Hi all If you animate with the genesis figures even nude & at

"base"resolution there can sometimes be viewport lag in Daz

studio because even at "base" resolution the genesis figures

are very hi poly for animation feedback. For those interested I would like share two low resolution proxy

figures, I made in silo,and rigged with Genesis 2 via the

transfer utility you can get near realtime (Iclone like feedback) while building your major body motion and save the animated

pose file for later application to a full res genesis2 character They should appear after install in props>builtin> Wolf359

hope you find them useful

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2TYEp536iB8SjJRN0pRU2l5TGs

Wolf, I think you're on murky territory using genesis rigging and distributing it. You have to create your own rig for your own figures otherwise I think you're in violation of DAZ3D's EULA. If you didn't create it, you really can't use it, and that includes another entity's rigging.

Not entirely true... you do have the ability to create "derivative" works under the TOS, and cloned rigs are necessary for items like conforming clothing which won't work properly if the rig on the conformers doesn't match the exact rig of the parent figure. From what I see presented in his promo image, he's done something similar in terms of rigging as that used in conforming items so it shouldn't violate anything in DAZ's licensing... if it did no-one would be able to create a figure that used a "standard" joint rig and having that standard for compatibility of poses etc is a basic part of everything in this community. Specially since if a figure can't use all the poses for the "standards" of rigging (read: can use all of the poses for what-ever version figure and rigging be it V4 poses, Genesis poses etc) it will get NO (and I mean absolutely zero, none, zip, zilch) support from the community what so ever. It will also get no support from programs like Cross Dresser or Wardrobe Wizard as even these require that 3rd party figures use "standard" DAZ/Poser rigs...

cschell posted at 9:00PM Sun, 26 February 2017 - #4298353

Not entirely true... you do have the ability to create "derivative" works under the TOS, and cloned rigs are necessary for items like conforming clothing which won't work properly if the rig on the conformers doesn't match the exact rig of the parent figure. From what I see presented in his promo image, he's done something similar in terms of rigging as that used in conforming items so it shouldn't violate anything in DAZ's licensing... if it did no-one would be able to create a figure that used a "standard" joint rig and having that standard for compatibility of poses etc is a basic part of everything in this community. Specially since if a figure can't use all the poses for the "standards" of rigging (read: can use all of the poses for what-ever version figure and rigging be it V4 poses, Genesis poses etc) it will get NO (and I mean absolutely zero, none, zip, zilch) support from the community what so ever. It will also get no support from programs like Cross Dresser or Wardrobe Wizard as even these require that 3rd party figures use "standard" DAZ/Poser rigs...

This is incorrect information. You simply can't use rigging for competing products, and this is exactly what this is and under the disguise of Open source. This is not how this works. This not being used in support of a genesis figure; the rigging for genesis is used for an entirely different figure and an a different program. Your explanation has absolutely nothing to do with making a product that is used with genesis itself, hence a TOS violation.

Hi cschell,I have that person on ignore so I am only responding to your comments.

You are correct of course.

This is effectively a free full body clothing item. for Genesis 2 (see sharecg) Except that the mesh is 100% original and therefore MINE to give away under any terms I choose.

This seems to be a stand alone figure not clothing, what Male_M3dia wrote is true and being the cranky old fart that I am I will probably be reporting you to DAZ.

If what you say is true then every single content creator out there that makes anything using the genesis or poser rigs is in violation of the terms of use as it all competes with a DAZ product in some way, and that includes everything sold here as well as any other 3d site. He has used the genesis rigs in the same way that every other content creator out there has done to make an item, or figure that uses rigs to make it compatible with the items it is aimed for use with. He also shows in his promo image that his item is intended to aid in animation for the genesis figures. If we go by your defined idea, DAZ would be able to close down every single site out there because 99% of the content out there re-uses either Poser standard, or DAZ standard, rigging, OR competes with a DAZ product in some way... and thus would be in direct violation of your definition of TOS simply because it has used the source rigging to function or offers a competing product to an item at the DAZ store...

By extension of your definition even using the same naming conventions for the bones in a figure would be grounds for a violation...

Sigh, I really was trying to stay out of this one. It seems like derivative use of the Genesis 2 rig, the open source reference could be an issue for one thing as Wolf is free to decide the license for his self created content, but placing content that you don't actually own or derivative content under an Open Source license could be an issue. Auto fitted Clothing, hair and such is generally regarded as okay, at the licence holders discretion of course. But figures tend to be a sticking point whether proxy or not and may run into issues at the copyright holders discretion. It may come as a surprise but there are quite a number of commercial products in 3rd party stores that could easily be seen to breach of each others terms of use. But rights holders may choose to allow the sale of these products for their own reasons. Both Renderosity and Hivewire3D's terms could be defined as being even tighter than Daz 3D's, with no clauses to permit the creation and distribution of derivative content at all, but clear terms stating it is breaking the rules. Under Hivewire3D's terms Dawn figure derivatives are not allowed for resale under their licence terms 4C. The licence for the content distributed with Poser is also similarly protected if not more murkily written into the terms of their EULA.

Does this freebie breach the Daz 3D Eula? Honestly only Daz 3D could say.

I downloaded the file to have a look at the package, it doesn't actually contain the data files which hold the required geometry, so is basically just the raw Genesis 2 rig renamed and zipped up.

For reference:

DAZ 3D EULA http://www.daz3d.com/eula

The relevant statements in this case are:

"Content License. Daz grants to User and User hereby accepts, subject to the limitations and obligations of this Agreement, a personal, non-exclusive, non-transferable license to use the Content, duly obtained by payment of all applicable license fees, as provided in this Agreement."

"The Content is for User’s exclusive use and no other individual or entity. Each individual must obtain his or her own license to use the Content."

"Three Dimensional Works. Daz wishes to encourage the expansion of the catalog of Content available to its users. Accordingly, User may access, use, copy, and modify the Content to create one or more derived or additional three-dimensional works provided that:"

"any such derived or additional three-dimensional works are designed to require or encourage the use of Content available through the online Daz store either by (i) requiring the use of such Content to function, or (ii) allowing only limited function when not used in conjunction with Content from the online Daz store; and"

"upon receipt of a written request from Daz, User will immediately cease any and all distribution of the derived or additional three-dimensional works User has created from the Content, if Daz has determined, in its sole discretion, that (i) such additional or derived work is substantially similar to or is a clone of existing Content; or (ii) such additional or derived work fails to require or encourage the use of Content available through the online Daz store as described above."

_

Solutions: Distribute the low res meshs on their own with instructions provided on how to auto fit the new mesh to Genesis 2 Rig or B ask Daz 3D what they think of the idea. Or option C risk it and wait for a possible cease and desist letter.

Hi first there is the fact that Daz has Not deleted my freebie

in their official forums or contacted me after a week http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/150941/open-

source-low-resolution-proxy-animation-rigs-for-daz-

studio#latest

Second @Razor you say you downloaded the package and it is just a "genesis 2 rig " packaged up & zipped.

Try this Load a genesis 2 female and fit my low res body suit

to her or him. conforms perfectly right?? ..ok their are some slight finger

issues.

Now clear your scene and go to your personal content library

and find the most full coverage bodysuit you have for genesis 2 and load it....ALONE now got to the animate 2 tab and load an aniblock notice your clothing item begin to dance,walk or whatever is

in the aniblock.

Bake the aniblock motion to studio frames and save and an animated pose file .

Now please explain to the legal difference between your clothing item ( purchased or free) being use in this manner and my free low res body suit.

well you can NOT give away your purchased clothing item because the duf file contains vertex information you likely dont own.

I own the vertex information in this duf file and that is where to open source designation resides anyone even a non animator may export this mesh to a modeling program and use it as a clean quad base mesh for product dev.. even you my friend

"Solutions: Distribute the low res meshs on their own with instructions provided on how to auto fit the new mesh to Genesis 2 Rig"

LOL!!..Why doe slosh and every other Genesis clothing merchant merchant NOT have to sell static .obj files with instructions on how to auto fit them? or every genesis 1,2,3 freebie on shareCG for that matter??

why is this simple free low res conforming bodysuit for genesis the source of so much fear for you people???

Okay lets just start with the technical issues of your zip file here before we start a debate on the legalities of derivative content under the Daz 3D EULA.

I have downloaded your zip file and installed to my library. Here is what I found.

As you can see the geometry "data" folder is missing from your zip file, this is what contains the actual geometry of your suit/proxy figure. Hence my statement. When you create a geometry prop/clothing/figure in Daz Studio you need to save it as Support Asset which will give you options as to where the geometry assets (Data files) are stored within your content library. Then you need to locate and include the associated data files within your zip package for distribution.

Hope this helps.

Actually this does help. I am still learning how to package this stuff for DS . THANKS razor!!!

BTW the metadata in my library list the item as "wearable"...Not. character ...or even actor.

One way the metadata is established is when you save the asset to your library, it will establish a category file type for each item saved based on the preset type it was saved as.

Remember when saving a Wearable preset, that this preset type will draw on already saved data assets for items to re-add the items to a selected figure. The best use of a wearable preset is to load a complete outfit onto your figure from a variety of products and then save as a wearable preset to reload the collection of assets with a single click again later. You can also include morph shaping, Pose, and material presets to the base figure of the wearable. Wearable preset will not save any actual data assets when they are saved as it draws on preexisting ones for each item.

Most clothing items should be saved as File/SaveAs/Support Asset/Figure Prop Asset...

Pick a name and location and fill out the dialogue box with the item details before saving. Take note of the Product Name and Author Name as this indicates where the associated data files will be stored. Generally in your content library data folder: Data/AuthorName/ProductName These are the data assets your currently missing.

If you want to change the metadata type later for a saved file you can locate the folder of the item in the Content Library Tab and select the Content DB Editor from the drop down at the top of the tab. This will show the associated metadata for the folder contents, the Category section is what defines the tag and type and you can change it to what you prefer and it will change the Metadata file type for the file. But it will not change the actual file in anyway. So you could tell DS that a Pose Preset is a Material Preset and it would show it as Material Preset. But the preset would fail when applied unless used like a pose preset.

Also Metadata data is stored locally for each product in the Runtime/Support folder which is made up generally of three files. Productname.dsx, Productname.dsa, Productname.jpg. If you want to transfer any metadata you have made you would need to include these into your distributed content. But I would suggest doing as much research into metadata as possible first, as it is something that's pretty easy to mess up at times and is quite an involved process.

Sorry about the previous mistae& confusion for all as the first file was missing the DAZ data folder(geometry,UV's etc.)

Corrected version at the link below

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2TYEp536iB8YTkxWEEwV1dKUzg

Thanks for the educational info Razor!!!

OK, One small technical issue the top folder is currently labelled as "My DAZ3D Library" the name should be "My DAZ 3D Library" with a space, to allow direct merging into the end user content library.

Your Proxy figure also has Sub D turned on in DS which means the geometry saving is quite low tbh. Genesis 2 with Sub D turned off comes in at 21,000 your "figure" comes in at a little over 15,000 with the Sub D applied. It probably would be best to have this turned off if animation smoothness is your aim.

OK now for some of the legal problems. As pointed out before, advice from anyone but Daz 3D is just their opinion. But that doesn't mean it's not relevant or should be just ignored. Often copyright issues lay low for a while and when they do arise later the damage can be perceived to be much greater and so too the legal fallout.

Okay so your figure loads without the need for Genesis 2 to be installed. Your figure is labelled as Open Source - free for commercially derivative products.

1. Load - G2MALE LOW POLY ANIMATION PROXY
2. Import an object file that roughly matches the shape
3. Use the Tranfer Utility to transfer from your proxy figure to my obj file.
4. Now I have a fully rigged derivative figure without legal restriction as to usage, as it was made from your Open Source figure and not the Genesis 2 Figure base.

I know this is not the intended use of your figure, but technically there is nothing stopping it being used in this way under your licence conditions or lack thereof.

I believe this would leave this item as being outside of the Daz 3D Eula and could be easily seen as a competitive derivative figure of the Daz 3D Genesis Figure series. Going further, it is also removing the licence conditions of the Genesis figure series and placing the derivative rig under an Open Source licence. Sooner or later this could come back to bite you in a big way. But sure you could argue that its not a figure, that it's actually a figure suit but your own promotional material seems to state otherwise. Now feel free to scoff and ignore me, but from what I can see you're on very murky ground with these two figures.

Genesis Pirate "Get out of me rigging, matey!"