Hi There!

I have a big question!

I recently bought  cinema 4d, vue 5, bryce 5.5 and 3d max 8. NOW........ i need from all of you well informed 3d junkies out there to give me opinions of what is easier to use, has the most functions, best rendering capabilities and just overall best to use!!

I am planning and learning all these aplications as i am more of a poser user!! but i want to start expanding my horizons into other applications. a have used 3d max 6 a while back and i remember it was a mission!!

so any comments you might have about any of these are all welcome!! i hope we get a whole lot of posts on here because i am sure i am not the only one wondering this question!!

thanks!!!!

The simple answer is there is no answer! you've spent a lot of time or cash gathering these together! The best thing you can do is sit down and choose one, get to know it inside out, the core modelling, lighting and texturing skills will transfer from one to the other.

vue and bryce aren't good for modelling,

Cinema and Max are both excellent all round packages, I prefer Max, mainly for it's material editor which I find far superior to the C4D one, but that's personal preference and I wouldn't recomend others decide on my thoughts.

i use 3d max. i got it under the assumption i could make a model there and throw it into poser. i was under a mishapprehention lol.  it's taking me a long time to get the hang of it. nearly finished my first head. once the full figure is done i have to take it to poser and rig it there. if i rig it in max it means i just have to rig it again anway if i wish to make it suitable for poser. all that said i love max.  i think i've been on the head for over a month now, scrapped the first two cos they looked like the elephant man. lmao. at  least this one looks semi huminoid hehe. all i can say is use any tools you get the chance to use. try and learn the hardest first. you'll find it helps when using the others. most modelling is done using poly's and splines. i think max is the best tool for these though some who use maya may disagree. spend 6 moths  getting to know max then delve into the others. max has a big learning curve but it does get easier the further round the curve you get.  lynda.com has some great cd tutorials, one for character modelling and one for texturing. they're well worth the money. an extra screen or pc helps as you can run the cd and work at the same time. once you actually get into using max it's more fulfiling than posr. i used poser for a short while but it wasn't for me. i was crap at the lighting and stuff

billy

That's easily a couple of thousand dollars you've invested in purchasing that software... so if you are really serious about that kind of an investment, you'd be better served by investing a few hundred more and get some real training. I'd recommend enrolling yourself in special classes, or unless that is not an option, why not buy a few training DVD's.

Cheers! — Möe

wow ... i wish i had your kind of ca$h ...

but when spending that amount of money i think it whould be smarter if you did it the other way around..

first check out whats what ..then fork out the cash ...  i wished i had 3Dmax ... i used it a while on a company system ..3D max rocks and blows away all the others ... so i say 3dMAX all the way!!

Chris

Why in the name of all that is good in this poor old over burderned earth are you asking this question?

You'v spent how much?  On software you'v not even had a go at testing yet!

You do realise in some parts of the world, in fact your own country people are dying of hunger for the want of a few Rand and you'v thown away thousands on software, you probbly won't or cant use!

You selfish little child.

Step out side of your house, look around!

Max is a walk up starter as far as I am concerned. You don't need anything else. And after spending around $4000 US on a program I would be getting my moneys worth before looking else where.

PS I assume it is around $4000 US. It is $5590 Australian with an exchange rate of $1 AUS to 75c US Approx.

Quote - Why in the name of all that is good in this poor old over burderned earth are you asking this question?

You'v spent how much?  On software you'v not even had a go at testing yet!

You do realise in some parts of the world, in fact your own country people are dying of hunger for the want of a few Rand and you'v thown away thousands on software, you probbly won't or cant use!

You selfish little child.

Step out side of your house, look around!

 

well now!!!!!!

i didnt think a question would be an invitation to a personal attack! lets get a few things straight! i worked hard and it paid off! i dont have to worry about having cash!!!! and the thing about people starving in my own country. listen man, i wise person once said that you cant expect to have money unless you are willing to give some away. i have personally paid for 10 low cost housing complexes to be built in rural areas for families to live in so dont tell me that there are people starving and i have to get out of my house!!!!! i know this!!!!! and i try and do everything i can to help those not as fortunate as i am! if you cant handle the fact that some people have a bit of money they can spend maybe you should lock yourself up somewhere and get out of this unfair world!!

so please keep your comments about people you dont know to yourself!!!!!!

thanks!

Well bully for you!

But which poor retches suffered for you to make all your money, in the first place.

The rich have always eaten from the corpses of the poor.

If you have done well for your self without the poor having to suffer for it, well good for you!

But the rich have a responsibility not to waste what they have, and you wasted your money!

i enjoy reading your garbage!!!

and clearly you dot understand how the world works! im going to go back to something my 4 year old says: "jelousy makes you nasty"

so according to you as i understand it, a person cannot make your own money without stepping on someone else or being a complete bastard? and that i wasted my money..........

gabling is wasting your money!!
buying cars and houses you dont use is wasting your money!!!

there are lots of ways to really waste your money, but buying some software to use is not really on top of my list for wasting money. i am willing to bet if i give you the specs of my home computer you will say i wasted money!

its not YOUR money! so why do you care?!?!?

O-Q ?? who the hell do you think you are? saying things like that ?

When your are such a world saver why are you using the internet? every amount of money you spent on the Inet connection YOU should sent to the people in need...

I think you'r a complete moron and should be banned from this site...its totaly insane to say to hard working people what they should do with there earned money...

I will not repley to any answer you give so dont even bother...

Now back to the real question of this thread...

Chris

I didn't say you couldn't make money!

I said that that the rich are rich becuase they feed off of the poor!

It's true!

As for jelous, me? maybe..... but i don't think so. I have every thing I need !

It's about the surplus money you have and the way you use it, wasting money on software, and doubbling up on types of software like ruana says she has done, is wastefull and I belive wrong!

I can't change what I believe! I may have been tactless the way I said it but waste is wrong!

Ruana as for your last piont, no it isn't my money, but it is my planet!

I am a Blender user. I am poor. Give me money.

Quote - I said that that the rich are rich becuase they feed off of the poor!

It's true!

Bit of a blinkered view? There are other ways to get rich, most of them involve hard work, risk taking a constant striving to reach a goal (if thats your choice). I know a fair number of people that would call me rich but I have what I have through hard work.

I would suggest that you take off those black tinted goggles and learn about others before you get out the daggers.

This is an art forum not a political one, please keep the personal attacks our of this.

There's probably 3 or 4 ways to get money: Hard work, luck (lotto or the such), inheritance (also might fall under the luck category), and being a greedy bastard (and doing illegal or unethical things to get money). So unless you really know someone, you can't say much about how they got their money or what they should do with it... And then again money isn't everything, if you're a nice guy or a real jerk - being rich or poor isn't going to change it.

Anyhow, if I had all those programs I'd try each one to figure out what works best. There's not much point in asking, because each person tends to find their own niche and what works best for them might not be so great for you.

Goes back to sitting by the cardboard "will 3D model for food" sign while using Wings3d on the ol' lappy.

isn't this a 3d forum?

cut the poverty crap if you wanna crusade go to the charity forums. this isn't  a place to distinguish rich from poor  or what people should and shouldn't do with their money. fuck the poor and fuck the rich in this context. stop attacking people, you don't know anything about.

it's her fuckin planet too, it;'s my planet. well get off your arse and do something constructive instead of preaching your views on a site that's inappropiate to do so.

the woman asked a simple question about software, she didn't ask how you think she should help the impoverished. go beat your drum somewhere else, i hate condescending bastards...not that i'm saying you're one of course but you do give one food for thought

billy

        Well this is getting to be an interesting discussion.  All large 3D programs have large learning curves so it will be a while before you really are up to speed on Max or C4D. I think another approach is get one big program and a few differnet modelers so you can find a way to model things to fit your workflow. Get Silo or Mondo download wings and then model there it is a bit easier and then learn rendering rigging in C4D or Max.  You have to look seriously at what you want to do with it too.

I agree with everything billy423uk wrote, and I'm definitely a lefty. There's plenty of injustice in the world, but it's systemic and isn't going to be solved by personal attacks on individuals, in forums like this or anywhere else.

As to the original enquiry, it's most unlikely (but maybe not impossible) that somebody could fully master two complex 3D progs like Max and C4D, so maybe try them out at first but then concentrate on developing skilled expertise on just one of those two.

Vue and Bryce are not primarily modelers so a similar approach to those two would be useful.

      O-Q While it is a nice sentiment people spend much more on things that are much more useless. Some examples a watch can cost more than that rims for your car. So if someone has the cash and a passion for 3d why not. I do think it is a bit much but there are many things people waste more on.  At least this will help advance the ability of the programs to do things. In a way I can almost applaud it most people with the means spend on something that will help status like the watch etc. Pleanty of hobby guitar players have expensive rigs too that cost close to the same. I view it as no different.

As I was reading this post I started to think it was a joke. How could anyone have those views that O-Q espouses. Hey O-Q, I am a self made millionaire who got that way helping people- yes helping people, ya know the less fortunate.  In addtiion I donate to many worthwhile causes like pediatric AIDS, woman with breast cancer, hurricane Katrina, etc... I understand your sentiment about "the rich are rich becuase they feed off of the poor", all you have to do is look around to find the opposite. Just open both eyes man!

While I would not have bought all the software Ruana has, that is his business. I'm sure if we looked at your spending we could find some waste, or are you perfect?

So O-Q just chill and be more constructive in your opinions or don't post. An angry person always loses as evidenced by all the responses to your intial post. 

PLEASE BE CIVIL TO ONE ANOTHER. There is no need to get overly upset, outraged or otherwise antagonistic because you don't approve of someone's spending habits. This is not a forum for that. Open discussion is all well and good but personal attacks and the like are not welcome in any forum I run. So I'll say this once and only once, please be civil to your fellow members and refrain from comments that can be viewed as personal attacks.

-Teyon
3D Modeling Forum Moderator.

ruana,

Back to the subject of your original post. I haven't tried 3DS MAX in years (version 4), but when I first  started to attempt to model, I found C4D to be much more intuitive than 3DS MAX.  Either one can provide just about anything you need. Pick a simple project to model, and try build it in both 3DS and C4D.  You'll know immediately which one works best for you. Don't try to learn both at once!  Learning either one is no simple task.

Vue and Bryce are primarily landscape programs. I don't use either one, but Vue is definitely the more advanced of the two, and e-on has X-Stream which makes Vue a plugin for either C4D or 3DS MAX.  This means that you can "use Vue" directly in either C4D or 3DS MAX. 

So I would recommend that first you focus on learning either C4D or 3DS (which ever app. "feels" best), and once you get your head around the one you pick, begin working on learnig Vue (or if your more interested in making landsacpe renders - start with Vue then go on to C4D or 3DS).

Good Luck!

To be constructive.

I would say try hexagon, if your used to poser and the like as the work flow will feel more intuative!

It seems Caligari always has older versions of Truespace on sale...

In answer to your first question regarding what's easier, as general rule, the deeper programs (Max/C4D, of the ones you've mentioned) will have steeper learning curves. Poser and Vue are specialty 3D apps. Unlike the others you've recently purchased, you can't model in them (to any significant degree). Obviously you can create with them but you wouldn't use them to build models for instance (other than terrains in Vue). C4D and Max are full featured. You can model, render (texture) and animate. A good question to ask yourself is what you want to do or what your objectives are in 3D. I don't see any real advantage to learning C4D and Max. That's two massive programs to learn that do most of the same things. That's not to suggest that one isn't better suited to some things over the other but that's where deciding your objectives come in. Even if you have the resources to purchase what you like it would probably still be a good idea to have an idea about what is it you want to do with 3D. Others can debate whether or not you have "wasted" any money or not but even if money is not an issue your still talking about a huge time commitment if you really plan to learn all those apps. I would be thinking more in terms of the time you're going to have to put into this since money appears not to be an object. Deep

If your in a spending mood please buy me an upgrade to Maya 8 while you are at it lol. Just joking. And for all you people talking smack to ruana get your facts straight. South Africa isnt a poor country at all. Yes there is poor people but there are also poor people here in Florida as well as everywhere else in the world. Its just a fact of life. He has every right to spend his hard earned money the way he see's fit. Better spent on software that could advance his career than some stupid flashy gizmo for his car or Jewelry that he wears once a year.

Back to the subject matter. I think Max should be all you ever need. Ive never used Cinema so I cant really compare the two but Max is a verry well rounded package that can do just about anything that you need it to. If not there is always a plugin for it. The learning curve may be a little steep as with any highend 3d software but if you have patience you should work past that realitivly easy. I prefer Maya over any package aside for a few exceptions such as silo for modeling but since you already have Max you should stick with that since its just as good but has a little bit of a funky interface in my opinion.

A few other software options that are verry helpfull  that you may also want to invest in are Silo and Zbrush. Dispite the low price of 109 usd Silo is in my opinion the best modeling package out right now. and Whenever version 2 is released should be even better. It is far better than Maya or Max for organic modeling especially. Zbrush is another piece of software that you must try. Both of these software are used to compliment your main package and give you much better results in a much faster time. Granted its more software to learn but both of these are verry easy to pick up and start using from the get go.

A supplemental modeler is always useful. Silo is a good choice Wings is cool because it is good and .....Free. (Don't laugh there are a number of Maya users that do most of their modeling in wings go figure after spending 7K they use a freeware program for modeling. ) Get yoru head aroudn the modelign end of stuff. Get soem books put some WIP's on soem better sites where people are not afraid to give real criticism.