Attached Link: http://market.renderosity.com/myservices.ez

There has been much discussion by the community and the administrators of this site about the slowness of Gallery pages to load and database locking issues. In order to remedy this situation--to increase overall site speed (especially in the Galleries); decrease bandwidth usage and the Gallery database load; and help make the experience of surfing through the pages of Renderosity a smoother, more reliable experience--we are implementing a change in the amount of allowable gallery uploads per day. Starting on Monday, 3 November 2003, members will be able to upload one Gallery image a day (that's seven images a week) instead of three. This should have a significant positive effect on the Gallery database and allow for faster site speeds. Those of you who would still require or desire three Gallery uploads a day, despair not. We are also introducing "Gallery Plus", the newest addition to the "My Services" program (see link). For $5 a month, and a one-time $5 set up fee, you can still enjoy three Gallery uploads per day (21 images a week). This feature will debut next week when the Gallery upload change takes effect. We would like to thank the community for your continued support and for your input on this matter over the months. --Asher Renderosity.com

Oh................. this is gonna be good.

I posted to this and my posting vanished. :( Goblins. I don't have a problem with this. I wish you would do two other things.... a) Get rid of old galleries of people who haven't posted on the galleries or in the forums for a year or more. b) Limit how many graphics we can have on each gallery...we might all be more careful of what we posted if we had to be more selective. I am really lazy about weeding my gallery, I admit it. Either might liberate some server space. And I suspect some people are going to scream over the idea of paying for space they are using. On the other hand, nothing is stopping anyone here from getting webspace and posting the bulk of their gallery on their own website. You can tell I'm not going to have much sympathy for the complainers. But that's because I'm evil, mean and nasty and, oh yes, I don't have a sense of humor. I just wanted to let people know I already have the list at hand. :)

I think this is a great idea, and is slow in coming..'Rosity has been needing to do this for awhile now ;) I also agree with Dialyn, weed out the old stuff that hasn't be accessed or uploaded to in a year..could send out notices telling members their gallery is about to be deleted, and if they want stop that, they need to either login or upload/delete stuff on their own. I'd give them about 2 weeks notice or so to get the reminder. And I suspect some people are going to scream over the idea of paying for space they are using. I hear that, and no doubt it wont be long before the screaming match starts ~lol~

I also support this change in policy. Renderosity is already generous as it is, as regards the galleries. I also think that a maximum number of images per member might be helpful to the site. Would 40 be too small of a number? I think most members have fewer than that, but I've seen many who have more. I'm getting close to that number myself, but as I (hopefully) improve with time, don't mind weeding out some of the older images that haven't aged well. :-) I hope people won't scream over paying the nominal fee for extra space. IMO it's more than fair, if you're being realistic about what the immense costs to Bondware/Renderosity must be already.

lol I was actually wondering how people can post 3 images a day in some galleries, some of my images take a few days to render, and have had to wait for a week for some of them.... I know others who talk about 15 day renders... As far as the actual deletion of old galleries, it is good and it's bad... Yes those members may not have been here for however long, but by deleting those galleries, we also lose access to that art... I dont' have that many images posted because I have some on another personal gecoties account, and i post and get all the feedback i need in some of the forums...grins, so over all space isn't a problem for me.....others who use this as a portfolio may disagree tho I have no idea how it's designed now, but perhaps placing the galleries on one server, while placing the marketplace and forums on another might help some....(then again, You guys prolly already thought of that winks) JenC

I managed it a coupla times (3 in a day), but for the most part, I'm not sure I like the direction this is going. I have no way to pay or send money over the web..so the moment they start charging for normal services, I gotta go..

Does the Rend ban bad guys permanantly and what do they do with their gallery space?

Whoa! My own estimate was that (if they limited themselves to uploading 2 per month) there would be a new upload every 4-5 seconds. If they're churning them out at the rate of 1 per day, I can see how that's way too much throughput (2 or 3 per second at peak rates, 500 - 1000 KByte per second, or practically one T1 line just for image uploads. Paying $1,000 per month to let people upload for free - it can definitely break your bank account. That's one of the reasons I don't upload (to keep the site bandwidth costs down) - the other being that my renders aren't good enough to stand out among the thousand or more uploaded per day.

I don't think this is a bad idea and it wouldn't really affect me cause I've rarely uploaded 3 in one day. The one thing it's got me thinking about though is, will this lead to us having to pay at some point in the future to access R'osity? I really hope not. Catlin

I think this is a great idea. Not so sure about the pay to upload more than one a day. But it's a step in the right direction IMO.

Does the Rend ban bad guys permanantly and what do they do with their gallery space? I would assume 'Rosity removes images of permanately banned members after the member requests it, and after a certain period of time...

As far as the actual deletion of old galleries, it is good and it's bad... Yes those members may not have been here for however long, but by deleting those galleries, we also lose access to that art... That is why they should be sent a reminder..could be some people just forgot they uploaded an image or 2 here..and never have any intention of coming back here..and also might want to be reminded where their images are, and have the choice of removing or leaving them here...they are, after all, their images.

They way I see it, I'm already doing my best to help pay for gallery and forum privelages by being a Marketplace customer to the best of my financial ability. If in the unlikely event we have to pay to be Rosity members at all, hmmm, that would be suicidal of the site. I can't imagine such a foolish decision being made. It'd be like handing the other sites dominance on a silver platter. But this current new policy seems fair. Hopefully, it'll encourage some persons to put more thought into what they post. I'll post any old thing to the Poser newsgroup, but I won't leave anything here for more than a few months if I can't take some pride in it for longer than that.

If nothing else, if you manage to produce a few renders in a day, then it will give you something to post on your off days.. I know I go thru very productive periods and very slow periods. Plus what has been mentioned before...think about what your posting!!! Post you best stuff!!! Given the sheer number of members...I don't see this as unreasonable... Plus the fact that it should improve the site speed, is a big plus... It will make it easier for all of us to view each others creations... That's a plus for me... Paying to upload more than one per day is OK for me... if your that productive and want to..hey, more power to ya...

How does limiting to 1 per day "....members will be able to upload one Gallery image a day (that's seven images a week) instead of three. This should have a significant positive effect on the Gallery database and allow for faster site speeds" Make a difference when you are allowing "... For $5 a month, and a one-time $5 set up fee, you can still enjoy three Gallery uploads per day (21 images a week)"? In other words those with the cash can go on like normal uploading 3 per day, 21per week, and everyone else has to deal with 1 a day or 7per week, correct? I believe that good housekeeping is one answer, or limiting 'every member' equally to one upload per day is another, but this is going down the road to becoming a 'pay site'. Sounds like 'If you have cash in hand, we are more than willing to let you upload to your hearts content within the 21', 'if you are not a 'cash' customer deal with the restrictions'. I don't know if anyone in management cruises other sites, but the general concensus out there is that Renderosity is going downhill into oblivion....it would be a sad day but the signposts are cropping up everywhere on this site....

It was only a matter of time before money was mentioned. It's not about space or time, it's about money. It's always about money. Why not just say so, right out, instead of hiding behind the whiners who won't buy decent service to see and download other people's art.

Just a quick answer to the question...When members are permanently banned their galleries are removed.

One image a day is fine by me (amazing lack of outcry so far, eh?) - but I really don't want the number of images in an artist's gallery to be limited (not that it sounds like you're planning that!). I have around 120 images in mine, which chart my progress (or lack of it) right back from when I was new to Poser and Bryce - and I enjoy looking at some of the older images of my favourite artists to see how they've progressed and improved - it gives me hope! I already have a website of my own, and - if it came to it - would simply move my gallery to my own webspace (some of it's there already), but it's not so easily accessible as my gallery here. Not that it's MY gallery that I'd like to see left intact - it's the galleries of my favourites - I'd hate to have to hunt round the web for them... Anyway, this is jumping the gun a little, as no-one from Da Management has suggested such a thing - just wanted to put my oar in while I had the chance!

About bloody time. A great number of people out there just ruin the galleries by uploading any old shit off their hard drive, just because they can. The galleries have been looking like a big dumping ground for a long time now and I'm sure this move will improve the quality of the images people post. There may be some peeps that can crank out three masterpieces a day, and I imagine they will suffer with this new rule. Oh well. At least this way, their stuff will get more viewings now that the fans wont have to wade through tons of crap.

IMHO

Well, the tons of crap will remain. There's no way to remove it except if the mods en masse become art jury. Even then... I wouldn't remove the old stuff anyway. There are people who left Renderosity but whose pictures are still great. If you remove the old stuff, the pics will go and we will all be poorer. And no, I don't think that a mail would solve it in many cases. I'm against the Gallery Plus. Renderosity can either be the most popular site or it can be a paying site. It cannot be both.

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This will not improve the galleries and keep any old stuff from being posted...If you have the cash you can post as much crap as you like within the 21 per week limit. The only thing this improves is the income to the site, not the galleries, not the speed, not the space. Those that can afford it, whether they are good artists or not, will be the ones burying the art of those that can't afford it. Wise up people, what this is about is the 'bottom line' i.e. how much revenue can this site generate. This is not an art site for Arts' sake, this is a business enterprise, run by businessmen and accountants, not artists.

"This is not an art site for Arts' sake, this is a business enterprise, run by businessmen and accountants, not artists. " I have news for these businessmen. When I signed on this morning I found my entire gallery had vanished completely, over 50 images! If this is how business is conducted then I would suggest selling your stock immediately. Mivan

My opinion? It is really easy to bypass this limit of one image a day. Just be member with three different identities and you will be able to post your three images a day at no cost. Have you thought about that, R-sity people? I know at least one person in one of the galleries who used to have two login names to post 6 images a day. Banned, she is probably there again with two new identities. Miche D.

And BTW, I am just coming back from my gallery and the same as Mivan happened to mine >8-(! Why I should post again in a place where they treat their good people like that? Miche D.

It seems that paying $5 has a good effect on the bandwidth... What a nonsense. Limit to one upload and let it be that way... Or use a better database engine...

I'm with Zhann on the good housekeeping thing. Why don't we all take a good hard look at our galleries and remove those that really don't do it for us. One of the great things about this forum is the people. Of course the art is simply stunning, but in the end the Rend is free and should stay that way. I hate to say it, but if I had to pay to be a member I would think long and hard about staying here. I would miss all you guys and all the stuff that makes the Bryce Forum what it is today, but I doubt if I could justify $X.XX a month to stay here. It's hard enough keeping on line at 15pm (and there's no way I can go on broadband) but to pay for the Rend?....I don't think so. Putting my preaching to the test, I'm going to weed the images that don't really come up to scratch out of my gallery. I think maybe others should do the same. The Bryster

"Putting my preaching to the test, I'm going to weed the images that don't really come up to scratch out of my gallery. I think maybe others should do the same." The Bryster As I understand this the issue is number of people trying to upload, not the number of images stored. How does deleting images help the bandwidth issue? Nobody looks at crummy art anyway. Mivan

Mivan: Maybe I've misunderstood! Isn't it about TOTAL usage? BTW, I hope you're not suggesting my art is crummy......

If anyone knows of a good and low-cost web host (in the US) that allows nudity on their customer's sites, I'd gladly start a site for the overflow of images in my gallery. (I don't want those banner heavy freebie sites though...they spam the hell outta ya :( ) Thanks...

The Bryster wrote: "Mivan: Maybe I've misunderstood! Isn't it about TOTAL usage? BTW, I hope you're not suggesting my art is crummy...... " Like many others I'm sure, my renderosity gallery is my portfolio. If I delete images that have not gotten as favorable a response as others or earlier art how will people see any progress or growth in my art ability. The renderosity community is primarily comprised of individuals whose art perception is generally limited to "eye candy" digital. Landscapes, botanical, nautical and other subjects rarely get a second look. If I as an artist pander only to that limited segment of the art world then I am severly limiting myself. How does this help me to grow? I did not suggest that your art was crummy. In fact a few months back I had marveled at your Belveder Revisited image, and as a former Brycer realised how much work was involved in that render. Mivan

Mivan, There was a problem with one of the servers last night. I just checked your gallery and there are 55 images in it. Has the problem corrected itself? Or are there still missing images? Deb (moderator)

I'm sorry but I don't see what the big problem is here.. Renderosity are very generous letting us upload images to the galleries at all.. anybody with their own site would know the cost of bandwith... 1 a day is more than enough.. if ppl spent more time on their images the gallery would get a higher quality.. As for the 5 dollar thing to get more uploads..I'm kinda against it.. for quite obvious reasons.. It would be nicer if ppl spent more time on their images Period!

I agree with Darkginger about not limiting the gallery counts. I have about 68 in mine, a kind of history of my artwork and progression. I think it shows good and bad how my art has transpired, and it's my hope that it's an inspiration to others. As far as the back galleries go, I could see that. If an artist hasn't logged on in a year or two, to send them a reminder to see if they are still around and then if not, close out their gallery. Rosity never promised that the galleries would be permanent records of someone's work. Although I agree that some would be very missed.

The 1 a day limit doesn't really bother me, and doesn't really surprise me. I dont post but once a week at best anyway, so doesn't really effect me. I don't agree with the whole 'if ppl spent more time' thing, with all due respect to Miyu. There are some artists that can really create great art in a few hours, people like robcamp and j-art to name a few.

$60 a year is a lot to be able to upload 3 images with no other benefits. Even if I was a poster of that many, I wouldn't go for that. There are too many other sites out there that would be glad to pick up the slack. I knew money would wind up coming into play at some point into this because of the rumored financial problems that Renderosity has, but this ain't the way to do it. And since you are an international place, $60 American can translate into pretty hefty fees in other countries. I would think something like $20-30 a year would be more paractical. I guess we'll see how the ball bounces, but I kinda fear it's the beginning of the end...

ShadowWind

If you have 90,000 artists' galleries, and each gallery has 50 images at 200 KBytes each, then you need about 1 Terabyte of server space to host all those masterpieces. Then you need to pay 4 guys to maintain the server farm, plus the cost of the lines into the farm, plus the cost of the servers, maintenance and upgrades. So it's costing Renderosity quite a bit of cash just to host free galleries. Historically on the Internet there are two factors that are famous for killing free sites: server space costs and throughput (bandwidth) costs. My guess is that Renderosity is getting to the point where upload and hosting costs are increasing faster than revenues, so they have to increase revenues to maintain the same level of service. It's definitely something new. I wonder what Rubens, Cezanne, Dali or Warhol would have said if somebody told them about a place where 90,000 artists gather?

We will not be limiting the amount of total images one can hold in the gallery. There is value in representing the entire arc of one's upload history to see how one's art has evolved over time. You can always remove your older images yourself, of course, but we will not be doing that. We will take down a member's gallery only when they are permanently banned, or they request it. If a member has not participated on the site for a year, they are moved to "Inactive" status, but we don't remove their gallery because they should always be able to come back. That's not an issue for us. We're not moving to become a pay site, though having premium features available for a fee is not unreasonable, as Renderosity does cost money to operate, and to improve; it's a feature-rich site already, and most of those features are included for free in your basic membership. And lastly, Renderosity is certainly not going down in flames, or into the dark night of oblivion, or what have you. We're doing just fine, and look forward to many, many more years of working with the most diverse group of artists on the "InterWeb". --Asher

'Historically on the Internet there are two factors that are famous for killing free sites: server space costs and throughput (bandwidth) costs.'

This is unfortunately true and even though Marketplace sales help defray these costs - this same problem is affecting the profitability of the MP for the same reasons.

This is a feature rich site with an immense amount of wonderful content. I hope everyone who opposes this remedy will try to consider this and not feel too badly about having to make this change :(

AsherD,
Don't get me wrong. I hope Rosity has a long happy life and I'm glad to hear that you will not be limiting the galleries. I don't spite Rosity for putting in value added services. I do think the price is a bit steep, but that's just me, but as I said, I don't upload more than 1 a week, so not really my call.

mateo,
There are roughly 300,000 images currently on Rosity, which if they are 200k each on average winds up 60,000,000,000, which is 60 Gig. Not a terrabyte...They got a long way to go to even fill up a 250 gig drive.

ShadowWind

Actually there is no way to tell how many there are now that they cut back the Most Commented, but I believe it was about 280,000 before they changed it to the top 100 only...

I would be surprised actually if somebody did pay to upload their 3 images a day. I'm sure Rosity isn't looking to make lots of money this way either. But can you imagine if Admins came in here and said "OK one upload per day that's it"? People would be running around screaming, setting the place on fire. Its an offering to keep the peace, that's all.

I for one would love to be able to look at EVERY image posted here, but the sheer quantity uploaded daily just makes this impossible. And has anyone ever complained that there were not enough images to look at? Nope.

(Not directed at anyone, just rambling out loud.)

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Mivan: I'm glad we got that sorted out! ;-) Like many others, I do appreciate comments on my work......

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I support the one-a-day and the pay part, but do not delete old renders, please!

"If a member has not participated on the site for a year, they are moved to 'Inactive' status..."

Out of curiosity, how many Active members does R'osity currently have?

I just have to say that I am in full support of the 1 gallery upload per day. That is a good move. I really don't like the idea of deleting old renders. As has been voiced here by many, the old renders are part of an individuals portfolio and lets people see how you have improved your artistic talents, and lets you see how others have improved their artistic talents. I don't necessarily agree with the "Gallery Plus" idea. However, the way I could see the "Gallery Plus" idea working out would be for people that were members of several forums and for them to post 1 image per day per forum. Outside of that I am not in agreement with the "Gallery Plus" idea. The bandwidth problem could see a lot of improvement though in my humble opinion with the 1 gallery upload per day. I have a 1.2 Mb connection and there are some days I feel like I am still using a 56k line when I am going through the forum.... When it is that bad I leave and come back the next day. Looking forward to the change and am glad that something like this is being implemented. Wade

Going through your gallery and deleting old stuff that you don't really like any more can increase your creativity. I wiped my gallery at the start of the year and have been working hard to fill it again ever since. But the images I'm making now, I find, are more satifying and of better quality than what was there before. And that was the only time I uploaded 3 in one day when I started restocking my gallery. Catlin

OK, I take back my suggestion about total gallery limits. :-) However, like a lot of folks here, I sure do wish that more members were less indiscriminate about what they post. Of course, most members don't appear to post to these forums, so who knows if they're even aware that it's considered an issue? And then of course there's what someone called the "art jury" conundrum. One person's garbage is another's treasure. There's no way I'd show anyone my earliest Poser renders at this point, but at the time, I was very pleased with them. :-)

Instead one image per day we should have seven images per week.Many people do not just have time at every day to even open computer(like me). And many times some images are "connected" with same story,motive or anything else and they should be loaded at same time. Anyway I doubt we wil see significant speed increase. Greetings...........Wojtek......... P.S.To JC_01 and others like him:there is some art which does not have to be rendered,like photography,hand painting,art made with Photoshop or Painter.

why not to automaticaly delete that images which after N days have less then X views and/or less then Y comments and/or less then Z rankings ?