Quote - I know that Mike (phantom3D) is going to be offering tutorials on weight mapping to the folks over at Poser Place. ** Join up, get involved, and learn how to weight map yourself!**

http://poserplace.phantom3d.net/forums/index.php

We could use the testers, and the community could use the folks converting figures!

And don't you Dare queue-jump... I was in that line first! :lol:

Quote - > Quote - I know that Mike (phantom3D) is going to be offering tutorials on weight mapping to the folks over at Poser Place. ** Join up, get involved, and learn how to weight map yourself!**

http://poserplace.phantom3d.net/forums/index.php

We could use the testers, and the community could use the folks converting figures!

And don't you Dare queue-jump... I was in that line first! :lol:

ROFL, yes ma'am!

It's just that the "will you please weight map next please" list is way too long for one or two human beings.

I fully agree, Glitterati. besides, SM didn't intend for this technology to be mastered by just the few gifted souls we have the distinct privilege to know: we're meant to all get in there and get our hands dirty.

But believe me, before I put one coloured dot of WMing on ANYTHING, I wanna get rigging down solid. Horses before the cart... :biggrin:

Quote - > Quote - I am curious though, has there been any mention if M4 will be done at some point as well?

I don't think there are any immediate plans at Poser Place to convert M4, although I do think it might make sense to do so.  I'll ask and see what may or may not be going on, with that.

While I know fewer people use the male characters, it would certainly help to have one that was weightmapped. People REALLY DO make renders other than naked girls in temples with swords. If it's a matter of money, I've got a hundred bucks that I'll toss into the pot to see M4 WM.

Diogenes/Phantom3D will be offering a tutorial class on rigging and weight-mapping (if present plans hold up) as part of the process of creating a male counterpart for Antonia. The purpose is to broaden the skills of a number of people in the Poser community, and apprentice people in these techniques. Consider it Poser Place U. Even if folks don’t join in the conversation, they can follow the tutorials.

Several people want to simultaneously work on a legacy figure as a practical application of what they are learning. When the time comes, folks may get together as work groups, or claim a figure independently. If some folks want to work on V3 (M4 or some other figure), they could take their “Crew” to another thread, or even another forum. With a supportive crew, and expert input, there is no reason why a number of legacy figures cannot be re-rigged and weight-mapped.

When people move from one home to a new home, they will get rid of some things, take some things with them, and get some new things in order to make themselves at home in their new environs. P9/PP2012 is a new environment, with new features. Some of the old stuff will not work well, but some can be updated and recycled. And, we will need and want some new figures and content.

Every legacy figure that is updated for P9/PP2012 is another reason for folks to upgrade to the new versions of Poser, and (because a lot of this content is available for free or inexpensive) each is a reason for some folks to buy Poser for the first time. These figures form the background, but not the bounderies of the content that can be used or developed. We want the Poser community to grow.

The more people who get P9/PP2012 the more that S/M can invest on developing Poser even more. We are hoping that SR2 will not just correct some issues, but open up some more of the rigging functions for Python so that people like Cage can do even more to extend the functionality of Poser. See, the whole Poser community benefits from this work (even if some people charge for their figure updates).

On the other hand, we do not want to chain Diogenes in a dungeon and force him to re-rig and weight-map old figures. He and some others, have the talent to make new, more advanced, and superior figures. So, it makes sense to teach a lot of us the skills needed to work on all of the worthwhile projects we can imagine. In the process, even more things will be discovered, and we will all improve our skills.

These are exciting times for the Poser Community. S/M and the Poser Development Team is very much more engaged with us than ever before (which is great), there are more expert Poser users in the Poserverse than ever before (materials room, mesh makers, morph makers, riggers, UV mapping, content creators, etc.), and the whole community is much more enthusiastic.

There is a shift in paradigms underway, so what is possible to achieve is changing. In the past the answer we got when we wanted something specific was "do it yourself," now a lot of us are saying, let's do it together. I hope that everyone will join in, the more the merrier.

lmk

I have enlisted and I am interested in learning how to weight map.  If rigging and everything else comes with the tutorial package, the more the merrier.  This is an opportunity of a lifetime, community action and interaction.

(parody)

Do you think you guys could WM the p4 cat?  Thx!

Offering tutorials is a great idea and hopefully more and more Poser users will be experimenting with WMing.   I would also be very interested in following these tutorials but my time is limited.   I do hope they will be archived for when I  have time later (June -September is when I have ample time to myself).  

One of the things I've always liked about Poser is the fact that users can tinker endlessly with various aspects.  I've built things from primitives, made hybrid characters, got very familiar with .cr2 editing and so on - all things I had originally thought to be beyond my capabilities.   Looking forward to all that's coming and a big, heartfelt thanks to our talented Poser Pioneers!

Any tutorials posted in the tutorial forums at PoserPlace will remain there, nothing to worry about there Kalypso.

I don't mean to hijack the direction of the thread, but I am curious about two problematic posing areas with the 'standard' V4.  These are when the leg is bent to the side (side-side) and when the arm is bent backwards.  Both cause unrealistic deformations of the mesh (in either the buttocks or shoulder area, respectively).  Does WM-V4 suffer the same problems?  Can any of the beta testers pose images of these areas when posed? 

Thanks.

P.S.  I have been a lurker over at Poser-Place.  Mike and his group is doing a wonderful job and service for the poser community by making V4 into a weight-mapped version.

Quote - I don't mean to hijack the direction of the thread, but I am curious about two problematic posing areas with the 'standard' V4.  These are when the leg is bent to the side (side-side) and when the arm is bent backwards.  Both cause unrealistic deformations of the mesh (in either the buttocks or shoulder area, respectively).  Does WM-V4 suffer the same problems?  Can any of the beta testers pose images of these areas when posed? 

Thanks.

P.S.  I have been a lurker over at Poser-Place.  Mike and his group is doing a wonderful job and service for the poser community by making V4 into a weight-mapped version.

 

 

Give me the numbers in the rotation you're concerned about and I'll be happy to render it for you.

A favorite pose that creates the problem?

Give me something to work with and I'll be happy to demonstrate it for you.

Counting down now...  Everyone hold your breath ;)

Robyn

I think I recall that too!

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - It's not inconceivable - just remember that if you consider that there are actually far superior figures out there from a mesh standpoint... time to do a little lateral thinking, maybe.

It is time to move from the Millenium on to the Revelation!

I understood/stand what was/is going on....

A better mesh needed to truly take advantage of weightmapping features and benefits.

I'm just saying V3 could use some love too...

I actually think that a weight-mapped version of V3 is being considered by one of the PoserPlace crew - I could swear I heard that being discussed... My understanding is that V3 is actually better mesh than V4... could be wrong, but that's what I understand.

 Testing of links, etc....

THE RELEASE IS READY!  Get your copy now!

Poser Place

Thanks Vestmann! Wow, I am impressed by the WM V4 pliability!  I can't wait to try her out.

Thanks Glitterati3D for the offer.  I am posting from work so I can't access Poser at the moment and give you specifics.  The images that Vestmann posted answered my main concerns.  The only other pose that still gives me some grief is when you pose the right shoulder down to V4 side (i.e. using down-up) and then bend it backwards (i.e. using front-back)--as if you were grasping your hands behind your back or leaning backwards over a table and using your arms to support your upper body.  This gives me mesh distortion in the upper shoulder area such that there is a 'ledge' where the seam separates the collar from the shoulder.  When I put V4's arm in such a pose I also use the twist function of the collar to rotate the arm back but I can't use too much twist because then I affect the pectoral area of the mesh.  For single renders this is not a problem as I use the morph brush to smooth over the offending areas as well as tweaking the image in photoshop but in animations I can see it.  Sorry, probably way too much detail....

Quote - Thanks Vestmann! Wow, I am impressed by the WM V4 pliability!  I can't wait to try her out.

Thanks Glitterati3D for the offer.  I am posting from work so I can't access Poser at the moment and give you specifics.  The images that Vestmann posted answered my main concerns.  The only other pose that still gives me some grief is when you pose the right shoulder down to V4 side (i.e. using down-up) and then bend it backwards (i.e. using front-back)--as if you were grasping your hands behind your back or leaning backwards over a table and using your arms to support your upper body.  This gives me mesh distortion in the upper shoulder area such that there is a 'ledge' where the seam separates the collar from the shoulder.  When I put V4's arm in such a pose I also use the twist function of the collar to rotate the arm back but I can't use too much twist because then I affect the pectoral area of the mesh.  For single renders this is not a problem as I use the morph brush to smooth over the offending areas as well as tweaking the image in photoshop but in animations I can see it.  Sorry, probably way too much detail....

She's available now, so you can test her out yourself.

Please do post the results of your test.

I am having problems with the download link at "dc274.4shared.com".  When I click on the Victoria4.2WM download link at Poser Place, internet explorer can't display the webpage.  Is anyone else having the same error? 

I am very excited, might have to leave work early today....

I use FF and had no problems when I tested the links..

Thanks, Vestmann.  I will grab my download when I get home this evening.

Using Chrome here and had no problems downloading.

I had no trouble downloading everything.  Thank you, development team!  Thank you ALL!

:)

@ Kendra.  I was thinking if you could change the title of thread to V4-WM is HERE! and maybe stick it?

The following people are members of the development team. They have worked many long hours and have given much of their time and talents to bring this excellent figure to all of the Poser public.They have been true champs throughout. Thank you Poser Place team.

• Amethyst.......................Beta team and promo renders.
• Bagoas..........................Beta team and composition consultant
• Begmysweet..................Beta team and promo renders
• Bevans84.......................Beta team and promo renders.
• CageDrei........................Beta team, python script development, project design and awesome bug fixer.
• Eric Walters...................Beta team and promo renders.
• Generalnutt.....................Beta team and promo renders.
• Glitterati3D.....................Beta team, clothing development, and promo renders.
• KittyBrown......................Beta team.
• LadyRaine......................Beta team and promo renders.
• Lkendall..........................Beta team
• Nephanor........................Beta team
• Paganeagle2001.............Beta team and promo renders.
• Phantom3D.....................Rigging and weight mapping.
• Robynsveil......................Project manager, shader development and promo renders.
• RHatch...........................Beta team.
• Rose2000........................Beta team, promo renders and bug fixer
• ShvrDavid........................Beta team, pose development, and promo renders.
• Vestmann.......................Beta team and promo renders.
• WandW..........................Beta team.

Clap clap clap clap clap clap clap clap.

@Everyone!  Please post renders and your findings here.  We'd love to hear your thoughts!

Yes we'd Love to see your renders... :)

great stuff. is she really jcm-free?

and is the vertex order is still the same as the classic v4?

if so, she could be genesis-fied with all the various incarnations m4 k4 etc.

Quote - great stuff. is she really jcm-free?
and is the vertex order is still the same as the classic v4?

Yes and yes.  :laugh:  No modifications were made to the mesh and JCMs were specifically avoided, although they were considered at one point, for a few difficult areas.

As reports leaked from time to time, she is still the classic V4 capable of accepting all available morphs and she is weightmapped.  Her rigging has been completely reworked.  Genesis like behavior from her is unlikely, but think of the possibilities with Stephanie 4, The Girl 4, Aiko 4 as well as elite morphing and male attribute.  All weightmapped.

@Vestmann -  Done.  :)  I'll check on stickying it.  

hm pity she doesnt have the animatable joints set by default

...and another one is here :biggrin:.

Bye and a truckload of thanks to the V4WM development team.

Quote - hm pity she doesnt have the animatable joints set by default

What animatable origins would you want to be able to apply to the figure?  I think handling of animatable origins was outside the scope of the project, since they aren't necessary for the base V4.2 figure.  :unsure:

Full size images at PoserPlace V4WM gallery.

Quote - @Vestmann -  Done.  :)  I'll check on stickying it.  

Thanks!

Quote - > Quote - hm pity she doesnt have the animatable joints set by default

What animatable origins would you want to be able to apply to the figure?  I think handling of animatable origins was outside the scope of the project, since they aren't necessary for the base V4.2 figure.  :unsure:

Agreeing with Cage: this figure takes advantage of Poser 9/Poser Pro 2012 technology to the extreme. The focus is on providing new-version Poser users with a figure that does exactly that. I really think Mike and Cage have achieved that goal!!

Thanks to all, I wondered if it could be done. After all, a large part of V4 is magnats. Won't be able to work with her right away, but I appreciate the incredible amount of effort being put out by volunteers.

Quote - > Quote - One quick question - How easy is it to convert the existing clothing to the V4M version?

Exactly the same as converting clothing to the Antonia WM version.

About 5 steps.

If you need those instructions, let me know.

So I gather we would run Cage's script again and in the field "Figure to have weights injected" we'd browse to the clothing item?   And can these clothes then be saved to the library retaining all the information?  Can various V4 character .cr2s be saved to the library as long as we don't use the binary morph option (.pmd)? 

Quote - Ah, I guess she can be genesis-ified indeed. I morphed her to K4, and the joint refit also workes except for the new bones that did not exist in K4. These have to be positioned manually but it seems to work in general.

Which figures would need to have their joint centers considered, for that effort?  Which is to say, which figures can be applied when V4 is genesis-ified?    Perhaps we can work out a way to generate the best locations for the new helper bones, with the different figure morphs. 

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - One quick question - How easy is it to convert the existing clothing to the V4M version?

Exactly the same as converting clothing to the Antonia WM version.

About 5 steps.

If you need those instructions, let me know.

So I gather we would run Cage's script again and in the field "Figure to have weights injected" we'd browse to the clothing item?   And can these clothes then be saved to the library retaining all the information?  Can various V4 character .cr2s be saved to the library as long as we don't use the binary morph option (.pmd)? 

I believe it's been suggested to use the instructions given in the Antonia Weight-mapped guide (pdf) for converting clothing for the figure to weight-mapping. A formal guide for V4 clothing should be forthcoming...

Thanks Robyn,  I assume that guide is available at Poser Place right?

@cage, (i just updated the posted image), where you see i morphed her to k4 for the genesis-effect. to these morphs dials, changes in the joint centers are slaved. for the classic ones my script can do it automatically but not for the new extra bones. i am not sure how this could be automized. maybe it can, i have to think a bit. i think the script detects the dummy geometry for the extra bones as relevant, and this would normally be not morphed. maybe i can tweak it to ignore this geometry.

Quote - THE RELEASE IS READY!  Get your copy now!

Poser Place

Just keeping the download link on each page :) so people wont need hunt :)

Quote - Thanks Robyn,  I assume that guide is available at Poser Place right?

The guide that came with Antonia-WM is available with that download, hun.

I'm going to set about getting something specific to V4 written later today... btw, for those of you who love dynamic cloth as much as I do, V4WM loves dynamic cloth! And looks awesome in it!

Quote - Thanks Robyn,  I assume that guide is available at Poser Place right?

Load the OBJECT file from your geometry folder of the clothing you wish to convert.  (I understand you can alternately load the CR2 file as well.)

Go into the Setup Room

Once the Setup Tab is open, from the main menu select Window>Library and navigate to your saved V4 Weight Mapped.  Double click to load V4~WM.

You will be asked if you wish to group the article.  Say no.

Go back to the Pose room and on the Properties tab, double click the name and change it to something besides Victoria4~WM.  While this isn't necessary, your figure drop down will show 2 Victoria's when you load them both, making it very confusing.

Save the new weight mapped clothing to your library.

Exit Poser. (Not sure why this is necessary, but it is as V4 won't load properly if you don't.)

When you restart Poser,  you may load V4 and conform the clothing as always.

If this is a clothing item you created and plan to distribute, there will be a good bit of housekeeping you should do first.  If you need help with that, feel free to send me a sitemail.

If this is for your personal use, you need to do nothing further.  Your weight mapped clothing is ready for use.

Quote - > Quote - Thanks Robyn,  I assume that guide is available at Poser Place right?

The guide that came with Antonia-WM is available with that download, hun.

I'm going to set about getting something specific to V4 written later today... btw, for those of you who love dynamic cloth as much as I do, V4WM loves dynamic cloth! And looks awesome in it!

Thank you!  Downloading it now from RDNA. 

Quote - @cage, (i just updated the posted image), where you see i morphed her to k4 for the genesis-effect. to these morphs dials, changes in the joint centers are slaved. for the classic ones my script can do it automatically but not for the new extra bones. i am not sure how this could be automized. maybe it can, i have to think a bit. i think the script detects the dummy geometry for the extra bones as relevant, and this would normally be not morphed. maybe i can tweak it to ignore this geometry.

Maybe you could join the team for the next project so we can incorporate your requirements.