I've found that most, not all,of the time, PPP will not convert jpg's to bum files. It accepts them as if converted. I can't tell if the bump is applied yet, but the bum file is not created. I have another Poser copy without PPP that will create any needed bum files. A glitch?

The ProPack is not supposed to convert any files to .bum anymore. They did away with needing to do that. Was there a reason you wanted to create .bum files? ScottA

OH...didn't know that. Do the unconverted bums act the same way? Also, some imported CR2's still demand a converted bum file anyway or they lock up Poser.

The PPP can read .bum files like the previous versions. It shouldn't lock up because you use a .bum file. You can convert a .bum file easily enough though. 1.)change the .bum file extension to .bmp 2.)open it in any paint program and convert it to grey scale. 3.)save it as a .bmp or .jpg if you want to reduce the file size. Then apply it in the material editor in the PPP. What figure's are locking up Poser? I'll download one of them if they are available for free. And see if it locks up for me. ScottA

What comes to mind wasn't free...it was Cammy from the store. Had to go to another copy of Poser to make the bums. I'll check this out some more, but thanks

ScottA, sorry to object, but your description will spoil the files. Poser's BUM conversion is a sort of (slightly weird) emboss filter, and turning it into greyscale (and ultimately forcing Poser to convert it again) will kill the map. To my knowledge, PPP will correctly open/apply existing (converted) BUM files, so there is no need for this type of manual transfer anyway.

OK. Thanks Martin. It wasn't my idea. I guess I should have tested it. ScottA

You say PPP doesn't need bum files anymore, but it uses them if made already. Aren't we losing the capability that bum files give in the long run? Or is there some other manner than PPP gets texture for its textures?

No. Poser can only understand how to apply a bump texture to a figure if it is converted from a .bmp,tif,jpeg,gif,etc.... into a format called .bum. Poser doesn't understand how to read those files directly and make a bumpy texture based on them. Without doing that conversion. They updated the programming in the ProPack so that now Poser CAN understand how to take a .bmp,.tif,.gif,etc.. and make a bumpy texture out of them. Without needing to convert it to that special .bum format. ScottA

Does this require grey scale only or will it take the color text and use it as a bump?

It can use a regular colored texture. ScottA

In Poser1 days Computers were very slow (I think on Mac it was just the age of Quadra?) and the conversion took so much time that it was clever to do it only once and save the result in order to directly load it when needed. It should have been changed with Poser3, but somehow it just sticked to the BUM writing. As a matter of fact, the bumpmap filter which I wrote for GraphicConverter takes a couple of milliseconds on a G3 (whis is slow as well nowadays... :-), so PPP simply converts it "on the fly" now for every render.

I remember when I bought my 16mhz PC. The salesman told me that machine was so fast. I'd never need another computer agin ;-) ScottA

Thanks all for the information ... the problem still remains for those with PPP to get a downloaded PZ3 or CR2 that specifically calls for a BUM because PPP will hang up when it gets the call from the download for a BUM. And, the PPP owner will have no way to convert an existing file to the BUM format with PPP.

What do you mean by "hang up" - does it freeze? If a BUM is missing from a file, Poser will/should ask to locate it. If it already is a .bum file, PPP should take it as it is, and for any other format it will convert it every time it renders (instead of writing out a new .bum like Poser1-4). If you don't have any file - no BUM, no TIF, no whatever - then you're just as lost as any other Poser user.

Lost is my usual state of mind. So far as I can tell, and I will get a screen capture the next time it happens, Poser asks for missing files, which I either have to fake or let Poser go without. In the latter case, usually when there is a missing file attached to sever element, Poser locks up. By lock up, I mean nothing happens ... it just sits there eating up CPU time until I do control-alt-delete or, in some cases, a hard shut down. On On Ctrl-Alt-Del, Norton Utilities will tell me that Poser is not responding. Faking a file means conjuring up a blank in my photo app and saving it in the required name and format,

Well... there is a third option, and it is actually the one which Poser expects you to do... Instead of cancelling or "faking", why don't you just select the correct file? Does your Poser only accept the file if it has the identical name? It shouldn't - often files got renamed, Poser asks for "BodyP4Tex.tif", you select "BodyTex.jpg", Poser uses it, and everyone is happy. Your description suggests that PPP might have a bug with "cancel" (how long do you wait? In case of "cancel" it can take a couple of minutes until Poser finishes!), but you only need this if the file is completely missing, which is rare. What exactly happens in this situation. Let's say a .cr2 references "some.bum" and you have either "someother.bum" or "some.tif". Can't you just select them ??

Poser will not accept, now or before, anything other than the specified file by name and formt when directed to do so by either a downloaded PZ3 or CR2 file. When a file is missing from a CR2 already installed, having been deleted or format changed or location change, Poser will only indicate that a file is missing without reference to the name or type. In the case of the downloaded file, you have two choices when Poser specifies the type file: provide it or not. If not, Poser reacts in two ways: It likes it or it doesn't. If it likes it, you get the mesh without the missing text. If it doesn't it locks up requiring a ctrl-alt-delete to shut down Poser. The distinction between whether Poser locks or not in this case is not certain, but seems to be the number of times that the same file is called for in the mesh. It seems to me that Poser will ask twice before locking up or giving up. Again, you must provide the file by exact name and type as requested. It won't accept the unconverted text intended as a bump even if the file name is the same except for format (Tiff for Jpg). Sometimes even capitalization with make the difference. Most of the time, a homemade PZ3 will load even without a requested file. The really serious problems come with someone else's CR2. I find at least 20% of downloaded CR2's are missing something. When it's a bum format, you have no way to fake it inside PPP.

This is the oddest thing I ever heard - is this true for every PC version of Poser? The Mac version will accept absolutely every file, no matter how different the filename might be (actually, it happens very often that Poser asks for localized filenames, and you have to point it to your own (renamed) copy). Every post regarding this mechanism suggested that the same is true for the PC version, and I never doubted it - otherwise it would be a nightmare. Are you absolutely sure that this "lock up" thing happened wir your Poser3 and Poser4 (pre-PPP) as well, and could someone else on PC confirm this?

I have difficulty in believing that, on calling up a CR2 and not finding the specified file, your Poser/Mac will accept another file selected at random instead. You mean that if a file calls for SexyTXT.tif, you can substitute Anytext.bmp for it? And poser will continue to load? This lock up business happened as far back as Poser 0.0 as far as I can recall. I've had every version since then.

Gosh...! I got no idea about this, and I'm in the repair-Poser-platform-blues business now for two years... Yes, on Mac you can select any readable/openable texture file when Poser asks for it, no matter where it sits, no matter how it's called, no matter which format - straight from Poser1-4 and (hopefully) 4.2 aka PPP. And I was perfectly sure that this is true for PC as well. Hmm.

Huolong, we must be trapped in a warp field running havoc... :-) This is what I did right this minute: 1) started the PC Poser (emulated, but that should make no difference here) 2) applied some picture as material, saved it to the library, quit 3) deleted the picture 4) placed a completely different picture with a different name into a different directory 5) started Poser again, loeaded the library file 6) it asked for the missing map, I selected the new file(name) in the new location 7) 30 seconds later the figure opened, with the substituted map 8) re-checked the materials box, the popup showed the new filename I've heard some claims that VirtualPC runs smoother than the real thing, but...

That's not the situation I described as the figure you applied the texture was already in your system and you modified it by changing a texture. Saving the file saved the instructions in the CR2 that told Poser where all the files are. If you shipped me that same file by email and I copied into my character directory (assuming that we had the same geometry file), AND I did NOT have the exact texture files that you had, by name, type or directory address .... what would happen is that when I clicked on your CR2 now in my character directory, it would ask for the missing files by name having not found them automatically. Unless I could provide those files by making substitutes of the same file by name and type (which I could place anywhere), Poser would give me the two alternatives addressed above: It goes ahead without the text file or locks up. You will get a similiar problem if you were to delete the files you just applied (or changed the file name or location) and then tried to recall the file from your character file. I have found some old files of mine won't load anymore, and lock up the computer because I had this genius idea to change the TIF's to JPG's when Poser4 came out. Save storage space. Now if I can remember which file I changed goes with the models .... trouble is, that in this case, Poser rarely tells me the name of the old file. Can't explain why.

I have a certain feeling that you will not like what I write now... :-) I just took one of my Mac .cr2 files from my Mac disk, opened it, and hacked in a bogus PC pathname to a non-existing texture - I think a Mac file treated this way qualifies as "alien file shipped from outside". Then I copied it to the PC partition into the Poser folder and started PC Poser. When I opened it, it asked for the bogus name, I pointed it to some very other file and... IT WORKED !!!

May I suggest something? Please check the amount of MEMORY you now have allocated to PPP. When I installed it, it reset to factory defaults (bare minimum) from the 200MB I'd given Poser4. Why did I give Poser4 200MB when I haven't started using Vicki or Michael? (Isn't Cammy a Vicki version?) Too many layers of textures on my little guys! Once they are dressed and propped, they can easily have a dozen texture maps applied to them. The error message would say "can't find bump map" or "can't find texture map" and then it would crash cold. I have no idea why it would say that it couldn't find the bump map when it really was out of the memory to go hunting for it, but I don't write error messages. (If I did, they would be friendlier and helpful.) Anyway, try allocating more memory to the program and see if that helps. Carolly

Carolly, you can't control the memory partition on PC, Windows usually does this automatically (which is very nice as long as it works, but on the down side you can't really do anything if it doesn't - we'll have to wait & wonder how smoothly OS-X will do this for us in future... :-) It also wouldn't explain why it accepts/refuses files depending on its name. I'm really confused about this whole issue, my only explanation would be that I'm using a very clean PC system. I'm not working with it, I only use it for testing, and Poser is the only non-trivial program installed, so there are no other 10 big apps messing up Windows and adding/spoiling hundreds of system files.

Martin, you must have a gifted computer or MAC treats files very differently from PC. What I'm telling you about file lockup is a constant since Poser first came out and over five different PC's. The missing file problem in downloaded Props and Characters is one of my pet peeves. Props don't create quite the problem characters do. This thread started about Bum files which PPP no longer creates but accepts. The problem remains for files requiring bums that don't have them as a part of the download.

Yeah, sorry for diverting the topic a bit... :-) I believe that it is a sort of bug which the PC Poser seems to suffer from, all that I can say is that it doesn't show on my testing config. To clear things up a bit: Texture references are indeed handled very differently on PC and Mac (Poser even uses a different method to store the references inside a file), so this could explain why it works on Mac but not on PC, but in this case it doesn't really. The emulation I was talking about is a 100% (well, 99.99% :-) simulation of the PC hardware, with an original unmodified bona fide vanilla Windows running - if you install it from the Microsoft CD it even identifies the environment as a real PC hardware. I have a clean W95 installed, and I have a clean US Poser 4.0 (unpatched, I never bothered to get the PC patches because I don't really work with it, of course), and all I can say is this: On this config, the texture "substitution" does work, so your bad experiences are neither fate nore a basic disability of Poser, but something affected by other odds on your computer - otherwise I would experience the same behaviour when I try it out.

1. All the versions of Poser on all the PC's I have had will not accept a file name other than the one specified by a CR2 that has been downloaded and on the occasion of it's being opened. 2. Poser will pointedly ignore any file not of the type and name specified. Once I click on the little window asking for the file with the wrong file, Poser plays with it for a second or so then asks again for the right file. I can do this all day long and Poser will not, nor has it ever, accepted the wrong file. 3. If the file is not provided Poser will ask for it a couple of times then either proceed without it or lock up (as described above). 4. Some download files require a BUM file. 5. PPP doesn't produce BUM files, but it can use them. 6. Current experience on receiving a call from Poser for a specified BUM file is as above, it will not accept it (allday long) and I have to go to my other non-PPP to make it. Once made, and pointed out to Poser, Poser accepts it. I have no idea why you are spending time trying to duplicate something on my PC on yours. At worst, it's an evil bug that infects only my PC singled out by the evil HR Director from Dilbert. I suspect there may be another PC person out there that is having the same problem.

Sorry for spending time trying to duplicate your problems on my PC - you are right, it's not my business helping other people. Mark all read, MartinC

Thanks for your concern, but it seemed to me that you were discounting what I have found to be consistent and predictable behavior of Poser with likely untoward outcomes for the community. As long as I have a manner of making bum files, I have a work around for the problem. I am at a complete loss as to why your system doesn't behaive in a similiar fashion. But that's not my problem nor could I deal with it as Mac does things differently ... and I have zip experience with a Mac. I appreciate your intent.

JUST TO PROVE YOU WRONG, I TRIED ASSIGNING THE JPG FOR A HAIR BUM WHEN THE BUM WAS MISSING .... GODDAM POSER TOOK IT! I RARELY MAKE SMALL MISTAKES. THANKS FOR YOUR HELP

You're welcome... I did ask some friends in the meantime about it, and I got a very mixed response. As a matter of fact, some backed your experience that it never seemed to work, some backed mine that it alway worked, and some say that it is very unpredictible. So there must be a longliving bug within Poser, but one that needs an external trigger in conjunction, one that exists on some PCs but not on all (and my own experience seems to imply that it could be a non-standard system file). I hope that someone will find out the actual source of the failure and might offer a workaround that stops this problem.

It may also be that the lead indications of the problem are the same, but the solution varies. I downloaded "smart hair" and found that the requested bum file was not converted. There was a jpg of the same name so I clicked on it to see if it took, it did. There was a call for a transmap the equivalent of which did not exist. I clicked on another transmap of similiar name and it did not take. Go figure

lol @ hulong screaning you made my day ;) just wanted to add something ive come acrossi have a texture in the store named tribal i also have post in my gallery you can look at the bump its pretty awesome but becuase of some problems when i first uploaded it i tried it on standard poser it looked like shit the reason being when i loaded the bump map wich wasnt a bump but a greyscale image at 100percent instead of making a 3d apperance it just washed the colors into flat black and white i adjusted it to 23 percent and it resolved the problem weird how much difference there is in pp and standard it almost seems like poser 4 is the newer version lol

Still baffled by what makes this happen sometimes and sometimes not. I unzipped an old download for a siamese cat and it locked up Poser so bad that it ate up too much CPU time until I had to do a hard reboot. I just make sure that any files that have a file that looks like it has a bum file in another format to convert to .bum format in Poser in another directory that is not PPP'd.

i've got the pc version of poser 4 & it never accepts the file if the name is not exactly correct. i can't believe you mac guys are in nirvana over this! ;-) btw, thanks for all the info on bumps, that's why i originally started reading this thread. most helpful!

Not a week goes by that I don't get a missing file in a downloaded product. Sometimes it's just not there, sometimes it's there but in a different format or filename, and sometimes it's a bum file. I set up Poser in two directories: one for work and the other for making bumps. The trouble is that if I don't find the bump before I load it, Poser will lock up the entire computer to the point of requiring a hard shut down. Sometimes, if I'm fast enough, I'll copy and rename any bump file to the desired name so that the computer won't lock up and fix it later,

sympathies. i know what you are going through! another thing is if a folder in the path was deleted. i.e : a directory structure change(as happens after a system restore). if that happens poser goes into a loop, requireing a shutdown. also, you can't use that prop until it's reinstalled!

OOooo ... that's a bummer I didn't know about. A lot of my props were made in Poser itself or imported and finalized in Poser and no external record exists.