Does anyone else have this problem.

I installed Poser 8 in Vista 64bit.  And the keyword search function does not work...at all.  I get no results at all.   Nothing.  I type in cockroach which is a default figure in both Poser 8 and 7.  No results at all.

I tried running as Administrator with no difference.

I turned UAC off and ran as administrator.  No difference.

It's like there is no search functionality at all.

Any hints.

Allan

Here's text from the Poser 8 README.rtf  that may provide a place to start:

"Content Library Search
  - When filtering content categories, Poser returns search results that contain individual items with matching name and type as well as folders with names that match the search term, regardless of whether or not they contain items of the filter type.
  - For best results, please ensure that Windows Search 4 is installed (Windows only). Search 4 is installed by Vista SP2, the stand alone installer is available for other supported operating systems at http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/940157
  - Poser enables indexing for all content library runtimes that are added to Poser (Windows only, enabled by default on Mac OS X).
  - Indexed search does not cover network volumes (Windows only). There is a possibility that a patch from Microsoft would enable that (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/918996), but we haven't verified that and therefore don't recommend installing it."

Steve Cooper
Poser Product Manager

Thanks for replying.

I have Vista 64bit SP2.

I went to the site link you provided but Windows Search 4.0 for Vista 64bit is only for people with SP1.  I downloaded it anyway but upon install it said "this is not for your version of windows."

I may try to reinstall Poser 8.  But the first time I installed it, I clicked continue when the Vista UAC prompt came up.  I followed the same procedure I do for all of the applications I've installed in Vista.......Are you sure?....Yes....Are you sure?.....Yes Continue.  And occasionally it asks me to unblock something and I always click Unblock.

Thanks for you help.

Allan 

Well I got it working by uninstalling, turning off UAC, reinstalling.

I hate to say it but that's just very poor quality control on their part.  UAC in Vista has been around for 3 years now.  This should not be a problem for application vendors.

For the record, my first install had UAC on and I chose to install it using the "for best backwords compatibility" option where it installs the runtime in a Poser directory on the c: drive vs. having the content installed on the shared User drive.  The shared User drive was the default recommended option for users with Vista and UAC on. 

The bottomline is Smith Micro should have been aware that the "backwords compatibility" install option will disable the search feature if you have UAC on in Vista when installing the application.

Now that Poser 8 is installed and the search feature does work as advertised, I turned UAC back on and everything seems to work ok.

Allan

Quote - Well I got it working by uninstalling, turning off UAC, reinstalling.

I hate to say it but that's just very poor quality control on their part.  UAC in Vista has been around for 3 years now.  This should not be a problem for application vendors.

For the record, my first install had UAC on and I chose to install it using the "for best backwords compatibility" option where it installs the runtime in a Poser directory on the c: drive vs. having the content installed on the shared User drive.  The shared User drive was the default recommended option for users with Vista and UAC on. 

The bottomline is Smith Micro should have been aware that the "backwords compatibility" install option will disable the search feature if you have UAC on in Vista when installing the application.

Now that Poser 8 is installed and the search feature does work as advertised, I turned UAC back on and everything seems to work ok.

Allan

These guys are sloppy programmers. I wish a real company would buy them out.

I have vista 64 and my search doesn't work either.  I don't want to jump through 483 hoops just to be able to "Search" lol.

I have Vista 64 fully service packed and hotfixed, indexing enabled and search works fine for me out of the box

From my experience the issue with UAC is not in the programming, but UAC itself and how it is used by users or the understanding of how to use it. Many Users create an account, but then install under the Admin Account instead of as an Administrator under the User Account (Microsoft does not recommend this). Others have actually run Vista under the Admin Account, instead of the User Account (Microsoft actual has warnings against this). Things like Virtual Store, Permissions, etc.. all come into play with any program on Vista.

The reason shutting off UAC is suggested for those having troubles, is there are so many variations on the settings. By shutting off UAC, no settings to their system need to change. Shut off UAC, install, turn UAC back on and it should work. It is similar to the suggestion to install in Safe Mode or using MSConfig to make sure things like AV, Internet Security software, etc... are not impacting the installation.

I have Vista, Vista 64, XP64, XP Pro, XP Home... along with MAC OSX (both Tiger and two machines running Leopard) and I can install the download or disk to any of those machines using the default installer and the Search works fine.

I will add that I have installed it both with UAC on and UAC off, but I also know what my settings are and what I need to do to install with those settings. Out of practice, I always shut off UAC to install and to run Updates. I even tend to use MSConfig, only because my Internet Security Software is too aware on some updates and it is easier to deal with the permissions after the update is installed (warning the next time I launch the program that it has changed) than to deal with the messages while installing. I also have gotten into the practice of installing Drivers using MSConfig for the same reasons.

My son just got a new Laptop for school and he installed Poser 8 Disk with no issues and has not encountered any issue with Search. He did run all the Updates first and made sure his system was running correctly before installing.

I personally do not think your wish for someone to buy Microsoft will come true, and I am sure that Microsoft, like SmithMicro has real programmers... maybe Windows 7 will help address some of the oddities resulting from the features of Vista.

I dont' think Zanzo was referring to Microsoft with the sloppy programmers comment.  I'm sure that was directed at Smith Micro or whoever they contracted with for developing their installation model. 

Look.. the bottomline is Vista and UAC have been on the market for over 3 years now.  I have dozens of applications on my system that have installed with no headaches with UAC on in Vista 64bit.  Install headaches that occur with a mature operating system are signs of very sloppy and lazy quality control at the tail end of development.  They clearly did not test the various install options that they make available to the user.  

Go ahead and try this on your Vista 64 bit system.  Turn on UAC, install Poser 8, choose the "Backwards Compatibility option" so your content is installed on the C drive in a Poser directory instead of the default install option of the User shared drive.  The search feature will be completely disabled.  If they make the option available for users, they should test it! 

The whole point of UAC is so the user doesn't have to worry about install headaches.  Things should just work while UAC is left on.  This is the job of the application developers not Microsoft.  The specs that spell out exactly what you need in your install routines have been published by MS for years.  There is no reasonable excuse for this. 

Ultimately I got it working by uninstalling, turning off UAC and reinstalling.  And that's just stupid.  You should never have to turn UAC off if the developer is doing their job.  The only difference UAC makes is to require your permission.  At some point during the install, Smith Micro forgot to put the request permission notification up.  So the aplpication's access to the C drive was blocked by UAC.  Again...very very sloppy.

My first install had UAC on and I chose to install it using the "for best backwords compatibility" option where it installs the runtime in a Poser directory on the c: drive vs. having the content installed on the shared User drive.  (The shared User drive was the default recommended option for users with Vista and UAC on.)  But if it doesn't work another way, don't provide the option to a user. 

The bottomline is Smith Micro should have been aware that the "backwords compatibility" install option will disable the search feature if you have UAC on in Vista when installing the application.

Now that Poser 8 is installed and the search feature does work as advertised, I turned UAC back on and everything seems to work ok.

Allan

Actually the first thing almost every single vista tip websites tells you to do is to turn off UAC. Some programs like Vue even recomnmend turning it off before attempting an install.

Thats why UAC was severly changed in windows 7.. it caused too many problems for too many people.

Here's a vista tweak guide link. The very FIRST thing they tell you to do after hardware preparation, and vista install, is turning off UAC.

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2238&page=5

Wow.

I'm not sure you read the article you linked to.  Here is a quote....

"Fortunately, UAC can be easily disabled, though you should be aware that doing so strips Vista of a considerable extra layer of security against viruses and malware

. Effectively, disabling UAC brings us back to XP territory in terms of security, but it makes Vista so much easier to use."

The reason why MS kept UAC in Windows 7 is because it's needed.  They provided an additional option for more advanced users who don't want to see so many prompts but it will still be on and by default it will be on.

I have countless applications that do not have problems with UAC.  But in order for them to work, they have to be changed to trigger the UAC prompts that ask the user for their permission.  If they do not do this, the install will fail in strange ways.  This isn't about UAC.

If I understand correctly you are saying that in order to accomodate sloppy application developers, we should remain entrenched in 6 year old technology.  Look even Apple has an equivalent UAC feature in Mac OS.  This article also appears rather old but I'm not sure because I could not find a date.

I'll say it again.  Vista with UAC has been out for 3 years now.  There should be no good reason to disable it as long as the application developer makes the calls to the premade routines that ask your permission when you want to install something.  This is not difficult stuff.  It just has to be tested for before shipping the application.

Finally, if you take a look at the majority of complaints with Poser 8, most of them have to do with installation problems.....missing directories, file links etc.  I really like Poser, don't get me wrong.  But don't make excuses for crappy quality control.

Allan

Everyone I know who uses vista has UAC turned off.. you are the only person I've ever seen post that the actually leave it on.

Its considered one of the "issues" with vista, and one that needed fixing badly.

You see it as sloppy programming.

I see it as UAC was a mistake on Microsoft's part, and most "in the know" people turn it off faster then you can say "Smith Micro".

Google disable UAC vista, and read some of the many MANY article posted about it. (I got over 4 million hits.)

I've yet to find one article that sings the praises of UAC, and recommends having it turned on.

But again, thats a personal opinion and choice.

Add me to this. Vista Business 64. No go.

Disabled UAC, nothing. Now I'm reading I should uninstall P8 with UAC off, reinstall P8, and maybe turn UAC back on.

Naw. Shouldn't have to...too much trouble.  I lived without a search for this long. I'm ok without it.

Just sayin.

Quote: *From my experience the issue with UAC is not in the programming, but UAC itself and how it is used by users or the understanding of how to use it. Many Users create an account, but then install under the Admin Account instead of as an Administrator under the User Account (Microsoft does not recommend this). Others have actually run Vista under the Admin Account, instead of the User Account (Microsoft actual has warnings against this). Things like Virtual Store, Permissions, etc.. all come into play with any program on Vista.

To be honest: I never heard of UAC, untill my poserpro files started to disappear, and I found out what the cause was by searching the internet and the poserforum. I only bought Vista ultimate because I wanted to use the full 64bit capacity of poserpro and Vue7Infinte. If I knew that it would cause so much troubles I would have gone for xp64, but it was too late for that.

Quote: *I have vista 64 and my search doesn't work either.  I don't want to jump through 483 hoops just to be able to "Search" lol.

*I ditto that, SM just has to fix this.

To my opinion: The way UAC works in Vista is just far too complicated for the average user, I understand that it's useful to avoid viruses, trojans, hackers, rootkits, cyberbots and any other kind of cybercrime you can imagine, but you have to be a full-skilled programmer to know all the settings you need to make it workable. I hope this will be better in windows7.

Best regards,

Bopper

I hope this will be better in windows7.*

it is. Microsoft have recognised that Vista's UAC is far to sensitive and most users are annoyed by it.

In Windows 7, I've only seen UAC when installing a program (has not prevented said install working properly afterwards (Poser 5, 6, 7, Pro, Sketchup, trueSpace etc)) and when there's been a major system change reported.

basically it's working properly in Windows 7 (32 bit install and 64 bit installs I have running here.)

That was my understading.. Microsoft completly reworked UAC, and they had actually been begging people not to turn it off in vista.

IMHO its one of those worthless vista features.

 Quote: "My son just got a new Laptop for school and he installed Poser 8 Disk with no issues and has not encountered any issue with Search. He did run all the Updates first and made sure his system was running correctly before installing. "

Poser 8 everything works fine on just a disk install. It's when you add all your own content that you notice problems.
I'm on a mac and haven't been able to get search working as yet either.
Love esther

Garee,

UAC is important for security purposes.  But to say MS completely reworked UAC is preposterous.  It's still there in Windows 7 because it's needed.  But I'm going to argue about that point because it's off subject.

Please show me in the install documentation or anywhere in any documentation for Poser 8 where the developer advises you to turn off UAC before you install.  They don't.  As a matter of fact, they state just the opposite.  They have numerous install options several of which mention that if you are a Vista user with UAC on, this is the best option....and that is the default install option.  However there are several other options for installation which they clearly did not test and they give the user no instructions regarding UAC at all.

This isn't about your problems with Microsoft.  This is about poor quality testing of a very nice, welcome update to Poser.   

64 bit vista ultimate, sp2........ search not working, uac is off and has been before poser install

Quote -

But to say MS completely reworked UAC is preposterous. 

and yet they have. you've still got time to download the Windows 7 RC and see for yourself.
I know they have since A: I've done research and B: I'm RUNNING WINDOWS 7.

http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/2008/10/08/user-account-control.aspx
http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/2009/02/05/uac-feedback-and-follow-up.aspx

read those and you see the changes they've made to the UAC in 7.

In Windows 7 UAC is set to a level there it's completely pointless, it can be changed back to Vista level (but without asking for the same action multiple times, so it's more clever).
I've got UAC enabled and don't have any problem, because I know its purpose and what it's doing...

So, anyone get it to WORK on 64bit Vista with the SP2 already installed?

... like chaneya said "I went to the site link you provided but Windows Search 4.0 for Vista 64bit is only for people with SP1.  I downloaded it anyway but upon install it said "this is not for your version of windows."

I did NOT have UAC on when installing P8...
I know ratcloset replied to my inqury on smithmicro (thank you, i'll update it soon) and said not to install the runtime to the programs folder (I'm assuming you meant program files(x86)... does this have anything to do with the search not working? Andif it does, WHY didn't the instructions tell vista 64bit users to do a specific install. There was like 4 different options when installing and none sounded better than the other!!

Quote -
I'm on a mac and haven't been able to get search working as yet either.

The Mac version is using OS X' own Spotlight for searches. If it's not working, have you verified that Spotlight indexing is not disabled for the drives you keep your content on? 

Looks like Win Poser 8's search relies on Windows Search 4.
By default, Window Search 4 only indexes the user's folder plus a few other common shared folders.
Try going to Control Panel->Indexing Options and add all your runtime folders to the locations to be indexed.

If anything, MS has done more over the years to piss me off than SM but I have to agree with chaneya here. If you provide an install option that by default cripples key functionality in your application, and you could have avoided it by making documented OS calls, then it's your bad as a developer. I don't care what misgivings MS may have had about UAC and what changes they may have made in Win7. The fact is people are using Vista and the Poser install option is (apparently) breaking search. It is NOT up to the user to Google UAC or be aware that all those in the know have it turned off. It is up to the developer to assume that the user will be running the OS in the default state and plan accordingly. I'd cut them a lot of slack if this were the early days of Vista when everyone was comming to grips with UAC. At this point, it's like crashing at 60 on a road clearly marked 'Danger Ice,' and blaming the county.

The "Gee everyone runs with UAC off" notion. clearly leaves out two groups, those who don't know about turning it off and those who actually prefer to leave security features enabled. I use Comodo's security tools and their Defense++ module pops up with annoying regularity but I personally prefer knowing when apps are writing to system folders or modifying protected registry keys. Others may prefer blessed silence but either way having your installer silently fail is not Microsoft's fault or that of the users. Developers are human and bugs happen. Now that the issue is known, they can resolve it for users having the problem and patch the installer - and I bet they will pay a lot more attention to installation issues with the next release.

 I got search working. I had to click on  one of the little checkboxes then back onto all again and then it worked.

lmckenzie,

Thank you.  For a second I thought I was the only sane person here.

It's always fascinated me how in some instances people choose to blame the platform developer instead of the application developer when problems occur with their favorite application.  In the gaming side of the industry, you rarely see people blaming MS when their favorite game crashes, doesn't install correctly etc. on their PC or XBox 360.  And yes all of those PC games have to deal with UAC just like everything thing else you install.  People instead rationally blame the developer of the game because the game wasn't in testing long enough.  It's funny how people react when it's their favorite application.

This has all of the signs of a developer who farmed out the install routines to their distributor/publisher.  I could certainly be wrong because I do know who actually develops Poser vs. who publishes it.  But it's very clear based upon the # of install complaints that the install routines were not tested appropriately on the platforms they were targeting for distibution. 

What I don't really understand is why the install hasn't been changed in the first two hotfixes.  That one baffles me.

Allan

Well, it's not like Poser 8 doesn't provide the option to install in a Vista friendly folder, you even said, it's the default, chaneya. So you can blame SM for that they didn't make it completely clear that the most backward compatible option might not work properly with UAC. One really shouldn't install there, when using UAC. There's really no way around that. Data doesn't belong into the program folder.

"t's always fascinated me how in some instances people choose to blame the platform developer instead of the application developer when problems occur with their favorite application." 

I'd bet that Mac users, who tend to prize their OS are less likely to do so. Microsoft bashing is part of the culture, with justification in some cases, so the automatic assumption is that it's their fault. I can sympathize with both sides. There's no way for Microsoft or a developer to even begin to test every possible combination of hardware, firmware and software that a Windows user might have. In this case though, it appears that simply installing on a vanilla Vista setup would have revealed the problem - assuming that testing meant more than just checking to see if Poser loaded. We have even less excuse today when using virtual machines, you can set up multiple configurations of everything from DOS to Windows 7 and Linux set up for testing on one machine and switch between them without even rebooting the physical hardware.

Umm where is Vista SP2? I have automatic updates on and I'm only at SP1. I've just checked the update site and I can't see any mention of it???

I'm asking because I'm having issues with P8 and this would be a great explanation if I'm missing a Vista update.

Bah never mind I checked my update history and I have Search 4 anyway. I guess my version of Vista already included it as the machine is only 4 or 5 months old.

 OK.. barging in here.

I just tried to search for something tonight, for the first time (funny enough it was actually also that cockroach) and.. zilch.

No results. I tried several other search, for some things I'd just opened and added to my scene. But nothing. 

I'm on Vista Home Premium 32 bits SP1 (and I'd like to know how to get SP2 as well...)  

UAC is turned off AND I'm using the Administrator account.

So what do I need to do (except to wait for the Poser 8 SP1?) - sacrifice a white goat or a black rooster? I can never remember which works best in occasions like these...

 once I got it working by checking one of the other boxes eg figures then going back to that general checkbox on the search screen but now it isn't working for me either.

TrekkieGirl,

First question is did you have UAC off when you installed Poser 8?

If yes then I would wager it's because you are using an older version of Vista (SP1).  I know Poser 8 uses the built in Windows Search 4  as it's search engine.  So the Poser people say to make sure you have Windows Search 4 installed.  (For the record here is another example of really really crappy quality control and very sloppy  development with the installer for Poser 8.  It's a very easy thing to have your installer check the users system to see if they have the necessary installed components and if not, link to them over the internet and install them.  It's been done for years with Direct X tec. etc.)  Anyway.....I think Windows Search 4 is built into SP2 in Vista.  

In order to install the latest updates to your Vista system you should be able to click on your Windows button in the lower left of your screen,  click all programs, and Windows Update should be an option as you scroll down through the menu choices.  Click that and that should scan your system and download the latest Vista updates.

You may actually have to reinstall Poser 8 after you do the Vista update...I'm not sure.  You may be able to check it first and if it's doesn't do the search feature....uninstall Poser 8, turn off UAC and reinstall.

I have to admit the Poser 8 install is the sloppiest piece of development I've seen in a long time.  Love the application but the install is crap.

Allan

 I'm on a mac and I only got it to work on one particular day or two, but since then nada

To get Vista SR-2 all I had to do was use the Windows Update.
I have Windows Vista Home Preieum 64bit. SR-2

1. I used Admin and installed P8 to C:Smith Microposer 8
2. I did "NOT" use the default install location for the Main Runtime. I opted to place the main Runtime in the conventional location - C:Smith Micro Poser 8
3. I have UAC Turned Off.

I did a Search for Ryan using "All".
It takes a few minutes and the search button will "Blink-Cancel Search" until the search is completed.
It found Ryan, see attached.