'Hi'. I'm mac and I thought I'd explain why I'm suddenly hanging around here. My main haunt is the poser forum, since I mostly make poser models and figures (furniture). I never render, so I have no gallery. This is one reason I've been peeping in here. I'm a fashion photographer, which is one reason I never render in poser. Any... 'ahem... art' (in the loosest sense of the word) I do, I do with the camera. But during some recent debates about galleries, I thought I should maybe hang around here more, so here I am. Maybe I can throw in a few answers from time to time. My site link is above, if anyone's interested. It's currently 3 years out of date, but about to undergo a major overhaul. I saw zhounder's thread below and jordy's comments about finding models. I didn't want to hijack the thread, so here are my basic rules for finding models in a new thread. 1. If you approach a girl/guy, have pics that you can show them, so they don't think you're a total flake. The pics don't need to be mega-fantastic. Remember that the average person is impressed if they see a well-framed shot that's in focus. Head shots always go down well with potential models. 2.It's important to emphasise a few things. First, that nothing seedy is going on and you're not a maniac. Tell them what you want to shoot and where the shoot will be. Give them a card (you can get them printed for a few bucks), with your name/number (a photo on it is a nice touch), so they can see you're legit. Don't insist on having their phone number. Offer to call, but tell them they can call you. Also, make sure they know that you're not going to sell the shots (personal portfolio) and that you'll give them a certain number of prints free, so they have an incentive to do the shoot. 2. Don't approach impossible models out of desperation. Zits and other 'features' will only ensure you never get good pics. And don't act as if the person you're asking is your last hope. A line like 'I need someone with hair/eyes/skin just like yours' is OK. It gives the impression you do it on a regular basis. 3. NEVER propose nudes on the first shoot. Have an idea ready and explain what you want to shoot. If you don't know what you want to shoot, look at magazines and find something that's within your range. 4. Who needs a studio? I've done perfect white background shoots on roofs and in back yards using a big white sheet and afternoon sunlight. You can get great backdrop cloths for around $20, and sunlight is free. Or use a location. 50% of good fashion is done on location. Just make sure it isn't a public place. A new model will freeze up in public. 5. Make sure you have everything prepared for the day of the shoot (including ideas). It's OK to try out 1 or 2 new things, but make sure 80% of it is stuff you know will come out on film. Otherwise, you just lost a model. 6. Get the film/prints back, make your selections, then make sure you show them to the model and give him/her prints. 7. If it goes well, you can either do another shoot with the same model, or ask him/her if they have any friends who would be interested in modelling. You don't need to committ yourself. Just say your looking for 'suitable' types. That way, if they suck, you can say they're 'not right for what you're doing'. OK. I'm sure there are lots of things I've forgotten, but that's the general idea. I work with professional models, but I had to do all this years ago to get a portfolio together, and the first few shoots are always the hardest. The thing to remember is that most people are actually flattered to be asked to model, assuming they know it's not a line and you're not Geoffrey Dahlmer or something. But first-time models get nervous, so you have to be professional and put them at their ease. The best way to do that is show some nice photos. mac PS If anyone's interested, I can give you my basic rules for nude shoots too.

Attached Link: http://web.infinito.it/utenti/m/maclean/

Thanks Mac! This is good stuff. Would love to hear the nude shoot rules, just don't get Jordy all hot and bothered. :) hehehe For backdrop material, I was thinking of going to a remnants store (they have ends of carpet and material rolls) and maybe seeing what they had. What do you think is a good general size for one or two people shoots? What do you use to hold your backdrops. I have seen a couple guys use two 7-10ft high light stands with a bar between them. -=>Donald

Great info. I want to shoot a model and this is well timed as I've been wondering about this for awhile :) Now I've only got to find a willing subject...

Hi maclean and welcome here! Great work on your site, and a really good discussion, with great tips.

Thanks guys. Hope you can find somthing useful in that lot. Re backdrops - The major problem with backdrops is always the seam down the middle. There are certain materials and cloths that come in wide sizes. You just have to look for them. Also, color is important for the seams. You can hide them by using white and a lot of light (high-key) or black and little light (low-key). Then again, white can be dyed a new color at some point, black can't. Canvas has a texture, cotton doesn't. It very much depends on what type of shots you're doing. For two people you'll need 9' in height (6' for a person, plus 3' spare, + 9' or more to lay out under and in front of them. So in length, you're talking 20' to be really comfortable. You could get away with 15/16' maybe. Width will need to be at least 7 or 8 feet, maybe more. The width depends on whether you're shooting vertical or horizontal (or square 6x6), and more importantly, how much space you might need to leave between them and the bkg. For instance, if you want to bring the model 4 - 6' forward from the bkg to avoid shadows falling onto the bkg, you have to move back, and so the camera takes in more bkg, and so you need more width. Studio paper backgrounds come in 2 sizes - 2.7 metres and 3.25 metres (sorry -don't know what that is in feet). But often, photographers will shoot on white 'limbos' or 'psyches' to get the space they need. You know - the big white, round-cornered 'eggs' that are built in most studios. So, I'd say the absolute minimum is 8' width by 16 length, but that's cutting it fine. The minute you start putting the bkg up, the sides move in, or people move too far to one side, etc. If you're buying cloth, it's better to spend a few bucks more and get it right. 'I have seen a couple guys use two 7-10ft high light stands with a bar between them' Yep. That's pretty standard. I use studio poles with a bar between them, but I've done it every way imaginable. Nailed them to walls, duct tape, the works. If you do use light stands, put weights on the bottom of the stands, even if it's only a few bricks. Sometimes cloth can be heavy. mac PS I'll post some stuff on nudes, maybe tomorrow.

Nice to have you here, and great advice. Your comment about "nothing seedy is going on and you're not a maniac," however, really dissapointed Jordy. Doesn't he have any hope at all?

I'm Jordy's only hope, but he's too cheap to pay for the plane fare.

Cheers Mac, much appreciated. I guess I'm gonna have to push myself a bit more to be able to put these ideas into practice..... (",)

Thanks Mac ... your information is much appreciated. I also checked out your site. You do beautiful work. I don't want to pull out the buzz words and stuff, but I couldn't think of any other way to say this but ... your work has a real edge to it. It's energetic ... sensual ... and there's a serious attitude that is coming across through the models (I guess I could think of another way to say it). Kayce frightens me in a good way. :) And I love your form and figure b&w shots (BTW - I'm taking a form and figure class in July). Thank you for sharing. -=>Donald

Hmmz, here is my 2 cents Work fast, get youre tecnics sort out. Models dont like slow working photografers. Make sure there comfertabel, music, not a cold room, a backdrop that is soft for a body. Take breaks every 20/30 minutes. If there good, let them do the moving. Just observe and frame. Talk to the model about her/him, not about you and youre tecnics, problems etc. Make her/him the center of the universe. Happy shooting. Kropot

Donald, Thanks for the compliments, although to be quite honest, I don't class myself as an 'artist'. I'm just a working joe. A photographer has to be like a plumber or a joiner, in a way. You need a certain look and a photographer who won't f**k up? OK, I can do that. I turn up, do the job, don't get drunk or come on to the models, and deliver results. That's it really. As an assistant, I worked with all sorts of primadonnas who thought they were 'artists'. Most of them don't last too long. Maybe this sounds brutal to anyone who is a hobbyist and wants to turn pro, but it's pretty much the way it is. I guess everyone is an artist in their own way, me as much as anyone else, but in the end, all that matters is getting 6 or 8 nice shots at the end of the day, and knowing that you won't be embarrassed when you see your name next to them. Funny you should mention Kayce. I forgot that shoot was on the site. I said in a post above that I'd done white studio backgrounds in courtyards. That was one of them. A big cloth set up in the courtyard + daylight. Everyone who sees it assumes it was done in the studio. She was my room-mate at the time and a hot working model. In fact, we had to do the shoot on a sunday, since she was always busy. That's only part of the shoot. We did a ton of stuff. I wonder where she is now? She played great piano and sang. Went back to the states to form a band and we lost touch. Oh well... I second everything kropot says above. I didn't touch on the actual shoot, since that's a whole other subject, but yes... be ready, work fast, use music and don't dork around. Maybe someone would want to hear how I do that part of it too. Although there aren't any hard and fast rules, there are some useful things to know. mac

Fascinating...really.... as a dreamer, you have these ideas in your head of how a photo shoot really is, thanks for the shot of reality. Any tips on putting together a portfolio? I'm not sure which direction I'm heading, but I'm wondering how one gets their work into galleries and shows..... In other words I'm not sure if shooting people commercially is where I want to go (probably where the money is?)...although I'm not totally against the idea either.

Ha-ha! If I were to tell you some of the real horror stories, your hair would stand on end. LOL. The portfolio isn't an easy subject, maily because it's so personal. I have a friend who is a photographer and she's convinced she knows exactly how my book (portfolio) should be. She's always trying to re-arrange it, and I always put it back the way it was. That's the way it is.... everyone has their own idea on the content and the sequencing. I'll have to come back to this later because there's a thunderstorm almost over my head. I live in the italian alps and I've already had 2 modems fried by lightning. Now I unplug the puter from the mains too, just in case. laters mac