I have tried to find a close fitting hajib head scarf-- bedouin and modern as worn with Western cothes. The scarves in the previews at Poserworld (I am not a member) do not look close enough to what seek. Here is my attempt to make one with Poser primatives. May I be directed to such a scarf? Is there a posable scarf I could drape around the head? I do not know how to make one.

here is wireframe view

I tried to model something like that. It's still a work in progress. If it'll do for you, or you have any suggestions, IM me. I think it needs a veil, and the headress would go over the top.

Here's one with a scarf and headdress.

Jim, the first one doesn't work the way cloth works. You can try this yourself if you have a large squarish dish-drying towel (or similar) at hand. Middle of one side at the forehead, pull back, both ends falling down straight, smooth the forehead... you get deep creases on both sides above the temples. IIRC, the bottom ends are crossed and thrown over the shoulders. This provides enough tension so that it doesn't side off and an end can be pulled up over the nose quickly. In the second one, the cloth should cover the forehead more. The roll (asayib) should be horizontal. You have it the right size. It seems to tie in back, or sometimes joins with metal rings and has pendants. The veil seems to be a separate piece and there is a lot of variety. Some of these examples are masks with barely slits for eyes. I live in a mixed neighborhood (Ashram, Baptist church take all 4 corners nearby, with the Black Muslim church a couple doors down from them)... and I see all sorts of headgear. No mennonites here... but just about everybody else, I think. Everybody has a different way of tying the turbans or flipping the headscarves so that they are identifiable to each other. Anyway, I just paged through my book on Arabian costume. It is mostly traditional, identifying the tribal wear, rather than modern. A websearch on contemporary women would perhaps be more fruitful. Best if our querant posted a couple of photos or links, considering all the variety in this book! Carolly

I woul love anything you can give... here are thought in image form. I can scan in an actual snap shot tomorow. I can not draw as well as I did before my hands were damaged.

Yes! :) The white one in the middle is exactly what I was thinking of. I forgot to mention the beaded trims. The embroidery on the under dresses is elaborate and the colors very, very bright... all hidden under black.

hmmmm... give me a day... Thank you both, for the help!

If you plan on making these available I'd love to have them also ... pretty please :)

Add me to the list of people who like to see this kind of product available with all shown options (potential customer hint)!

Hi... saw some scarf around the neighborhood this morning... this is my attempt to replicate them using Poser Primatives.

Here is hajib worn by an aquantance who is actuall quite liberal and wears pants and sneakers under a Pakastani style shirt though she is Egytian.

Here is an old photo of my father's sister and her baby. This is standard scarf in Cairo... white for younger women and black for older women, at least in our class... I don't know what rich people wear... Western close and a western scarf I think. Bottom of scarf is a bit loose here as we are at home. If you cross your eyes so three images apear you will get a stereo effect.

I may have to take this to the PS forum, with the amount of work I've put into it. I'm going to do a new face veil for it. I don't think I can get any better on the headpiece. I will be adding coins to a seperate version. ...sigh...

I wanted to do an older woman, in a black veil for momodot. I also added a few morphs to it, and intend to add some more. Is this good enough? Will it do?

all I can say is....WOW!

That looks fantastic :) The The ones you showed up further ( with the white one) look just like the ones worn here in the UAE. Wonderful work

WOW! is right! That is amazing... that would be terrific to have. What is PS Forum? Here are visual notes, I hope they are not un welcome... the front is draped over and should have a sharp edge showing this and an asymetry as well... in my image it is draped to figure left but women actually seem to drape to right I believe. Crease should show actual fold at crown as well. On back scarf tents over hair bun and scarf is pined at back. Your item is wonderful!

I was thinking... in west I see more this thrown over sholder as in painting of post above... in Islam more the pulled over cloth is pined up as here... often pined on both sides at jaw bone to be assured snug fit around face to contain face... more liberal or Western woman just toss scraf over shoulder... no garment I have seen has tailered opening you show though you are getting close... perhapse Saudie do but hard to tell as face viel is worn... I have seen many such veiled women in shops with children passing donuts up under their veils. I think you need to go down on forehead and larger on chest... wider at neck. Deeper creases and sharper yet shalower folds. Again this image is backwards/lefthanded...

Message edited on: 10/25/2004 22:23

Top of head is fine. :) Under the chin should show a crossing of fabric as momodot has in post #18... and maybe a bit wider on top of shoulders but that can be so variable (at home or in hot weather it is probably looser, if windy or dusty it is probably snugger... and some wearers are perhaps more compulsive than others about the arrangement).

when i look at the head skaft from #19, all i could think of was that indonesian women wear like that with the exception of the front head tip part. Those are usually a bit rounder. Anyway, it looks good.

OK. I've got the wider shoulder morphs (left and right), a face forward morph to bring it out so it's further forward on the face. Working on a lower brow morph and maybe a crossed fabric morph. The crossed fabric one won't be easy, but I'll try. I'll also ask Dodger to look at that one. He has some tools I don't have.

Cool.

Here's the final of the headdress. Morphs are: Pull Right (across right shoulder) Pull Left (across left shoulder) Lower Front (down chest) Lower Back Lower Forehead (to the eyebrows) Higher Forehead Face Forward (pull out to edge of the chin) And, drum roll please Pull over, to give that wrapped effect. Now stage 2: I need a picture, from the side, of someone wearing this type of headdress with a face veil. I'm working on some coins for it now, to go across the forehead piece. Anyone who posts a suggestion on this, will get it. I MAY use it as part of a complete robe package later, but for now it's just going to be free to everyone who's helped in this thread. When it's done, I'll IM everyone who gets it and let them know where to download it. BTW, that means anyone who's even encouraged me in the thread, so if you've posted so far, you get it. This has been a LOT of work! Fun though! Thanks everyone!

I promise this isn't a ploy to get this for free...and don't expect anything. I'm just curious what modelling program you're using to fashion this headpiece so quickly? I'm particularly interested in the fold details, especially the ones you've created starting at the top of the head, working down the sides. I've recently purchased Amapi 7 Designer, and although I enjoy it's ease of use, I've had heaps of trouble trying to create the basis for hair. Thanks for your time!

I'm using Amapi 7, regular version. Then the P5 cloth room, then back to Amapi, then a few magnets... It's fun. The base is to start very low poly. I start with 4 splines, upper and lower ones contour to the general shape, and two VERY jagged, lightning bolt style. I then use the Goridon Surface to make a shape. You get a VERY stylized object. I combine it with other shapes I've built this way and weld them, making sure there's no holes. Then I smooth the whole thing (that's why you start with a very low poly mesh). When it smooths, you get a nice draping potential. Then, if the drape doesn't look quite natural, I'll pull it into the P5 cloth room and drape it over a figure in zero pose for a couple of frames. Export it back out, and back to Amapi for a BumpSoften and a little more fitting. If you need any more help with Amapi, IM me.

All done! Sending out IM's in a few minutes, with a request on when to download so I don't kill my limit. It's a little over a meg. It includes the Hajib head scarf, the face veil, a single gold coin, and a 7 coin spread. The coins are smart props. I hope you enjoy it. Jim

I've asked a couple of people to hold off a day or two to download, to keep my daily bandwidth down. DONE! Now I can go take my pills and take a nap!

Thanks pdxjims! A wonderful gift! I'm truly in awe of your skill in producing an incredibly nice mesh in such a short amount of time. Please, O Master, TEACH ME! lol :)

Jim, been following the thread (with nothing to contribute as I plead ignorance of the garment), and must say -- you did a great job.

let me know when it hits the store :) and if not the store, and ya need a host -- I can do that. :)

Message edited on: 10/27/2004 05:20