything you post.

It does not matter how much content Wendy buys because she uses other software/figures UE4 ,an older version of Iclone for animation, and is not true a Genesis loyalist/content hoarder.

Daz inc's biggest problem is the fact that EVERY GPU from Nvidia going forward will be RTX The NVIDA omnivers requires an RTX card and you really need an RTX to truly get full realtime performance from the Metahumans.

Reallusion already has a bridge application to the realtime Omnivers in Beta. they have the ActorCore motion library(with no direct genesis support) and CC3 can convert any pre genesis 8.1 Character to an Iclone Avatar

So people being forced to buy an RTX GPU will be in a better position to access the REALTIME meta humans via UE4. or migrate to the Realtime Reallusion/omniverse Ecosystem and get the most out of thier hardware investments.

With these competing REALTIME ecosystems the battle lines are drawn. Daz is in a fight for its very life.

@Eclarke1894 My advice is to focus on the areas that are most relevant to your primary reason for using Blender in the first place.

I personally found every version of Blender prior to 2.8 utterly unusable!!!

My first usage of 2.8+ was initially to migrate my custom clothing modeling for genesis in Maxon C4D, over to the Reallusion CC3 base figures with Blender. once that was achieved the other features of the new Blender came more naturally on a project by project basis.

I have seen your poser prop models and frankly you are already skilled far beyond bothering with that newbie "doughut" tutorial.

Pick something you want to make for Poser and go from there .. you will get productive rather quickly working on a real project instead of passively watching unrelated video tutorials. and feel free to post specific 2.9 modeling tool questions here ,in this forum, and we will get you the answers you need.