Oh yeah, now that is completely cool. the second link has been bandwidth limited but the first link still worked. Very very very neat. Is a tutorial in the making? BabaLouie

GroinGrinder.. Naaa, that was not me, I won't say something ugly about a persons art work. Generally, the only thing that gets my hackles up is selfish or childish behaviour. :) BabaLouie

I would say just ignore this individual. It is a troll or perhaps a SNOT, but certainly it is not someone who has much knowledge about art. Personally I like how you have used blue, green and gold with the black. I probably would have enlarged the frame so that the composition shows all nine sides of the three 'rings' but that is just a personal choice on my part. I have always liked your work, don't let this person get under your skin. BabaLouie

PJF .. /* http://graphics.ucsd.edu/~henrik/images/global.html */ Thanks for posting that link, I had forgotten about Jensen, certainly a good source of info and an interesting web site as well.

PJF ... /* but last time I checked I was able to constructively slate what they do */ The 'intent' behind what the speaker or author has said or written, or the perceived intent by the audience, often determines whether the subject matter at hand is being viewed as constructive criticism or a public trashing. Granted, there is a very fine line between that which is constructive and that which is not. I support that which is constructive, a good debate about a matter is always healthy and keeps the mind from getting too locked into stale ways. However, what sometimes occurs is that the problem is between what the communicator intended and what the listener or reader perceived. The speaker may intend their words to be positive or constructive criticism but the listener may perceive these words as negative criticism. When in doubt, a communicator will do will to remember that 'descretion is the better part of valor'. If a person is unsure how their words, oral or written will be perceived it is usually better to say or write nothing at all. This is a lesson that I will do well to remember as well. :) I have reread this thread again, for the third time and I find it difficult to see it as anything else but a public trashing. Perhaps my perception is skewed in this matter or perhaps it has been skewed by a repeating of history.

/* fortunant=fortunate */ That is why they gave me an editor .. :) Probably would been cheaper just to buy me a spell checker though. :)

Sorry to hear this Catlin, diabetes is common in my family and I certainly know that it can be tough. Hang in there, you are in our thoughts. :) BabaLouie

PJF ... > I think he is perfectly entitled to publicly sever his >association with the edited article and to state why (if >he breaks an agreement in the process of doing so, that's >his problem). I agree completely that Ornlu or anyone for that fact has the right to publicly distance themselves from misconstrued words, verbal or written. It would have been better if Ornlu had simply opened a thread and given a brief statement about the matter, stated that what he actually had written would be posted in 90 days and that as a matter of personal integerity he would not discuss the matter until then and asked AS or Clay to lock the thread. However, as is obvious, as folks continued to ask questions, Ornlu continued to provide answers or examples. That is partly where I have issues, it became a public trashing of Renderosity. >Why restrict it to a fee-paying audience when you aren't >even getting a fee yourself, and when what you say is >mangled by people who don't know what they're doing? You >almost certainly got started in this with the help of >people openly sharing their knowledge - so why not return >the compliment? Agreed, I have difficulities with how this online magazine is being handled. Would I pay for it? No. Certainly an editor should have a knowledge of the subject that they are editing. I have been a subject matter expert in electronic switching systems and have written tech manuals before, but I was quite fortunant that the editor had a very good knowledge of the equipment and only hacked my poor spelling and grammar. :) As I mentioned before, this is not personal, my words would have been the same for anyone else. Had this thread died after a couple of posts, I would have thought nothing of it, however, starting at post 6 it got out of control. There is simply no need to publicly trash Renderosity. For what is basically a free service for the bulk of us here, Renderosity, the admins and mods do a pretty good job. Are there some bumps, oh yes, but there are mature and appropriate ways to handle the bumps in the road of life.

rickymaveety, Yes, you are correct and thank you for pointing that out. When dealing with adults I tend to 'pull no punches', the result of this, when it is written, can often be misinterpreted. Of course, when dealing with children, I do a 180, I have the patience and understanding of Job. :) Once again, thank you. BabaLouie

Catlin... I have nothing personal against Ornlu, that was stated so in a PM I sent to Clay several days ago concerning this thread. What ever the editor or editors did, correct or incorrect I can not say, I will say that they should have at least discussed the changes with Ornlu prior to publication, but as we all know, the editors are not obligated to do so. My beef is with anyone who airs their displeasure here concerning Renderosity in the open forum, and some folks do it more than others. If you have a problem with Renderosity, concerning your dealings as a vender or author, then take it to the proper channels, do not air it here. As I recall, this bridge has been crossed with Ornlu before and the moderators then reminded folks to go to them first instead of taking the complaint to the open forum. I can not help but think what newcomers to this forum think when they see a thread like this one. It certaintly does not reflect well on Renderosity, it does not reflect well on Brycers, especially when adults chime in and support this type of behavior and lastly it does not reflect well on the individual who is complaining. A perspective employer would look at this type of behavior as belonging to a person who has not used the 'proper channels' for problem resolution. Ornlu has a habit of bringing his gripes about Renderosity to the forum. This is the third time, as I recall, that he has brought his displeasure to the open forum. Obviously he has problems with Renderosity at one level or the other. Perhaps he needs to move to another site that can better serve his needs as he apparently is not pleased with Renderosity. My suggestion to anyone who feels that they have repeatedly been 'wronged' by Renderosity staff and they can not seem to get this problem resolved is to go participate on another service. Is this personal? No, not at all, I am just an adult dealing with the actions of another adult.

No ... actually what I see the problem as is Ornlu being a cry baby again. He Has done this before, and the bulk of you jump to pamper him. Whine Whine Whine .. How about this, how about growing up Ornlu, you are not eleven years old. Granted, they should have discussed with you the editing of your article.. but just as importantly, you should have gone to the admins or editors and talked with them about what happened. But no, as before, you seem to have a need to cry out in public, your crying has brought more harm to Renderosity and Bryce by being public that the butchered article itself. Renderosity seems to cause you grief to such an extent that you must whine on the open forum, how about this, how about leaving Renderosity, you can only feel better about yourself afterwards, the editors will no longer be able to hack you work and the market place will no longer be able to delay getting your products on line. GO AWAY OR GROW UP !

If it is the same one I picked up from here or AS or where ever, it was the wsearch.vbs bho. Only took a couple of minutes to manually fix the problem, though it is aggrevating to be hijacked. My own fault I must admit, I had disabled some safety features on Nav AV and Firewall as well as Win2k while testing something else and then forgot to reenable the features. STUPID STUPID STUPID ! :) BabaLouie

BTW 2, I'm for the court's decision, because RIAA has >very little to do with protecting the authors and their >copyrights. Erlik, that statement is so very true, RIAA is not protecting the author/artist and their copyrights, it is only giving corporations and their lawyers a 'carte blanc' subpoena to go virtually anywhere they want and for very nearly any reason they want. BabaLouie

Very impressive tutorial Amethyss, any chance you could post a link that would permit the downloading of the html? BabaLouie

IMO, good decision by this judge. Americans as a whole, do not realise how close we are to losing an awful lot of privacy rights and privilages all because greedy corporations have been able to enact 'blanket' acts. An act that can be interpreted to cover a very, very broad range of activities, even activities that are exclusive of the original act. I do not support the thief of any software or art, period! But, I am not willing to give up any rights to my privacy either and, in this case, I do not feel that an ISP should have to devulge, much less track the names of particular individuals, to any group of lawyers. These corporations and lawyers are making big dollars while the artist is making pennies. This is not about the artist not making money, this is about the corporations not making more money. My apologies if any are offended.... BabaLouie