Walt Disney (actually Ub Iwerks, if you want to be technically correct) invented, many years ago, a technique to get 3D effects in animation. This was called multiplaning and can be seen most clearly in the movie Snow White. This consisted of placing several painted cells at various distances underneath each other. The cells were painted with transparent areas which would show the scenes on the cells beneath. I'm wondering if there's a way to do this in Bryce. For example, I take a photo of a forest scene, and in Photoshop cut out the areas between the trees I want, leaving white of black areas, place this on a 2D plane, then place other similar forest planes behind that one, thus achieving a 3D effect. Now, theoretically, I know this is possible, because some of the preset trees in Bryce are simply pictures places on 2D planes. But I have no clue how to do it, nor how to make the areas I want transparent to be transparent. The ability to do multiplaning would really help me out in the type of pictures I want to do. Hawk, or anyone else out there, can anyone give me a clue how I might be able to accomplish this using photos and photoshop?

Transparency map on a 2D plane maybe?

What I would do is render each layer or plane as a separate image. Also do an mask render for each plane. Then you can either composit the images as separate layers in Photoshop (and blur each plane as needed) or you could reimport the images onto planes in Bryce. Use the mask render to make the duplicated sky and background transparent). Then set up your camera to see all the planes (maybe do some foreground lighting). Then render. Also, do a distance render to then do some final blurring in photoshop. This sounds interesting. I might give it a try too. =-)

That works too caligula, but the point of multiplaning is that with the layers seperated at a distance, you SEE the distance between them, and as the camera moves laft or right or whatever, you see the distant planes moving as well, as they would in reality. To tell the truth, I haven't used masks in Bryce, but I might try that. I know there's a way to make things transparent in Bryce though, like choosing black or blue and making just that color transparent. Hawk said something about how to do it a while back, but I can't remnember what he said to do. I've never seen anyone try to multiplane in any 3D program, and by golly, I want to be the first to do it. And as I say, I know it's possible because a couple of the trees in presets are just photos on transparent planes. I just need to find out how to do that and translate if into a full screen image. It should, if I can figure it out, give a very deep 3D effect to backgrounds, rather than having a single image as a backdrop. I get good results with a backdrop, but I want to take it further, I want to push the program, and simple 2D planes with transparency shouldn't add much to render time while acheiving a large effect. It's a very old animation technique, but no one uses it these days because the multiplane camera that Uwerks invented simply is rare anymore, and the way animation is done would make it prohibitively expensive and time consuming. But for 3D work, it seems to me to offer a technique for making deep forest scenes, city scenes and other types of scenes with real depth to them.

Hmmm.... I don't know if Bryce was designed to do something like that. I know you can do that type of stuff in Lightwave and Max but landscape gens I don't know.

Sounds interesting. Would you be interested in coming up w/ a tutorial on it when you get it ironed out, Bonestructure? It would be much appreciated. Then I might actually be able to get some of these pictures out of my head. It's getting kinda crowded up there ... :) John

I know how a multiplane works. I have two degrees in film. =-) Disney does have a relatively brand new multiplane which they've used in a few of their films from the last decade. I was offering two approaches to the problem--one through post production to mimic the effect and one direct--in Bryce to replicate the effect depending on the skill level and patience of the person doing the project.

Well caligula, I certainly didn't mean any offense. I only meant I don't want to emulate it, I want to do it dead bang the way it is. Those transparent plane trees in the presets tell me it's possible. I just have to find out how those were done. I have to go deep into my books for the answwer I guess. I know I have a reference on making those kinds of trees in MAX, I guess I'll find out if I can do it in max and then import it into Bryce. I wish Hawk would have answered this thread though. I know he told me once there was a way to make parts of a texture transparent. I just can't remember how he said to do it.

You can use hi-resolution alpha channels to cut you mask, gives good clean edges. One for each plane should work just fine. But as you move the camera, you would see that the images are 2D planes, unless your dead straight on. The trouble with the preset trees is that they are LOW-res with badly made alpha channels.

Well, I'm not going to be using them in animation. I'd do that in MAX if I was gonna do animation. But I think even in a still in Bryce they would give a more striking 3D effect than just a single backdrop.

You should be able to do it with the alpha or transparancy thing no problem ... Just like hair from poser in bryce. You will have a two part material. One black and white, the other would be trees like you mentioned ... I can do up a quick test if I had a picture to work from like you wanted.

I think I have the idea now. I just have to experiment and see what I come up with. I don't really have any pictures at the moment to work from. I have to go into my CD photo library. 15 CDs, a daunting task at best, but all royalty free for use. Pick two or three pictures and then retain the main objects I want and delete the rest and try the ole blue screen mask bit. and then take em into Bryce and see what happens. It's difficult at the moment because I'm busy with other things, and have a pesky virus my virus program seems unable to remove. But the people here will be the first to see the results when I get to doing it. Should be next week sometime

I think I have the idea now. I just have to experiment and see what I come up with. I don't really have any pictures at the moment to work from. I have to go into my CD photo library. 15 CDs, a daunting task at best, but all royalty free for use. Pick two or three pictures and then retain the main objects I want and delete the rest and try the ole blue screen mask bit. and then take em into Bryce and see what happens. It's difficult at the moment because I'm busy with other things, and have a pesky virus my virus program seems unable to remove. But the people here will be the first to see the results when I get to doing it. Should be next week sometime when I get started on it

Cool .. Basically, I would trace the picture in another layer with black for the drop off and white for the things you want to keep. Save the layer as "picture trans" or whatever and you should be set. BRing it in like you would the transmap hair or whatknot .. Good luck