Yes I'm still but ugly, and it's he...........Oh, you mean the V3 Character!
 
I don't think so, no not really. For what it's worth Dp, to me she actually looks a little like a barbie doll like the Original V3 and V4 do to me.

But that shouldn't really count, see I don't think there'll ever be a model that looks 100% human. I mean even when it's the big movie studios I can always tell if it's a CGI human figure.

But whats the black stuff under her eye Dp?

The black stuff under eyes is still incompletely remapped face.  It'll all be fixed in due time.
DPH

A poser figure with some "meat on their bones" and some small tiny imperfections here and there, looks more realistic to me anyways Dp.

As far as her face goes, I think she needs to be "filled" out a bit more in the face.

She looks as if she has all of her "body fat" distributed in her body, with none in her head.

And in reality the Human body doesn't do that. It sends body fat everywhere.

I would gladly offer to help you out Dp. But I only model using wings, and thats only very simple stuff at that.

I'm no where near wise and talented enough to try my hand at doing something on something so complex as a human figure.

But once she's done I might buy her!

Regards,

Daidalos

Butt ugly, and DinaV was nowhere to be seen? Well dangit...

Quote - Butt ugly, and DinaV was nowhere to be seen? Well dangit...

?????????
I live in Israel!  I've lived in Israel for the past 35 years, so I'm not up on all the nuances of speech nowadays.  Frankly, I can't quite tell whether this comment is meant to be snide ridicule, or is a left-handed form of encouragement. 

If the latter, then I really appreciate the kind sentiment.  If the former, well as my father used to say: "No accounting for taste said the old woman as she kissed the cow!"
;=D
Yours truly,
David P. Hoadley

Oh, your creation looks quite nice, I assure you! :) I like the more "everyday" proportions and appearance. One can get bored with the Victorias, y'know? :) Heck, that's why I'm a Terai Yuki 2 fan. :> Just recently picked up Miki 2, as well.. I'm convinced that there has to be a way to make her look attractive. :)

It seems as though her eyes are looking different directions. The lack of eyebrows makes it hard to judge the beauty. Everyone looks weird without eyebrows.  Still, the nose seems unusually thick and the eyes seem very wide apart.

Native Poser hair could stand some improvement.

The body looks good, for its type.  

DinaV is just another poser figure. If you search the "Rotica store you will find her. I never see anyone use her though :-)

-Sarah

I like the face you've created. (:

I think she is beautiful. Terrific job. i appreciate the variety you make available for us. it is particularly valuable for people who do animation and need different characters in scenes that are not V4 clones.
cheerio  lululee

I admire your talent in re-mapping, morphing the Poser women - Judy is getting very close to being useable - keep up the good work

Rather then remaps, why not just make plugins for the new Texture Converter 2? That might sell a LOT more, and still give the charcter the versitality that you want to add to her.

Dark Whisper has contact infor for potential plugin develpers for TC2, and supposed it only really needs remapping and uv editing skills.

Very lovely. I prefer the figure remapped to dealing with converting textures but seriously dp, it is hard to shell out money if the material zones are not set up to take standard MATposes as well as all the UV work you are doing. Would not expect much sales on this though given how the market as it is today but wow! A neat figure you are making. I like your face more too.

Dp, is there anyone who can give you advise about the unit cost per volume sales situation? I just don't know... my gut is you would do better making something popular with a low ball price and going for volume sales but actually I have no idea... I think people looking at a lower res or "older" figure would be in the low end of available discretionary spending but I really don't know.

Great work.

Heck, even new products for new figures sell VERY low numbers in some cases.

That's why I figured a plugin for TC2 might be the better way to go.. so the work is at least worthwhile doing.

Many people already have a preconceived notion the figure is ugly, and they dislike it for that reason.

While I wish you well in your endeavor, personally as a commercial project I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.

Quote - Heck, even new products for new figures sell VERY low numbers in some cases.

That's why I figured a plugin for TC2 might be the better way to go.. so the work is at least worthwhile doing.

Many people already have a preconceived notion the figure is ugly, and they dislike it for that reason.

While I wish you well in your endeavor, personally as a commercial project I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.

Agreed on all points

it's hard for me to tell if the model is any good without a professional render,
using something other than FFRender and a blank scene.

I like her the way she is, getting tired of everyone wanting all the models to be beautiful. The reason I use her and SP3 is for variety, walk down the street not everyone is a V3. I agree with the UTC usage to give her more options on the skins, but think the base product should be left alone. I personally don't think they are butt ugly just different. And Dina is still in my runtime, never did buy DinaV for the same reason I wouldn't buy this one. But to each his own. Not meaning to be snide just giving my opinion.

It's not a matter of pleased, or even caring at all.. it's really a non issue for me, since I never use the character at all.

My only thoughts were to make it possibly a viable commercial product for you, nothing more or less.

it;s nifty to see that some people can take old content and repurpose it for newer improved use, but when I already have new and improved content already, it just becomes an interesting nostalgia thing, and I suspect many others will share that same feeling.

I'm sure users who DO already use the older figures might like it, but I also suspect those users are very few in number.

We do exist however.

But do you exist in numbers to make his work time worthwhile as a commercial venture? THAT's the real question.

And how many people use Judy because she was free, and wouldn;t pay for an upgrade anyway? (We are seeing a LOT of new DS users in the community that think everything should be $1 or free.)

Also, now we are also seeing people who think that Daz is a content platform, and wonder if poser content can be used along with thier Daz stuff.

and does it matter to him? from the reply "Ah well, since I can't please everybody, I might as well just worry about pleasing myself." I'd say not.

Gareee, there's more to life than money. it's nice your so concerned.. but.. he's not worried... why are you? you say 'But do you exist in numbers to make his work time worthwhile as a commercial venture? THAT's the real question.' - your're the only person asking it!

He mentioned this was a commercial venture, not me, and asked what we thought about the idea. I answered his question. What's your beef with that? I'm not entitled to my opinion?

(Hmm.. maybe I missed that new rendo regulation?  (Snicker!)

erm no, just that your preaching.... I was wondering why you were.

Boredom? ;)

Actually I just saw an oppertunity do this alternately with the new texture convertor, and judy is even on the list of potential candidates for a plugin (Though she's almost at the bottom of the list I think.)

From what dark whisper told me, if you can remap the figure to another's uv mapping, they can then put that through a utility that creates the plugin.

Since TC2 has the spotlight for some time (and seems to be performing quite welll by accounts), that would be a better way to breathe life into an older figure, I'd think.

People are also looking for V2 and M2 conversion as well.

Khai,

I'm not usually one to interfere in Rendonista mutual nit-picking (I am mighty guilty of that myself ) but the OP is clear:

 *I figure ... my P5JudyV3 should also have some buyers.
*...
Your opinions are hereby solicited.

Gareee was just giving his opinion on what the phrase "some buyers" is likely to mean. Given that texture conversion with TC2 is potentially "universal", I'd rather buy that than buy just one re-mapped character. Of course I don't buy much of anything and sell nothing , so what do I know? Heheheh.

DP:

Your figure is nice but your renders are not. I agree with Miss Nancy. If you're going to be a "pro" and sell stuff, then you should upgrade your demos.

Are you still on Poser 5? If you're on Poser 6 or 7, then download my VSS and apply a good set of shaders to the figure. It's just a couple clicks.

Personally I think she looks gross but that's just my opinion. Just because something is free doesn't mean it's good, and just because you try to make something look like V3 doesn't mean it's good either. I'm not saying don't do it, just don't act like everyone should love it just because it's a labor of love to you. Garee just stated his opinion as he is allowed to do here. You stated yours as well. I was under the impression that we are not supposed to advertise here for commercial products, which he has stated this is so why is it in here in the first place?

Hmmm valid point.

The scalloped edges on the nipples are pretty awful.  Her face looks somewhat less ugly than it did previously.  I agree with Marque, BB and Miss Nancy.

*The scalloped edges on the nipples are pretty awful.  Her face looks somewhat less ugly than it did previously.  I agree with Marque, BB and Miss Nancy.

Hey Jaci

How are you and Pjz00 doing on your female figure?  Great,  I hope.  The scalloped edges are no problem for 3d max.  All David has to do is apply a gradient map to that area.  He could even bake it into the texture along with true sub surface scattering.

*it's hard for me to tell if the model is any good without a professional render,
using something other than FFRender and a blank scene.

Would it be all right if he used maxwell?  Maxwell and lightwave are used a lot in cinema and I believe maxwell comes with 3d max.

*I was under the impression that we are not supposed to advertise here for commercial products, which he has stated this is so why is it in here in the first place?

Should a mod intervine then?

*DP:

Your figure is nice but your renders are not. I agree with Miss Nancy. If you're going to be a "pro" and sell stuff, then you should upgrade your demos.

Are you still on Poser 5? If you're on Poser 6 or 7, then download my VSS and apply a good set of shaders to the figure. It's just a couple clicks.

Or David could deploy the big guns and bake a surface in 3d max and save it out as a texture map for poser.

Huh? What are you talking about?

I thought the point of this thread was to measure interest in this by Poser users, and get some feedback to guide the development process. That means showing Poser users how posing, changing your lights, etc are going to reveal the nature of the new improved figure, in Poser. How would baking a render from Max and then re-rendering it in Poser make that point? You might as well render a photo of Carmen Electra projected on Judy's belly and call it a "re-mapped figure".

My suggestion was that DP get my free Poser tool, something available to everybody, and demonstrate what the figure is really capable of. The renders so far don't do it justice. I think its just ridiculous that people still publish Poser renders that have no Blinn in the shader, no hint of ambient lighting, no gamma correction, no attempt at SSS, etc. I made VSS available for free and it does all that for you. It may not be a perfect realistic result like you get from $5000 programs, but it produces results better than 95% of the renders in the Poser gallery, and way better than DP's demo renders. 

Sorry my bad...carry on.

If I told you that I made this "improved" Judy by remapping her UVs, loading a quality V3 texture set, and some subtle morphs, you'd probably believe me.

But I didn't. It's the same Judy with the same textures and the same face and the same lighting. The only difference is shaders. 

This is pretty good lighting; two infinites with soft shadows, IBL and AO. Yet the default shaders fail to convey that.

NO! you can;t make me click to see that larger. She's too damned fugly! ;)

Awesome!  Hey Bill,  have you given any thought to a shader work up for the high end apps and maybe selling the preset?

Thank you Bagginsbill, you aid and suggestions are most sincerely appreciated!  It took me awhile, but I've made my Judy's eyes fully V3 MAT poseable.  Now I'm proceeding with the eyelashes.
Yours truly,
David P. Hoadley

Quote - Awesome!  Hey Bill,  have you given any thought to a shader work up for the high end apps and maybe selling the preset?

Once or twice. Face_off insists the "big boys" don't need no help from a stinking Poserite. Anyway, I don't use any of those apps, although I've tried using Kerkythea, and making materials in Kerky. Totally different paradigm, so it's hard to translate what I do in Poser to other apps. They always have "knob" ways of doing things, instead of letting me just do the math myself. So if they don't have the kind of math I'm doing built into some shader module, I can't even do it.

I've been playing with Filter Forge, however. Very interesting and Poser-like. You string together nodes and they make color maps, bump maps, specular maps, and so on, which you can then drop into your rendering engines. You can do serious math with FF, and it has things built into it that even Poser nodes don't have.

Since I'm here posting, I just want to let everybody know I'm going away for the weekend and probably won't be threading for a couple days. See ya.

 Yamato has reworked Judy a long time ago (not only face and mesh, but also all the joints): 

http://www.juno.dti.ne.jp/%7Eyamato-k/TentenPre.html

Unfortunately you cant download the figure anymore - somewhere there is also a V3 texture remapped version in the Japanese Poser world ( I have it, but cant remember from where).

I agree with bagginsbill - beefing up the renders would help.

Gareee please be gentleman. Judy is just mesh but she is a woman either.
"De gustibus non est disputandum" - I do not like here would be more correct ;)

Few yrs ago I've tried to fix her face. According to me biggest problem was flat triangle shaped cheeks and chin - alien head. There was no morphs in face room which could correct it and I've added magnets. I wanted to move/bulg nose and make it wider, moreover I've tried to bulg front cheek bones (not side - they are wide enough) last was magnet on chin to make jaws wider and chin shorter. Results were terrible.
I really wish you good luck David, Judy is really big chalenge if you want make her anorectic model or warior princess.

And the last question for guys. Who can say honestly that in the real world meets girl like Judy, who lies back and stands with 1 mouse click and ask her "you are butt ugly conform your clothes and go away" ;)

The TenTen downloads were hosted as guest downloadss on a different Japanese site... here they are I think:

http://www.eurus.dti.ne.jp/~masasi/Service/indexE.html

Would love the Judy remap :( Also the E-Frontier Judy FBMs.

Quote - ...And the last question for guys. Who can say honestly that in the real world meets girl like Judy, who lies back and stands with 1 mouse click and ask her "you are butt ugly conform your clothes and go away" ;)

I like this, this is profound.

(:

@dphoadley

What you're doing is akin to recycling and my hat goes off to you. There is so much concentration on new content and so little on repurposed content.

Keep doing what you're doing, its great. I love her body geometry. She looks more like a real woman. She would have been a goddess in the 70s. We're so used to seeing the super trim fashion model figure we've forgotten what real women look like. I'm sure if we ever saw Charlie's Angels naked, Farrah, Kate and Jacklyn would look just like Judy.

Well, I have DPHoadley's Remapped V4 and she's great. :)

Just thought I'll drop that in. :)

Here are the links for the V3 and Judy/V2 (frankensteined)  Tenten:

www.juno.dti.ne.jp/~yamato-k/Penthousecollection.html

It's still on Yamato site, only the early NewJudy (anan2) tenten version is a dead link.

As I showed in another thread, Judy's head works very good in Poser's Faceroom and it is not that hard to change it into a  prettier face without needing any chopped off V2-head.

Best regards,

Bopper.