I've gotten Blender last week and starting to learn the basics.

I've bee praticing by making Logos for fellow artist (see gallery). But I really purfer to creating models. But that'll be useless if I can'e pose them.

 I've managed to create a simple Spider Model with Spheres. The Body is one object and each part (except the elbows) are seperate objects. As seen here Hosted by Image Shack:

 http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/3167/b3dsrsl3.jpg

 

 I've figured out how to aliegn the bones and joints. But I can't for the life of me figure out how to connect the Armiture to the Objects. Every time I try to pose the bones, the Model (and it's seperate objects) stay put.  They just refuse to move.

 I've Searched the internet for Tuts, but NONE of them acturally explain how to fix my problem. And Each Tut has different ScreenShots that show Bones with a different look to them then the ones I see. The ones I see loof VERY fimilar to the legs of my Spider Model. Except the bones have joint spheres at both ends of the bones.

 Can someone PLEASE help? I hate useing Bryce5 to pose the spider.

 http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/41738085/?qo=5&q=by%3Asespider&qh=sort%3Atime+-in%3Ascraps

i still cant,  figure out why you are exporting to bryce.  i am no expert at armatures but try this select the object you want to apply the armature to.  go into object mode go into the editing tab (picture of a box with verticies)  then click add modifiers under the modifiers panel.  select armature.  once you have selected armature type in the name of the armature object you wish to apply (caps matter).  i dont think this is the full solution to the problem but it is definitly part of it

Whoah, it's a modifier now?  I've still been using parenting (still works though).

Is your spider model more than one object?  That would be a problem too.

i am fairly sure that the modifier method (using falloff for bone verticy selection method) can work on multiple objects easily and seamlessly. infact, that each segment is its own object might actualy help to create that segmented spider look rather than having the joints bend smothly as would normaly do if the mesh was one object.  however like i said, i am still learning (not even doing much of that) about using bones in blender.  using bones in animation master was way to easy and thus spoiled me into getting ADD attacks whever attempting to learn bones in any other program.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/rrfilelock/download.php?fileid=27237&key=5138

Ooh, you're right, it *does* allow multiple objects!  The deformation wouldn't really be a problem with a single mesh since you can just use vertex groups, not envelopes--in fact, either way for something like this you should just use vertex groups since everything is spheres.

SEspider:  Since I've been playing with it a bit, I'm attaching a file.  Take a look and see if it makes sense to you.

What I did is create some spheres like how your spider's joints are set up and an armature with two bones, one for each leg segment.  The spheres are all separate objects.  I selected each sphere and added an Armature modifier to it, then typed the name of the armature in the OB: box.  (In this case it was called "Armature"--creative, eh?) I also deselected the "Envelope" option, but I suggest you try reselecting it on all spheres object to see what happens so you can see why I did that.

Since I deselected the Envelope option I have to create vertex groups for all the objects.  I selected the top one, went to edit mode and selected all vertices.  In the Edit panel in the Links and Materials area there is a "Vertex Groups" label with some buttons underneath.  I clicked the "New" button under that label (not the one over to the right!) and renamed the group from "Group" to "Bone.001", which is the name of the top bone, then hit "Assign" to add the selected vertices to that group.  I did the same for the other two spheres, but the group names for those were "Bone", which is the name of the bottom bone in the armature.

All the spheres are also parented to the armature (as an object, not as an armature) which means moving the armature will move all of them.  This isn't really a necessary step, but it's convenient.

If all your spheres are in a single mesh never fear, armatures will still work.  There will just be a single object to add a modifier to, and all the vertex groups will be the same (top sphere for top bone, other two spheres for bottom bone) but they will all be within the same mesh.

Finally got a chance to try these. Unfortaintly, half of what you two said completely went over my head. What I did understand, didn't work. :(

I'm a COMPLETE NOOB with Blender. And I really hate to ask this of you, but I kinda have no choice. Sorry.

Since I'm a NOOB, can you, please, give Simple Step-By-Step intructions frfom start to finish with the sample you provided? I currently have no idedea how to give names to different parts of an object. I typed in the name of the file, (when the full set of objects selected) but nothing happened.

Once again, So sorry. And MUCH appreciated.

 Thanks, Richard

No problem.  I thought you might have problems with the naming in particular but I was too lazy to write in more detail ;)

So, once again, with pictures!

This won't quite match the file that's up for download since I'm doing it again, but it'll still work.

step 1

Go to top view (numpad 7), delete the default square, and add a sphere (space-->mesh-->uvsphere).  You can keept the default number of vertices (32 and 32), it doesn't really matter for this. Do not leave edit mode (tab) just yet.

Go to front view (numpad 1).  We're going to scale it on all dimensions except for z.  Hit the "s" key, then hold shift and hit the "z" key.  Now type ".25" (without the quotation marks, of course) and hit enter.

Leave edit mode (tab) and move the sphere object down one unit by typing "g", then "z" followed by "-1" (again, no quotation marks) and hit enter.

Now make another one and move it up above the x-axis.  Shift-d will create a duplicate and put you in "grab" mode, so hit z to constrain the motion to the z-axis and type 2, then enter.  Now you have 2 spheres, one above the other.

Go to top view again (numpad 7) and create another sphere, then scale it along all axes to 25%--space, add-->mesh-->uvsphere, ok, ok, then hit the "s" key and type .25 and hit enter.

Leave edit mode and go to front view.  You should have something like the picture above.

Stay in front view and in object mode.  Hit z to take you out of shaded mode so you can see what you're doing.  Add an armature (space, add-->armature). This will put you in edit mode.  Select the bottom circle of the armature and move it down by 2 units (g, z, -2), then select the top circle and move it down by one unit (g, z, -1).  Leave the top circle selected and hit the "e" key--this creates a second bone that is connected to the first one *.  Move the end of that bone up by two units so it is at the top of the top sphere.  You should have something like the picture above at this point.

• Note that you can also add bones without extruding, but they won't be connected to other bones.  This is good for creating multiple legs or things like that where you want them starting at different points and not dependent on one another.

Stay in edit mode.  Select a bone by clicking on the portion between the circular endpoints.  You could also select it by selecting both of the endpoints.  Open the edit panel below the 3d window.  You should be able to find the name of the armatue object and the name of the bone selected (see image).  If you select all bones (a key) you will see the names of all of the bones.

The first bone created will be called "Bone" and the second one will be called "Bone.001".  The name of the object is probably "Armature".  Every type of object has an object name and a mesh/curve/armature name in the Link and Materials panel.  We're just worrying about the OB: one right now.  Remember these names so you can set up your vertex groups and the armature modifier later.

The first bone you created, the bottom bone, is the beginning of the chain of bones.  It is the parent of the top bone.  Next to the top bone you will see "child of" and a drop list that shows the name of the bottom bone.

You should probably look at the manual to see what the other buttons do.  The manual may or may not be up to date on these, I dont actually know.

Leave edit mode (tab key).  Select one of the spheres.  In the edit buttons, go to Modifiers panel and click the Add Modifier button.  Click on the Armature option.  In the box under the new armature modifier that starts with Ob: type in "Armature", which is the name of your armature object that we looked at before.  Click on the "Envelopes" button to deselect it.  For something like this you don't need it.  Actually, I avoid it most of the time, it never does quite what I want.

Do the same thing for each of the other spheres.

Now select the bottom sphere and go into edit mode (tab).  Select all vertices and then go to the "link and materials" panel in the edit buttons.  On the left side of the panel it says "Vertex Groups".  Click on the "New" button directly below that label to create a new group.  Two new boxes pop up.  The top one should say something like "Group".  Click in there and change the name of the group to the name of the bottom bone, which you looked up before.  The name is probably "Bone", so call your group "Bone".

Underneath that box is a box for the weight of the group.  In this case we will want it to be 1, on other cases where you want the bone to deform the mesh you might want some other value or you might need to use weight paint mode.  Don't worry about that right now, just make sure it says 1.

Make sure all your vertices are selected, then hit the Assign button.

Leave edit mode and do exactly the same thing for the small middle sphere.  These two objects will now follow the bottom bone when you move or rotate it in pose mode (more on that later).

The top sphere is set up almost exactly the same, except we want it to follow the top bone instead of the bottom one.  Do everything the same, except when you change the name of the group, change it to "Bone.001" (the name of the top bone) instead of "Bone".

If you're still in edit mode, leave edit mode (tab key).  Select the armature and hit Ctrl-tab.  You are now in Pose Mode.  The armature should now be blue.  You can leave pose mode by hitting Ctrl-tab again.

Select the top bone and rotate it (r key).  The top sphere should go with it, the others should stay still.  You should get something like the image above.  Try rotating the bottom bone too, all spheres should move.  When you leave edit mode everything should stay posed.

AWSOME!! Thanks. Can't wait to try it.

If it makes sense let me know, I'll stick it in the tutorials section

It worked GRRRRRRRREAT!! Thanks TONS so Very Much!

 That's the good news. The bad news is that (because it was my very 1st try at modeling) I used NURBS Sphere to make everything. Beacuse of that, the "Links and Materials" section doesn't show what I need append them to bones. So I'm gonna have to re-modedl the entire spider from scratch. >_<  But since I was planing to do that anyway, it's no big.

 When you post it in the Tut's section, point out that it only works with MESHes. I also suggest making the tut downloadable  (Photoshop or Reader format). That way, members can share it with their offline friends. Oh and feel free to use any images I posted for your tut.

 anyway, Most diffently add this to the Tuts section. It's BADLY needed. ^_^

 Thanks again.

-Richard

Whoah, hang on, you shouldn't have to remodel it even if it doesn't work for nurbs.

There has to be a way to rig nurbs, it would be a serious shortcoming if there isn't one, but even if there isn't you can convert a nurbs object to a mesh in object mode with the "Objects" menu, "Convert Object Type"

Don't have time to look into it right now, maybe later this week.

Made a quick remodel of the spider's body and added the armature.

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/4218/spiderpreviewdr9.jpg

 

 I figured out that I can have add a bone to only part of the spider's er...butt. But asfter connecting the rest of the ..Butt to another boe, the rest of it left the bone it was originally connected to. Is that what the "Expend" is for?

Oops! I mean "Envelope"

Not really sure what your problem is, more pictures would help.

What envelopes do is create a zone of influence around the bone.  The bone will affect everything within a certain distance of the bone, and it will affect vertices that are closer more than it will affect the ones that are further away.  It's good for creating nice transitions from one bone to another if you've got two bones affecting the same mesh, say if you've got an elbow you can get a nice bend.  If you use one vertex group for each of the bones and the weights are set at 1 for all the vertices in the group you'll get really ugly bends in something like an elbow; here it is fine because everything is separate.  If you use envelopes you do not have to set up vertex groups.

Personally I don't like using envelopes very much, I find they affect parts that I don't want to be affected by the bone and they don't affect parts of what I want to move so I get strange squashing affects.  I may just need to combine them with vertex groups and it would work, but it seems like using vertex groups and vertex paint mode is easier.

You can have multiple bones affecting the same mesh by using multiple vertex groups, and you can get smooth transitions with vertex groups too.  That's what the "weight" thing that I mentioned in the tutorial but told you to ignore does.  Something that has a weight of 1 in a group will be affected 100% by the corresponding bone.  When the bone moves it will move.  Something with a weight of 0 (or something that is not in the group) will not be affected by the bone.  Something with a weight of .5 will move about half as much as the bone does.  Vertices can also belong to two groups and have a weight of 1 in each--this means that its position when bones are posed will be an average of the two.  (Yeah, it can get kinda complicated)  That might be related to the problem you were having with your spider's body.

For single-mesh joints I like to pose bones then select the mesh and go to weight paint mode and modify the weights at the joints until I get a bend that I like.

Alt-C will convert your nurbs into a mesh.

Excellent info, haloedrain!

I hate to ask this after all the help, you've provided, but I have no choice.

 How do you EXPORT the Armature WITH your Model for use in other programs like 3DS Max7 and Maya? I already know that 3DS format doesn't work.
 I ask because I've made a Character Model but need to export to 3DS Max7 for adding to the game (Halo: CE).

 I would just model and armature in 3D Max7, but I just can't figure that fustrating program out. So I'm exporting for someone else to import for game use.

Wow this is nice work man. I highly reccommend using the .x format for use in games. It supports armatures data.  md2 is another popular format , but it stores keyframes as animations. Prolly just ask what engine your friend is using and see what formats it likes. Some engines (like ogre) have thier own blender script for exporting.

Thanks. I'll try it. Hope it works. I'll let you know.
Great Avitar, by the way. ^_^

Thought I should post the reson I decided to re-model my Spider from scratch. Well, the original just didn't fit for what I have planed for it. The NEW dedsign is a COMPLETE overhaul of the original. The new one more resembles my Online Name, and will fit in nicely with my plans.
 The image below is a model WITHOUT final materials, textures, or even an armeture. The Armeture will be added sone and the segments connected. I'll then worry about everything else.
 One of the first things you'll notice about the body is that it's not a triditional spider. It has ONE LARGE eye and a neck. I added these because it's creapier and weirder. The "BUTT" will not be largely connected to the skull and will move indedpendent from it. The spider's torso and the front part of it's butt will connect to the skull via green silk. I've still gotta figure out how to do that part.
 Anyway, Once I've finished everything, I'll post a posed image of it with other objects. I would like to think haloedrain for her tut (above) on Armeture, oodmb for his much help and tuts that I'll be using later in the final image, and GreenSat for his constent support and incoragement. I couldn't do this without all of your help. Thank You So Very Much!

-Richard

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1387047

For tutorials on the above you can also check http://mediawiki.blender.org. They not only have a number of tutorials, but they have a manual -- a work in progress, for ever ... it is never done.

Thanks. I'll be sure to check it out.

I finished rigging the model and adding the materials and such. Also created a scene for it. I've figured out what's been causeing the Grainess in the render. But now something is preventing the program from rendering. Just gives a black image. It's weird but I have a few ideas to try. Hopfully one will work.
 In the mean time here's a close up of the model frrom my posted image (see Blender gallery). try to ignore the lack of detail in the eye. It's been fixed as has the pencil. Oh and the paper has the original doodles of the character on it. ^_^

Blender
http://www.deviantart.com/download/49351612/
**

Edited In Photoshop
** Hope I got the shadows looking real enough.
http://www.deviantart.com/download/49351297/

GRRRRRR. This is being a real pain. Any ideas why it's doing this? I copied the armature so you can see it. All of the parts have the correct Bone info and all. It just doesn't want to work correctly. This model has been a BIG pain to work with, but I need it and I need it to have a Armature. PLEASE HELP?!?!

It is hard to tell. It looks correct at the bottom. To fix the harsh bend, try making your groups overlap some. The bad stretch at the top looks like it could be grouped to the wrong bone. If you want, you could post this section in a .blend file somewhere and I could look at it ?