Attached Link: http://fraktali.849pm.com/graphcon.html

I also have all 3.. and I agree with you on the LW forums. Though it's really only a couple people there who while they know what they are doing, are like grumpy old men who give a big FU to politeness and some seem like kids who think they got "mad skillz". The rest seem like good people. I have to say I really like modeling in C4d the best. Especially with a few basic mostly free plugs. Even though the majority are in german, they still make and effort to provide instruction in English. The people on the C4d forum here are overall great. I agree with you on the screen space issue with C4d, but it's not unworkable. I do have to say if Carrara put a few more modeling freindly features in I think it would be a real contender. Round/chamfer corners, keyboard nudge (please EOVIA!), better mesh control, bitmap placement.. and a few others well documented in this forum. Carrara is also fairly slow for me when it comes to high density meshes.. and it's .obj importer sometimes places stuff willy nilly, but overall it's very full featured for the price (collision detection for example.. a $200-$400 plug for LW). I can't say I have a love hate relationship with it, because I don't hate it. Right now it just doesn't do what I need it to is all. I'm waiting for Amapi7 pro to come out.. we'll see how that is. Though it's still like the LW paradigm then. Model in one program, render in the other.

Ahh.. it's for Windows.. no wonder I don't have it :) On a mac here. Hartcons.. just curious, why Carrara if you have LW and C4D?

Thanks for the link. I didn't know that was available. "Another problem I'm having is every time I go to select something it seems like I end up moving it as well. Is the solution to only use marquee selects? Would a higher rez mouse make any difference?" Marquee selects work great unless other points are behind them, like in a head mesh say. You can hide the back of the head and go on but... if you're careful about point/click selecting individual points you shouldn't have a problem. Not sure why your having points move. :( Maybe it's a slightly sticky mouse button? I'm on the opposite end.. especially edges. Unless I select directly on them they don't move. Drives me crazy :)

You can also add points with the +point tool on the polygon edge and then Link the two points, add two and link lower down for a quad. This keeps the nasty tri's down but still isn't as elegant as LW's or C4d's to be sure. If you want you can also select an edge and sub-d it if you want to split it exactly in half. Now, If only I could get ortho reference images in :) . I also like Electric Image's knife tool, which completely cuts the object in two (or more).. but I suppose if they added all the features the big boys had they'd have to price accordingly. :)

"A manual just isn't as good as a community"- When did I ever say it wasn't???? I help people out in forums all over the web on a daily basis. I believe in the community. My point is that forums should be a supplement to the manual, not a replacement for one. Obviously you have a reading comprehension problem otherwise you would have understood this from my very first post.

Actually I was very polite... By the way: Manuals are great because they are effective: 1.) 1 on 1 just you and the manual 2.) A little at a time or a lot.. go nuts! 3.) For specific examples. 4.)You don't have to wait for an answer! "This is really simple stuff we talking here! You don't expect someone working on a 2hr. Hollywood Feature to answer you r first few posts"- I don't expect anything from you. "This is for people roughly at my experience level, that can give a simple straight forward response!"- Actually these forums are for all experience levels. "It was stupid of you to ignore that I mentioned having the manual for a reason"- I saw you mentioned it twice and said you were avoiding using it. Your "reason" is your own. I can "say" I own the Brooklyn bridge. Does it mean I do?

"Like I said I have the manual, but this approach to learning is much much more straight forward." ROFL!! and here I got caught chiding people who say RTFM so much they never answer a question over in the LW forum. Odie, it may be easier for you but it's considered rude not to at lease SKIM the chapter in question before going into a forum. That's a sure way to get fried. And on some forums they sniff that as not HAVING a manual which means warez which really get people hot. Hopefully 'nuff said.

My top 5 so far... pretty simple..nothing new.. 1.) Keyboard Nudge 2.) Rounding/Chamfer etc.. edges 3.) Ability to bring in pics to trace from in all axis. 4.) Symetrical modeling In vertex..a la Project Gemini 5.) The ability to "lock" nodes/points... yet still keep them visible, similar to Illustrators lock points. I like hide but this would be extremely useful also.

I know this doesn't have much to do with GI lighting, or the glow problems but while cruising I saw this page and thought of this discussion... http://www.menithings.com/How/Trek/Trek_Voyager_01.html