Attached Link: http://www.mitch3dseite.de

Had to share this brief comment from a Master Artist, Master Model-Maker and "Vue Master"- (Hope he doesn't mind- It's from the comments area on the Renderosity Front Page, Vue 4 Announcement... MAY 17, 2001 "Hello I'm a Beta-tester from Vue 4. And I can tell you....THIS IS THE BEST RENDER PROGRAM WHATEVER I HAVE SEE..... Many many new Features....very Great.... Bye Mitch www.mitch3dseite.de" Having read this, anyone who hasn't been convinced, should be. Mitch is also a long time Brycer and user of other 3D software, like some of the rest of us. Visit his website to be blown away with talent, intelligence and fantastic free undersea models, textures, etc...

That's all we get??? :) But you are right, Mitch is absolutely brilliant at this work...

Uh, Mitch...are you supposed to be spilling that yet? Hmmm..... Laurie

Yup, a good endorsement. If Mitch likes it, it's gotta be good. :)

The question is, is which will be better...Vue 4, or Bryce 5? We know basically nothing about Bryce 5...Corel's not talking, and neither are the Bryce 5 beta-testers (as they are not supposed to give out any specifics). From the Vue website, we can see Vue 4 will kick major butt, just being able to open .pz3 files directly into Vue 4 makes it worthy...I guess we will have to wait and see. Too bad Mitch isn't beta-testing both...(he isn't, is he?) AgentSmith

EXCELLENT! V4 or Bryce 5? I dunno, but I'd be betting on Vue and e-on from here on out. Something about Corel I just don't trust....

If Corel has decided to keep Bryce's dreadful, confusing and totally unforgiving interface (my reason for leaving Bryce and moving to Vue) than Vue has my vote bar nothing. Bryce never really impressed me that much, too limiting and confusing. Nice skies though have to admit. Slow render engine. Best wishes Jody

I'm pretty much with Jody. The very reason I left it on the shelf was the interface. Nothing made sense with it, and just forget the material editor! WAY too confusing. Laurie

I Guess one also should not forget about Worldbuilder 3.0 which will be released within a week or two, (www.digi-element.com). Its price for the standard version is obviously dropped from 999 USD to 399 USD. If I cant decide I might have to get them both (Vue + WB)... Enjoy the Sunshine in Life Ole

Really?????!!!! Only 400 bucks?! Fantastic! That's within the realm of possibility (for me anyhow). I may just have to soften up the hubby some then.... ;) Laurie

I agree that Bryce's interface is confusing, yes the material editor is next to impossible to learn, but other then that, I kind of don't mind the other parts of the interface, once you get used to the layout it can be very efficient to use, think Blender. But I like Vue better, so don't jump on me :) better renderer, and I can actually use the material editor, which I would like to say is amazing, so many possiblities!!! Bryce is a good package though, it has its own unique interface, and a slow renderer, but its still good software, I don't trust Corel either though, especially the way with each release of there CorelDraw/Photo..package they drop or add a program...sigh is it just me or does anyone else think that metacreations was stupid to drop there products...well at least there still is Carrara.

Carrara was sold off, too. Eovia picked it up. I wonder if Eovia will give it an interface that a person could actually use. I think Bryce's GUI is difficult and confusing, but Carrara's is much, much worse! (IMHO)

I know:) thats why there is more hope, eovia, is owned by the same people who developed and built metacreations software, 3D Studio MAX thats a confusing interface:), oooooh thats where the modeling tools are...hmmmm behind those..ok

Well, I remember a couple of years ago, I saw this picture on the web of a bridge high up between 2 mountain tops, with a river underneath, vegetation and stuff... It was realistic , but not quite real, had vegetation it was a great picture... It was at a 3d gallery... Below it said that this was done with Bryce... I wanted to do pictures like that...:) I still dig Bryce... Bryce got me into the whole 3d thing and allowed me to do a lot of stuff... I got into all aspects of it, so I don't think that there's anything wrong with the interface, or the deep texture editor... But then again, I come from an audio background, where I have to edit wav files, and keep track of numbers, and process this and that, do a lot of number crunching, so anything with pictures is a real treat... :) Then I found about Vue recently and yes, there are a lot of things about Vue that are better than Bryce and vice versa... Certainly, vue is easier in many respects and less cumbersome... Also, it has a certain quality that Bryce doesn't have... I look forward to the new Vue cause it seems to have a lot of the things vue is missing, for my tastes anyway...

Bryce would have been as popular as Vue 3.1 as it is now if only it render as faster and vegetation feature as flexible as Vue. It is an excellent program and somewhat, the rendering output of certain layout that Bryce produce, Vue can't. Well, I too do not like the GUI, Why can't they be just a simple direct approach thing. I mean its well done and up to date fashsionable and texhkie looking. They should have an option to choose between various GUI type setting. Hmmmmm....wonder any Corelian from CDR is reading stuff here....Bryce user may be?

Tesign- Like the "Corelian" thing. Great story line- "Once a promising young prince, Bryce-the-younger was sold off by the nitwit goombah MetaCreators, the beaver-skin clad Corelians of the Great North took it to their frozen lair... But juiced on tons of Moosehead brewski from far too many wild Mike Cowpland-the-extravagant feasts, the once High Corelians of Canuckia have allowed the Quick and Fast New Vuesters of Paree to HOSE their chances of crowning young Bryce the King of Lowcost 3D Land... Actually I'm mixing sci-fi and myths & ledgend genre's here. Too much of that great French VUE Champagne, I think. (Note, not Champaigne, that's a town in Illinois, right Varian?...)

Right, Champaign Illinois, where I'm sure at least someone drinks champagne. :) And hey... ...wild Mike Cowpland-the-extravagant... This wouldn't be a veiled reference to our MOD Bull, would it? ;)

No, it's Wild Michael Cowpland, former founder and CEO of Corel. Got himself in some real hot-water and had to resign from Corel. Also look in Poser FREE STUFF and SEARCH for "Queen of Corel" and you will learn part of the reason... Too bad, because I would love to use the term "Corel Cowplanderers" or "Corelian Cowplandarians" to describe the "Corelian World" at Corel Corp. But since he's left, Corelia has calmed down somewhat. Question now is, is the "juice" still in the Bryce 5 programmers, or, are they just "going through the motions" for a "few dollars more"? (That means, grabs some upgrade bucks among the Brycer Die-Hards, but not REALLY deliver the GOODS...) I think- VUE 4 has stolen their thunder (and lighting)...

Cowpland...hmmm...the day I had Corel version 4 and started subscribing to the Corel magazine, all I know and saw about him is "tennis" and his smile that goes with the picture.

WHAT!? I left my 2 cents like 14 messages ago...but now have I read SO MANY messages about Bryce's CONFUSING interface...confusing???? Huh?..am I truly from Mars here? I "Dislike" Vue because of it's interface, (It's looks like EVERY other 3D program) and I LOVE Bryce because it's (interface). Hey, I'm not angry folks, just wildly bewildered, lol. Probably the only reason I was finally brave enough to take the plunge into 3D at all was Poser's and Bryce's interface, No other program of ANY type has "flowed" so well, (for me) everything is logical and simple and leaves my brain to ONLY do creative thinking, instead of trying to figure out the original programmer's logic of where THEY might put something. The interface is hands on, not (confused) brains on, almost instant gratification, not a lot of number punching. I do admit I finally had to truly read my manual when it came to the Materials Editor, but almost everything else was second nature to me. Yet, I do admit I am known as the weird one in my family, so maybe that is why I like the Bryce interface WAY batter, so there, lol. But...In the end, it's not the tool that makes the art, it is the artist, it's not what program you have, it's what you can do with it. I have seen, well...not so great art in these galleries from say, 3D Studio Max, (a $3,500.00 program), then I have seen AMAZING art from Bryce that inspires me more than anything, and it costs $200.00. Yet, maybe there is a reason there is 902 Vue pics in the gallery, and almost 9,823 Bryce pictures. (and 14,683 Poser pics). But...I do bet one thing...I bet there will be a LOT more Vue (4) pics rolling in, in the future. Which leads me to this... My second 2 cents; "Bryce 5 had better be able to stand up to Vue 4 in at least some ways...or it may get slowly squashed". (And, I will be learning a new interface) AgentSmith

Well, the reason there are 10 times more Bryce pics probably has more to do with the fact that Bryce has been around longer, and had a major software company behind it's development and distribution. E-on is a relatively young company, and Vue 3 has only been out for I think a little over a year, maybe a year and a half. Anyhow, I actually LOVE Bryce's interface. Especially that trackball camera--ESPECIALLY! I'm actually a little irritated with Vue's interface from time to time, but Vue 4 shows promise in that it seems to have fixed all the things I didn't like about it. Bryce 4 is one major ass-kickin' program, and don't beleive that many of us here don't know that. Having both Bryce and Vue installed currently though I have to say that I'm willing to forget about the trackball camera in favor of Vue for mostly it's ease in material editing, it's Solid Growth plants, and it's considerably quicker rendering speed. Bryce has had the volumetric effects over Vue for a while now, but Vue 4 does have volumetrics. I don't want to see this turn into a Vue/Bryce comparison thread though. Bryce is still way-cool in MY book!

I've been using Vue for over two years, and I only began with version 2, so Vue has been around for awhile. My guess on why there are more Brycers here is because R'osity was originally set up as a Poser group, and way back when, a couple Poser users discovered Bryce and passed that news along to other Poser users. It became nearly synoymous to say "I use Poser" also meaning "I use Bryce." It also had some to do with MetaCreations housing both Poser and Bryce. They also had Ray Dream, but RDS was touted as a "modeler" while Bryce was the "landscape generator" -- the latter of which most Poser users were anxious for. Althought both Vue and Bryce are reasonably priced, there are a lot of folks who consider $200-$250 to be a major investment. I think most of those persons will stick with Bryce simply because they've already been working with it and don't feel they can afford two programs. I have both programs, but for me, Bryce's interface is confusing. There's no right-click for anything, I don't remember seeing any tool-tips, and almost none of the icons are marked. I can't use Bryce without having the manual open, and even then I can't really do anything with it, like actually make a picture. I don't like having to memorize each and every icon and then trying to remember them again for later use. Maybe because I'm old and senile, but I'd prefer to have some tool-tip reminders or some right-click options in order to have some clues right at hand. All that aside, I'm not against Bryce. Like AgentSmith said above, it's not the tool that makes the art, it's what the artist does with it. If you have a vision to follow, just keep following it, and it doesn't matter if you're using Bryce or Vue or Poser or Maya or pencil and paper. You will get closer to your original version if you're comfortable with the tools you're using, though, and I'm just very comfortable using Vue. :)

Yes, a very much to each his own kind of stuff. Best is to do what you can do best in. I heard of Vue 2 when it was out but never bought it because it was not 'useable' with Poser. Then, I read about 2.1 able to do so and was just tagging along and knew that Vue 3 was around the bend. At that time, I already had Bryce but never quite use it at all. It was just too time consumming with the render and being a 2d artist, it hard to accept that kind of wait time. A complex 'rendering' wait time with a filter plugin would almost 'kill' me already. When Vue 3 was release, I never even tried the Vue 2 demo and it was an investment I never regret. What I fear now is that, expecting too much from Vue 4 may turn out to be disappointing, so jsut have to wait and see. Bryce 5...what's going with it, wish I know.

Hello, I am new to Vue 3, while having Bryced ever since Bryce "came to PC". While there are a lot of things that (currently) Bryce 4 can do, that Vue cannot.... I am so thrilled with the "vegitation" in Vue 3 (HAD to splurge to get the vegitation bundle!)... and how when you assign the (for example) grass material to the ground plane and a mountain in vue- it will go up so naturally onto the mountain terrain!!!! I have found that in Bryce there still may be a separation between the ground material and the mountain material, even when it is the same... BUT now with the sneak peek at Vue 4's rather "bryce like" new terrain editor, I am wondering if it is going to have this same "fault" in it??? I am very comfortable with the bryce interface, as it is very visual...and I also have never been a mac user (mac converted programs have a lot of "right clicks"...like trueSpace where one HAS to right click all over to FIND tools.. ugh!) I also found that vue 3 has a super easy "jump in and do without reading the manual" interface! :) I am trying a vue image that will show what I mean about the ground and terrian materials meeting seamlessly....hope to show it here...

Hi sparkel, Nice to hear your input on this, and am looking forward to seeing your picture! :)

Wow, that macaw is beautiful, really! And this certainly is a fine picture to "house" him in. :) I know what you mean about the vegetation and the non-anti-aliasing; I too think that sometimes it can look better without. As for the materials, try selecting the "Mix materials" setting in the material editor, and then checking the box which says to the effect of "materials are dependent on local altitude and slope", and then clicking on the tab which specifies "influence of environment", which appears after checking off the altitude dependence box. I'm sorry if that sounds confusing, but I'm working from memory alone right now, since I actually have a Vue pic rendering at the moment. yeah, I know, that's one of those, "thou shalt not multi-task" sort of things, but why not, eh? ;) What I mean though is, just play around with the materials some---soon you will see just how versatile Vue is. Of course also, ask anything you want! And I almost forgot: this picture is lovely! :) -Mike

thanks Mike! :) Not sure I can follow what you said, but I will copy paste it out to study when I am "vueing"! :) Also, I am also going to delete my image/post from this thread and put it in it's own thread as it is not really the subject of this one... I really need to BUILD a vue web site, but I wanted to make a few more images first... then it will be nicer to post a url of an image instead of putting the image here...save space for the renderosity servers! :) (I tossed my OLD bryce web site..was not happy with it)