I'm trying to find somewhere that will let me try both the 300d and 10d before I can make my decision of which would suit me best. Has anyone here tried both of these? If so what did you choose and why? I like the idea that the 300d being newer technology etc.. but slightly lower spec than the 10d being the trade off. But I also like the idea of the 10d being tried and tested and found to be robust all round camera. Others have suggested that I take a look at the Olympus E-1 or the Pentax or Nikon d100. I have read reviews of them all but still leaning towards the 300 and 10 d. I am almost leaning to the 300d, 2 reasons influence this leaning. 1 is the price, is the 10d worth 45% more? I can get the 300d with 2 lenses for 900. 2 is the newer technology, I know as soon as I hand over my money for a 10d canon will announce it's replacement the 10di with go faster stripes and everything, you just know it's going to happen. Which would meen I have paid the top price for something that would drop in value very swiftly to make way for it's replacement. I would appreciate it if anyone has tried these 2 cameras, could leave a brief comparison they used for the 2 and why they chose the one they now use.

Any places nearby that you can rent them for a time? I think this is a good way to try them out for a bit.... Sorry I have neither one.... no advice in that regard.

Hello, i do own a 300D (but have never got my hands on a 10D). So of course i can't answer your prime question. But one thing to your Nr.2: there's no newer technology in the 300D. It's basically a 10D with a plastic-body instead of magnesium (?) and a mirror instead of a penta-prisma. Additionally there are some functions missing on the 300D (user-defined parameters, flash on rear, selectable flash-strenght, combination of shoot-modes and light-metering is predefined - non-selectable) .. depends on your use if that can be a problem or not. The pics themselfes are absolutely the same (same sensor, same electronics in processing) when using the same lens. To me, the 300D is easier in handling (having the display in the back instead on-top and i prefer the cursor to move through the menus instead of the 10Ds wheel) .. but that's just a matter of personal taste. The 10D with her metal-body may live longer .. don't know if that could ever be a problem in "normal" usage ... the more than this cam (for me) may be replaced in 5 years. So, to cut that short: despite the 10D offering more options (and therefore is the better cam), the 300D is quite fine for me. Use the saved money on good lenses for any SLR is crippled if you try to save money on the lenses. There'll be no fun with your 10D if you budget limits you to cheapest lenses ... But do as you wanted and get your hands on both of them! Maybe the 10D is love on first sight and the 300D isn't :). And if you don't already own canon-lenses, take the Nikon D70 into your choice. She maybe not to bad too - when she'll get available. Hope this helps a little Tom

Good advice from both 'chelle and Tom. I have the 10D. I've looked at the 300D/Digital Rebel in the store. I wouldn't trade my 10D for it, but that's me. I couldn't live with the missing functions/parameters that the 300D has or the light, smaller body (the 300D felt too small to be comfortable to me, even with the optional grip). Raven is also right about there not being any newer technology in the 300D. Much of the price difference seems to be in the change from the metal magnesium-alloy body to plastic, the switch from a pentaprism to penta-mirror viewer, and in the sensor. Canon says there is no difference between the 10D and 300D CMOS array, that they just learned to make it cheaper. Some people argue that there is a slight quality difference in 10D and 300D sensor. I've seen shots from the 300D and while I can't say "Yup ... it's 100% like the 10D" or "Nope ... there's a quality loss" I can say that they are top notch quality and very much at the top of the list in quality compared to other digital cameras. As for the 10D's replacement. I dunno, it doesn't feel right. 10D is the hottest camera on the planet right now. They've just stole Nikon's D2H thunder with the incredible EOS 1D Mark II. They have the 300D/Digital Rebel to take the sub $1000 DSLR market. The 10D for the sub-$2000 Market. Makes me think they're going to go one of two places next. A camera above the EOS 1DS that takes a shot at the super high res cameras like the Kodak 14N or a DSLR that's between the 1D Mark II and 1DS price point (around $5000 or so) - or maybe a 1DS Mark II with faster buffer and increas from 11megapixel to 15 or 16mp. shrug -=>Donald

Attached Link: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujis2pro/

OMG... I wasn't informed about the D70!! that's so cool, I'm gonna have to test one as soon as they come out :) Have you seen the S2-Pro? http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujis2pro/ it's base on the Nikon N80 body... and I love mine to death. I tried the 10D and the D100 when I was buying a camera and by far the S2-Pro got my vote. leo

Yea, I've used the S2-Pro (as well as shooting with the D100 for a week). I like the S2-Pro over the D100, and the 10D over both; though the margin isn't that huge. Fuji just announced the S3-Pro. -=>Donald

Thanks for the feedback. I have looked at the Fuji before but I am put off slightly because my current camera is a fuji and I am not happy with the quality of the images straight from the camera. I get a lot of grain in all lighting conditions I have tested in and at all ISO levels. I saw items on the D70 but I was thinking more towards the canon because there are people at my camera club that use canon film cameras and do have a lot of lenses that I could potentially borrow (if compatible) This way I was thinking, I could get the 300d with the 2 lens kit to deal with most of my needs but I could then look at other lenses that others have in the club (unfortunately none of them have a 300d or 10d to try) I can then evaluate what other lenses to buy. I'm not too concerned with navigation on the camera as I believe that will get better through useage but I am concerned that I get a good quality image out of the camera in the first instance and not have to recreate the image in photoshop. Starting out with nothing (lens wise) I thought that because most of the guys in my photo club have film canons, when they do sell them on (as some have recently) then some of their compatable lenses may be at a more affordable price and at least I will be able to test them prior to buying. I have seen in some reviews that the Sigma lenses are not as good a quality as the canons! They say that the Sigma lenses tend to be a little softer around the edges. Anyone know if that is true? I know there is a difference between cheap glass and value for money, I was just wondering if the Sigma dc lenses would be another option for me? One thing I looked at between the 300d and 10d was the price difference I could buy the 300d with the 2 lens kit and still have enough to buy a 300 lens for the same price it would be for the 10d body only. I think I have almost talked myself into the 300d but I will wait until I can get to try both. I am struggling to find anyone that hires the cameras without having to hire the studio for hours as well.

the Fuji S2 Pro camera is not Fuji technology. The S2 Pro is really the Nikon D100 guts. Amazingly, Nikon allowed Fuji to create, what many people consider (including myself), a better camera with the Nikon technology than Nikon did. shrug Dunno about the S3 Pro. If your camra club friends have EOS cameras, then the lenses are all compatiable with the 300D, 10D, 1D, 1D Mark II and 1DS. They all use EF lenses. I had, and use to swear by the Sigma 28-200mm f/3.5-5.6 lens. And then I shot with the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 L and 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS lenses and I was shocked by the quality difference. The Sigma shots were definetly softer, lower contrast with lower color saturation than the Canons. But then, your mileage may vary. -=>Donald

Heard lots of bad words about the mechanical quality of Sigma-Lenses. And yes, i have owned one (50mm EX F2.8 Macro) which was very poor in any aspect. I do still have the 105mm EX F2.8 Macro from Sigma (got full refund on that crap-lens and gave that one a chance) which at least provides images that are fine to me but it's mechanical quality is .. hmm .. lets say: a lot less than perfect but ok for that price. Sorry, missing the english words to tell exactly what's wrong with it. Tom PS Which lenses are in that kit? If you don't really need the 18mm wide-angle, than by all means think about paying money on the 18-55 EF-S which is in the european kit.

The bestbuy close to my home have the 300d in display... you can just bring a card and try it out. ALSO if all your friends have canons... then why don't you ask them to show you their 300d or 10d??? (or are they all film only?) leo P.s. Hands down on the S2-Pro, I won't trade it for anything... (hehehe although S3-pro sounds promissing)

Tom - I think the quality issue with Sigma is a little in the past. I had heard the same thing too before I bought the 28-200mm lens. Wasn't going to get it, but I came across it brand new for under $150 on eBay and couldn't pass that up. I am glad I didn't. It was a solid lens for me. I bet that I could get better photos out of it with my 10D if I send it in and have it calibrated for the body. I'm thinking of doing that anyway with all my lenses. It was a great lens for my film camera. -=>Donald

Hello Donald,
hmm ... i'm not sure about that. Sorry if the following is hard to be understood ... no native english, no dictionary around ... but i'll give it a try:

On that 105 EX .. if the tube is at full lenght, the front part isn't really fixed. Let me illustrate that:

Side view from the lens (=) with the extended inner barrel (-):
====---- ^
Than the front can be moved up and down as showed by the last ^ .. sigh .. one word if one finds the right one in english .. ;)

I expect probs like that on a zoom-lens .. but not if it's a fixed-focal-lenght.

Secondly, Sigma still uses small screws to attach the single elements. But what good is a screw, if srewed into plastic? Let that lens drop down once and your chances are good, it's broken after that. I constantly find myself handling that lens with a lot more care than the other ones. Those others are glue-ed. Of course that doesn't look as Pro-like as screws do .. but considering that most airplanes are glued too .. it's fine with me .. cheaper and better.

Other things: the AF (though a lot better than on the 50EX) is very slow and loud (not that shrill sound of the 50EX but still noisy) .. and hits the point not all to often. Of course, that's of not to much importance on a macro-lens, but it still is a problem of that lens.

Compatibility is another Sigma-Problem. Tamron uses licensed Canon chips. Sigma builds them by reengineering so that lot's of older sigmas won't work on the 10D / 300D for example. Will this one work on my 10D Mk II i'll buy in some years? The canon certainly will!

Why are there two points to switch from AF to MF?

Last (and least) i've heard stories about the EX-finish breaking away after some usage .. can't verify that for now .. as i do have that lens for just 2 or 3 month.

That's just about mechanical qualities. Optically, i've heard excellent stories and very bad ones. I'm happy with the pics i get and can't afford the other ones so i don't care about them.

To any reader: please keep in mind, that i can just speak of those two lenses .. maybe, the other Sigmas are a lot better!!

Btw: any chance to get that fuji-pic smaller? Makes this thread very hard to read .. sigh

And one last question: anyone using the new Sigma EX 80-400/4,5-5,6 OS CA? May be an alternative to the canon 100-400 IS as it's 300 Euro cheaper ..

Best Regards, Tom :)

Tom: I think a lot of it comes down to personal experience. I've never even touched the 105mm Sigma so I couldn't say one way or the other. I do know that it rates pretty good on PhotographyReview.com (see link) with 72 reviews from consumers, it rates a 4.67 out of 5. I've seen a couple guys on DPReview rake the Canon 70-200 f/2.8L over the coals. I've used this lens a half dozen times (I'm renting the IS version again this weekend for an event) and I know this lens is phenomenal. But the copy they had was apparently defective. shrug. Yea, the compatibility bothers me sometimes, but so far Sigma has stood behind their lenses. When the 10D came out and it was found that some older lenses didn't work, Sigma immediately let it be known that if you sent the lens in they would reprogram it and clean it at their cost. That's pretty good. Don't get me wrong. I love the Canon lenses (28-135IS, 28-70L, 70-200L), but in my experience the Sigmas have been very good lenses at an exceptional price point. Smaller pic? What??!! Are you insane!!! Do you know I beat the last person to within an inch of his life with a small, wet napkin when he asked me to do something like that??!!! :) Sorry, I didn't realize how big that photo was. Will delete it. -=>Donald.

flutteringaway evadingtheflyingnapkin About that lenses: of course the Sigma lenses are not bad (with the exception of the 50 EX macro which IS bad .. as is the EF-S from Canon to have another example). They are affordable and better that some Canon lenses of the same (low) price range. One just have to live with their limits .. or buy a Canon L-lens. Even if you like Sigma lenses (not saying that's wrong) .. there is a reason you own Canons, isn't it? :) Thanks Donald and have a great day!! :-) Tom

I had the same predicament a couple of moths ago, I have used both camera before, and the 10d is obviously a better camera. I ended up getting the 300d, because I am poor. Best But let me trade in my broken Olympus C5050 for the full purchase price, so I only had to pay $100! My plan was to get the 300d, and get a few lenses (which I still havent done yet) and then when canon makes an affordable full frame dslr, I will get it. That probably won't happen for a while. But by then I might have more money.